Help pls! i have very resistant strep, possibly rheumatic fever, and now baby has scarlet fever

[JessieBird]

(similar post in life with a babe)(apologies in advance for the long post)

Hi everyone - I've been laying low since DS2 was born but I would really appreciate some advice now. Background: I have had a very resistant strep infection since mid-December. Three different antibiotics have done nothing, nor have large doses of GSE (gargle and drops in juice). In December when it first hit I ended up in hospital for a very high fever for 48 hours and then developed the severe joint inflammation and other advanced symptoms despite antibiotics. I'm going for heart tests on Thursday in case I had/have rheumatic fever. I have had a sore throat for ten weeks now. I'm quite freaked out and not sure what to do next for myself. So far, I have taken courses of amoxicillin, penicillin and most recently cefprozil. I know my doctor is going to push another antibiotic on me but I hate that idea. I've taken more antibiotics in the last two months than I had in the twenty years previous!

As for my 4 mo old baby, I hadn't been worried about my him (or my 2 year old) because I've read over and over that breastfed babies don't get strep but now I'm 99% certain that he has scarlet fever. His rash matches every description and photo I can find. Even though he didn't have symptoms then, our doctor swabbed him along with DS1 and DH on Friday just to make sure they were clear but I haven't heard back from her yet. Now in hindsight I realize that DS2 was a bit fussy at the breast on Friday and Saturday, perhaps his throat hurt. Now he's nursing fine but the rash has appeared, starting Sunday at his neck and spreading all over his body today, Monday. He's never had a fever. Because the strain I have is turning out to be so resistant and because of the risk of serious complications, I'm pretty nervous about this.

So...thanks for reading this far. My question is - does strep always have to be treated with antibiotics? In my baby's case, can it be allowed to run it's course on its own, given that he hasn't had a fever and generally appears well other than the rash? I really don't want to expose my baby to antibiotics especially if they may not kill the bacteria anyway. And what on earth should I do next for myself?

Of course I will try to get through to my doctor tomorrow (not easy) but I'm going to be up worrying all night so would love to hear what you think.

Thanks!

[MeepyCat]

I don't know where you've been reading that babies don't get strep, but it's absolutely untrue.  Babies can and do get strep, and it can have quite serious long-term complications.  Untreated scarlet fever can develop into a secondary malignant syndrome (generally about 18 days after the initial onset).  Complications of this can include kidney infections, sepsis of the ear, nose and throat, chest pain, meningitis, pneumonia and rheumatic fever. 

In your shoes, I would be in the ER tonight.

[JessieBird]

Each of my three baby books and almost every on-line source I've read says that scarlet fever/rheumatic fever affect only those over the age of three. However, most also say that they don't affect adults (that it's primarily a child and adolescent illness)...and look at me. I shouldn't have been so reassured. Anyway, I got through to a doctor at my doctor's office and she advised that because he hasn't had a fever, an ER trip wasn't warranted but to come in first thing in the morning. You can bet we'll be waiting at the door!

[Ornery]

I had antibiotic resistant strep last summer for several months so I definitely feel for you.  And I didn't even have a newborn! 

To get rid of my infection, I had to do three IV courses of antibiotics in the hospital and then continue to take antibiotics by mouth for almost a month.  That finally killed it off.  And then I did a ton of probiotics to repopulate my gut.  It was not a fun time.

None of my family or friends got sick from me, which I thought was very odd, considering how contagious strep is.

I know nothing about babies and strep.  I'm glad you are taking him tomorrow to get checked out! 

[naturalmummy]

This sounds very scary. I am probably taking a risk b/c i stopped taking abx about 5 years ago for infections like strep and breast (from nursing). In all of my cases my body has fought it on its own and my understanding was that abx might speed up the healing but it wasn't necessary. I read mostly natural/holistic based theories though vs listening to MDs. I know Rh and Sc fever are associated risks with strep gone haywire, so i guess i would have considered abx if i didn't get better on my own after a reasonable amount of time (a week or so).

Isn't the reason why these strains of strep resist abx is b/c we have overused them (i know growing up i was on them all the time) and now our immune systems can't fight on their own? Not suggesting that is what has happened in your case but just throwing it out there.

I also have thought that if my DS (21 mos) were to test positive for strep i would avoid abx for a reasonable amt of time to allow his immune system to fight, then next time if infected it would be recognized and fought. That's what I believe is happening in my body since I adjusted my approach to medicine/abx and fostering my immune system.

All that said, if i were in your shoes now i know i would be scared and would probably take in MD advice, but certainly try to sort it all out before commiting to more abx for baby. Hopefully you can confirm diagnosis for your LO.

Good luck!

[MeepyCat]

Originally Posted by naturalmummy 

Isn't the reason why these strains of strep resist abx is b/c we have overused them (i know growing up i was on them all the time) and now our immune systems can't fight on their own? Not suggesting that is what has happened in your case but just throwing it out there.

 

Nope.  The reason why these strains of strep resist abx is that we've overused abx, giving the bacteria the opportunity to evolve to resist them.  Your immune system is fine, it's the strep that's meaner.

[JessieBird]

Thanks everyone for your feedback, I really appreciate it - the mystery got deeper today. I went to the doctor and was thrilled when the nurse told me that they'd just gotten our cultures back (the whole family was swabbed last Thursday even though at the time I was the only one with symptoms) and my baby and I were negative! I was so relieved. However, when we got in to see the doctor and she took a look she said without a doubt it's scarlet fever - totally classic presentation with the little lines in the armpits and all - and both my throat and my baby's show signs of strep. She figures there are two possibilities - our symptoms are caused by something else or the tests were faulty. She re-swabbed us and sent them for 48 hour cultures. (My doctor's office doesn't do rapid strep tests in cases like this because the rate of error is so high.)

Then we talked through what to do now. Because my strep became so severe so quickly back in December and affected my kidneys and joints (maybe my heart too, find out tomorrow), I'm EXTREMELY concerned that the same could happen to my baby before we get the test result back. I could certainly wait 48 hours to get the new swab results but I opted to fill a prescription for amoxicillin for my baby right away. But I haven't given it to him yet. It's in the fridge waiting for me to decide. What would you do?

As for the comments on antibiotic over-use, I totally agree. The last time I took any prior to this was about fifteen years ago, before I knew that there are other ways to treat UTIs and the like. The strep I had/have is pure evil though and no amount of garlic, GSE, etc, even put a dent in it so, delirious with fever and my ankles so swollen I couldn't walk, I really felt like I had no choice this time. 

[mbravebird]

Wow. Can you try things in concert with the antibiotics, since they aren't totally doing the trick? I know you've tried GSE, but how about oregano oil? Colloidal silver? Olive Leaf Extract? Just from some quick looking around, it looks like Olive Leaf extract in particular has been effective against strep and rheumatic fever when antibiotics have not. Anecdotal, but interesting.