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DH is uncut, he favors circ on DS at birth, I'm still undecided... - Page 2

post #21 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by summermommy2004 View Post

I would make him watch a video of a circumcision. And honestly if you're able to "not care one way or the other" that tells me you likely haven't watched one either. I can't even make it through an entire video of a procedure, so I'd be damned if I were going to allow something that horribly unnecessary to happen to my son.



This.

 

I even get sick looking at pictures.

post #22 of 29

Quote:

Originally Posted by chaoticzenmom View Post

My brother was intact and circ'd his son.  I honestly think that it was he equated foreskin with poverty.  My mother always told him that she just couldn't afford to get him done, so he was left intact.  [snip]

 

So, remind your husband that it's not a sign of poverty (it's 50/50 now) and the care of the intact penis is much gentler now.


This "reason" for circ that I think could be challenging for the intactivist movement, especially with Medicaid not covering circ ... it will translate to lower rates of circ overall, but disproportionatley in lower-income circles than in high-income circles. My sister circ'd her two sons, and gave as a reason that people in their "socioeconomic bracket" were almost 100% circ'd. Rolling eyes.

 

In earlier days, circ was used in the locker room to differentiate people of Jewish descent from others (this is depicted in lots of Hollywood movies set in the 1930s and 1940s) and was the basis for discriminating against circ'd boys at that time. Are we moving to a time when being circ'd will be a sign of relative wealth? Like fancy shoes or clothes? Sheesh. Please, say it ain't so!!

 

EDITED to remove suggestion that this was a "new" reason for circ. I was incorrect to refer to it that way. My bad!


Edited by vachi73 - 1/5/11 at 11:09am
post #23 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by vachi73 View Post

Quote:

Originally Posted by chaoticzenmom View Post

My brother was intact and circ'd his son.  I honestly think that it was he equated foreskin with poverty.  My mother always told him that she just couldn't afford to get him done, so he was left intact.  [snip]

 

So, remind your husband that it's not a sign of poverty (it's 50/50 now) and the care of the intact penis is much gentler now.


This is a new "reason" for circ that I think could be challenging for the intactivist movement, especially with Medicaid not covering circ ... it will translate to lower rates of circ overall, but disproportionatley in lower-income circles than in high-income circles. My sister circ'd her two sons, and gave as a reason that people in their "socioeconomic bracket" were almost 100% circ'd. Rolling eyes.

 

In earlier days, circ was used in the locker room to differentiate people of Jewish descent from others (this is depicted in lots of Hollywood movies set in the 1930s and 1940s) and was the basis for discriminating against circ'd boys at that time. Are we moving to a time when being circ'd will be a sign of relative wealth? Like fancy shoes or clothes? Sheesh. Please, say it ain't so!!



This is not a "new" reason.  In the 1930's boys who were born in hospitals were circumcised. Families who could not afford a hospital birth and had their babies at home were looked down upon as they were lower class. Consequently circumcision was seen as class distinction between those who could afford a hospital birth and those who could not.

 

Circumcision Decline 

In 1971, the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) reported that there are no valid medical indications for circumcision in the neonatal period.  After that the nationwide incidence of neonatal circumcision continued the slow decline that started in 1965.

 

In 1989, the AAP issued a statement that claimed that circumcision had "potential benefits". The publication of this statement temporarily arrested the decline in circumcision. 

 

In 1999, the AAP issued yet another statement that said the data on potential benefits were insufficient to recommend the practice of neonatal non-therapeutic circumcision. Shortly thereafter, the American Medical Association declared that neonatal circumcision is a non- therapeutic procedure. More parents began to opt for genital integrity and the percentage of boys circumcised once again began to decline.

 

The CDC data, reported by the New York Times, showed that the incidence of circumcision declined from 56 percent in 2006 to 32.5 percent in 2009. According to these statistics, non-circumcision or genital integrity has become the normal condition among newborn boys in the United States.

 

Circumcision is covered by 33 states and is also covered by military insurance TRICARE. This medically unnecessary surgery is not covered in 17 states. It has not been covered in California since 1982. North Dakota 1986, Oregon 1994, Mississippi 1998, Nevada 1998, Washington 1998, Missouri 2002, Arizona 2002, North Carolina 2002, Montana 2003, Utah 2003, Florida 2003, Maine 2004, Louisiana 2005, Idaho 2005, Minnesota 2005, West Virginia 2010, South Carolina 2011.

 

Personally I don't see a class or poverty factor today. If you examine the data it looks more like a regional issue with a huge majority of boys in the west being intact. In the U.S 67.5% of boys were left intact in 2009 while 32.5% were circumcised. In 2009, 15 states federal programs did not cover circumcision, there is no way that they account for 67.5% of births. It's also silly to think that people cant afford to pay for the procedure on their own. A decline this significant has to do with awareness. Yes, people in states who's federal programs do not cover it could very well be more aware. 

 

I am happily married to an intact man. Until we did our research we had no idea how lucky we were or what lube was used for.


Edited by JulianneW - 1/5/11 at 11:05am
post #24 of 29
post #25 of 29

 

Quote:
 DH really wanted our sons to be 'like him'. It's important to him

 

If your son is blond but your dh is dark will you color his hair? What if your sons are short and your DH is tall-will they get lifts so they are more like Dad? Why does your dh's needs trump your son's bodily integrity?

 

I can not support a decision in which a cosmetic "need" is used as an excuse to perform a surgery on an unwilling/unable to consent child.

 

 

Quote:
 decide not to for your SON's sake - its not about your husband - its about your CHILD. 

 

 

Well said.

 

post #26 of 29

I think it is becoming an education issue, to be honest.  Will you (generic "you") circumcise b/c you think everyone else does?  Will you leave him intact b/c you have considered the ethics of it?

post #27 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol_y_Paz View Post

Read this thread.

It made me think:

http://www.mothering.com/community/forum/thread/1278399/50-reasons-to-leave-it-alone



Thanks for that thread.  To be honest, number 13 suits me very well, too.  :-P

 

post #28 of 29
Thread Starter 

WIN!  I don't know if DH will read the article or not, but I've convinced him that medically, it's better to leave DS intact at birth, and there's no real reason for us to do it.  We're not part of any religion or community in which it is standard.  On top of that, the only thing that can really go wrong with being intact is improper care causing yeast infections.  whoopee - I'm sure DH will take care of that lesson.  lol

post #29 of 29

I am so happy for you! One article that you might print out and leave for him to read is http://www.drmomma.org/2009/10/how-male-circumcision-impacts-your-love.html

It may help him appreciate what he has. My DH is also intact and had no idea what he had been blessed with until I started researching and sharing with him. 

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