I was going to nightwean this week, BUT........

[Adaline'sMama]

For the past two weeks DD has been refusing the breast several times every day. She is so excited and rowdy that she just doesnt want to sit still and nurse. She has one long nursing session right before a nap, then just does drive by nursing all day long. She is probably getting about 50% of her milk at night.

DH will start working 60 hour weeks again in mid March, so we were really planning on nigtweaning this week, to give us a good solid month of possibly crappy sleep before he started back to work full time (not much landscaping work in feb). Now I dont want to, because Im afraid that if I nightwean her, she will wont make up for the milk in the daytime. She has been a slow gainer (17.5 lbs@ 11 months) so I dont want to do anything that will make her lose weight. She is crawling and trying to walk and burning tons and tons of calories all day long. She is only taking one 1 hour nap a day and sleeping 8-10 hours at night, so I feel like she really needs the milk.

At night she is latched on for probably 4 of 8 hours. When I put her down at night, she nurses (sucking and swallowing ever two sucks) hard for a good solid 45 minutes. Then she wakes up about 2 hours later and nurses hard for another 30 minutes. I usually go to bed then, and she just stays latched forever. If I take my boob out and turn over she wakes up- instantly. Its killing my hips and back to have to stay in the same position for so long. Im a stomach sleeper. I have twin mattress on the floor perpendicular to my bed that Im ready for her to start sleeping in, but Im scared to move her and not have her nursing.

What should I do?

[Knitting Mama]

Rather than nightweaning altogether, can you try night consolidating? Maybe getting up fully once or twice at night after you go to bed to ensure she drinks a good amount, and not offering the other times? We did something like that sort of out of necessity, since my supply is low and bare nursing wasn't cutting it anymore after about 8 months. So I would get up and use the SNS and make sure she drank the whole thing (5-6 oz). That has gotten us down to one (and sometime none) overnight nursing at 10 months.

[SeattleRain]

Yeah, I don't think you necessarily have to nightwean (i.e. drop breastfeeding at night all together). There were a few things that stood out to be from you post:

1. It sounds like your LO has a nipple-sleep association. She nurses to sleep for her nap and then nurses to sleep at night and then nurses all night long to stay asleep. It sounds like this is your true issue, not the fact that she nurses at night. Truthfully, you may not be successful at eliminating ALL nursing at night in a month. You may, however, be able to get her to wake up to nurse and then head back down without having a nipple in her mouth. Does she take a paci? If so, this might be a way to break this association, slip out your nipple and replace the paci.

2. Since she goes down for a nap without needing a nipple in her mouth for an hour long, it sounds like this is possible. If you get up, nurse her in a chair, and then return her sleeping to the bed, is this possible? Could you place her next to your husband so that she's not snuggling up against the milkies all night long and wondering what changed?

3. Your daughters total sleep is only around 9-11 hours a day which may not be enough sleep for her. I know it  sounds counterintuitive, but babies who go to sleep earlier tend to fall into a deeper sleep and wake less at night for food. This is because the first part of the night is considered to be our deepest sleep, with out weakest sleep being between 4-7am. If you put her down a little earlier, she might spend more time in the deepest sleep and you might see that time period extend because the body just keeps going through those 45 minute cycles to keep her in deeper sleep. The longer she goes without nursing at night, the hungerier she'll get when she DOES wake up and more she'll take in, consolidating her nursing like CM said.

4. I think it's a good idea to try and offset the balance of night to day calories. I wouldn't do it by depriving her of food if she's hungry, but you should definitely try and consolidate her nursing to a few real times a night so that she's not seeing nighttime as food time. Daytime is for eating, and once she stops getting so much food at night, she will make it up during the day. My son is also a slow gainer (though FF) and he used to eat the majority of his food at night because like your daughter, he's just so busy he can only relax to eat when he's about to fall asleep for naps. We started cutting down on how many ounces we offered him at night and lo and behold, he started picking them up during the day.

5. (and I know this is long and rambly) I would try and bring her to a dark and quiet room to nurse every few hours during the day to encourage her to eat. I find Daniel needs a little wind-down, so I sit him on my lap on the glider in the dark and read him a book on my lap before I try and feed him. It slows his body down a little bit and helps him to realize he's hungry. Maybe try this to encourage him to eat.

[elluin]

I think No Cry Sleep Solution might help you achieve what the previous posters are recommending - consolidated nursing, reduced nipple-sleep association and more sleep. We used it to improve our sleep situation without nightweaning.

Good luck!

[Adaline'sMama]

Thanks everyone. I guess when I said "nightwean" I didnt really mean NO milkies. I just meant maybe only one nursing session as opposed to all.night.long. I agree that she has a nipple-sleep assiociation.
 

Originally Posted by elluin 

I think No Cry Sleep Solution might help you achieve what the previous posters are recommending - consolidated nursing, reduced nipple-sleep association and more sleep. We used it to improve our sleep situation without nightweaning.

Good luck!

Im sure you are right about this. I have a copy of it that my dog chewed all over and it has detered me from reading it (how lame is that...?) DD was a FANTASTIC sleeper up until she hit 10 months. Since then it has just been crazy. Im ready to figure out a way for her to sleep without boobs.

In purple:

Originally Posted by SeattleRain 

Yeah, I don't think you necessarily have to nightwean (i.e. drop breastfeeding at night all together). There were a few things that stood out to be from you post:

1. It sounds like your LO has a nipple-sleep association. She nurses to sleep for her nap and then nurses to sleep at night and then nurses all night long to stay asleep. It sounds like this is your true issue, not the fact that she nurses at night. Truthfully, you may not be successful at eliminating ALL nursing at night in a month. You may, however, be able to get her to wake up to nurse and then head back down without having a nipple in her mouth. Does she take a paci? If so, this might be a way to break this association, slip out your nipple and replace the paci.

No, she doesnt take a paci. She quit when we introduced a sippy cup at 4 months. I have actually attempted to get her to take it again in the past month but she just isnt taking it.

2. Since she goes down for a nap without needing a nipple in her mouth for an hour long, it sounds like this is possible. If you get up, nurse her in a chair, and then return her sleeping to the bed, is this possible? Could you place her next to your husband so that she's not snuggling up against the milkies all night long and wondering what changed?

Thats the plan. He was going to sleep with her in the twin mattress for the next few weeks. (with me sleeping in the bed next to them)

3. Your daughters total sleep is only around 9-11 hours a day which may not be enough sleep for her. I know it  sounds counterintuitive, but babies who go to sleep earlier tend to fall into a deeper sleep and wake less at night for food. This is because the first part of the night is considered to be our deepest sleep, with out weakest sleep being between 4-7am. If you put her down a little earlier, she might spend more time in the deepest sleep and you might see that time period extend because the body just keeps going through those 45 minute cycles to keep her in deeper sleep. The longer she goes without nursing at night, the hungerier she'll get when she DOES wake up and more she'll take in, consolidating her nursing like CM said.

I think there were days last week where she was seriously up for 18 hours. We swaddled, went into dark rooms, shhhhed, played music, read books, watched tv, drove around in the car, patted and patted and patted. The child just would.not.sleep. It was crazy. It seems to be getting a little better. I think it has a lot to do with the fact that she is starting to walk and talk.

4. I think it's a good idea to try and offset the balance of night to day calories. I wouldn't do it by depriving her of food if she's hungry, but you should definitely try and consolidate her nursing to a few real times a night so that she's not seeing nighttime as food time. Daytime is for eating, and once she stops getting so much food at night, she will make it up during the day. My son is also a slow gainer (though FF) and he used to eat the majority of his food at night because like your daughter, he's just so busy he can only relax to eat when he's about to fall asleep for naps. We started cutting down on how many ounces we offered him at night and lo and behold, he started picking them up during the day.

 This is great to know. I was super scared she would wean herself.

5. (and I know this is long and rambly) I would try and bring her to a dark and quiet room to nurse every few hours during the day to encourage her to eat. I find Daniel needs a little wind-down, so I sit him on my lap on the glider in the dark and read him a book on my lap before I try and feed him. It slows his body down a little bit and helps him to realize he's hungry. Maybe try this to encourage him to eat.

Dark is hard. I live in a house that was built in 1850, and the windows are 12 feet tall. I just cant afford shades. Our bedroom seriously has six 12' tall windows. I do swaddle for naps and rock, but its hard to get her to go to sleep. She will start saying "cat" over and over and blowing raspberries with her lips. She isnt grumpy, she is just constantly awake and on the go.

[SeattleRain]

Hmmm, dark is somewhat important. I've found that being in the dark really mellows Daniel out. I think its part of our biological makeup, dark makes us sleepy and light makes us alert. She could be always alert because she's always in the light. I know what you mean about not being able to afford shades though, that stuff is SO expensive. We went to Home Depot and bought these roller shades that were probably $20 though. They're not the most attractive shades ever, but they were cheap and they're blackout. You can have them cut down for you width wise to fit any size window.

There are two things I want to add as a follow up:

1) It did take a few days of adjustment to get him to eat more in the day than at night, so I don't want you to think it happened overnight. The way I did it (which may not apply to you since you're nursing) is that I would offer him two less ounces at night than he was used to getting, per bottle he got at night. So usually he got a 6 ounce bottle twice per night, and I reduced that to a 4 oz bottle twice. During the day I added an extra ounce to his four daytime bottles. There were a few days that he didn't drink the extra ounces that I gave him during the day, but I didn't increase the amount I gave him at night. He didn't seem really affected by this at night, he wasn't screaming for two more ounces, he just was eating a little bit less those days. And then all of the sudden he started taking the extra milk I offered during the day. So she might not accept more nursing during the day right off the bat, but if you just keep offering it to her in regular intervals, eventually she'll get the hang of it.

2) There is going to be crying. Whenever you change things up on babies they're going to cry. I just want to prepare you because this is probably not going to be a cry-free solution. That doesn't mean it's a CIO solution, but there is going to be some power struggle. You have to think of it this way: according to her, there is no problem. Everything is just perfect exactly the way it is. If you want to do anything to mess with her day, you're going to experience some crying. This didn't really bother me because I have a somewhat high tolerance for these things and my husband was available for helping me at night, so I didn't feel like it all fell on my shoulders, but I know it bothers some people immensely to the point where they'd rather not make any changes than hear the crying. We speant a lot of time rocking Daniel in the rocking chair while he cried until he finally fell asleep to get him to take naps during the day, and then it got much better. Now he's started crawling and being way more alert and we're getting a lot more crying again.

[elluin]

Originally Posted by Adaline'sMama 

I have a copy of it that my dog chewed all over and it has detered me from reading it (how lame is that...?) DD was a FANTASTIC sleeper up until she hit 10 months. Since then it has just been crazy. Im ready to figure out a way for her to sleep without boobs.

I might resist a dog-chewed copy too.

We're at 10 months too and also struggling... I posted elsewhere about when I can expect dd to sleep without movement, and one Mama had this to share:

Originally Posted by sammymama 

FWIW, 10 months was the PEAK of our sleeping insanity, between teething and developmental milestones (and I had many, many moms agree). I thought I might lose my mind a few times with all of the awakenings; I ended up moving the ball to the bedside so I could just pop out and bounce a million times a night. It did pass - it was a challenge for sure, but I do think it will get better for you, hopefully sooner than later.

[crystal_buffaloe]

Our house is also pretty bright, and DD loves the white noise of the exhaust fan ... so she naps in the swing in the bathroom (seriously, the darkest room in the house)