need advice: cosleeping and dr says no pacifier and stop night time nursing 4 mo old

[gardenmama76]

My dd just had her 4 mo check up (she's actually 4 1/2 mo).  A few weeks ago she went from sleeping on average 6 hours at a stretch at night and sometimes 8, to 1-2 and she was waking up screaming with her fist in her mouth.  I don't think it was a growth spurt, because it got worse and worse over the course of a few weeks, and I did not notice any noticable growth (i.e. how her clothes fit).  I also noticed a marked difference in her during the day with the teething necklace, so I went for it overnight and overnight she was sleeping soundly and at least back to 4 hour stretches. 

When she wakes up I generally nurse her if she keeps fussing next to me (she sleeps in a cosleeper next to me).  My pediatrician said there's no way she's teething (said he didn't feel anything) and this seems awfully strange to me based on her behavior and my success with the teething necklace.  I've read about tons of moms who had kids with teeth early, and he says no way until 6 mo.  I also DO think I feel something, and he put his hand in her mouth for a millisecond and said there was nothing there.  But I'm no doctor and have had no prior children.  I attributed her recent more frequent wakings to teething.  She does seem upset at times and will ravenously shove her teethers in her mouth.  If what we've seen so far isn't teething I'm not sure what else there is! 

Anyway, he insisted that I should stop giving her a pacifier at night and should try as much as possible not to nurse her at night, especially to put her to bed.  He said nurse her beforehand and THEN read her a story - instead of reading then nursing which is what we do now.  He said it shouldn't be that she's that hungry that often, and she must be doing it for comfort. 

SO....I partly agree with him in that it is probably for comfort and not necessarily hunger, but then I think, she's FOUR MONTHS OLD! She's an itty bitty thing that has been on this planet for only four months!  What is wrong with comforting her throughout the night if that's what she needs?  But then I worry that if I don't start to break this habit of frequent nightly nursing now, I'll be doing it until we stop nursing all together (I'm hoping to make it until she's around two years old), and may have SERIOUS problems getting her to sleep once she has stopped nursing.  I just don't know what to do.  4 mo seems AWFULLY young to make her stop using a pacifier to go to sleep. 

Do you think it could be the teething causing the recent more frequent waking?  I REALLY don't think it was a growth spurt because it got more frequent building up over a few weeks time, and was literally night and day once I started using the necklace at night.  Do you think if I don't stop nursing her whenever she wakes up now, that I will have a problem in the future?

Any advice is welcome!

[Chamomile Girl]

Your ped is full of it.  Babies nurse at night both for comfort and for calories.  Nothing wrong with that...why on earth would there be?  Especially for a 4mo old.  Heck I still nurse my 16mo old all night long.

Sure your kid could be teething.  My kid had his first teeth at 4mo (and his cousin had six teeth by that age!).  IMO the discomfort starts way before any tooth is visible in the gum.  It sounds to me like your ped is blowing you off in a pretty blatant way.

[Sfcmama]

It's too late for me to censor my real thoughts about the ped so I'll just suggest you look up info about 4 month sleep regressions.
Try http://moxie.blogs.com/askmoxie/2006/02/qa_what_are_sle.html or http://www.kellymom.com/parenting/sleep/4mo-sleep.html

Then check your gut and see what resonates, the above info or your doctor.

Pediatricians are not trained in sleep or breastfeeding and , IME, often assert their own beliefs or best guesses innplace of medical knowledge.

Hope this helps! I'll be curious to see what you think after checking out the websites!!

[CBEmomma]

There is nothing wrong with comforting a 4 month old, they need comfort. And I don't think nursing at night, even if it is for comfort, is a bad habit. My 7 month old still nurses, and actually eats, every 2-3 hours at night. Your baby could be teething, and if she needs the comfort of your breasts during that time at night, I'd give it to her.

[blessedwithboys]

My niece had a tooth at 4 mos and both of my kids nursed through the night until 24 mos.  So yes, your dd could be teething, and yes, you will likely be nursing her in the night until age 2.  :)

[Lauren82]

Oh wow. 4 months is so little. She most definitely can be teething already, even if teeth haven't popped through yet. Comfort nursing is normal and I think it's a wonderful GIFT when there is a crabby or sick LO and nursing is the only way mama or baby gets any rest.

[marinak1977]

I think your ped has no clue and shouldn't dispense parenting advice with such authority. I know many babies that had teeth show up as early as 3 months.  My DS didn't get his until 9 months, but he had several teething episodes around 6 months that didn't amount to much. I think it's possible for the babies to feel discomfort long before the teeth are ready to come through. Go with your instinct. For the record I nurse DS throughout the night and I'm sure that is not the reason he wakes up, but it's a great way to comfort him back to sleep.

[lexapurple]

Teething or not, there is nothing wrong with comfort nursing at night if it is for comfort only. Don't forget that breastfeeding is demand-supply relationship and babies are responsible for keeping mom's supply at the level that would satisfy the baby. Keep nursing her on demand and don't listen to you ped on parenting advise it is not their specialty. My DD nurded to eat at least untill she was 10 m. old and after that it was more for comfort at night.

[Mosaic]

Nurse and snuggle your baby, and don't worry about it.

My first DD had 2 teeth at 3.5 months, and my second DD waiting until 4 months. When DD1 was teething, she refused to nurse during the day because of the pain, but she'd nurse like crazy half-asleep at night so get her calories in.

Though I'll also mention that you may want to offer more during the day as well. My second DD did that crazy night-waking at the same time, and she was able to sleep a bit better at night when I tried really hard to tank her up during the day. That said, she's 7 months and we still wake up 3 times a night, which doesn't bother me.

[childsplay]

Aw he's full of poop.  

Her teeth are moving upward getting ready to break through the gums...and it must hurt.....where does he think the teeth come from anyway??

She's only tiny, if she, and you want to keep nursing at night then why not? So what if it's just for comfort, she's only tiny. Just keep following your instincts and you'll be fine.

(Someday maybe you'll be posting his 'words of wisdom' on the 'dumbest thing someone ever said to you about parenting' thread here on MDC : )

[Katie T]

Don't listen to drs for parenting advise. She could very well be teething (sounds like it to me and I have had 3 kids). Also comforting nursing and sucking for confort in general are wonderful for baby. I say ignore everything he has said as I too feel he is full of it! Enjoy our baby and keep listening to that mommy gut of yours, it sounds like it is right on track!

[ssh]

My oldest DD got 4 teeth in at 4 months, 2 at a time. My youngest DD was still nursing about every 2 or 3 hours at that age and she didn't have teeth until 7.5 months. Your ped doesn't know what he's talking about.  Nursing on demand is recommended for babies even by the AAP.

[Anastasiya]

My little ones always start teething right around 4 months, though no teeth break through till a few months later. But they are noticeably bothered by the pressure, or sensations, in their gums.

Your ped sounds very opinionated. Of course you should keep nursing her. Nursing is about nutrition AND comfort.

[waiting2bemommy]

Teeth sometimes move up, about to break through the surface, and then don't for a while. Our dd did the same thing at about 4 months, complete with drooling, nightwaking and general misery, and then stopped altogether, and just recently picked it back up at almost 7 months. And she still does not have a visible tooth, but this is not the first teethign baby i've encountered in my life and I'll be darned if someone tried to tell me it isn't what I know it is.

Pediatricians imo are good for two things: making sure your child does not have some deathly illness, and as an excuse for grandma (as in: the doctor said xyz) beyond that I just pretty much ignore them.

also goldenseal works wonders, when you do finally see the tooth about to break through, you rub some of it on the gums and it speeds up the process while easing the pain.

Oh and my ds comfort nursed at night until 15 months. I nightweaned him at that point and he continued to nurse until he was just shy of 2. He was also potty trained at 15/16 months which most people consider early. So don't worry about the nursing...it will not make your baby be a baby forever....enjoy it while it lasts and cross that bridge when you get to it!

[gardenmama76]

thank you everyone!  I always trust the opinions of mamas over doctors!  This baby took 3 years to conceive and in that time of discovering I had just about every fertility impairing affliction known to man, I went  through FIVE obgyns.  When one would stop giving me answers (each thing was diagnosed by a dif dr) or say they didn't know what they saw growing inside me during my surgery but didn't bother looking anything up to give me answers at my postop (happened 2x w/2 dif docs!)...I'd move on.  The only reason I got pregnant was because I kept demanding answers and ended up reading a lot of medical journals myself when the docs didn't have answers.  But I ALSO got a lot of info from other women online going through fertility problems.  I began to trust them FAR more than the doctors!

As I do with this!  It's just hard because in this instance I wouldn't feel so inclined to go to a medical journal for answers.  Parenting is far different from physical ailments.  So I appreciate all of the input and I will keep doing what I've been doing - which, consequently, has been raising a very happy baby who is growing practically off the charts for her height and weight!  I think she's doing just fine...

Oh and a big thanks to sfcmama for those articles!  I can't wait to show my husband!  It was great to discover I was not alone in this sleep change and that I wasn't doing anything wrong.  Now I'll be armed when we go to stay with my evil mother in law next week who is so critical of the AP thing and keeps demanding that I should let Zoë cry it out and sleep in a crib.  I'm sure when she hears she's gone back to waking more frequently in the night she'll try to pin it on me or AP somehow!

thanks everyone! :) 

[MeepyCat]

I may be the exception here:  I do look for parenting advice from my pediatrician.  I looked very hard for a pediatrician who would be a good philosophical match for our family, and the way that we want to raise our kids.  She's given me great advice on feeding and sleeping (including co-sleeping).  She helped me breast feed until my son was nearly two, and when I wanted to, she helped me wean.  She's completely awesome, and I love that I have her as a resource.  I would find a new pediatrician in your shoes.  He's giving you bad advice, and he's flat-out wrong on some things. 

Some babies are *born* with teeth, so yes, your four month-old certainly *can* be teething.  Whether she'll actually cut a tooth anytime soon is anyone's guess.  I think previous posters are right about teeth moving up in the gums.

Babies do go through all kinds of different cycles with waking and sleeping, so just tune your MIL out of you can. 

[MrsBone]

Trust your own instinct mama, if you think she's teething, she probably is. my son started teething at 4 months...drooled all the time but didn't pop any teeth until 6 months. As far as nursing to sleep? You have to be prepared to break the habit if you start to get tired of it later on. I wish I had started getting my baby to sleep w/o nursing at an earlier age. He's now 22 mo and weaned, but it was a battle! Either way though, you'll have to battle breaking the paci habit or the nursing habit..you just gotta decide :)

[sosurreal09]

you're baby already seems to be doing great with 4 hour stretches! i would not listen to him. he's trying to promote independent sleeping in you're DD...thats why he's saying it. we personally dont use a paci for several reasons but i still nurse my 13 m/o at least 2x a night. i think she needs it b/c shes hungry although when we have an all night nursing marathon its comfort, but like you said they are sooooooo young! i mean why wouldn't i comfort and nourish my baby? could you go 10+ hours without any food or drink? i mean seriously people have ridiculous expectations for babies and even toddlers! thats great you want to nurse her until shes 2...maybe look into child led weaning? just saying haha but seriously congrats on the new baby and the BFing relationship! you are doing what's best for you're child period! also infants and beyond go through all kinds of sleep regressions periodically you're lucky shes a good sleeper! When DD was 4 months old she was up like every 45 mins....

[blessedwithboys]

"Now I'll be armed when we go to stay with my evil mother in law next week who is so critical of the AP thing and keeps demanding that I should let Zoë cry it out and sleep in a crib.  I'm sure when she hears she's gone back to waking more frequently in the night she'll try to pin it on me or AP somehow!" 

Unless the baby is screaming in the night, how would she know?  Just don't tell her bc it's really none of her business!  :)