Would you say something?

[APToddlerMama]

We are in a preschool type of class where caregivers stay.  There is a 2.5 year old in the class who comes with a great aunt and never with the parents.  This little girl most definitely has some major speech issues going and and is probably on the spectrum.  Great aunt is like 70 years old and way out of her league...actually spanked (lightly, but still) this kid in class yesterday.  Her expectations are totally inappropriate, she gets majorly flustered by her behavior, and she does things like cover the girls' mouth when she is crying/sceaming, etc.  She covers it for a long time and forcefully trying to get her to quiet down. The poor little girl ends up flapping, becoming more upset, etc.  Teacher is clearly upset by behavior and tries to redirect, but doesn't directly intervene, or at least I haven't seen it. 

I am just wondering if I should ask this woman if the child has been evaluated or let her know about resources or something?  I am at a loss... Especially with her age and seriously old school discipline style, I don't know what do say or how to say it or if there is any point but I just feel so bad that this poor child is being cared for by someone who doesn't have a clue about her needs. 

[chiefmir]

IMO, you'd be WAY out of line saying anything to this relative stranger about her methods... and even more out of line suggesting an eval to someone you don't know-- who isn't even the person who'd be able to get the child an eval (unless she is a guardian).  In your shoes, I'd make it a point to be sitting next to them at the next circle time, or standing nearby while your kids are playing... strike up a friendly kid-related conversation... whatever it might be to make a little connection.  Maybe the next time the child is "mis" behaving and the great aunt starts to handle it in a way you find "wrong", maybe interrupt the moment with a comiserating smile or share a little story about how hard something your child did recently was for you.  Maybe if you guys start chatting at preschool, there will be an opening later on for something more specific.

[APToddlerMama]

Originally Posted by chiefmir 

IMO, you'd be WAY out of line saying anything to this relative stranger about her methods... and even more out of line suggesting an eval to someone you don't know-- who isn't even the person who'd be able to get the child an eval (unless she is a guardian).  In your shoes, I'd make it a point to be sitting next to them at the next circle time, or standing nearby while your kids are playing... strike up a friendly kid-related conversation... whatever it might be to make a little connection.  Maybe the next time the child is "mis" behaving and the great aunt starts to handle it in a way you find "wrong", maybe interrupt the moment with a comiserating smile or share a little story about how hard something your child did recently was for you.  Maybe if you guys start chatting at preschool, there will be an opening later on for something more specific.

To be clear, I'm not considering criticizing (to her face) her discipline.  I just see her at the complete end of her rope trying to care for this kid and using methods that wouldn't work with a typically developing child, much less one with special needs.  It is seriously horrifying to see someone spank a child and forcefully keep their mouth closed especially when that child is obviously having such a tough time sensory wise and communicating her needs.  It would be like watching someone spank a baby for crying for being hungry.  That is where this child is at.  Also, my son is the same age and has very similar issues (which I've posted about many many times on these boards but realize I should have added that) that I figure there may be a way to work it into the conversation naturally....like "ohhh, yeah, my son xyz and now he's in speech and PT and OT and doing a lot better."  Not that, but you know what I mean....I just need help knowing *how* to phrase something like that and *if* others would do so or would not.  I want to be as tactful as possible if I do say something...  It would be related to helping her find resources/EI for this kiddo, not in a "hey your discipline style sucks" kind of way.

[Heavenly]

Sorry, I agree. It is really not your place to say anything. 

[chiefmir]

even with the additional info, I think the only way you could possibly ever bring anything up is if you first make a connection with the great-aunt (if there is an opening... ).  My kids are NT (as far as we know at their various ages) and I've definately started up friendly conversations with other parents at gym classes, the playground etc. by just sort of be-moaning how frustrating a certain behavior in my own kid is. 

[APToddlerMama]

Originally Posted by chiefmir 

even with the additional info, I think the only way you could possibly ever bring anything up is if you first make a connection with the great-aunt (if there is an opening... ).  My kids are NT (as far as we know at their various ages) and I've definately started up friendly conversations with other parents at gym classes, the playground etc. by just sort of be-moaning how frustrating a certain behavior in my own kid is. 

Again, I'm not asking about criticizing her discipline style or how frustrating kid's behavior is.  The kid obviously would majorly benefit from EI...the behaviors are just demonstrating the need.  I'm curious about what other parents of kids with SN think. 
 

[Eyelet]

Could you share your concerns with the preschool teacher (in private) and see what they say? If the teacher agrees that this girl would benefit from EI, it would be more appropriate for them to address this with the girl's family, and probably better received.

[Ldavis24]

I don't have a SN child but I come at this from the perspective of Nannying and homeschooling a SN boy who I loved and cared for deeply. 
His mom upon the hiring process with me discussed in great length his "challenges" (her words not mine). I nannied him for a summer them homeschooled him for the following school year.

I knew for a fact with every shred of conviction that this special boy had the most classical case of Asperger's you could imagine. Check off every "symptom" possible and that was him to a tee.

The problem, Mom did not believe, couldn't believe, wouldn't believe it. She flew this poor kid to Colorado to have him evaluated multiple times and I don't know what they told her but she disregarded it as best she could. He had a speech therapist and she and I

were in complete agreement but this mom was determined for her son to NT or NT and slightly gifted. 

This little boy needed more help than I could give him, a lot more. I wasn't trained to deal with Asperger's I didn't know how best to help him. I ended up quitting because Mom just refused to see the truth...

My point is, what makes you think the family doesn't know whats going on? They probably already do if it is as obvious as you say it is. Maybe they just aren't interested in accepting it. I think it is really not your place at all to assume they aren't aware of what is going on with this little girl. You don't even know these people! Make friend's with the Great Aunt and ask questions if you want but I seriously doubt they don't have a clue as to what is going on. 

I can tell you that if you suggest EI to them it will probably be met with a lot of anger. Most likely. I would say maybe talking to the teacher or something in that capacity might work more for you if you are determined to do it. It must be very distressing to see a child being handled that way by their caretaker but sometimes thats life. I don't like to see a mom yelling at her kid in public but it happens you know?

[Agatha_Ann]

I agree with the pp's that it isn't your place to say anything to the aunt. That must be very frustrating and difficult to watch.

If I were in this situation, I would be talking to the teacher privately about the physical discipline happening in the classroom. I would be very uncomfortable having my children be witnesses to that.

[marge234]

I disagree with PPs.  I'd say something, give her some information, whatever.  She may get mad, she may blow you off completely, but at least you know you tried.  I'd also say something to the teacher--though I'd preface my comment with "I don't expect you to reply as I realize it would be inappropriate for you to discuss another student with me, but I want to share some observations and encourage you to inform this family about EI."  GL.

[KCMichigan]

Originally Posted by IxIa 

Could you share your concerns with the preschool teacher (in private) and see what they say? If the teacher agrees that this girl would benefit from EI, it would be more appropriate for them to address this with the girl's family, and probably better received.

Ditto this.

[sapphire_chan]

There is no guarantee that the parents have observed the behaviors. If they are never with their dd in a situation with other kids, with a certain amount of stimulation, what have you, easy to not realize. Especially if they also don't have time around lots of different kids their dd's age to have a good sense of "normal".

[SpottedFoxx]

Wait - is the Aunt the primary caregiver or just the person who does drop off and pick up.  If she's the primary caregiver, I'd offer resources in a way that is like you are offering to all parents not just her.  If she's not the primary caregiver, I'd have the teacher contact the parents directly and offer them resources.

[APToddlerMama]

Well, I don't know for sure, but having worked in EI, parents frequently have no clue anything is going on, or if they do, they ignore it for quite some time for a variety of reasons (which I totally understand as a parent of a child with SN).  That said, I really doubt that they do know what is going on, because it they did, I cannot imagine that they would leave this child with someone so clearly unable to meet their daughter's needs. 

I don't personally gain anything from saying something to them, so I am a little surprised by how harsh some of the comments are.  I really just feel so very sad for this little girl and know that EI would be incredibly beneficial to her.  It is sad to see kids fall through the cracks because their pediatrician or whoever else hasn't maybe brought it to the parents' attention.  I know with my son, his doctor really was telling me to wait it out, which was the dumbest thing I could have done.  The point of my question is to find a *tactful* and helpful way to somehow point this woman towards some resources to *help* this little girl and to *help* her in caring for her.  It isn't like this caregiver is a monster...she just has no tools to help this kid and is at the end of her rope.  It is hard to watch that an not toss out some sort of resources for both of them. 

Originally Posted by Ldavis24 

My point is, what makes you think the family doesn't know whats going on? They probably already do if it is as obvious as you say it is. Maybe they just aren't interested in accepting it. I think it is really not your place at all to assume they aren't aware of what is going on with this little girl. You don't even know these people!  

[APToddlerMama]

Originally Posted by SpottedFoxx 

Wait - is the Aunt the primary caregiver or just the person who does drop off and pick up.  If she's the primary caregiver, I'd offer resources in a way that is like you are offering to all parents not just her.  If she's not the primary caregiver, I'd have the teacher contact the parents directly and offer them resources.

 primary caregiver...have not yet seen parents.

[APToddlerMama]

Triple post...sorry, but I don't know how to multi quote.  Anyhow, thank you to those of you who gave gentle responses!  I am still thinking over how to handle it...I really do want to be very careful to not step on toes.

[Stephenie]

It's really complicated. If the parents/caregiver are not willing or ready to hear it, it won't go well, no matter how hard you try to be tactful. I know the first time someone (a professional nonetheless) said they thought something was going on with my son I was furious. I really was. How dare they speak about my son as if he were less than perfect. That's really how I felt. It took time, research, tears and further evaluation before I was even ready to consider it. 

Also, the only other time I even came close to suggesting someone's kid could have issues it really upset them. But I didn't even mean to do so... they were making fun of their child for not wanting to get dirty while playing, calling him a pansy. I said my son didn't like it either and they said "What is with these pansy boys?" and I felt the need to defend him. I said "Well my son has sensory difficulties that we're working on with an Occupational Therapist. Not saying your son does, but there are a lot of reasons kids may not want to get dirty." The look I got wasn't pleased. 

If you said anything, I think it would happen best if it was while the aunt was expressing frustrations to you, and even then I think it's complicated. There's a good chance you'll just make her mad. It really would be better coming from the teacher. Maybe you could suggest it to her. That's the best I can think of in this situation. I know you want to help her, and I hope she does get help... good luck. 

[SpottedFoxx]

Originally Posted by APToddlerMama 

 primary caregiver...have not yet seen parents.

The most effective people who have offered me unsolicited advice, did it in such a way that I never realized they were telling me that something was "wrong" with my child.  They few that have done this all have done the same thing - befriended me by offering small talk at pick up and drop off.  Just nonsense and as I got more comfortable with them, more personal.  One day a teacher said to me "oh, my nephew went to "x" hospital last week for some testing and it was really neat - for him it was just play but they found out he had some delays".  Of course, I started to ask questions - what were the signs, etc. and eventually, put two and two together.  I think it was her way of leading me down that path.