Advise for 5 month old cat napper

[superlove]

Hello fellow mamas,

I have an almost 5 month old boy and he's great, sleeps decent at night, but will never take a nap longer than a half hour.  He sleeps in his crib, usually falls asleep on his own, with white noise in the background. We also just got black out curtains, it's only been a couple days, but haven't seen any changes with this.  I know I should do a pre-nap routine, but since his naps are so short, he's constantly going down for naps throughout the day, and I can't bring myself to do a pre-nap routine everytime.  So we just manage to swaddle him and sing a short lullaby and rock him for a few minutes with his pacifier, then put him in his crib.

Does anyone have any advice of suggestions.  I've gotten varying opinions, some say this is normal, and others say its too short of a nap to get any benefit.  I've tried the no-cry sleep solution technique of trying to get him to go back to sleep, but he almost never seems to go back to sleep, even with rocking/ nursing etc...

Is this something babies just grow out of? has anyone else had experience with this?

Thanks so much for any advice or suggestions.

[porcelina]

Ugh, this takes me back! DS1 was like this -- never more than 20-30 minutes in a crib/pack-n-play. Woke up startled that no one was around. Sometimes he'd go back down with lots of bouncing, but not always. Of course, napping on me in a carrier, nap could last 2+ hours! He did eventually grow out of it, but only as his sleep cycles got longer! I think some LOs are just more sensitive to the environment, and can't make it through a complete sleep cycle. I would imagine a conventional person would say that the only way to teach such a child to sleep is to cry it out. But, this child is so intense, that could CIO for hours!! So, I think unfortunately the only answer is to just wait it out, and keep trying the get them back down technique to get a bit longer nap when you can (or, let them nap on you -- I know someone who did this for a long, long time!)

Hugs!

[P.J.]

My DS is the same way! 5.5 months and rarely naps for more than 30 minutes. It's maddening! I'm curious to hear from mamas of older babies if they do grow out of this.

[aphel]

Sigh. Just came on MDC to start this thread, exactly.

I'm not even putting DD down any more, I just wear her or lie next to her with boob in mouth for the whole darned nap. I'm going back to school in January and I'm worried she won't nap at all without me or my boob.

Would also like to know when other mama's babes grew out of this???

[P.J.]

Originally Posted by aphel 

I'm not even putting DD down any more, I just wear her or lie next to her with boob in mouth for the whole darned nap. I'm going back to school in January and I'm worried she won't nap at all without me or my boob.

Ha, yeah I do the same thing sometimes. It's like, why bother putting him down when he wakes up so soon after? Sometimes he even wakes up from being laid down and the whole nap is ruined. So I just nurse him down and use that time to catch up here or otherwise do stuff online. I have the same concern about nursing down and DH hates it that he mostly cannot get DS to sleep on his own, plus I need more time off so sooner or later DS will have to get used to others putting him down.

Anyway, there is a solution in The No Cry Nap Solution book about catnapping (and nursing to sleep, BTW)....the method mentioned in the OP...and I have used it with success -and also woken him up when trying to use it, oops! To be honest I am just too lazy to consistently apply it for weeks on end which it requires to retrain the baby to sleep through more than one cycle. As annoying as the catnaps are, in a way I feel like 'If it aint broke...'. I guess I'm just hoping he will outgrow it.

Originally Posted by superlove 
.  I've gotten varying opinions, some say this is normal, and others say its too short of a nap to get any benefit. 

My feeling is: if the baby seems healthy and relatively content, then it's not a problem (unless it is a problem for you). My intuition tells me DS is getting enough sleep, even though I know he gets less than all the books and experts say a baby his age should be getting, so he could get more. But if I hadn't read any of that I would not be thinking he had a 'problem', kwim?

[Shanesmom]

Shane is about 4 months now and sleeps about 45 minutes. I'd say it's normal and not to worry.

I also do the whole falling asleep with boob in mouth thing and I love it. I appreciate the quiet time and I love holding him

[superlove]

Great to see I'm not alone! I agree with P.J., Pantley's solution  in the No Cry Sleep Solution is very tedious and I've tried it but never consistently for a few weeks as she says.  I also agree that if it ain't broke don't fix it.. so I vacillate between trying to fix it and getting him to nap longer, and giving up and accepting that it might be normal and enough for him.  

BUT, yesterday after I posted my question, I decided to just give him my boob and let him fall asleep on the boppy with boob in mouth... and he slept for 3 HOURS!!!!-  which was amazing and made me think that he must be sleep deprived and tired...

So today I'm trying something new, instead of putting him down in the crib, I nursed him to sleep in my bed, then crept away once he was asleep, then basically did the pantley solution, hung around the room till he woke (30 minutes on the dot!),  the laid down next to him and gave him the paci and patted and shhhhed him, after about 5-10 minutes he fell back asleep and he's sleeping right now!!! --- I'm going to try to suck it up and do this for a week and see if he will learn to sleep through his sleep cycle.

Let's see, i'll report back.  The good news that I discovered i can put him back to sleep if i lie next to him, whereas in the crib, i couldn't get him back to sleep and picking him up out of the crib to rock and nurse just woke him up even more....

I'll keep you all posted and look forward to hearing other peoples experience and advice...

[ann_of_loxley]

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

I know I should do a pre-nap routine

 Should you?  Really?  Why?  Who says? lol 

A nap is a nap.  If he is happy and devloping well - how is this not good enough and how is he not gaining anything from it?  I don't get it. 

DS1 (at that age) used to have a two very long naps a day.  DS2 has anything up to 6 small naps a day.  Both slept well throughout the night (DS1 sleeping through at a few months old and DS2 is on the boob all night long (we go sleep of course) but never actually wakes up - so despite the fact he feeds thoughout the night, neither of us wake for it so he does sleep through the whole night).  DS1 was pretty slow to do anything but thats his personality as well as he is a perfectionist. DS2 is a right monkey and is already zipping around the house 5 months sooner than his brother ever was! lol  Both were happy content babies. 

I don't get nap 'routines' - I don't get any routines.  I don't get why anyone should have to do anything.  ? 

[superlove]

I see your point (ann of loxey) and I think what your saying is valid (about not having routines), but I also feel like my baby is not really fully rested after a 30 minute nap, and that accumulates throughout the day and makes his evenings really squishy (our family code for tired).  I think it just depends on your instincts as a mom on what's best for your baby and you.

[newmamalizzy]

DD was the same way from about 4 - 6 months.  Once I finally learned her patterns, we did end up bottle-feeding for the entirety of 4 40 minute naps each day.  She napped after approximately every 1.5 hours of awake time, then slept a 12 hour night.  I sat with her in the rocking chair the entire time, though it sounds like you may not have to do this if your LO can go to sleep OK by himself.  Honestly, I grew to really enjoy that time with Bea.  We had been SOOOOO frustrated about sleep for so long, and suddenly it became so easy.  All I had to do was sit quietly in a cozy room, snuggling my beautiful baby, smelling her hair, hearing her breathe...It helped us to reconnect after struggling for so long over naps.  I had to let go of the idea of doing chores or having time to myself during the day, but I think it was worth it.  The good news:  Around 6 months Bea started skipping right through that one-cycle wake-up and could sleep for 2.5 hours.  She did this completely on her own.  At first it happened sporadically, then on a more regular basis.  The bad news:  Now, at 7.5 months, she's back to short naps, but tends to only take two or three, or sometimes a longer nap and a short nap.  Whenever we feed, I give her the opportunity to nap.  It's not super-convenient, but it works for us.  Bea also can now fall asleep in different ways, so if she doesn't fall asleep to a bottle I can put her into bed.  So, from a catnapping veteran, all I have to say is give you LO the opportunity to nap frequently, don't let there be a lot of stress associated with sleep (forcing a nap, getting all frustrated when you can't get the nap to extend or put the baby down for naps, etc.), and trust that his/her sleep will mature and change over the next two - three months.   Heck, even if naps are still annoying, at least they'll be less frequent. 

As for a routine, we start with a diaper change, then take the long way to the bedroom, slowly turning out lights, shutting shades, and saying good nights along the way (Good night, Bella-cat!  Good night, Tom Ashbrook!  Good night, bathroom!).  This has become Bea's major sleep cue and even helps when we're trying to nap in an unfamiliar place. 

I really, really, REALLY understand what you're going through, and how it can feel like naps have taken over your whole life.  Wishing you the very best of luck.

[P.J.]

Originally Posted by ann_of_loxley 

I don't get nap 'routines' - I don't get any routines.  I don't get why anyone should have to do anything.  ? 

For many babies (and adults, lol!), a pre-sleep routine signals to them that sleep is going to happen and helps them to wind down and shift into sleep mode. My baby is pretty high-strung and if I just lay him in bed when I see he's tired, look out! Crying and fussing are sure to follow. But if I dim the lights, rock and nurse him and sing our lullaby, within 5 minutes he is either asleep or sleepy enough to transfer to bed.

Originally Posted by superlove 

So today I'm trying something new, instead of putting him down in the crib, I nursed him to sleep in my bed, then crept away once he was asleep, then basically did the pantley solution, hung around the room till he woke (30 minutes on the dot!),  the laid down next to him and gave him the paci and patted and shhhhed him, after about 5-10 minutes he fell back asleep and he's sleeping right now!!! --- I'm going to try to suck it up and do this for a week and see if he will learn to sleep through his sleep cycle.

Currently DS naps in our bed (we cosleep at night), and he has been army crawling for awhile and on the verge of crawling. Sadly, that means this bed napping will not last as he'll be crawling all over and falling off the bed soon. I usually have to lie next to him and nurse him back down after transferring him into the bed, and I'm not sure how that's going to work once he's napping in a crib ...???

Just something to consider when establishing a lying-down-together nap routine, you will have to change that once your baby's mobile...that or remove your bedframe.
 

[1blueheron]

I am still waiting for my 9 month old to "grow out of it."  Sadly, all she's done is drop down to two 30 minute naps.  Of course, she sleeps for 13+ hours at night...

ETA: it's not as dire as it sounds...if it doesn't change, you'll get used to it.  it doesn't make me feel insane any more (usually)   :)

Edited by 1blueheron - 11/21/10 at 7:47am

[faeriecurls]

DD is 2.5 months old and doing this - I was wondering if she will out grow it or if this is it forever? I nurse her down and lie next to her for a while. SOmetimes the patting and shushing works, other times it doesn't. I know that she needs more sleep though, because on the days it works she will go back to sleep and sleep for close to 3 hours, the days she doesn't she is miserable by the end of the day. I am worried because I have to go back to work PT in January and I don't know how we will find a sitter that will do this (without the nursing down of course) plus she doesn't like the bottle (she's only had one 3 times).

I'm glad that there are others out there going through the same thing.

[porcelina]

Originally Posted by superlove 

Great to see I'm not alone! I agree with P.J., Pantley's solution  in the No Cry Sleep Solution is very tedious and I've tried it but never consistently for a few weeks as she says.  I also agree that if it ain't broke don't fix it.. so I vacillate between trying to fix it and getting him to nap longer, and giving up and accepting that it might be normal and enough for him.  

BUT, yesterday after I posted my question, I decided to just give him my boob and let him fall asleep on the boppy with boob in mouth... and he slept for 3 HOURS!!!!-  which was amazing and made me think that he must be sleep deprived and tired...

So today I'm trying something new, instead of putting him down in the crib, I nursed him to sleep in my bed, then crept away once he was asleep, then basically did the pantley solution, hung around the room till he woke (30 minutes on the dot!),  the laid down next to him and gave him the paci and patted and shhhhed him, after about 5-10 minutes he fell back asleep and he's sleeping right now!!! --- I'm going to try to suck it up and do this for a week and see if he will learn to sleep through his sleep cycle.

Let's see, i'll report back.  The good news that I discovered i can put him back to sleep if i lie next to him, whereas in the crib, i couldn't get him back to sleep and picking him up out of the crib to rock and nurse just woke him up even more....

I'll keep you all posted and look forward to hearing other peoples experience and advice...

Wow! My newborn also seems to sleep better when there are cushy pillows involved. I guess people used to use lots of soft bedding with babies, and with so many cases of SIDS, they gradually said no soft bedding, no bumpers, no anything. Only hard surfaces. Now babies don't sleep! Sigh

As for when my DS1 grew out of the catnapping -- his catnaps just gradually increased in length from 30 minutes to then 40 minutes, to then 50 minutes, eventually to an hour and a half. Honestly, I can't remember when, but definitely he was past a year, maybe 18 months, when we started getting decent nap times from him. Again, this is for any nap on a flat surface with me not around. If I could hang around like OP and be there to try to get him through the end of the sleep cycle, sometimes it worked. You really have to go up about 5 minutes before they usually (always) wake up, and then pop the boob in right when they do. Definitely moving to the bed helps this strategy. I think we gave up naps in the crib pretty early, and having the boob out on the bed, allowing me to sneak away, was the best strategy for a long time. Of course, with babysitter, naps went much better, though I think at that age (around 12 months to about 19 months), she just eventually started putting him down on the couch so that she was right there when he woke, and he'd go back to sleep.

[superlove]

Currently DS naps in our bed (we cosleep at night), and he has been army crawling for awhile and on the verge of crawling. Sadly, that means this bed napping will not last as he'll be crawling all over and falling off the bed soon. I usually have to lie next to him and nurse him back down after transferring him into the bed, and I'm not sure how that's going to work once he's napping in a crib ...???

Just something to consider when establishing a lying-down-together nap routine, you will have to change that once your baby's mobile...that or remove your bedframe.
 

True, good point about having to move naps to the crib when baby is mobile.  I guess my hope is that if I can teach him how to sleep through his cycle (like is taught in the NCSS)- then I can move him to the crib and he'll be able to sleep longer without my help.  But that might be wishful thinking.

[superlove]

First of all, thanks to everyone for their input and experience...  and it's nice to know that i'm not the only one that is so frustrated by a seemly small problem.

Secondly, things did not go so well with trying out the NCSS technique for my little catnapper.  Taking him out of the crib for naps, and into the bed, so i could sooth/nurse him back to sleep seemed to mess up his whole routine :-(  

First of all, even nursing him while laying next to him did not work most of the time to get him back to sleep, only a couple of times.  Secondly, for some reason, when I tried to transition him back to his crib, even though it had only been like 2-3 days, he became super fussy and unable to fall asleep for naps... now it's been over a week of struggling just to get him to fall asleep, let alone extend his naps... So I guess the moral of this story for me has been a big fat "If it ain't broke, don't fix it".  A hard as the 30 minute naps are, I'm done with trying to "fix" it,  compounds the stress around naps and just makes it worse... 

[Knitting Mama]

I saw it mentioned briefly, but while my girl is a good napper now, she wasn't when she was younger, and I just wore her for her naps. That way I wasn't glued to the couch/bed and I could get stuff done while she slept. A comfy wrap, Mei Tai or carrier is a godsend for a lot of kids!

I also didn't see much mention of swings. That's where Cecilia sleeps now. She is still swaddled, and I strap the strap over her swaddled legs and it works just fine.

[lizsky]

I feel for you.  My DD was the same way.  She is almost 9 months now and she still takes naps that are shorter than a lot of the other babies I know, but it got better somewhere around 6-7 months.  Now she will typically take one nap that is longer than an hour and another that is 40 minutes.  I hope your LO grows beyond this stage too!