Strongly Considering a UC in June '11 Tribe...support only please!

[Tumble Bumbles]

Hi all. I'm starting this thread as a place for those of us who are considering or have decided a on UC (unassisted birth) for our June babes.It's a spin-off of a few threads discussing making the decision to UC.  It seems like those of us who are considering it are still working through some logistics, fears, plans, and feelings surrounding having an unassisted birth -- this would be a great place to talk about it, work through our fears, questions, and support each other on our journeys. Some mamas have already had one, or multiple UCs and of course are welcome here to share their wisdom, experience and so on!

I thought it could be a supportive place even if some of us ultimately decide against having an unassisted birth. Many of us are working against 20-30+ years of societal and cultural conditioning that says a woman cannot birth without "professionals". Some of us have had birth trauma, or c-sections, and though desiring UC, may later choose it's best mentally/physically not to. That's fine, no pressure!

I myself am still not sure if I will UC, though I feel really, really led to it. I had a home birth with my daughter and though my midwife was swell, the baby came with or without her and I feel like I would have been more comfortable alone (or with dh). I'm working through the fears and what ifs and I do think they're valid even if improbable or rare, because they affect the process and mental/spiritual state.

I know I have to get to a place of complete trust and I'm getting there.

 To be brutally honest, my biggest fears are CPS, and if something happened to the baby, everyone blaming me (including myself) even if it would have happened with a midwife in attendance. I also fear having to transfer and being treated like an irresponsible nutcase. I fear shoulder dystocia (sp?) even though these hips were made for birthin', I assure you lol, so that's not a big fear.  I fear the baby not breathing and me completely forgetting infant CPR or freezing and being of no help. I fear losing control during transition and calling 911 for no reason or something and blowing the whole thing etc... I don't fear hemorrhage for some reason because I've never been a bleeder at all and that's not a you're-dying-now scenario. I don't really fear breech but that would freak me out a bit I think, although people say it's not a big worry.

Obviously I have some things to work through but I feel really led to UC.

Welcome all :)

[jshannyn519]

(copied from the old UC thread so it's all in one place)

I went from planning a mw attended hospital birth to being on the fence about UC to being sure that UC is the option for me and this little bunny. The mws I'm seeing are CNMs and don't do HB, which doesn't bother me at all because I don't want anyone there, except maybe one of my best friends who is a super cool chick and very supportive. Every time I envision myself giving birth, it's in this corner of my bedroom, between the side of my bed and the closet door, with the light from the closet being the only illumination. It feels like it's late at night/early in the morning and it's just me and the baby working together in birth. Once I jumped all the way into the UC camp, my fears and anxieties pretty much vanished. Initially I was concerned about breech or weird presentation, but I have an entire library of midwifery texts and I've learned how to reposition a mama so that a different presentation isn't as much of an issue.

I totally plan on calling my MW group after baby is born and telling them that it went really fast at home, everyone is fine, and I'd like to come in to the office to get checked. I'll do the same thing with our pediatrician.

[tracymom1]

We should combine the two threads.  Anyone know how to go about doing that?

[kawa kamuri]

Originally Posted by jshannyn519 

I totally plan on calling my MW group after baby is born and telling them that it went really fast at home, everyone is fine, and I'd like to come in to the office to get checked. I'll do the same thing with our pediatrician.

I'm seeing a group of MW's that do both home and hospital births who, if I decide to UC, I'd like to contact sometime soonish after the birth. They're also my primary care providers and I'd like to stay in good standing/contact with them. I do have a history of precipitous labour with them (baby #4) so it might not be very very weird for me to ask what they prefer if I "accidentally" had this one without them. I don't want to give my plans away. I'd feel ok having a HB with any of these women HOWEVER if someone else is already labouring at home at the time I call they'll ask me to go to hospital. I birthed my 1st daughter there and it was fine, I was in transition anyway and the MW was a great advocate for me but I'd prefer to stay at home.

On the subject of being split between care providers - 

My complaints with this group (CNMs) is that they have to work under an OB and are subject to some janky protocol. Like, I know they'll get antsy when I go over my EDD as I always do. With babe #4 they asked me to get an US and NST at 41w (I didn't). I'll risk out of HB at 42w which I'm not worried about because I most likely will birth sometime 41w+ but not yet 42w. If my blood pressure gets a little high, which is not unlikely very late in pregnancy, I think they'll get all excited on me and I don't know what the consequences will be aside that they'll err very much on the side of caution. 

I saw a HB OB for baby #5 and I could still go with him. He's extremely hands off to the point where, I don't know what my problem with him is exactly. He's almost too nonchalant, lacks the hugs and kisses and warmth the MWs give me. The birth I had with him in attendance was as UC-like as one can get but I didn't like that my SO and I were left with 100% of the cleanup, I was never actually examined after the birth. This wouldn't bother me so much if I hadn't paid him. On the other hand, he charges 1/2 what the MWs do for HB. He's lax about returning calls. I've never had any pregnancy related or other health problems and this isn't my 1st day on the job. I know how to make a baby get out of me and I don't need or want people fawning over me. 

Beautiful and wise ladies of the June 2011 DDC, WWYD? Go with the warm, lovey but strictly mandated MWs, possibly UC if the HB slot was taken or go with the OB who is very chill, a guaranteed HB minus the cuddly stuff? FWIW my SO is not at all a fan of UC and, while we have plenty of time to talk and learn, it's important to me that I'm respectful of his wishes and comfort level. I feel pretty tormented by this choice, to be honest. I wake up at night thinking about it, the best path for me. I don't think either is wrong, just different. I have appointments set up with both the MWs and the OB next week and I'll choose one. Ai yi yi, I wrote a novella. 

[Mamatoabunch]

Hi mamas! Most of you know by now this is our 11th or so baby. My first pregnancy I had twins. I always have, are there two again, feelings lingering. Anyway, this is also my 11th pregnancy, I lost a baby very early just before expecting my 9th. My first birth I had a c/s, twin A breech. I had wanted a HB, but after we discovered twins I "thought" we would be safer in hospital. I had a HBAC w/ my third, a very hands off CNM. My midwives missed our 4th baby's HB. It was a lovely UC, my heart's desire. I have been UP and UC since. I am happy to have an intimate place to discuss w/ mamas due around the same time as I. Currently I am wondering if I have an anterior placenta b/c I only feel baby's movement down very low, bladder, cervix area. I have not experienced this before and surprised how little I feel baby at 18 weeks tomorrow. I have my general pregnancy worries or concerns, is baby well, are there two. Sometimes I think about getting an U/S to peek and see if there are two, but usually I just think I have always known so I eventually will. I need patience. I always worry about CPS. HB, UC, HSing, nonvaxing all puts me at greater "risk" of scrutiny, but I cannot live for that. I mostly just pray, pray often. I also slightly miss talking about my pregnancy w/ another women in person, solely focused on me. I talk w/ dh, but it isn't the same. I talk w/ the kids alot about the baby, they love hearing what size fruit or veggie the baby is each week. 

[Mamatoabunch]

Originally Posted by kawa kamuri 

Beautiful and wise ladies of the June 2011 DDC, WWYD? Go with the warm, lovey but strictly mandated MWs, possibly UC if the HB slot was taken or go with the OB who is very chill, a guaranteed HB minus the cuddly stuff? FWIW my SO is not at all a fan of UC and, while we have plenty of time to talk and learn, it's important to me that I'm respectful of his wishes and comfort level. I feel pretty tormented by this choice, to be honest. I wake up at night thinking about it, the best path for me. I don't think either is wrong, just different. I have appointments set up with both the MWs and the OB next week and I'll choose one. Ai yi yi, I wrote a novella. 

I really like the cuddly stuff, but less stress is much more important IMO. I would go w/ the HB OB.

[BarefootScientist]

I had posted in the other thread, had been considering a UC early in my pregnancy, but have now decided to have a CPM. I hope it's ok if I still lurk here (I'm supportive I promise!) and I did want to tell tracymom (I think it was you that asked in the other thread) what I thought of the Laura Shanley book. It is definitely not a how-to book, there is no practical stuff at all in there. It is mostly philosophical. It is heavily...um, I'm sure there's a word for it...the idea that you create your own reality by saying affirmations and so forth. For example, in one of her pregnancies, she repeatedly "said affirmations" that she would miscarry because it was not a good time for a baby. She didn't miscarry, but the baby was born early with some sort of birth defect and died. She says in the book that the baby's death was the late manifestation of her desire to miscarry. I was kinda appalled by that, to be honest. So yeah, there is a LOT of that in the book, so if you are into that type of philosophy you may enjoy it, but otherwise, the only practical advice you are going to get out of it is to hope and believe that you are going to have a perfect birth. I personally did not like the book at all and cannot recommend it...I hope that helps...and hope I didn't offend anyone who shares the author's beliefs!

[jshannyn519]

Originally Posted by kawa kamuri 

Beautiful and wise ladies of the June 2011 DDC, WWYD? Go with the warm, lovey but strictly mandated MWs, possibly UC if the HB slot was taken or go with the OB who is very chill, a guaranteed HB minus the cuddly stuff? FWIW my SO is not at all a fan of UC and, while we have plenty of time to talk and learn, it's important to me that I'm respectful of his wishes and comfort level. I feel pretty tormented by this choice, to be honest. I wake up at night thinking about it, the best path for me. I don't think either is wrong, just different. I have appointments set up with both the MWs and the OB next week and I'll choose one. Ai yi yi, I wrote a novella. 

I'm with mamacrunch on this, I'd opt for the less cuddly but more hands off HB OB. One of the things that I cannot stand (both about my insurance and the MWs that are covered under it) is that HB is just not an option. I dislike the inflexibility of my group although I like the CNMs as individuals and practioners. They also know my sister, who is an OB, so telling them that I plan to UC would get me kicked out of their care and my sister would be all up in my Kool-Aid. Neither of those is a good option for me. Since you have the option of a HB practioner, I'd totally go with him and get your cuddles elsewhere. As for the clean-up, could you maybe hire a doula and have her take over that role?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mamatoabunch 

Currently I am wondering if I have an anterior placenta b/c I only feel baby's movement down very low, bladder, cervix area. I have not experienced this before and surprised how little I feel baby at 18 weeks tomorrow. I have my general pregnancy worries or concerns, is baby well, are there two. Sometimes I think about getting an U/S to peek and see if there are two, but usually I just think I have always known so I eventually will. I need patience. I always worry about CPS. HB, UC, HSing, nonvaxing all puts me at greater "risk" of scrutiny, but I cannot live for that. I mostly just pray, pray often. I also slightly miss talking about my pregnancy w/ another women in person, solely focused on me. I talk w/ dh, but it isn't the same. I talk w/ the kids alot about the baby, they love hearing what size fruit or veggie the baby is each week. 

It sounds like you might have an anterior placenta. I had one with my last pregnancy and it took forever to feel movement and then when I did it was in weird places, like waaaaaaay over on each side, and in the back. I could actually feel her kicking my colon!

I miss my CPMs because they are super caring and nuturing and we would just chat about the pregnancy and how everything was going. The CNMs are less cuddly, which I can understand, but it makes me sad. Not having the emotional support and physical presence of baby daddy is hard. Pregnant women need to be cuddled and loved and I'm not getting that from many people in my life.
 

[tracymom1]

BarefootScientist - thank you for the info.  I had a feeling it was a little like that from a couple of reviews I found but didn't know if they were skewed towards being against UC.  I think I will probably just get some more 'instruction' type materials for now.  

And Kawa, the answer will come to you.  Maybe you need a whole day or at least several hours to just sit in peace and let your mind take you to the place where you need to be to make that decision.  I think with all of your birth experience and knowledge and the fact that your partner wouldn't go for UC, I would go with the OB.  You know how to give birth - you just need someone there as backup for DP.  I know the love and kindness of midwives can be of great help and comfort during pregnancy, but maybe you can find a homebirth group you can join for some of that camaraderie?  Whatever the outcome, I am sure you will make the absolute right decision.

[Tumble Bumbles]

Hi mamas!

Kawa- I'm sure you'll make the right decision. Sit quietly about it, pray/meditate whatever you do to find that place of really listening to your inner voice and I'm sure the decision will come. Personally, I would go for the hands-off non-cuddly rather than the hands-on cuddly Lil...You can meet the need for cuddles with other ladies/friends but you can't put a price on a hands-off HP!

mamatoabunch- glad you're here! It's somewhat comforting to know you still have some worries/concerns about cps, healthy babe etc even though you're a CU 'pro'! I feel like sometimes when we express our fears/worries we are told to sort of just get over it and trust our bodies (albeit in a more gentle way Lil) and I think getting them out and hashing through them is important!

BFS - thanks for the book review. Yeah, I so wouldn't be into that type of book. While I do believe our minds have *a lot* to do with shaping our experience, I don't put 100% of the responsibility on my shoulders of creating my entire reality -- we don't live in a vacuum. Also being a Christian (YMMV) I totally trust in God and His sovereignty and plan so yeah, I won't be picking that book up :)

I'm still on the fence. I know I'm a UC'er at heart. I was able to get an u/s at 19 weeks so everything looked great (placenta, baby etc). That gives me more confidence to UC...

Edited by Tumble Bumbles - 4/9/11 at 4:18pm

[Buddhamom]

I have to say DH wanted to UC originally and I said no out of fear and shock that I was even preg. So we looked into HB but with children in college, who has 4000.00 laying around? So we decided midwifes at birthing center like with our older two.  But now since I have had the 20 wk and everything looks great I am leaning toward just waiting until last minute and then making the decision.  Our last birth was one where I got there just in time to give birth and did ALL laboring at home and it was really nice so I think I can do this. Besides, I grew up on a farm and have alpacas now and have assisted in birth before

[Tumble Bumbles]

Originally Posted by Buddhamom 

Besides, I grew up on a farm and have alpacas now and have assisted in birth before

 Seriously, I told my best friend yesterday I'm going to be like a cat, if someone will just prepare a box with blankets for me in a dark corner, I'll be just fine lol

[jshannyn519]

Originally Posted by Tumble Bumbles 

 Seriously, I told my best friend yesterday I'm going to be like a cat, if someone will just prepare a box with blankets for me in a dark corner, I'll be just fine lol

This is exactly what I've told a couple of my friends! I can totally see myself in the closet on a pile of blankets, giving birth. :D

[grcelizabeth]

This is a wonderful idea! I ultimately feel lead to have a UC, but DH isn't full comfortable with it yet. We currently have a midwife that is VERY hands-off and will sit in the other room the whole time unless I call her over. She educates UC families, is mostly retired from doing primary care, and won't come to the birth if we decide even up to the last moment. Therefore, we have the perfect set-up (A midwife for my husband and a super hands-off MW for me ).  The only issue is that I still would like to UC and so I'm hoping that maybe after all the education our MW will give us (mainly hubby), he'll feel more comfortable about UC and change his mind. Also, we MIGHT move within 1-3 months before the baby is due, to a different state, and most likely be forced to UC because of how hard it is to find such a hands-off MW like what we want, PLUS it's in a state where MW's are mandatory to have licensure and I DO NOT WANT a MW who follows the silly state regulations at my birth. For example... transfer to hosp. after ROM (rupture of membranes) after 12 hrs. HOW FREAKIN RIDICULOUS. Sorry, this just really gets me going and I wouldn't have been able to have a homebirth with my first two if I had a licensed MW because of this alone. Anyhow, I'm also a student Midwife and I feel confident in my knowledge and my womanly intuition. 

[Tumble Bumbles]

Wow that's awesome about your current set-up Grace. Maybe your husband will come around. A lot of people poo poo the husband's comfort level ("it's my body, I'm the one giving birth!") and I get that, but I think if a woman has a nervous/freaked-out/uncomfortable partner during labor it can really do a lot more harm than good. That's one aspect of why we are still with a midwife because on one hand DH is very supportive of a UC but on the other hand I know he's a bit freaked out. He's made comments about how he would feel 100% responsible and he's not "qualified" and so on. I try to alleviate this because I don't hold him responsible for anything, but I get his concerns. I am hoping with more reading/research combined with trusting me (he does trust my instincts and intuition A LOT) he will come to a place of complete peace about it. Barring that, I'm praying to go into labor around 10pm when everyone is sleeping and just do it myself like a cat in a cardboard box

[Tumble Bumbles]

Originally Posted by grcelizabeth 

 PLUS it's in a state where MW's are mandatory to have licensure and I DO NOT WANT a MW who follows the silly state regulations at my birth. For example... transfer to hosp. after ROM (rupture of membranes) after 12 hrs. HOW FREAKIN RIDICULOUS. Sorry, this just really gets me going and I wouldn't have been able to have a homebirth with my first two if I had a licensed MW because of this alone. Anyhow, I'm also a student Midwife and I feel confident in my knowledge and my womanly intuition. 

 I KNOW. That's so ridiculous. I get that the "chance of infection goes up" but that's only if people's hands are all up in your business doing "checks" and nonsense.  If you take a hands-off approach (which it sounds totally like you are) people have gone 24+ hours after ROM to give birth with no issues whatsoever.

[grcelizabeth]

For me, DH is my rock during the birth process and I need him comfortable, sane, and peaceful for me. I can tell if he's not and therefore it would get me all riled-up and anxious, not trusting my body. I really do like our current set-up but who knows what will happen if we move shortly before baby is due.

Lol. I think that's a perfect time while everyone is quiet and you can call DH over if you want to. The thing about UC is that you ARE taking 100% of the responsibility into your own hands, not just DH, but both of you and it's a hard concept to swallow. Birth is inherently safe and sometimes babies just have difficulties getting started or just pass away, where there was nothing anyone could do in the first place. I see that you're a Christian so I tell you my philosophy is that the ONLY savior of birth is THE SAVIOR himself. It's His will no matter what. I don't know if that helps, but either way.... just have faith in your body, baby, intuition, and your Savior.
 

Originally Posted by Tumble Bumbles 

Wow that's awesome about your current set-up Grace. Maybe your husband will come around. A lot of people poo poo the husband's comfort level ("it's my body, I'm the one giving birth!") and I get that, but I think if a woman has a nervous/freaked-out/uncomfortable partner during labor it can really do a lot more harm than good. That's one aspect of why we are still with a midwife because on one hand DH is very supportive of a UC but on the other hand I know he's a bit freaked out. He's made comments about how he would feel 100% responsible and he's not "qualified" and so on. I try to alleviate this because I don't hold him responsible for anything, but I get his concerns. I am hoping with more reading/research combined with trusting me (he does trust my instincts and intuition A LOT) he will come to a place of complete peace about it. Barring that, I'm praying to go into labor around 10pm when everyone is sleeping and just do it myself like a cat in a cardboard box

If people actually knew where and how that study came about originally, the 24-hr. rule wouldn't be a risk factor. As long as no one has hands up inside, no fever, still feeling baby move, continues to drink water, and overall feels fine, then there's no reason for fear. I've known moms to go days after ROM where everything was just fine. I wish our culture would get back to listening to our bodies and babies. 

Originally Posted by Tumble Bumbles 

Originally Posted by grcelizabeth 

 PLUS it's in a state where MW's are mandatory to have licensure and I DO NOT WANT a MW who follows the silly state regulations at my birth. For example... transfer to hosp. after ROM (rupture of membranes) after 12 hrs. HOW FREAKIN RIDICULOUS. Sorry, this just really gets me going and I wouldn't have been able to have a homebirth with my first two if I had a licensed MW because of this alone. Anyhow, I'm also a student Midwife and I feel confident in my knowledge and my womanly intuition. 

 I KNOW. That's so ridiculous. I get that the "chance of infection goes up" but that's only if people's hands are all up in your business doing "checks" and nonsense.  If you take a hands-off approach (which it sounds totally like you are) people have gone 24+ hours after ROM to give birth with no issues whatsoever.

[Tumble Bumbles]

 I see that you're a Christian so I tell you my philosophy is that the ONLY savior of birth is THE SAVIOR himself. It's His will no matter what. I don't know if that helps, but either way.... just have faith in your body, baby, intuition, and your Savior.
 

  I completely agree. That's what I believe as well which is part of what's leading me to UC. There can be a team of doctors and if The Lord wants to take our babe home, that's what's going to happen. On the other hand, if God has it in His plan for a healthy babe, it's going to happen right here. I totally believe in God's sovereignty. Thanks for the encouragement.

[tracymom1]

Originally Posted by Tumble Bumbles 

 I see that you're a Christian so I tell you my philosophy is that the ONLY savior of birth is THE SAVIOR himself. It's His will no matter what. I don't know if that helps, but either way.... just have faith in your body, baby, intuition, and your Savior.
 

  I completely agree. That's what I believe as well which is part of what's leading me to UC. There can be a team of doctors and if The Lord wants to take our babe home, that's what's going to happen. On the other hand, if God has it in His plan for a healthy babe, it's going to happen right here. I totally believe in God's sovereignty. Thanks for the encouragement.

I am not a Christian but I am religious (Jewish) and completely agree - God's will is God's will and the best we can do is what we believe is right and safe for ourselves and our families.  The rest is in His hands.

The more and more I think about it, the more I feel UC is in my future.  DH is not totally on board yet, but he is leaning this way, too.  As a funny side note, he said to me "so does this mean I have to do all the clean-up after the birth?!!"  I said that I would be happy to do it in several weeks when I feel healed enough, but I don't know if we should let all the bloody mess sit around for that long.  Might start to stink or something...   

And as far as the ROM goes, if you are at home and surrounded by your things, the risk of infection is reduced dramatically.  Your body is used to the bacteria that live in your house and as long as you are not doing anything to introduce infectious things into the birth canal, all should be just fine.  My friendly nurse advice to all my friends who birth in hospitals is to never tell them when your water broke!!  They will tell you to come in right away and then we all know what happens from there...

[Tumble Bumbles]

Awesome re: trusting God!

Dh isn't 100% on board either but he is very supportive of me if that makes sense. He even said last night, "well, you were right the last time and I trust your intuition" because my intuition/prayer led to a change in care providers VERY late in the game against everyone's "better judgment" to just stay put.

LOL @ the cleaning up aspect. Thank God we have a washer/dryer this time (we rent) so we can just throw everything into the wash with a bottle of hydrogen peroxide and oxiclean and be done with it lol Dh said something similar except along the lines of his time off  after the birth being taken out of personal time rather than FMLA (because a doc/midwife has to sign off on that. I was like  that's the least of our problems, sweetie...perspective lol

I am not a Christian but I am religious (Jewish) and completely agree - God's will is God's will and the best we can do is what we believe is right and safe for ourselves and our families.  The rest is in His hands.

 

The more and more I think about it, the more I feel UC is in my future.  DH is not totally on board yet, but he is leaning this way, too.  As a funny side note, he said to me "so does this mean I have to do all the clean-up after the birth?!!"  I said that I would be happy to do it in several weeks when I feel healed enough, but I don't know if we should let all the bloody mess sit around for that long.  Might start to stink or something...   

And as far as the ROM goes, if you are at home and surrounded by your things, the risk of infection is reduced dramatically.  Your body is used to the bacteria that live in your house and as long as you are not doing anything to introduce infectious things into the birth canal, all should be just fine.  My friendly nurse advice to all my friends who birth in hospitals is to never tell them when your water broke!!  They will tell you to come in right away and then we all know what happens from there...