discipline and finding a school for kindy

[chelsmm]

I had been planning on homeschooling for a while now, but things have recently changed, and most likely we will be sending our kids to school.  My dd is going to be in kindergarten next year.  Our options are-

public school

private Catholic school

private non Catholic school

My biggest concern right now is discipline styles.  The public school in town and one of the two Catholic schools use a green/yellow/red light system.  The children all have their names on the board, and everyone starts with a green light.  If a warning is given, the light changes to yellow.  5 minutes of recess are missed.  If the child is warned again, the light changes to red and recess is missed entirely.  The Catholic school gives a sticker at the end of the day to children who have green light behavior all day.  This goes against everything we do at home.  It's not the way I want my children to learn.  The other Catholic school in town does not list on the website how they handle discipline.  I need to take a tour and ask some questions.  The third option private non Catholic school is amazing.  But it's very expensive.  I am going to apply for financial aid, but most likely we won't get it.  We could possibly send the kids through about 2nd grade, but then we'd have to pull them out and send them to either Catholic private (if we could even afford that after paying for the third option private school for a few years ) or public. 

So I'm wondering what everyone thinks about this type of behavoir system.  Do you feel it will negatively impact a child?  My daughter is unlikely to ever even get a yellow light warning, but I still don't want her getting a sticker every day for behaving in school. My son...he's three and very energetic.  I don't know how he'll be at 5 when he enters school, but if he's anything like he is now, he could get a lot of yellow light warnings.  The thought of missing recess time makes me cringe. 

I'm also wondering how other parents here deal with non GD schools when GD is the way at home.  Does it matter?  Do you care much about it?  Am I making a big deal of nothing? 

Thanks for your input.

[GuildJenn]

It's not my preferred system either but I think it's likely that next year my son will be in a school with a similar discipline system. 

For me if all the other components were in place - a respectful, age-appropriate classroom with good materials and a caring teacher - a card system wouldn't be my deciding factor. It's behaviour mod, and I am not a fan. But it's not super harsh and I think most kids are resilient enough to learn how to work it and move on.  I don't think it's as demotivating as some other methods can be (lines, sitting in the corner and so on).

I would probably mildly express my concern about kids missing recess in this day and age where we understand how important physical activity is to learning, but I'd also make sure my kid had lots of time to run around before and after school. This is my plan anyway. Then, of course, if there are further issues in the year I'd address them.

Just some musings...when I was in elementary our school still had the strap and I have vivid memories of my grade one teacher breaking a metre (yard) stick over a child's bottom, so I tend to think schools have come a long way, and I appreciate that part of having 20+ kids in a classroom is sometimes people will resort to methods that are less than ideal. This seems to be the pet system they're adopting these days, and in a few years it will be something else. I really think the search for the perfect education every minute of every day is driving all us parents insane and although I think we have a responsibility to keep working at it, there is also nothing wrong with saying "we can't afford this crazy tuition and in return we'll put up with a card & sticker system for a couple of years."

[amma_mama]

I agree with GuildJenn - you have to look at the whole picture of what each school has to offer. While the lucky few manage to find thier ideal (and have the means to pay for it, if it is a private school or homeschooling option). It is not my classroom management system of choice, but I understand the need to have a system to reinforce rules for 20+ kids.

That said, I also do not like the system very much. DD has it for first grade this year. She was very upset by the system when she got her first "yellow" as she really took it as a permanent "judgement" of her character (i.e. she was now on yellow for life. Once I explained the system more to her, she took it more in stride and I so not believe that it will affect her much. Fortunately, they do not lose recess, they have to walk "laps" during that time, so still get physical activity even if it is not the activity of their choice. As much as I dislike the system in general, the part about losing recess is just counterproductive to the goals. DD's school, a pulbic one, makes a big deal of ensuring that kids get adequate opportunities for physical movement throughout the day.

[madskye]

DD's school has this system for kindergarten.  She seems to take her color status in stride and definitely doesn't connect it to "good" or "bad"--as far as I can tell, in her class her teacher has rules and the color system indicates how well you did that day following the rules.  Some days, she just has a tough time following the rules.

No one misses recesses or anything like that for reds.  At the end of the day if you're on green you get a gold star, and at the end of a row on the star chart, you get to pick a treat from the "treasure chest" which is wildly exciting for her.

It's definitely useful to me in gauging her adjustment.  She's really picked up in the star department in the last few weeks, but the beginning of school was not so starry.  I can see she is doing much better now at working within the rules of the classroom.;

[MJB]

My 2nd grader's school has a system like this (3 faces, happy, neutral, sad). He's had a happy face every day so far and it really isn't a big deal to him. It's not on a board, it gets stamped in their agenda so theoretically it's not so public, it's just to communicate with parents, but in reality, they know who gets the sad face stamps. I don't think the kids really care that much, though, seeing as how the same kids get smiley or sad faces almost every day.

They also lose recess when the class gets out of control which is the one thing I don't agree with. If it's just a couple kids, they have to walk laps at recess but if it's a lot of kids, the whole class loses recess, which isn't fair or productive IMO. I plan to talk to the teacher about it at our next conference (I have also requested a classroom switch which I may get after the holiday break).

[eepster]

When these systems are being dictated by the school board/principal/director, and aren't the teachers idea, implementation will vary greatly.  I would focus more on what the actual class room your child will be in, and less on what the general policies on the website.

[whatsnextmom]

You know, what you teach at home doesn't get wiped out because they go to school. Truely, kids aren't so easily brainwashed. If you are honest about your feelings about the system, the meaning (or meaninglessness) of the stickers, your own expectations, your child will believe you because YOU are the one she mosts trusts.

Both my kids used this system at some time in their schooling and niether were ever harmed by it in the least. Neither became dependant on rewards to fuel their drive and morality. They liked the candy or stickers they got for a week or two and then the goods would pile up untouched and eventually trashed. Neither ever "turned a card." The few kids who really need that sort of system (and there are a few that do) got it. Those that didn't just sort of forgot about it.

Attitude is everything. If you are honest, relaxed and non-chalant about it, your kids won't take it too seriously.

[chelsmm]

Thanks everyone.  We have narrowed it down to two schools, just waiting on financial aid info.  Anyways, one school uses the stop light system, but it seems like they don't reward or punish for yellow or red lights.  It is more of an indicator for the kids to know how they are doing.  The other school doesn't use anything like this at all.  But that is the more expensive, by a ton, school, and I'm pretty sure we won't get enough financial aide to cover it.

Anyways, thanks for the replies!

[EVC]

DD's kindergarten has a similar system. It is green (good), yellow (warning), red (they miss "explore time" or something like that), and blue (they get sent to the office). At first, I found it pretty icky, especially the "public" aspect of it (all the kids see who is misbehaving, etc). But it has turned out to be fine. The nice thing, I guess, is that none of the colors are "permanent": meaning, you can go to yellow, but if you correct your behavior, you can go back to green. For example, it's rug time, a child refuses to sit down, they go to yellow, then they sit down and participate. They would then go back to green. Going below yellow, from what dd tells me, is less common and is generally for more serious things like hitting OR if you persistently ignore your "yellow" warning and continue to refuse to cooperate with instructions. Even then, I think it is possible to earn your way back to green by the end of the day (which I guess is to show kids that they can make choices about how they behave).  I don't think anyone has gotten to blue yet. 

At the end of the day, everyone who is on "green" gets a star by their name on a chart. After 10 stars, you get a little note saying "I stayed on the green team" or something. Strangely, the kids LOVE these little cards. Dd is SO PROUD to bring them home. Not really my cup of tea in terms of discipline, but dd doesn't seem to have a problem with it. She never feels demeaned or publicly punished or anything (and I guess those were my initial fears). So I guess it's fine. And, honestly, with a class of 26 kids and one teacher, it's probably a reasonable solution. 

Edited by EVC - 12/5/10 at 11:03am

[melissa17s]

When my ds was in kindergarten and 1st, they used the green, yellow, red system, but fazed it out by the time dd was in kindergarten.  It did not really change ds' behavior.  We had all colors on various days.  One time he ate the red sheet he was supposed to turn into me while riding the bus home.  We would talk to him about his days, but no punishments or rewards.  It is a much better system then the candy as reward we have had with the majority of teachers at the kids school- it is not district endorsed, but most of the teachers use it here.

[Emmeline II]

Originally Posted by chelsmm 

Thanks everyone.  We have narrowed it down to two schools, just waiting on financial aid info.  Anyways, one school uses the stop light system, but it seems like they don't reward or punish for yellow or red lights.  It is more of an indicator for the kids to know how they are doing.  The other school doesn't use anything like this at all.  But that is the more expensive, by a ton, school, and I'm pretty sure we won't get enough financial aide to cover it.

Anyways, thanks for the replies!

Ds' public charter uses faces (smiley, straight, sad). Ds doesn't internalize these types of things so it hasn't bothered him, though his behavior has been good enough this year to ensure several trips to the "treasure box." His teacher just marks his folder at the end of the day. Recess is only missed due to infractions at recess (I believe that in some states it is not legal to withhold recess for classroom behavior).

His public school last year had a public traffic light system. I guess they are trying to used peer pressure? I don't thing behavior correcting measures should be public like that.