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We don't believe in Santa Claus. - Page 2

post #21 of 33

She may very well feel left out.  I was raised Jewish and I KNOW I felt very left out.  In fact, I used to pretend that I was Christian.  I don't practice any religion as an adult but we do celebrate both Christmas and Hanukkah as secular holidays.

post #22 of 33

I would avoid calling parts of other peoples religions "games."  

 

Think about how you will be explaining Jesus.  I am guessing that it will involve telling the basic story of the historical Jesus.  Then briefly outlining the more debatable parts of the biblical accounts.  Then finally an explanation of how there are people called "Christians" who believe that Jesus was the Messiah.  After this you will explain why your family doesn't believe that the Messiah has come yet and you believe Jesus was just another guy.

 

You can approach Santa (aka St. Nicholas) in the same manner.  You can explain about the historical St Nick. Give a general explanation of how saints are canonized and how they are then intermediaries to god (especially for Catholics.)   Explain that some men use dressing up as Santa to continue the works of St Nick.  Then explain how it is not a part of your faith.

post #23 of 33

We are Catholic, and we don't "do" Santa here either.  We celebrate the feast day of St. Nick, and exchange stocking then.  We tell our oldest that Santa is a tradition stemming from St Nick, and that some families incoporate him into Christmas instead of celebrating a seperate feast day.  It's annoying when strangers keep asking what Santa brought him, but as he gets older and has a better understanding of our faith I'm comfindent he'll be able to handle the repsonses.  

post #24 of 33

I'm glad to see people(Religious ) celebrating what they believe is the true meaning of Christmas and not the Pagan part (Santa ,tree decorations,etc).

With that being said someone here mentioned that we should not lie to our children and while I agree to a point what is the difference in me saying Santa is "real" than saying God or Jesus is real? 

 

Most Christain families would be upset if my child or any other child told your child God or Jesus was not real,Correct?

So why would it be okay for another child or adult to tell a Santa believing family he's not real?

 

I believe every one has the right to believe in whatever Religion or lack there of one they choose I however don't think anyone has the right to infringe on another persons beliefs,whether it's Santa,God,Jesus,faries or the flying purple people eater.

 

post #25 of 33


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sharon71 View Post

I'm glad to see people(Religious ) celebrating what they believe is the true meaning of Christmas and not the Pagan part (Santa ,tree decorations,etc).

With that being said someone here mentioned that we should not lie to our children and while I agree to a point what is the difference in me saying Santa is "real" than saying God or Jesus is real? 

 

Most Christian families would be upset if my child or any other child told your child God or Jesus was not real,Correct?

So why would it be okay for another child or adult to tell a Santa believing family he's not real?

 

I believe every one has the right to believe in whatever Religion or lack there of one they choose I however don't think anyone has the right to infringe on another persons beliefs,whether it's Santa,God,Jesus,fairies or the flying purple people eater.

 


You do touch on a good point here. I actually left religion because of the Santa lies. I figured if Santa is BS then their god must be BS, too.

 

The bible does preach against the "heathens cutting a tree". I remember that pretty clearly from my research.

Jeremiah 10: 1-5 does talk about cutting down a tree and decorating it.
God and Idols
1 Hear what the LORD says to you, O house of Israel. 2 This is what the LORD says:
       "Do not learn the ways of the nations
       or be terrified by signs in the sky,
       though the nations are terrified by them.
3 For the customs of the peoples are worthless;
       they cut a tree out of the forest,
       and a craftsman shapes it with his chisel.

4 They adorn it with silver and gold;
       they fasten it with hammer and nails
       so it will not totter.

 

 

 

Each family does have the right to raise their children as they choose.... as long as that belief does not harm them.

post #26 of 33

We don't do it either, and the one big downside of DS's small school is that EVERYTHING of the ENTIRE MONTH OF DECEMBER was Christmas (i.e. Santa, secular songs, etc.) related.  To the point that I have entertained the thought of changing schools, but I love everything else about this school and I feel that it would be at least almost as bad if not equally as bad anywhere else.

 

I flat-out told DS that Santa is all the other kids' parents playing a game.  That there is NOT really a guy in a suit who comes. What really happens is it's everybody's mom and dad buying the presents.  The "Santas" are really people in suits, just like when people dress up for Halloween.

 

And since we do not celebrate Christmas (being Muslim) this is not a game in which we participate.

 

Thanks to school though focusing EVERYTHING on it for an ENTIRE MONTH (grr)  DS1 told my mom he was upset by lack of Santa presents on the appropriate morning.

 

I know we as a family seriously need to work on focusing on our own holidays and traditions so that I can remind them of that at this time.....I've also entertained thoughts of yearly, month-long visits to DH's family.....from Thanksgiving through to New Year's....

post #27 of 33

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sharon71 View Post

I'm glad to see people(Religious ) celebrating what they believe is the true meaning of Christmas and not the Pagan part (Santa ,tree decorations,etc).

With that being said someone here mentioned that we should not lie to our children and while I agree to a point what is the difference in me saying Santa is "real" than saying God or Jesus is real? 

 

Most Christain families would be upset if my child or any other child told your child God or Jesus was not real,Correct?

So why would it be okay for another child or adult to tell a Santa believing family he's not real?

 

I believe every one has the right to believe in whatever Religion or lack there of one they choose I however don't think anyone has the right to infringe on another persons beliefs,whether it's Santa,God,Jesus,faries or the flying purple people eater.

 

I'm not clear on what place your first point has to do with the thread at hand (nor do I accept your distinction between the "real" or "true" meaning of Christmas vs the "Pagan" part or this idea that "Pagan" and "Religious" are different or somehow the antithesis of each other).  It's going to be difficult to avoid the conflicts that will arise when people hold varying beliefs or cultural norms.  I think it's safe to say that your comments about non-Santa believers applies equally to the Santa-believers as well, correct?

post #28 of 33

We are Jewish and we live in a primarily Christian neighborhood.  I had no trouble with the other children because we lived fairly secluded from everyone else.  This year, however, we live in a cul-de-sac.  Kids on the block spent the entire season talking about what Santa was bringing them.  On Christmas day, ds (4 yrs. old), even though we explained that we do not believe in Santa, that he was for Christmas and we don't celebrate Christmas, woke up and started crying about how Santa didn't bring him any presents.  I said, "is Santa real?" he said, "NO".  So I asked why he was upset about it and he said that he WANTED Santa to be real.  I am honestly glad that this Christmas season is over because at least we don't have to go through this again. 

post #29 of 33

We are Christians and do NOT do Santa. DD1 is only 3yo and is just starting to get the whole holiday thing but due to our beliefs we feel that Christ and His birth should be the center of our holiday. I also don't like the idea of gifts being dependent on behavior and bribery. DMIL was totally fine with it (it didn't matter if she wasn't anyway) but I think my parents think we are "depriving" our kids. We still do presents, just not Santa so I don't get why they feel that way.

 

On a related topic, one of DH's cousins do Santa (and are very very very mainstream) and introduced this "Elf on the Shelf" thing this year. I personally thought the idea was really creepy. Apparently they move this elf around the house and he is supposed to spy on their children and report back to Santa their behavior and whether or not they get presents! I was honestly a bit apalled but they were so proud of themselves for getting their kids to behave for the season (they are honestly wonderful children year round so I don't understand this either) I explained to DD that we give gifts out of love, not because she was "nice" or "naughty". Even the term "naughty" I just can't stand....sigh.greensad.gif

post #30 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by philomom View Post


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sharon71 View Post

I'm glad to see people(Religious ) celebrating what they believe is the true meaning of Christmas and not the Pagan part (Santa ,tree decorations,etc).

With that being said someone here mentioned that we should not lie to our children and while I agree to a point what is the difference in me saying Santa is "real" than saying God or Jesus is real? 

 

Most Christian families would be upset if my child or any other child told your child God or Jesus was not real,Correct?

So why would it be okay for another child or adult to tell a Santa believing family he's not real?

 

I believe every one has the right to believe in whatever Religion or lack there of one they choose I however don't think anyone has the right to infringe on another persons beliefs,whether it's Santa,God,Jesus,fairies or the flying purple people eater.

 


You do touch on a good point here. I actually left religion because of the Santa lies. I figured if Santa is BS then their god must be BS, too.

 

The bible does preach against the "heathens cutting a tree". I remember that pretty clearly from my research.

Jeremiah 10: 1-5 does talk about cutting down a tree and decorating it.
God and Idols
1 Hear what the LORD says to you, O house of Israel. 2 This is what the LORD says:
       "Do not learn the ways of the nations
       or be terrified by signs in the sky,
       though the nations are terrified by them.
3 For the customs of the peoples are worthless;
       they cut a tree out of the forest,
       and a craftsman shapes it with his chisel.

4 They adorn it with silver and gold;
       they fasten it with hammer and nails
       so it will not totter.

 

 

 

Each family does have the right to raise their children as they choose.... as long as that belief does not harm them.


Philomom - This verse is taken out of context by saying that the tree is a Christmas tree.  It is referring to the crafting of idols by wood (and also adding other adornments).  An idol that they would give a name and then worship as their "god".  It is not referring to a Christmas Tree.  Unless of course you are worshiping a Christmas tree, which I don't think most of us do. :)

post #31 of 33

 

 

Quote:

I'm glad to see people(Religious ) celebrating what they believe is the true meaning of Christmas and not the Pagan part (Santa ,tree decorations,etc).

With that being said someone here mentioned that we should not lie to our children and while I agree to a point what is the difference in me saying Santa is "real" than saying God or Jesus is real? 

 

Most Christain families would be upset if my child or any other child told your child God or Jesus was not real,Correct?

So why would it be okay for another child or adult to tell a Santa believing family he's not real?

 

I believe every one has the right to believe in whatever Religion or lack there of one they choose I however don't think anyone has the right to infringe on another persons beliefs,whether it's Santa,God,Jesus,faries or the flying purple people eater.

 

we totally agree with this!

 

I find some of what is being said on this thread creepy too - 

 

Quote:
On a related topic, one of DH's cousins do Santa (and are very very very mainstream) and introduced this "Elf on the Shelf" thing this year.

 we love the elf-one persons creepy is not another's (say for god and jesus as well)

 

I hate to think some parents might infringe their personal creepies/beleifs on their children- I see so little tolerance in some who claim such devotion (for religious reasons) and have actually found non-religious believes far more tolerant and teaching their children tolerance of others religious customs.

 

post #32 of 33

I would say that DH and I are agnostic, and have never pushed any type of belief system (in terms of the major religions) on DD.  Disclaimer:  I don't think that "values" and "religious" leanings need to be inclusive.  DD, who is four, views Santa in much the same way that she views other fictional characters.  A Santa that she sees at Macy's is no different than the actors who parade up and down the avenues of Manhattan in Dora the Explorer or Statute of Liberty costumes.  They are merely characters to her.

 

Tough conversations, though, go something like this:  "Why doesn't [insert neighbor's name here] celebrate Hanukkah?"  I find these questions a little harder to deal with (with a four year old) than with questions about other traditions and religions.  It is easy to explain why other people do the things they do.  I find it a lot harder to explain why we are different because of our own traditions.  I'm sure it will get easier as DD develops.    But, explaining why we do things differently than people in our building and in the larger world is really tough.  I think it is really hard for a child to wrap her mind around the idea of being different, or at least celebrating traditions that are different than others'.  

post #33 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by pampered_mom View Post

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sharon71 View Post

I'm glad to see people(Religious ) celebrating what they believe is the true meaning of Christmas and not the Pagan part (Santa ,tree decorations,etc).

With that being said someone here mentioned that we should not lie to our children and while I agree to a point what is the difference in me saying Santa is "real" than saying God or Jesus is real? 

 

Most Christain families would be upset if my child or any other child told your child God or Jesus was not real,Correct?

So why would it be okay for another child or adult to tell a Santa believing family he's not real?

 

I believe every one has the right to believe in whatever Religion or lack there of one they choose I however don't think anyone has the right to infringe on another persons beliefs,whether it's Santa,God,Jesus,faries or the flying purple people eater.

 

I'm not clear on what place your first point has to do with the thread at hand (nor do I accept your distinction between the "real" or "true" meaning of Christmas vs the "Pagan" part or this idea that "Pagan" and "Religious" are different or somehow the antithesis of each other).  It's going to be difficult to avoid the conflicts that will arise when people hold varying beliefs or cultural norms.  I think it's safe to say that your comments about non-Santa believers applies equally to the Santa-believers as well, correct?



I did not mean to imply anything bad in my 1st sentence,I think you may have taken my post wrongly,I'll try to explain.

 

In my first sentence  I meant that I have heard many Christians say negative things about Pagan type holidays yet those same Christians then turn around and celebrateChristmas and Easter with Trees and related decorations same with dying eggs ,etc. I was nice to finally see some staying true to their beliefs without being hyopcritical.

 

 and yes I guess my comment applies to both santa and non santa believers and I thought that was clear in my previous post.

I don't want you (general you) telling my child that Santa is a game or fake any more than a God believing person wants me to tell them their God is not real.

 

 

maybe there's an easier way to have worded my posts to get my points across,but I have a tendancy to ramble. LOL

 

I'm sorry if my other post offended anyone it was not my intention.

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