I need help with formula feeding and I don't know where to go for help

[SuzyLee]

DD never much cared for nursing.  After fighting her on a nursing strike for 3.5 weeks (including lots of pumping, herbs, dom, etc) I just couldn't do it anyone.  

Long story short, after nursing my first until 21 months, I now have an almost 9 month old who is completely formula fed and I am flummoxed.  I don't know how to do this!  I have so many questions but I don't want to turn to the mainstream sources that just assume a 9 month old will be in a crib, STTN, eating rice cereal, etc.  

Any other FF'ers who want to talk?  Or is there a tribe or something on MDC dealing with FF'ing, and how it intersects with AP?

TIA mamas, I am really struggling.  

[mzpuff]

Hey mama.. I too struggled with BF my daughter and so I started supplementing with formula at about 2 weeks.. now she is 3 months and she mostly gets formula bottles with 2 oz of breast milk. I'd be more than willing to help you out and answer any questions with whatever you're struggling with! Just let me know.

[mzpuff]

I'm also going to direct you to a thread on a different website (babygaga) just for formula feeding moms. Lots of helpful info and knowledgable people http://forum.baby-gaga.com/about104318.html

[SuzyLee]

Here is a random list of questions.

How big of bottles should she be taking?  She rarely even drinks 4 oz. at a time.  Seems like she should be able to take more.  

Shouldn't she be able to go 3 or so hours between bottles?  Or is that unrealistic?  Even Dr. Sears says 3 hours with formula.  We seem to be in this pattern where she is fussy for a bottle but only takes an oz or 2, so then she wants it again in an hour.   Should I not give the bottle?  Should I try to just keep her happy with water in between bottles?  Part of the reason I am unsure of this (vs. nursing where they just can nurse whenever) is that you are supposed to toss bottles that don't get drank.  And as expensive as formula is I do not want to toss a 4 oz. bottle that she drank 1 oz. of.

Night time.... Oy that could be a whole different post.  So with nursing, I am in the mindset that you don't night wean until 16-18 months at least.  But I am not feeling like I want to be giving 2 or 3 bottles a night for much longer-it is a LOT of work to do bottles at night compared to just rolling over and popping a boob into a mouth!  I am getting exhausted.  Our pattern right now is she takes a bottle at 6pm goes to sleep at 6:30, bottle again at 8 or 9, midnight, 4 am, then up at 6 am.  I have no idea what to do to change that.  And often the middle of the night ones she doesn't take the whole bottle, she just wants a bit then falls back to sleep.

Total formula intake in 24 hours is about 22 oz.  She weighs maybe 20 lbs.  Seems like she should be drinking more, but she does eat some solid food (I don't know how much because she self-feeds and makes a huge mess).  

I am sure I will think of more questions.

[coyotemist]

Formula feeding doesn't have to be much different than breastfeeding.  You just are providing the food differently.  My first 2 were nursed almost 2 years each, it was pretty easy, and then our third baby had issues.  At 2 years he still has swallowing issues and speech issues, so I know now that it wasn't my fault, and I'm sure it's not yours either.

You hold her as she takes her bottle.  Sometimes we gave a bottle in the night, the same way I nursed in the night with my other 2.  If you like to babywear, you might bottle-nurse in the carrier, you can still enjoy skin-to-skin contact, you still discipline with gentleness, you still love her!

Unfortunately bottle feeding requires a few extra steps, but here is what we did to make it easier:

We made a quart of formula at a time and added probiotics and kept in the fridge

We had a bottle cooler and kept a bottle or 2 made next to the bed at night

We held him, and didn't prop the bottle.

Bottle feeding isn't hard.  Just like everything else, you do the best you can.

[mzpuff]

Seems to me like she should definitely be taking more than just 4 oz, my LO is 3 months old and drinks 5-6 oz every 3-4 hours and then gets 6oz before bed at 9-10:00, she will sleep all the way until around 6 am. You say your LO is eating solids also so she may not be drinking as much formula but still I she should be drinking more than 4 oz, I think. Does she just refuse to drink anymore after a certain point or what? As far as not wanting to waste the formula maybe you should try putting 2 oz in a bottle, if she drinks it all and is still hungry.. give her 2 more etc. so then you aren't wasting it. 

About the night time feeding, Are you waking her up to feed her? If you are.. would she sleep through the night otherwise? Maybe try feeding her a big bottle before bedtime (if she will take it) and letting her sleep for as long as she will until she wakes up hungry. With bottle feeding I don't see any need in waking up so often to feed her throughout the night seeing as how she's not a newborn anymore. Anyways, hope I helped you out some. 

[laughingfox]

I'm unintentionally formula feeding my second after my first BF for 29 months, and I know how hard it is.

How new is she to bottles? My DD2 would only take 2 ounces at once for the longest time. Then she moved up to 4, then back to 2, then back to 4, then to 6, then 8, then back to 6. We feed on demand.

Your LO will probably go less than 3 hours between bottles if she's not drinking a lot at each feeding, 22 ounces in a day sounds like very little for her age/size, so I'd definitely offer more as soon as she's hungry, no matter what the clock says. Have you asked your doc about her volume of intake? The general rule before 6 months is 2 to 2.5 ounces of formula per day per pound of body weight, but it gets fuzzier when solids are introduced. Is she still gaining well?

As far an night feedings, here's what works for us:

My DD will take her formula at room temperature. She actually prefers it that way. (This is a huge help, especially when we're out during the day.) I would suggest seeing if your little one will do so as well, if you don't pre-mix formula in batches.
We keep formula powder in pre-measured amounts in a dispenser container on the nightstand, and we keep bottles with pre-measured water on the nightstand as well. It's a pain to set all that up before bed, but it really makes night wakings easier. When she wakes up and wants to eat, all we have to do is grab a bottle, pour the pre-measured formula powder into the pre-measured water, shake and feed. It takes 10-15 seconds, tops (well, not considering the prep time). We can prepare it and start feeding her before she fully wakes up and starts crying. If your little one won't take it room temperature, maybe it would work to keep the pre-measured baby bottle full of water in a bottle warmer on the nightstand, and add powder to that?

[laughingfox]

Also, I wear low-cut t-shirts a lot, and let DD rest her cheeks on my naked upper chest as much as possible when being carried/worn. I stroke her face while she eats (if I have a free hand). When she just wants to comfort suck on a pacifier, I rest the palm of my hand against her cheek, and/or put my fingertips on her nose to give her as much skin contact as possible. That extra bit of touch really seems to help soothe her.

She loves to nurse side-lying, and it helps her fall asleep. I prop her head on my arm and/or a pillow so she's on an incline when I do this to lessen the chance for ear infections. Also, we still use slow flow/newborn nipples, even though she's almost 7 months. It lets her have more time to eat slowly and suck for comfort as she eats. I think slower nipples also lessen the chance for ear infections (just my own opinion/guess).

[KempsMama]

I FF'd my first from 3 months on after I became ill.  I know how difficult it can be.  I agree with the PP about making larger amounts and storing in the fridge.  Also, she should be taking more ounces in at each feeding.  My DS never went more than 2 hours between bottles, ever, so I can't commit on frequency.  Have you started any solids?  

[SuzyLee]

Thanks for all the replies, I appreciate it!  I will try to answer all the questions.  Sorry in advance if I miss any.  

For how much she drinks at a time, I give her as much as she will take, then when she pulls away, I give her a break for a few minutes, then try again, and sometimes she will take a little more.  So basically I try to give her as much as she will let me, but she is very stubborn and once she decides she is done, that is it!

We do give her tap-temp bottles, so I do what laughing fox said and have pre-measured formula and bottles with just water so I just pour and shake in the middle of the night.  Still seems like so much more work than roll over and letting my boob hang in her general vicinity, lol!  We do NOT wake her up at night- hahahaha I wish!  No she wakes up just fine on her own!  And actually she doesn't drink all that much formula at night, it seems more like she just needs a little sip of milk and then she falls back into a deeper sleep for a couple hours.  But if I try to avoid giving her the bottle at night, she just tosses and turns and keeps waking herself and me up.  Maybe I need to just suck it up and let her do that for a few nights.

I either feed her in a cradle hold or in the sling during the day.  She typically likes to look around the room, not at me (same as when she nursed) but I will try the ideas to do much skin to skin contact. 

In terms of her solid food intake, I give her 3 "meals" a day and a few snacks, and she gets a sippy of water with that.  She makes a huge mess and smears food everywhere, and definitely eats some based on her poop .  We have a Dr. appt the week after T-day so I will have a better idea about her weight gain then.   When I get closer to the appt.  I think I will keep a feeding log so that I can show the doc.  

Sigh....  we were out and about today having a great time, and had to go home bc I only packed 1 bottle since I thought we were just going to run out for a quick errand.  I really didn't appreciate how easy nursing can be (if your baby cooperates!).

[newmamalizzy]

My LO has been entirely FF for most of her life (she's 7.5 months now).  We make her a 6 oz pre-bed bottle, otherwise she rarely wants more than 4 oz at a time and prefers to feed frequently.  Since she's become more active, she's eating every 1.5 to 2 hours.  Yeah.  I know.  Honestly, I don't think my DD will ever take more than a 4 oz bottle. She takes about 24 - 28 ounces total in a day at 17 lbs, and I'd suspect that your baby could probably use a bit more.  I would suggest trying to feed your LO more frequently.  If she was always breastfed, perhaps her belly just isn't used to getting that much fluid in one sitting and needs to stretch a little.   As for night-time, you're absolutely right:  It is definitely more difficult than breastfeeding, but you'll get used to it, and at least you won't have to do it all that much longer.  You also described my DD to a T.  She wakes many times, takes a few sips, then conks right back out.  Lately I've been deliberately putting her back to bed sooner than I think she's ready.  She generally protests, and I soothe her with the same bottle.  Second time around she usually takes more than the first before falling back asleep, then sleeps longer before waking up again.  She really IS hungry, but sleep just overpowers her, poor thing. 

Also, I'm sorry to hijack, but, Coyotemist, is there a resource on this forum about swallowing issues?  I've started to suspect this problem for DD, and am really curious about your LO's symptoms and how you found out that swallowing issues were the problem.

[SeattleRain]

I have FF my baby his whole life due to my breast reduction surgery. I'd like to say I'm some kind of expert, and until probably a week ago I could have said that, but I'm struggling a little bit with it too. My 4.5m old is 13lbs so he should be drinking between 26-32oz a day and was drinking 5 6oz bottles but lately he's on a bottle strike. Seriously. The kid won't drink. I think today he's had 17oz of formula. He'll wake up once tonight and have 6oz so he'll get up to 23 which isn't so shabby.

Your baby should definitely be taking around 4 ounces per feeding. Are you sure she's hungry when  you feed her everytime? I know it seems antithetical to the "feed on demand" mentality of breastfeeding, but I try to keep my baby on a schedule of eating at MOST every 3 hours. Perhaps try a paci in between. She may just want to suck and not want to eat. I also would try different bottles (that's what we're trying right now to combat the bottle strike), warming them up or even changing the formula. We were using Earth's Best for a month or two and he wasn't really eating that much and was quite constipated so the pediatrician recommended trying some different formulas and sent us home with a few smaples. We ended up going with Enfamil and things had been going much much better. Ask your pediatrician for some formula samples of the big three, Enfamil Similac and GoodStart and see if your baby prefers a particular taste.

[laughingfox]

Don't forget the store brands, too. The company that makes Earth's Best also makes the organic formula for the WalMart store brand (for half the price) as well as the standard store brands for Walgreens, Target, BRU, etc. My daughter does best on the standard store brand formula, which I never would have expected.

Another trick I picked up: When your baby's drifting off to sleep and has stopped sucking on the bottle, try twisting it left to right slightly in her mouth a couple of times. That always gets my daughter to start drinking again.

[sageowl]

RE:  random list of questions.

Q:  How big of bottles should she be taking?  

A:  Depends on the babe's size, energy level and appetite.  To gauge, start with 4 ounces.  If DD polishes that off, give a bit more (1-2 ounces).  After a few feedings, you should see a pattern of consumption.  But keep in mind that it changes over time.  My ginormous babe varies widely on how much formula he wants--sometimes he wants 6 ounces, other times, only 3 or 4 ounces.  Occasionally he gets "snacky" where he wants 2 ounces, but more frequently. 

Q:  Shouldn't she be able to go 3 or so hours between bottles?  

A:  That too depends on your child.  I feed mine on demand, and sometimes it's 2 hours, other times it's more like 4.  Just go with whatever your DD seems to want--she'll let you know what she needs. Ignore the experts.

Q:  We seem to be in this pattern where she is fussy for a bottle but only takes an oz or 2, so then she wants it again in an hour.   Should I not give the bottle?  

A:  It sounds like she's doing the "snacky" routine--mine did this for a couple of weeks at that age.  Then he went back to his normal pattern.  

Q:  Should I try to just keep her happy with water in between bottles?

A:  You can if you're worried about the amount of formula she's getting, but earlier, you said she barely finished off 4 ounces, so it doesn't sound like she's eating too much.  BTW, it's okay to treat FF like nursing, and feed on demand.

Q:  You are supposed to toss bottles that don't get drank.  And as expensive as formula is I do not want to toss a 4 oz. bottle that she drank 1 oz. of.

A:  This is why it's good to get a feel for what her feeding patterns are.  Technically you're not supposed to save formula, and it's up to you how strictly you want to follow the feeding guidelines on the canister, but due to my financial situation, I've personally chosen NOT to toss out perfectly good bottles of unfinished formula--I just stick them in the fridge right away and use them during the next feeding.  I've never had a problem, myself, but that's my own choice.  You'll have to decide what your comfort level is with deviating from the guidelines.

Q:  I am not feeling like I want to be giving 2 or 3 bottles a night for much longer.

A:  Mine has always been a big night feeder, so I can sympathize.  (Back when I was still working, he started reverse cycling, and wanted to breastfeed all night--which was so effortless that I didn't really mind all that much).  When he was a lot older, and eating 3 meals a day of solids, I stopped feeding him overnight.  To wean him off the night feedings gradually, I gave him bottles of water instead of formula, reducing the amount a bit each night.  I would simply fill them up and bring them to bed with us, and just reach over and grab one if I needed it.  Not quite as convenient as breastfeeding was, but still better than trekking out of bed to mix up formula.  After awhile he started waking up less and less.  He still wakes up once for a "sip" of water, but I can live with that.

So based on your pattern:  You'll still want to feed your DD  at 6pm, and again at 8 or 9 (to tank up for the night).  You may want to gradually eliminate some of the night feedings:  I'd start with replacing just one at a time.  You can try using my water method, but this assumes you have a kid that will drink water out of a bottle (mine is used to this because he has always been very hiccuppy, so is quite used to drinking water).  If she totally won't go for it, just decrease the amount of formula at each feeding, since she's not drinking much at night anyway.  Eventually she might start skipping some of them, and you'll get way more sleep.

An addition hint to make the whole night time thing easier:  Make a few bottles before you go to bed, so you're not trying to do it in the middle of the night.  I'm assuming you're using powdered formula here--just put the powder in the bottle, but don't add the water until you need it.  Then all you have to do is add water at the time of use.  (for example, I'd keep a few beside the bed with a bottle of room temperature water, and once the babe started stirring, I'd just add the water and shake--I didn't even have to get out of bed).

Hope some of this helps.