Questions about kefir

[bcblondie]

So I know that adding sugar kills off a lot of the good bacteria and what not... But I see a ton of recipes where there are fruits added, (a natural sugar,) say to smoothies. Or some that contain honey, or some that bake the kefir. (I made bread with kefir last night. Nomnomnom.)

Just wondering if these things also harm the bacteria, and how much / how fast? Surely the baking does...

I've been googling and can't seem to find answers. Does anyone know?

[bcblondie]

Oh and chocolate. I've heard of adding hot chocolate mix...

[Milkymommi]

This is what seems to make sense to me as well... I'm always partial to grabbing the plain ole plainy plain kind even though the ones with fruit added look sooooo delectable! Sometimes I grab the fruit added stuff and flip it over to remind myself just how many grams of sugar per serving are in it- then gently replace on shelf. I'll be interested to see what this thread comes up with.

[bcblondie]

And the whole artificial sweetener thing really gets me. I mean, I eat kefir to improve my health. And really I have idea how fake sweeteners will affect my body. Some say it's totally fine. Some list hundreds of side effects.

I also don't get why (some baking) recipes include artificial sweetener, so as to save the good bacteria... when the bacteria gets killed off in the oven anyways!

[cyclamen]

I wouldn't let honey sit in kefir for a long time, since it can inhibit the growth of bacteria (Dom's site says this - don't make water kefir with honey because it won't work), but I hardly think that adding fruit to a smoothie is bad news.  Last week I added two spoons of kefir to a jar of grated apples and got fizzy apples two days later! 

[bcblondie]

Yeah I'm starting to accept the fruit idea. I mean, refined sugar supresses your immune system when you eat it. Fruit doesn't. Probably works the same way.

What did you do with fizzy apples?!

I really want to convert some of my grains to water kefir so I can ferment some grape juice or something. Apparently it tastes like wine/champagne?!

[cyclamen]

Originally Posted by bcblondie 

Yeah I'm starting to accept the fruit idea. I mean, refined sugar supresses your immune system when you eat it. Fruit doesn't. Probably works the same way.

What did you do with fizzy apples?!

I wanted to feed them to DD but she was kind of "eh" about it - she'd rather just eat the kefir.  So I ate them!  They were delicious!

The thing is, kefir culture feeds on sugars and converts them to something else... lactic acid, I think?  What kind of sugar it is, I think doesn't matter, though they prefer lactose to fructose.  Sugar's not a microbicide.  You could put refined sugar in your smoothie and it wouldn't do anything to your kefir bacteria.  If you waited an hour +, the bacteria and yeast would consume the sugar and grow from it.  But if you drank it right away, you're just drinking refined sugar mixed with kefir. 

I think the issue with refined sugar is that it causes an insulin spike & is free food to any bacteria and yeast in your gut, not just the beneficial ones?  But if you are consuming it along with the live cultures, they are already working on those sugars.  I personally wouldn't put it in my smoothie, but it's probably not nearly as bad as drinkng a coke, you know?  Especially if you are just putting a small amount.

Maybe someone with greater knowlege on this topic can weigh in.

[Milkymommi]

Wow... I thought yours was great reasoning! And holy moly the fizzy apples sound mouth watering!!!

[bcblondie]

Originally Posted by cyclamen 

Originally Posted by bcblondie 

Yeah I'm starting to accept the fruit idea. I mean, refined sugar supresses your immune system when you eat it. Fruit doesn't. Probably works the same way.

What did you do with fizzy apples?!

I wanted to feed them to DD but she was kind of "eh" about it - she'd rather just eat the kefir.  So I ate them!  They were delicious!

The thing is, kefir culture feeds on sugars and converts them to something else... lactic acid, I think?  What kind of sugar it is, I think doesn't matter, though they prefer lactose to fructose.  Sugar's not a microbicide.  You could put refined sugar in your smoothie and it wouldn't do anything to your kefir bacteria.  If you waited an hour +, the bacteria and yeast would consume the sugar and grow from it.  But if you drank it right away, you're just drinking refined sugar mixed with kefir. 

I think the issue with refined sugar is that it causes an insulin spike & is free food to any bacteria and yeast in your gut, not just the beneficial ones?  But if you are consuming it along with the live cultures, they are already working on those sugars.  I personally wouldn't put it in my smoothie, but it's probably not nearly as bad as drinkng a coke, you know?  Especially if you are just putting a small amount.

Maybe someone with greater knowlege on this topic can weigh in.

Yeah this is what doesn't make sense to me. EVERYWHERE says sugar kills the probiotics... But doesn't kefir EAT sugar lol. I converted milk kefir grains to water kefir and they are sitting in sugar water right now...

... maybe it only kills the "curds" that are produced. I dunno. Super confusing. And the moment it hits our stomach acid it would all die too... I dunno...

I guess I just keep eating it as much as possible and waiting to see some results lol. It definitely has that relaxing effect... and tastes yummy... 

[cyclamen]

Maybe the "sugar kills probiotics" is an oversimplification of the idea that high concentrations of anything (salt, sugar) retard bacterial growth?  This is the principle behind fruits preserved in syrup or jams and jellies.  A really sugary packaged yogurt will probably have retarded cultures... if you leave them in the fridge, they don't get more sour, right?  Or, I wonder if those sugary packaged yogurts have actually been pasteurized to kill the cultures to keep the flavor of the product from changing on the shelf?

[bcblondie]

Makes sense to me!

[lucifugous]

I would also say it's an oversimplification but for different reasons. I don't think sugar kills probiotics; sugar counteracts the benefits of probiotics. Sugar feeds yeast and the purpose of consuming probiotics is to combat an overgrowth of yeast or maintain that healthy balance. I love the sour flavor, but a kefir blended with fruit or honey or both would be healthier than what I usually reach for when I have a craving for sweets!

[bcblondie]

Good points!!