Really need advice/ex requiring flu shot for visits

[robinchap1]

Hello.  I apologize that I haven't been on in a while, and am hoping that I can get some advice here anyway.  Thank you!

My son is 4, and it is just him and I at my house.  His father and I were separated when I was pregnant and he is now remarried with 2 young children and his wife is due with their 3rd in January.

Every year my ex and I argue about the flu shot.  I am not asking for advice about the vaccine itself, or I would have posted in the vaccine section.  This really is a single parent issue.  I have never had the flu shot nor have I ever given it to my son.  I respect people's decision to get it, but I don't feel it is right for us.  In particular with my son I don't find that he responds well to vaccinations (my ex and my ped don't believe me) and I am working very hard to build his immune system and try to minimize/prevent the development of allergies and possibly asthma that he shows some possible tendencies toward.  It is my belief that the flu shot will work in opposition to these goals.

This year, my ex's wife is having a baby in January.  They are all big believers in the whole flu shot scare and they are all vaccinated.  There is no convincing them otherwise.  The baby will be too young to be vaccinated this year and my ex is stating that if I don't give DS the flu shot that his time at their house will be "extremely minimized" this winter, which is "not what he wants and would not be good for DS."  He is very concerned about the threat of flu to the new baby and will severely limit DS's time around the baby and at the house.

He says it won't be an issue if I don't want to do it next year because the baby will be old enough to be vaccinated by then.  He is asking me to do it this one year.

Now, a little background without going on too long here.  DS, in theory, spends one afternoon/dinner each week there.  And then goes Friday evening to sleep over and spends the day Sat there.  In reality, my ex cancels a good bit, especially the overnights.  And this is before the new baby.  I am FAR from convinced that the flu shot is, in reality, going to have anything to do with his time there being limited.  He already doesn't take DS when he is sick.  HOWEVER, the picture that will be painted to everyone, most importantly to DS, is that he can't spend time there because Mommy wouldn't get him a flu shot.  That Mommy is trying to keep DS from spending time there.

DS generally loves to go there.  He goes through phases where he doesn't want to sleep over, and even sometimes when he doesn't want to go.  But in general, he likes to go and gets sad when his dad cancels.  He is excited about the baby and would be devastated if they didn't let him around the baby.

I don't know what to do.  Do I give in and do it this one year because emotionally it may be better for DS?  Or is that giving in to his manipulation and allowing it to continue?  I believe the flu shot is unhealthy for him. But I also believe his father's behavior if I do not get him the shot will be unhealthy for him. 

I am so torn about this.  I would love any thoughts, ideas, insights, etc. 

Thank you.

[coyotemist]

I don't know the right answer.  We are an on the fence family about shots in general...my older children always did fine with shots, but the youngest one does not.  I do fine with shots, and the flu shot this year has effected me much less than it has in the past (I have to get it for work).

If you do decide to get him the shot, be sure it's the shot and not the nasal mist.

What a rough place to be in, he sounds like a bit of a germaphobe.

[hillymum]

I think even though it's against what I believe I would give in on this one as I remember those new born hormones and how insane I could be at times. I would however get the ex to do it and pay for it.

[JBaxter]

Why not say... If DS is sick or starting to get sick he will stay home.  Which with the new baby in the house would be a good thing anyway.  Tell your X that in light of the flu shot missing the exact flu strain that IF the flu is bad ... like last years H1N1 then you will revisit it.

IF it gets painted as mommy wont get you a shot then "I" would fire back ... Mommy doesnt want you to get that big nasty shot because the shot could make you stick too.

I selectively delay  my kids and the flu shot for us is not worth it.  I would not give in on injecting my kids to make my x or his wife happy.  

[MeepyCat]

It sounds to me like your ex is trying to push responsibility for his decisions on to you.

It is ex and his wife who decide who is welcome in their home, not you.  It is ex who decides whether or not to make use of the generous visitation schedule that he has with your son.  It always has been, and it always will be.

Now, ex is trying to make this a flu shot issue:  they can't have the boy around because he has no flu shot and they have a newborn yadda yadda.  But it's still your ex making that decision.  It's your ex deciding to exclude your son from his home.  He's acting all regretful, and if you ask me, it's kinda BS.  If he really regretted it, he would make a point of taking your son out without the baby, or he would have hand sanitizer by the door, in the car, and next to the soap in the kitchen and bathrooms.  Every parent knows that the arrival of a new baby can make older siblings feel insecure and unloved, and most try to mitigate that as much as they can.

Given that your DS is four, I would get him the flu shot, mostly so that the picture you fear can't be painted.  But given your ex's habit of canceling, I think your poor DS is in for a rough time anyway.

[Goodmom2008]

I, personally, would not get the flu shot for my child.  It's your ex's parenting time to do with as he pleases.  Even if he chooses not to utilize it. 

I'm also not one to give in to someone who is using emotional blackmail, like your ex is, either.   Just my 2 cents.

[bananabee]

I wonder if your ex has had HIS flu shot?

I think if I were in your situation with my STBX, I would tell him that he can take your son to get the shot if he insists that he have it. I'd offer it as a compromise right up front, knowing that my STBX is way too lazy to use any of his "free time" to do anything responsible or "boring". If it became a real argument, then he might take me up on that to be obnoxious, but I know my STBX is all attitude and has little true parental concern for his daughter. It sounds like your ex's wife is running the show, so there might not be much you can do other than that. Then if he gripes, he doesn't have any basis for it.

[meemee]

i would give him the flu shot.

not for anything else but as a gesture to show ex that you fully support and care about what is going on in his life. that you respect his concern for the baby. 

he may not take ds that much. but he will know that you heard his request and even though you didnt really support it, you did it for ex kinda.

if your relationship is in the healing mode - then that's a huge deal. 

[haydn'smommy]

I'd tell X that he could take ds for the shot and pay for it.

[MissLotus]

the picture that will be painted to everyone, most importantly to DS, is that he can't spend time there because Mommy wouldn't get him a flu shot.  That Mommy is trying to keep DS from spending time there.

If your ex is the type to be likely to say something like this, then he's already saying it any time he decides not to have your son overnight or whatever.  I'm sure everything is already "your fault" anyway, you know?  So there really is no point in giving in to something you feel strongly about.  Your ex will say what he likes to your son.  Which you can't control (and it stinks).  But you can control the relationship you have with your son, always.  I don't mean to badmouth ex back, which you don't sound likely to do anyway.  I just mean that if somehow your son reports that you don't want him to have fun at Dad's, cheerfully tell him that of course you want him to have fun at Dad's.  But that you've decided it's healthier for him to not have a flu shot this year, and Dad is worried about germs around the new baby at first, but the older the baby gets, the more he (your son) can play with it.  Basically - honesty, pared down to 4-yr-old level. 

Tell ex that if your son gets sick, then you won't send him over there, period.  I totally get being careful with a newborn but there are so many flu strains, I really don't see how to guard against them all anyhow.  And if it's not that, it could be something else.  I am somewhat of a germophobe myself.  Hand sanitizer all over the place, the works.  And while this is a very uneducated observation, the only time I've had the flu in the past ten years is the one & only year I GOT the flu shot!  Came down sick with the flu the next day.  I suppose that could be coincidence but I don't think so.

Anyway, it's not a hill I'd die on, there are worst requests, certainly.  I'm just saying, don't let manipulation be the reason you decide something, as your ex will say/do whatever he wants if he's built that way.

[weliveintheforest]

I would not do the flu shot.  Plenty of doctors don't even believe they are helpful... hand washing is more important.  I would try to talk about it with your ex again, maybe with a polite email showing some articles, and a few suggestions for things you are willing to do to help minimize the risk.  

[Super~Single~Mama]

Originally Posted by JBaxter 

IF it gets painted as mommy wont get you a shot then "I" would fire back ... Mommy doesnt want you to get that big nasty shot because the shot could make you stick too.

You've gotten some good advice, I would caution against doing this though - it would put your ds in the middle of your arguments with ex.  NOT ok - your ds doesn't need to shoulder that burden.  If your ex is going to do that, fine, but then you need to step up and be the bigger person and not do it.
 

[One_Girl]

I wouldn't get the flu shot and I suggest that you document how much time your ex spends with him if he does cut back after the baby arrives so you can bring him back to court and have his visitation time cut down.  A child being sick is no reason not to do your job as a parent.  I think you should ask him if they will be excluding all people from her family and his who don't have a flu shot or only his first born son. 

Edited by One_Girl - 12/17/10 at 9:20pm

[soso-lynn]

I would never, under any circumstances, make medical decisions for my children based on other people's fear and/or convenience. You already decided on not getting the shot, you are not responsible for your ex's other children. I would not get it. If your ex does follow through with limiting visitations, then he can maybe agree to spending more time with your son in other locations or when/if the baby is not home.

[Goodmom2008]

Originally Posted by One_Girl 

I wouldn't get the flu shot and I suggest that you document how much time your ex spends with him if he does cut back after the baby arrives so you can bring him back to court and have his visitation time cut down.  A child being sick is no reason not to do your job as a parent.  I think you should ask him if they will be excluding all people from her family and his who don't have a flu shot or only his first born son. 

Just an FYI, this is a waste of time and money if the father is only getting EOW and a dinner during the week.  A judge isn't going to order less than that.  Now, if the parenting plan is for more time, then it would be worthwhile to go to court and get it changed and have child support calculated based on actual parenting time. 

But don't be surprised if the ex becomes father of the year and starts using all of his time as soon as he gets the motion.  

[One_Girl]

Originally Posted by Goodmom2008 

Originally Posted by One_Girl 

I wouldn't get the flu shot and I suggest that you document how much time your ex spends with him if he does cut back after the baby arrives so you can bring him back to court and have his visitation time cut down.  A child being sick is no reason not to do your job as a parent.  I think you should ask him if they will be excluding all people from her family and his who don't have a flu shot or only his first born son. 

Just an FYI, this is a waste of time and money if the father is only getting EOW and a dinner during the week.  A judge isn't going to order less than that.  Now, if the parenting plan is for more time, then it would be worthwhile to go to court and get it changed and have child support calculated based on actual parenting time. 

But don't be surprised if the ex becomes father of the year and starts using all of his time as soon as he gets the motion.  

That really depends on where you live, what the minimum custody is, and how good your lawyer is at navigating the court system. 
 

[Goodmom2008]

Originally Posted by One_Girl 

That really depends on where you live, what the minimum custody is, and how good your lawyer is at navigating the court system. 
 

A judge isn't going to order less than the minimum custody(unless it's a state that automatically orders 50/50 physical).  And if that is what is in the court order, going to court is a waste of time and money.  And will most likely annoy the judge.  Better to wait for when there's a chance of actually winning a change. 

And, really, all the other parent has to do is start using the time in the court order and the case goes out the window.

[One_Girl]

Originally Posted by Goodmom2008 

Originally Posted by One_Girl 

That really depends on where you live, what the minimum custody is, and how good your lawyer is at navigating the court system. 
 

A judge isn't going to order less than the minimum custody(unless it's a state that automatically orders 50/50 physical).  And if that is what is in the court order, going to court is a waste of time and money.  And will most likely annoy the judge.  Better to wait for when there's a chance of actually winning a change. 

And, really, all the other parent has to do is start using the time in the court order and the case goes out the window.

My ex has a lot less than the minimum visitation and a judge signed off on it.  My ex is not the kind who cares to get up off his butt to use his parenting time and judges don't probe into things that aren't contested (unless child support isn't going to be paid).  Showing the visitation history is also good for getting child support readjusted to reflect actual visitation.  There are a lot of different judges out there that order a lot of different things and sadly some dads are just to bad to even pretend that they care.  I am sorry it didn't work out for you but that doesn't mean it is a pointless thing to do.
 

[babygirlie]

I wouldnt

[Ceinwen]

Originally Posted by soso-lynn 

I would never, under any circumstances, make medical decisions for my children based on other people's fear and/or convenience. You already decided on not getting the shot, you are not responsible for your ex's other children. I would not get it. If your ex does follow through with limiting visitations, then he can maybe agree to spending more time with your son in other locations or when/if the baby is not home.

This.