working on some new thoughts - Page 11

[sunnysandiegan]

That opens more questions!

First, how can I buffer the detox? Specifically the headaches...I really have a hard time with headaches. The other stuff I can handle for the most part.

Next, nutrition... Is it cumulative nutrition or more immediate? I was raised on the standard American diet of the 70s and 80s (not great, but not as bad as SAD today). As a young adult, my nutrition/diet was worse than ever. It was later when I started eating healthier and healthier (gradually). We eat much healthier than SAD now, but we're not on a specific diet like all the ones I see here on MDC (GAPS, Candida, primal, traditional, etc). Most of our produce is local, organic from our CSA or our backyard (and we eat a mix of raw and cooked). We cook most of our meals from basic ingredients, but not everything is organic. We eat some packaged foods, but fast food is extremely rare (a couple times in last five years).

It all seems so relative. Compared to MDC families, we eat on the less healthy side. Compared to local friends, we eat slightly better (and we live in a health-conscious area). Compared to relatives, we eat WAY better. Then, there is the source of "what is healthy?" A whole 'nother topic!

Last, since I am not taking any life-saving meds/supps, does it matter when I take the clay? Aim for between meals, but don't worry about it otherwise??? How much clay will help things progress without causing too much distress? I need to get through another few days of commitments, and then I have a month where I can go full-on.

[gigismom]

Originally Posted by Panserbjorne 

of course it can happen with digestive enzymes too, but be aware that when you have taken too much clay one of the things you can see is loose stool.
 

Thanks for reminding me... It is so hard to figure what is what sometimes.  Ds has been slowly increasing his dose of clay to what it current is at 1t 2x per day.  I gave up on 3x per day because it was just too hard to manage with work, other kids, hubby, house etc...  He had the above referenced huge liquid poop on Monday and then he had a very soft and large poop on Thursday (so not as liquid but still very soft).  This is major improvement as he had been going 1x per week again and only with a liquid suppository at that.  He has also been VERY gassy this week.  His sleep has essentially returned to normal.  (We recently night weaned and he had regressed during the die off before the clay started and is now back to sleeping all night until about 5am).  He does have a strange diaper rash....small bumps all over the diaper area and very itchy.  What's that all about?  I think it must be that something in the poop is causing his skin to be irritated.  He has never had this before.  It seems better today, though.  I have been mixing his clay with oj.  Is this ok?  This kid takes fCLO so could easily drink down the clay undiluted if need be.  I was just wanting to make it as easy as possible.   As for me... I am now up to 1T 2x per day, which is the recommended dose on the bottle.  I am having more regular bms and less gas than I usually have.  I hope I am not just imagining this, but I feel like my head is begining to clear too.  Hard to describe, but a general feeling of clarity and lightness.  I knew this would be a step in the right direction for us and feel like it can only get better from here.  Thanks so much for the nudge in this direction from all of you.  I enjoy reading how you all are doing also

Jennifer

[bluets]

after our bizarre bout of gastric weirdness, VSL#3 seems (1 capsule per day) seems to have stabilized dh.  when i added in a dose of liver support tincture (local product, dandelion root extract, burdock? yellow dock?), and the VSL#3, i seemed to have regained lost ground from that weirdness.

my clay has finally arrived, so i think our plan is to finish off the VSL#3 and then move into a clay experiment.  though, i feel drawn to the liver support.  thinking that punched out eyes with dark circles just are not a good sign :)

[gigismom]

Just got back from the chiro and she gave me a list of probiotic strains that DS tested strong to.  I am so excited to try them.  I spoke to Harry at Custom Probiotics and he has them all and will ship next week.  DS also tested weakened by fungus so this doesn't suprise me given the itchy diaper rash.  He was very much strengthend by the clay.  In fact, it was so funny because after she tested him on the 1t of clay he kept asking to drink it.  I put him off until all the testing was done but he did not stop asking for it!  He drank it right down undiluted and said it was yummy!  So cool to see kids just go with their intuition.   So he got an extra dose of clay today.  She tested for some nutrients (b12, folinic, mag and zinc) so we will be diligent with these again.  She also suggested an anitfungal that I am going to start with him.  I feel much more confident about killing off fungus now that he is taking the clay. 

When the probiotics come I will need some guidance on dosages, ladies!   I am going to take him back to chiro to be tested but like she said... what he can physiologically handle and what he and I can handle as far as die off may be two different things. 

She fully supports the theory that we need to get detoxing well first with the clay and then massively increase probiotics (gradually).  She also agrees it takes way more probiotics than what we currently are taking to recolonize on any even semi permanent basis. 

So glad to have been curious about the thoughts that you have been working on, PB!

Jennifer

[sunnysandiegan]

That's an awesome progress report!!!

[tanyalynn]

Alison (why is my cursor doing strange things?  I was responding after the other bit... argh.. but it doesn't matter), I think I have less body odor now than a few years ago, I know my nutrition's better and I've gotten at least a sizeable chunk of my toxic load out, my body's functioning better in several ways.  So yeah, I think that's a reasonable expectation.

sunnysandiegan, it seems like I stink when more stuff is mobilized than I've really got capacity to get rid of right now.  It seems like the clay could shift how your body wants to work, it's letting more stuff be mobilized because you've got more bandwidth to get rid of it, and that was its new pattern, then when you stopped, the new pattern didn't stop right away.

[sunnysandiegan]

Thanks! :)

I took two doses yesterday (2 teaspoons each) and two doses today (a scant tablespoon each) and no more stinkiness!!!!!!! Yippeeeee!!!!!

We're throwing a spa party tomorrow, so this was very important to me right now.

I am getting mild-to-moderate headaches, though. Still wondering what I can do for those...

Tomorrow, my plan is to take two doses of 2 full tablespoons each. Every day I increase a little bit. With hydrated clay, at what point should I aim for three times a day versus two? Is that important or helpful or personal preference? How will I know I have taken too much? Loose, watery stools? Any other symptoms?

[Koalamom]

That is great news Jenn!!

[Panserbjorne]

Originally Posted by tanyalynn 

sunnysandiegan, it seems like I stink when more stuff is mobilized than I've really got capacity to get rid of right now.  It seems like the clay could shift how your body wants to work, it's letting more stuff be mobilized because you've got more bandwidth to get rid of it, and that was its new pattern, then when you stopped, the new pattern didn't stop right away.

yup, that's what I was attempting to say in the midst of my sleep deprived fog!

[gigismom]

DS just had a fantastic beautiful consistency poop!  All by himself (did not have mag yet today and no suppository needed)!!!!  This is so great for us!  Anybody have any suggestions to help with the diaper rash?  He is itching like mad.  He has tiny slightly raised bumps all over his diaper area.  They are slightly pink and feel rough.  He is scratching until he bleeds.  He is waking at night scratching.  This all started with the clay.   The itching is worse just after he has a bm and the poop has contacted his skin (he is not potty trained yet).  I change him immediately and am about to give him a bath.  Coconut oil seems to help calm the itching somewhat.  I am going to give him a bath with coconut oil in the water and then smear him up with coconut oil.  Any other ideas?  I have been assuming that this is a yeasty rash and related to killing of fungus in his gut but maybe I am missing something.  I think I have an old tube of nystatin cream somewhere if that might be indicated I might try it.  thanks for any suggestions

jennifer

[Panserbjorne]

I'd try calendula (pure calendula tincture diluted or calendula oil but not a cream or ointment) and wash the area with it a few times.  You can also sprinkle dry clay topically and see if that helps.  It's what I did with all my babes when there was any kind of yeast or food allergy rash.  I have a long relationship with clay!  LOL!

[joybird]

What a great thread.  I'm loving clay lately.  I was using hydrated clay but when that ran out I purchased some powdered bentonite from my herb store.  I can't seem to get it to disperse in any liquid.  Have I missed that part of the conversation?  Also, my powdered clay leaves some dirty-looking residue at the bottom of my glass...is that normal?  The hydrated clay I've always used says it is purified bentonite (Great Plains) and it does look much whiter than the powder...

[mbravebird]

Originally Posted by Panserbjorne 

You can also sprinkle dry clay topically and see if that helps.  It's what I did with all my babes when there was any kind of yeast or food allergy rash. 
 

This is what I was going to suggest too! It has always worked really well on our diaper rashes. And then you're giving him clay inside and out! Cool to hear about the formed poop.

[KKKK74]

I did the first clay bath with my son (2 1/2) at the weekend and gave him the first oral dose today. The clay we are using for the oral dose is edible earth - it is high (213% rda) in chromium - which is one of the things marked as 'high' on his hair elements test.

Are all the edible clays high in chromium ? I remember reading somewhere that clays high in aluminium weren't a problem as due to the way clay works the aluminium wouldn't be absorbed - would that also be the case for chromium ? Can anyone recommend a better clay for someone high in chromium and also aluminium (and of course many other things !) 

[Panserbjorne]

Originally Posted by KKKK74 

I did the first clay bath with my son (2 1/2) at the weekend and gave him the first oral dose today. The clay we are using for the oral dose is edible earth - it is high (213% rda) in chromium - which is one of the things marked as 'high' on his hair elements test.

Are all the edible clays high in chromium ? I remember reading somewhere that clays high in aluminium weren't a problem as due to the way clay works the aluminium wouldn't be absorbed - would that also be the case for chromium ? Can anyone recommend a better clay for someone high in chromium and also aluminium (and of course many other things !) 

I think it would be fine.  If he already has a ton of chromium his body isn't looking to take on more of a load.  As I said, we did use clays high in aluminum when were were aluminum toxic and we still brought our numbers down.

Did you do a hair test or a provoked challenge?  Remember too that the high numbers don't mean much until you look at the disrupted nutrients.  Numbers *can* be high because you're excreting well.
 

[Panserbjorne]

Originally Posted by joybird 

What a great thread.  I'm loving clay lately.  I was using hydrated clay but when that ran out I purchased some powdered bentonite from my herb store.  I can't seem to get it to disperse in any liquid.  Have I missed that part of the conversation?  Also, my powdered clay leaves some dirty-looking residue at the bottom of my glass...is that normal?  The hydrated clay I've always used says it is purified bentonite (Great Plains) and it does look much whiter than the powder...

hi there!  you need to either shake/stir it up and leave it out overnight or blend it.  For the residue, I just leave it unless there's a good amount, then I add water, swish it up and drink it.

I was taught never to allow metal to touch the clay water/magma...so I use chopsticks for stirring.  I am guilty of a 5 second spin in the blender at times though!

[sunnysandiegan]

Have I hit the "sweet spot" or have I hit my tolerance or is something else going on???

I worked my way up to 1 Tablespoon three times a day of hydrated clay (and I am now taking it away from food and other supplements). My stools are very loose and QUITE voluminous and frequent -- 4-5 times a day is becoming common. Not watery, though. My insides feel all mixed up; lots of movement; not comfortable, but not intolerable. Urine output is also higher volume than usual. Very gassy at times.  I feel bloated and slightly icky. Been getting a headache pretty much every day, but not a predictable pattern. I had lost 15-16 pounds recently (since late October) and it is slowly coming back (5 pounds now, I think), but I haven't really changed my diet nor exercise the entire time. It feels like water weight on all counts (loss and now gain).

A little reassurance is what I could use right now...

[Panserbjorne]

Originally Posted by sunnysandiegan 

Have I hit the "sweet spot" or have I hit my tolerance or is something else going on???

I worked my way up to 1 Tablespoon three times a day of hydrated clay (and I am now taking it away from food and other supplements). My stools are very loose and QUITE voluminous and frequent -- 4-5 times a day is becoming common. Not watery, though. My insides feel all mixed up; lots of movement; not comfortable, but not intolerable. Urine output is also higher volume than usual. Very gassy at times.  I feel bloated and slightly icky. Been getting a headache pretty much every day, but not a predictable pattern. I had lost 15-16 pounds recently (since late October) and it is slowly coming back (5 pounds now, I think), but I haven't really changed my diet nor exercise the entire time. It feels like water weight on all counts (loss and now gain).

A little reassurance is what I could use right now...

the stool itself indicates something is off.  You can reduce the clay to a point where you're having formed stool OR increase it so that you do.  Sounds counter-intuitive, but if the issue is that your body is trying to get rid of stuff and it's doing it too rapidly then more clay will be the answer.  BUT I'd decrease first and see if you can get to a better place that way.  You don't want it to be loose or more frequent than 3 times a day-and that is even pushing it for me.

[sunnysandiegan]

Thank you! I was comfortable enough (only the headaches bothered me) at 2 Tablespoons per day (1T twice a day), so I'll go back to that today and tomorrow and see where I am tomorrow night.

[Panserbjorne]

I'd give it two full days to settle before doing anything else.  If stuff was getting stirred up, it's going to take some time to chill out.