how to teach DS to fall asleep on his own and stay in his own bed

[shanniesue2]

DS will be 3 at the end of february.  And I don't want to be too forceful with this.  But the fact is, that hour+ long bed time routines just aren't working for us anymore.  Sure, he will fall asleep quicker if DH goes to bed with him.  But then DH falls asleep and he and I never get any us time.  We're struggling with our marriage and need some us time.

Here's our current bedtime ritual--7:45-- brush teeth, jammas, story, lights out, prayer, then lay down with him until everyone's asleep.  Lights are usually out by 8:10, and he's not usually asleep until almost 9.

My idea was to sit in a chair and hold his hand instead of laying down with him.  But his dad won't do this, for some reason.  Even though he seemed favorable when I posed the idea.  I think it's mostly an issue of  DH is tired come 8 PM.  So I've done it a few times.  The first time it worked brilliantly.  The second time, I thought he was asleep and he woke up 5 minutes after I left crying.  DH went in and laid down with him and they both fell asleep.  Then I got sick, and have been sick all week, so DH was sleeping with DS.  And last night, I was well enough to do bed time, and it was similar to that second time.  It took 30 or so minutes for DS to doze off.  And he woke up 5 min after I left, and wouldn't go back to sleep.  It was up and down (although very few tears) for the next 30 minutes.  Until I finally gave in and laid down with him to help him fall asleep.  Once he was asleep, I went back to my bed.  But he woke up at about midnight and came and joined us and proceded to kick, paw at, and push me the rest of the night.  He even punched me in the eye at one point... it's all sleep behaviors... so it's not that he's misbehaving.  But this brings me to our second issue.  He is like this every night.  And I'm getting to the point where I need my sleep.

How can we help him learn to fall back asleep on his own so that he stays in his own bed all night?

[mama2soren]

Hoping you get some good advice.... we are dealing with similar issues :(

[MrsBone]

Dealing with the same issue, although it's me who falls asleep putting DS to sleep. I'm also 25 weeks preggo, so it doesn't seem to matter when I put him down, I always fall asleep, even naptime. We are going to try putting a baby gate on his door, with me sitting by the gate, just out of sight, but he can still hear me, to see if he can learn to go to sleep on his own. He knows how, he went through a two week period where he'd go to sleep with me just laying on the floor in his room on my phone, but one night, just stopped doing it. So we're going to try the gate..if it's too traumatic, I'm not sure what we're gonna do.

[flower01]

Would love some tips, too.  Same thing here. DH falls asleep putting DD to bed, while I fall asleep nursing DS to bed.  By the time the kids are asleep, we are done. Dinner isn't even cleaned up half the time and we have no time to ourselves.

[lisathena]

We are doing this currently as well! I sit in the room while ds (2 1/2) is in a CRIB and dd ( 8 months) is in her crib. I have a rocker in there and rub her back and remind him to be quite and lay down. Sometimes he is good about it and sometimes they both are screaming! It has been tough but i know it will take time to build a new habit w/ them. Be persistant and consistant mama....

Now ds used to go to bed w/ us in our bed up until last week when we got the 2nd crib for the new baby in april. But dh decided to use it for tyler as a crib not a toddler bed to keep him in it! He cannot climb out....never tries. So having him contained helps and NOT picking him up no matter what helps...just reminding him to be quite and lay down....over and over! It is exhausting our routine takes about 45min once the kids are both in their bed (share room). 

Our problem is them waking up part way thru the night (seperate times) and dh and I being so tired that we dont have a consitant routine for this yet.....sometimes baby will just rock/eat back to sleep w/ DH or sometimes he has to take her downstairs and spend and hour or two getting her back to sleep, we trie dthe CIO in the middle of the night and honestly after 2 hours :( i gave up it was Hell!  And w/ ds i have him lay back down and sit w/ him until he goes back to sleep...or like last night i threw him in our bed....which i shouldnt have done! after 5am they all can come in and sleep w/ me but i would like my bed w/ dh before then!

We are doing all this since #4 is joining us in april and i cannot have 3 in my bed...

IDK if this helps at all...but we currently are sticking (or trying ) to this plan...

Good luck!

[shanniesue2]

update!

Instead of sitting in a chair next to his bed, I have been taking a little pen light and a book and laying on the floor next to his bed... he falls asleep really quickly this way :)  And I don't get so frustrated just sitting there waiting for him to settle down and go to sleep

Now, we just need to get him staying in his own bed until it's time to wake up in the morning!

[starling&diesel]

dropping in to read the responses ...

Our dd is turning two and has slept between us in our bed since the day she was born.  She has never, not even once in her life, fallen asleep on her own.  We lay down with her for naps, and I've nursed her to sleep and still do.   However, she is getting too big and thrashy for our bed and we are losing much-needed sleep.  We showed her some big girl beds online, she chose one, and we got it off CL, with a mattress.  It's a toddler bed.  We got it tonight, and she helped put it together, and arranged her stuffed animals on it, and was excited about going to bed there.  We put it beside our bed.  Tonight, I switched up the routine.  Instead of ending with nursing, I started with nursing.  Then stories.  Then lights out.  Then I sat there and sang songs and rubbed her back and told her stories.  She was upset when she realized that num nums (nursing) was done for the night and that we couldn't cuddle to sleep.  But I promised her num nums in the morning, and just kept rubbing her back.  It took forty-five minutes.   Hopefully we'll get it down to no more than twenty!  Good luck to you, OP ... sound like you're making progress!  Who knows when DD will wake up tonight and want to be in our bed.

[mama2soren]

Here's what we've done the last two nights:

For the last week or so, we've been talking to DS about how he will soon sleep in his little bed and DH and I will sleep in the big bed.  We made up stories and songs about it.  We always brought it up casually, but talked about it often.

The last 2 nights, we have been calmly taking him back to his bed when he gets up.  No talking, just tucking him in with a gentle pat or kiss and walking away.  The first night, we had to do this about 200 times.  DS was pretty ticked about it.  No one got much sleep.  But, last night we did it "only" 85 times (DH counted).  After that 85th time, DS said "covers on, Dada. Sleep"  And, sure enough, he stayed in his bed and slept alone from 1:00 am to 6:45 am   This is a child who has not slept longer than 3.5 hours by himself.  Ever.  Today we've been saying how happy we are that everyone got to sleep in their own beds, how rested we are, etc.  DS seemed proud of himself.  

Maybe not everyone would feel comfortable with this approach, because there was lots of screaming during those hundreds of times we put him back in his bed.  But, I truly believe it was angry screaming, not scared screaming.  And we were always available to him when he came out of his room.  I wouldn't have done this when DS was much younger, but now that he's almost three he seems to understand the goal of having him stay in his own bed.  I'll post an update after the next couple of days to let you know if it continues to get easier.

I will stay lie down with DS to get him to sleep initially.  I cherish that time (I just don't cherish having to do it 10 times per night), and now that he's no longer napping, it only takes 20 minutes or so.

[shanniesue2]

See, and we've tried that approach:  putting him back to bed, give a kiss, pat on the back and leave... and DS's cries aren't angry or scared cries... they are these heartbroken cries that seriously tug at me... it's not like I'm so pissed because you won't let me sleep with you... it's like Oh my goddess, mommy doesn't want to stay with me anymore....

So right now, I am trying to stay focused on the fact that our bedtime routine and timing is so improved!  We put jammas on, brush teeth, read 1 book, say our bed time prayers (more on that in a bit), give a kiss, and last night I laid down in the hall outside his room with the hall light on, and he was asleep in 10 minutes!!!!  Our routine has gone from 1-2 hours down to about 30 minutes!!!  HUGE success.  And we didn't have any heartbreaking, angry, or scared tears in the whole process :D Double Bonus!!

And while I'm on the topic, I have to tell you about our bedtime prayers... this is a new thing for us... I just got done reading a book on prayer and it inspired me.  Anyway, we start by saying all the people we love "I love Christopher, I love mommy, I love daddy, I love grandpa, etc).  He usually wants to include a few special friends from day care and his teachers.  The we say, "may love be in my heart and in my dreams while I sleep tonight."  And it didn't take him long to start telling me that he wants to say his prayer... and then he says in his sweet little toddler voice "love in my heart and in... my... dreams... ever while I sleep"    It's quickly become my favorite part of our whole evening

Originally Posted by mama2soren 

Here's what we've done the last two nights:

For the last week or so, we've been talking to DS about how he will soon sleep in his little bed and DH and I will sleep in the big bed.  We made up stories and songs about it.  We always brought it up casually, but talked about it often.

The last 2 nights, we have been calmly taking him back to his bed when he gets up.  No talking, just tucking him in with a gentle pat or kiss and walking away.  The first night, we had to do this about 200 times.  DS was pretty ticked about it.  No one got much sleep.  But, last night we did it "only" 85 times (DH counted).  After that 85th time, DS said "covers on, Dada. Sleep"  And, sure enough, he stayed in his bed and slept alone from 1:00 am to 6:45 am   This is a child who has not slept longer than 3.5 hours by himself.  Ever.  Today we've been saying how happy we are that everyone got to sleep in their own beds, how rested we are, etc.  DS seemed proud of himself.  

Maybe not everyone would feel comfortable with this approach, because there was lots of screaming during those hundreds of times we put him back in his bed.  But, I truly believe it was angry screaming, not scared screaming.  And we were always available to him when he came out of his room.  I wouldn't have done this when DS was much younger, but now that he's almost three he seems to understand the goal of having him stay in his own bed.  I'll post an update after the next couple of days to let you know if it continues to get easier.

I will stay lie down with DS to get him to sleep initially.  I cherish that time (I just don't cherish having to do it 10 times per night), and now that he's no longer napping, it only takes 20 minutes or so.

[mama2soren]

So glad you found something to help, shanniesue!  

I wanted to update, in case anyone else searches for tips....  We just finished our 5th night of quietly and calmly tucking DS back in his bed when he gets out at night.  The third night was a great improvement, only 20 minutes of putting him in/him getting right out/etc.  He was out at 10:50 pm and slept until 5!  The fourth night, we put him back just ONE time around 10:30.  I actually don't even think he was 100% awake.  He went right back to sleep, and again slept until 5.  Last night it was also just one time, sometime in the middle of the night.

This is an absolute miracle.  I never imagined that this would work, or that it would work so quickly.  Since leaving the NICU at 6 weeks old, my sweet son has NEVER fallen asleep on his own, except for on long car trips.  EVERY nap, EVERY bedtime, EVERY night waking has involved a long process of cuddling, nursing, rocking, etc.  For 2.5 years.  With a new one coming in August, we knew this sleep pattern would just not work for us any longer.  The first two nights were tough, and I had doubts that we were doing the right thing.  But after the last few nights, I know we made a good choice for us.  DS is sleeping more without so many full on night wakings, and we're all happier.

Good luck to all of those who are still finding the best path for better sleep for their families! 

[jenni22]

I'm glad to see that it ended up working out for you!  It would be hard those first couple of nights!  We have some traveling coming up where dd will have to share a bed with me, but when we get back I think I'll try this!  Her bed is in my room (we only have one room) so it should be maybe even easier!  Thanks for the update!

[mikanmom]

your situation gives me hope!

I guess it really takes sticking with it for the first hard couple of nights, while trying to keep in mind it will get easier.

[One_Girl]

Originally Posted by shanniesue2 

update!

Instead of sitting in a chair next to his bed, I have been taking a little pen light and a book and laying on the floor next to his bed... he falls asleep really quickly this way :)  And I don't get so frustrated just sitting there waiting for him to settle down and go to sleep

Now, we just need to get him staying in his own bed until it's time to wake up in the morning!

Does he disturb you when he comes in or are you able to stir slightly then fall back asleep?  If you are getting time to spend building your relationship with your husband before you two fall asleep then I think that you should consider letting him stay in the bed if he doesn't disturb your sleep when he comes in in the middle of the night.  My dd comes into my bed from time to time when she gets a nightmare and I rarely notice until morning.  It is something that many kids do.  I have met some adults who talk fondly about their parents letting them go into their beds when they were sick or needed comfort even as teenagers and I really think it is something that builds a strong relationship of trust.  If you can let him find the comfort he needs just by coming in after sleeping in his bed for a few hours then I think that is an easy way to meet his need for closeness while also working on your marriage.

[Trasan]

Thank you mama2soren and all you others with ideas in this thread. We are dealing with a similar situation of bedtime and sleep patterns that put a strain on our marriage. DD is almost 2.5 years old, we co-slept until she was around 1.5 and then got her toddler bed which worked pretty well. But we often deal with bedtimes of 1.5-2 hours and she is almost pathologically fighting her sleep (poking fingers in her eyes when dozing off, banging her head or jumping up and down, singing out loud or what have you...anything not to fall asleep), which is frustrating to say the least. The lastest is that she demands to fall asleep in our bed even at bedtime, which generally has not been allowed, but occasionally, on one of those not so consistent and very tired nights, it has happened that we agreed to it (usually her dad).

Most nights she will also come in to our bed during the night which is our issue right now. When she comes, me or my husband usually leave to sleep in the guestroom (mostly me leaving) because the bed is getting too small for three people to sleep well, especially a little one that is climbing all over you when trying to sleep. We are now feeling that this needs to come to an end, since we don't want to do anymore bedhopping at night time.

I am considering testing the idea from mama2soren about carrying her back to her bed when she comes during the night, and I think it could work. BUT I have one central question about his: How do you justify to a toddler, who has always been allowed to sleep with you, that suddenly it is not ok anymore? To me, it sounds like one of those random adult decisions that have no logic to it... though the logic is we neeeeed our bed and our sleep in it, if nothing else to save our relationship since we do not get (or make) much time during the days for spending time together. So please, give me a few ideas. I know she will not understand the idea, because we are always including her in everything.

In our strategic planning for upcoming change, my husband said the other day that he thinks that if we let her come in to us during the night, she must also be allowed to fall asleep there at bedtime. To me that sounds a bit strange, and I peronally have no problem with bedtime being only for her bed in her room (which she is used to anyway but is now challenging) and her coming in to our bed in the middle of the night. But he seems to think that is not consistent to her that sometimes she is allowed in the bed and sometimes not. Comments on that? I just feel we see it so completely different in this case (which is unusual)...

Thanks for any input and thanks again for your suggestions (the 5 am deadline for coming in is another idea, thanks lisathena).

[shanniesue2]

Originally Posted by One_Girl 

Originally Posted by shanniesue2 

update!

Instead of sitting in a chair next to his bed, I have been taking a little pen light and a book and laying on the floor next to his bed... he falls asleep really quickly this way :)  And I don't get so frustrated just sitting there waiting for him to settle down and go to sleep

Now, we just need to get him staying in his own bed until it's time to wake up in the morning!

Does he disturb you when he comes in or are you able to stir slightly then fall back asleep?  If you are getting time to spend building your relationship with your husband before you two fall asleep then I think that you should consider letting him stay in the bed if he doesn't disturb your sleep when he comes in in the middle of the night.  My dd comes into my bed from time to time when she gets a nightmare and I rarely notice until morning.  It is something that many kids do.  I have met some adults who talk fondly about their parents letting them go into their beds when they were sick or needed comfort even as teenagers and I really think it is something that builds a strong relationship of trust.  If you can let him find the comfort he needs just by coming in after sleeping in his bed for a few hours then I think that is an easy way to meet his need for closeness while also working on your marriage.
 

 Its not really the point at which he joins us that is the issue... because he usually just crawls in and we alldrift back to sleep no biggie.  The issue is that usually between 4:00 and 5:00, he starts getting really restless in his sleep and he starts needing, groping, and digging his feet into me.  On work mornings, I have to be up at 5:30, so it's usually a loss of 1-1.5 hours of sleep for me.  And I have issues with falling asleep, so being woken up before its time for me to get up compounds my sleep issues.  So I really do need to have DS in his own bed for those early morning hours...  I would never never never tell him that he can't come cuddle with us at night if he needs us... but I do at least need a mechanism for getting him back in bed so that he's not waking me up for good at 4 AM.

[lisathena]

Things have been going better for us too :)

Our ds who is 2 1/2 cannot get out of his bed tho, we put him back in a crib.....so he CANT, but we end up getting him around 1 or 2 am when he wakes up crying for us. As long as he goes to bed in his own bed i am ok w/ him coming in part way thru the night. I would make him settle back dow, but he shares a room w/ his 10 month old sister! So i dont want him waking her up and i am due to have another baby in 2 months....so i want no kids in our bed so it can just be the newb (safer!) but so far we normally have both babies in bed w/ us by monring....its stressing me out!

What we have been doing for bed time:

At 8 make bottle for dd, change her get jammies on. I rock her w/ DH sits and reads us (me, dd, ds) a storie then i sit in the room till both babies are asleep, i still rock dd to she is out then lay her down. We were doing the CIO while i was sitting there and it stressed me out, wasnt worth it. W/ the 2 1/2 yo he fusses for a bit but settles and goes to sleep pretty easily MOST nights....

[One_Girl]

You may need to lose some sleep in the middle of the night, on a weekend, to see if he is coming into your room knowingly or if he sort of wanders in mostly asleep and falls back asleep when he comes in needing you.  My dd is the mostly asleep kind and she doesn't even seem to know that she is coming into my bed, she sort of just does it.  If I was going to meet her need for comfort and get her back in her bed at midnight I would need to notice that she was there (which I often don't until morning), carry her to her bed or spend a lot of time waking her up so she could be redirected to her bed.  If your son wakes and knows what he is doing it may be easier to get him into his bed again after a quick cuddle. 

One thing that really helps to decrease my dd's nighttime cuddle need is to spend a lot of time giving her the cuddles and one on one during the time we are together.  We almost always read and talk for about an hour before bed and that has really cut down how much she comes in to my bed at midnight.  When I work late and she doesn't get a lot of one on one she almost always comes in at night.

[MrsBone]

this is what motivated me to get busy working on the sleep schedule. Due in May with #2. My son is just 2 and now sleeping in his own bed. I don't care if he comes in our room after he wakes for the first time, but most of the time he's sleeping through the night now. I had to put a gate on the door though.I know alot of people think it sounds mean to do that, but he truly responded better to having that physical boundary. If I leave the gate off, he doesn't cry and scream, he just walks out the door, acting like it's play time and he can do whatever. Once I put the gate back on the door, he cries for a few seconds then goes and lays down and goes to sleep. Like he's thinking, oh..it really is bedtime, okay. :)

Originally Posted by mama2soren 

So glad you found something to help, shanniesue!  

I wanted to update, in case anyone else searches for tips....  We just finished our 5th night of quietly and calmly tucking DS back in his bed when he gets out at night.  The third night was a great improvement, only 20 minutes of putting him in/him getting right out/etc.  He was out at 10:50 pm and slept until 5!  The fourth night, we put him back just ONE time around 10:30.  I actually don't even think he was 100% awake.  He went right back to sleep, and again slept until 5.  Last night it was also just one time, sometime in the middle of the night.

This is an absolute miracle.  I never imagined that this would work, or that it would work so quickly.  Since leaving the NICU at 6 weeks old, my sweet son has NEVER fallen asleep on his own, except for on long car trips.  EVERY nap, EVERY bedtime, EVERY night waking has involved a long process of cuddling, nursing, rocking, etc.  For 2.5 years.  With a new one coming in August, we knew this sleep pattern would just not work for us any longer.  The first two nights were tough, and I had doubts that we were doing the right thing.  But after the last few nights, I know we made a good choice for us.  DS is sleeping more without so many full on night wakings, and we're all happier.

Good luck to all of those who are still finding the best path for better sleep for their families! 

[lisathena]

Kids do find safety in boundries.....so he probably understands thats what it means, its not a bad thing at all. We had to put ds who is 27  months old back into a crib and it has worked wonders...