Does the Pertussis vaccine actually do anything?

[Ruthla]

My DD is sick, with what I suspect may be pertussis. A few months ago, I had a talk with the school nurse about the "booster" shots, which consisted of me basically saying "thank you for your concern, but I'm comfortable with my decision not to vaccinate."

Now I'm wondering, if I had gotten her the vaccine, would she be any less sick right now (assuming that she really does have the illness the vaccine is designed to protect against)?

[cappuccinosmom]

If it is pertussis, she might have had increased protection, but it's not full protection.  So if she was in the percentage that it didn't work for, she'd still be sick, and just as sick.  But there's no point wondering and worrying, you can't change the past.  If her illness is bad enough to make you re-think vaccines, do that on a going forward basis, not out of guilt. 

[Ruthla]

Well, it begs the question: "Should I get this vaccine for myself or my other two children?" or at least is a reason to re-evaluate.

So, if the vaccine does absolutely nothing, then there's no reason to vaccinate anybody. If it leads to reduced severity of illness, then I need to weigh that agains the risk of vaccine reactions, and try to figure out which is more likely to have long-term health consequences (the vaccine or getting the illness.)

Of course, this would be a completely moot point if she has something other than pertussis- you could get a vaccine reaction and then still get super-sick with something that has similar symptoms.

[carriebft]

Actually it is incorrect to say that the pertussis vaccinated child would have the same course of illness as the non if they both contract. The pertussis vaccine helps stop the production of the toxin that causes the cough. Those vaccinated with the DtaP vaccine who still contract the illness will have significantly less days of coughing and will have much less severe coughing. This has been shown in mulitple studies. The reduction in severity of the disease is significant with the vaccine.

[carriebft]

There are tests for pertussis, not allows 100% accurate, but accuracy seems to be increased in cases of unvaccinated individuals since they tend to have more bacteria in the system maybe? not sure why. There have been studies showing decreased bacterial load in those with the vaccine, whcih makes sense since the disease is much less severe then.

[Ruthla]

Does having the illness confer lifetime immunity? Clearly the vaccine wears off over time. But will she now have a stronger immunity to pertussis than if she hadn't gotten sick, keeping my grandbabies healthier when she nurses them someday?

[Otto]

Originally Posted by Ruthla 

Does having the illness confer lifetime immunity?

No. The protection may be a bit longer lasting than that provided by the vaccine, on the order of two years if I recall corrrectly.

[carriebft]

the numbers are:

vaccine immunity: 4-12 years

disease acquired immunity: 4-20 years

http://journals.lww.com/pidj/Abstract/2005/05001/Duration_of_Immunity_Against_Pertussis_After.11.aspx

[harli]

I know this is completely anecdotal but my dd was fully vaccinated and got a full blown case of pertussis.  She had an incredibly bad cough for longer then the normal duration of pertussis. 

Here is an article citing a study that claims that natural immunity to pertussis last 30 years and possibly 70 years.  I just saw the study the other day and haven't gotten to look up the research yet but the article perked my interest.   So depending on some factors  it's possible natural immunity to the disease is lifelong.

http://www.newswise.com/articles/view/557711/

[majormajor]

here's a link to a study that found pertussis vaccination to be 88% effective at preventing the disease.

http://jama.ama-assn.org/content/275/1/37.abstract

when there was a pertussis outbreak in my town, the state CDC woman said that if we started showing symptoms after exposure (we were at a birthday party with an unvaccinated child later diagnosed w/ pertussis), they would recommend antibiotics to hopefully shorten duration and severity. i'd talk to you dr. or state CDC about this. if you've caught it but are in the latent phase, the vaccine won't work but antibiotics might. fingers crossed 4 u that no one else gets it!

[carriebft]

If you read the study, they are say this immunity seems to be both: vaccines and natural (with natural still being longer). They also have a large section about the vaccine interrupting transmission.
 

Originally Posted by harli 

I know this is completely anecdotal but my dd was fully vaccinated and got a full blown case of pertussis.  She had an incredibly bad cough for longer then the normal duration of pertussis. 

Here is an article citing a study that claims that natural immunity to pertussis last 30 years and possibly 70 years.  I just saw the study the other day and haven't gotten to look up the research yet but the article perked my interest.   So depending on some factors  it's possible natural immunity to the disease is lifelong.

http://www.newswise.com/articles/view/557711/

[Otto]

Originally Posted by harli 

Here is an article citing a study that claims that natural immunity to pertussis last 30 years and possibly 70 years.

Happily, PLoS is open-source. The original is here; closely related work by Rohani is here.

[carriebft]

more transmission stuff in his other papers it seems; he concludes that the vaccine induces "strong herd immunity effects."

[carriebft]

http://stg.jfponline.com/Pages.asp?AID=3776&issue=January_2006&UID=

This is a great efficacy study because it follows vaccinated and unvaccinated adults and tests all coughing illnesses to see if they are pertussis using PCR. So there is not worry that they missed the "hidden cases"  kwim?

They found the vaccine to be 63-92% effective in preventing pertussis.

[Otto]

I think it's particularly helpful that they highlight in pretty plain speech the fact that the typical time between outbreaks is not some sort of metaphysical constant that absorbs all causality in its wake.

[Referring to the Rohani papers; I've yet to look at the one posted in between.]

[Ruthla]

At this point, I'm thinking that the three of us don't *need* this vaccine when we've obviously been exposed and none of us are showing any signs of illness.

Also, what else is in the vaccine besides the weakened pertussis, diptheria, and tetanus germs? What kinds of adjucvants and "inert" ingredients are found in this shot?

Seeing DD1 being this sick, I've come to the conclusion that pertussis is a nasty illness, but not dangerous for a teenager. I'd still rather trust her immune system than poisons in a shot for her longterm health.

[Marnica]

All the DTaP's have aluminum and formaldehyde in them

there are 3 and they each have a variety of other preservatives (like polysorbate 80 and 2-phenoxyethanol). Two of them have bovine extract in them, 1 has casamino acids. Tripedia contains "trace" amounts of thimeroal.

You can look at all the inserts in detail here:

http://www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/Vaccines/ApprovedProducts/ucm094013.htm

[Ruthla]

Marnica- those links are for the vaccines they give to babies and kids up to 6. Here's the link to the vaccines they give to older kids and adults. I still can't make heads or tails of the information- the second one doesn't even seem to list the ingredients anywhere! Ah, found it hidden in a sentence when I searched for the word "contains."   What are those things?Wh What

formaldehyde-treated filamentous hemagglutinin [FHA] and pertactin

[Marnica]

Thanks - sorry I missed your DD is 15 yo!!

Filamentous Hemagglutinin is a surface pertussis protien I believe and Pertactin http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pertactin

Looks like they both have aluminum, formaldehyde and other preservatives

Originally Posted by Ruthla 

Marnica- those links are for the vaccines they give to babies and kids up to 6. Here's the link to the vaccines they give to older kids and adults. I still can't make heads or tails of the information- the second one doesn't even seem to list the ingredients anywhere! Ah, found it hidden in a sentence when I searched for the word "contains."   What are those things?Wh What

formaldehyde-treated filamentous hemagglutinin [FHA] and pertactin