elimination issues...or perhaps this is all totally normal...

[northcountrymamma]

ok so let me preface this by saying that dd never once in her life spit up...so i might have just been spoiled...

but here's our issue with ds...he is an elimination machine...he pukes after every feeding (a huge amount), sometimes more than once, he poops probably 12+ times/day and soaks thru a hemp fitted with an insert in less than an hour and has a pretty bad diaper rash as well.

Im just not sure how to deal with all of this consecutively.  

For the diaper rash, it makes logical sense to me to air him out with some naked time...which I am trying to do, but it's really tricky because as soon as I lay him down on his back he pukes, which leads to a meltdown creating a need to nurse. Then as he's nursing, still with no diaper on, because there was no time for the diaper after the puke situation, he poops...everywhere. Then we typically get a pee in there and then take a sink bath or a full bath because we are both covered in pee, puke, poo and breastmilk as I also have a forceful letdown and leak like crazy when we can't finish off. 

It feels like pure chaos and it's making both of us miserable. This cycle repeats itself like 10 times each day. Most nights are much easier but last night was an exception where we dealt with leaking wet diapers (because ds has to sleep on his side or he pukes) and a screaming babe who was visably uncomfortable. 

I'm just wondering...does anyone have any suggestions?  He is EBF, we use CD's only and we bedshare and I wear him for naps in a stretchy wrap or ring sling. 

Please help...or at least help me find my sanity again!

[liberal_chick]

Well, to start, it sounds like he has reflux.  Especially if he's crying afterward, that would make me think it hurts.  My ds3 spits up quite a bit, but it is never followed with crying.  I'd make a doctor's visit for that and get some reflux meds.

I can't really advise about the poop issue.  Have you tried various fabrics, even disposables, to see if that clears up the rash?  My ds2 just could not wear cloth w/o getting a rash, so we had to switch to disposables.  I have a friend with a kiddo who cannot wear suedecloth, so they can still use cloth they just can't use that type.

[northcountrymamma]

reflux...I didn't really think of that. 

Are there ways to treat reflux without meds? Elimination diets? Craniosacral therapy? Chiropractic? Naturopathic options? 

We don't use alopathic meds and would really hate to go that route before trying anything else.

I will check with my midwife as well...but thanks, I didn't think of that. 

[HappyMonkey]

This this book on breastfeeding there's a whole page on dealing with reflex without meds. Maybe you can get a copy or already have one? I don't remember most of it, but I know no tight fitting clothes around the waist, and keeping them more upright were 2 of the 10 or so things to check for.

[LadyCatherine185]

sounds to me like a sensitivity to food(s) in your diet. i would start by eliminating dairy (which can take 2 weeks to get out of your system, but you should see results after 4-5 days)

[AislinCarys]

I can't really help with the spitting up issues, but we did EC with DD, so I have some tips on how to deal with the poos and wees issue. Get a small bowl, and hold it under LO's bottom (rest it in your lap) while you breastfeed. And keep some wipes nearby (either wet ones, or with a bowl or bottle so you can wet them if needed). And make sure you keep to bowl under him while you burp him. If you start offering a potty (bowl), just as soon as you pick him up, while you burp him and after the feed, he may quickly start expecting it.

The other thing I did early on was to keep a nice sheepskin in my lap, with a folded flat diaper on it (or when out, I had a wool underlay, for a basinette, folded over, and with the diaper on top. Any "misses"and you can just toss the diaper in a plastic bag kept nearby, for washing later.

[porcelina]

Another vote for dairy, and if that doesn't work, try eliminating soy (it is in absolutely everything at the supermarket -- just read labels -- bread, fruit bars, meats at restaurants, on and on).

Also another vote for it being reflux -- it does sound like it hurts him. Try to keep him at an angle. You can air out diaper with him on you, or in a swing, just use wool pads and/or trifolds under him.

As far as the diaper rash, DS2 had a horrible, raw one from weeks 2 to 5 of his life. We got rid of it by starting completely by accident practicing elimination communication. We had the problem of every time we would have him air out, he would leak poop constantly, so I was constantly holding him over the sink using a squirt bottle (any rubbing of wipes, cloth or otherwise, can make it worse), and he started pooping. Then, he got conditioned to do it there, and I started to notice when he was going to eliminate (grunting) and would hold him over the sink. Eventually, I read up on it and learned a bit more, got him a little potty, and he now does about 95 percent of his poops in the potty and has no rash. Whenever we miss one for more than 10 mins, he still gets a rash, so I feel like we have no choice. Definitely look into elimination for persistent diaper rash.

[northcountrymamma]

Thanks so much for the tips...I did some EC with dd from 8mo onward...so I'm somewhat familiar with it, but hadn't thought about it with a newborn. 

I like the idea though as today I noticed exactly what porcelina indicated...he was drying out on a prefold in bed and enjoying a brief moment of content lying down on his back...I had things looking fairly tame with his bum by eliminating dairy for the past 3-4 days and by lots of (messy but effective) airdrying and some slippery elm on his bum...then he pooped and everything instantly got red again. 

With the dairy elimination...would yogurt or kefir still be considered bad news? I had to cut out some dairy with dd as well...but yogurt was always fine...I can't imagine my life without it!

What kind of bowl would you recommend to put under him while I am nursing? I like that idea...we've been just doing a prefold and a wool blanket (I'm worried about ruining our sheepskin) and it's still so messy as he is so long (23" at birth), his bum basically hangs off my lap. 

Off to check out the EC forum as well. Need some tips!

Thanks for the wisdom.

[porcelina]

To get started with some of your concerns, I'm sure you could get some good advice from the EC forum here. The trickiest thing for EC with a newborn is finding a position that seems comfortable and also supports the head! But, I held DS2 in sitting position with my hands under his thighs and his back/head propped against my tummy/chest. Most comfortable over the sink (it's easy to disinfect)! We don't do EC for pee, just poop, to deal with the rash issue. So, we're not constantly running him to the potty.

That said, for eliminating while nursing, you can just use any kind of bowl that fits under LO comfortably. I think tupperware type containers that you may already have around the house may be the easiest.

Good luck!

[KempsMama]

Regarding the reflux, I highly rec. a chiro.  It took several visits, but I was able to get my DS2 off meds and he hasn't had problems in months.

[porcelina]

Oh, and you bet that kefir and yogurt, cheese, deli meat, salad dressing, the icing on fruit bars, etc., all count as dairy! If you really want to eliminate it, you have to stop eating all dairy completely. Dairy is hidden in so many things. I found a good substitute for yogurt is coconut milk yogurt (only like strawberry and blueberry -- the other flavors are pretty gross) that you can get at a whole foods store. You can substitute for milk with rice milk or almond milk for cooking, for putting in your coffee, etc. It took me a very long time to get truly dairy free with DS1, and now with DS2, I'm going dairy and soy free. Soy is in almost everything else, so it's really tough. But, totally worth it to NOT have a fussy baby with tons of spit up who wakes up all the time from naps and night sleep!

[northcountrymamma]

Thanks so much for all your help...

We actually eat very little dairy (just kefir, yogurt, yogurt cheese and some other cheeses though not a lot) and no soy as it is. We use almond or coconut milk for our milk needs and otherwise eat an entirely whole foods, vegetarian for the most part (some game), diet and no processed foods at all...so it's not that hard.  it's just that I find that without kefir or plain yogurt (not a fan of flavoured yogurts) that I get rather yeasty myself...even with a good dose of probiotics. I'm struggling with this part but realize that it might have to happen for ds's sake. I will look for coconut yogurt the next time I'm at the health food store...but I've not seen it there before...and I am there all the time. 

I am seeing an improvement today and yesterday though...he hasn't spit up since 36 hours ago and seems pretty happy, even resting right now in his cosleeper...which I didn't think was ever going to happen, but I layed him in there this am so I could get dressed...put on some yoga music and alas, sound asleep in a few minutes...I did have some kefir in my morning smoothie though, so time will tell. Also, I had to do some burts bees diaper cream...I couldn't bare to see him in such discomfort...it helped a lot. That coupled with slippery elm powder and lots of naked time, his bum looks SO much better!  We are not however, having any success with EC...I'm just not sure how to catch them...even the bowl isn't getting them...or I end up spilling the bowl as I move him around to burp. It's been a bit of a disaster...but I'm still trying. And also, wool diaper covers rather than PUL seems to be helpful. Too bad I just ordered 6 new PUL covers and they are in the mail right now. it's just hard to tell what is working when I'm doing all of this...I guess keeping it all up is ideal!

[northcountrymamma]

oh and we have a wonderful pediatric chiro...I am going in to see her this week, I'll have ds with me and will ask her advice on this too. Great thought.