How to be gentle with my mom about our ways...

[Toposlonoshlep]

I'm really conflicted about how to tell my mother that we won't be coming to visit unless she makes some changes in her household. She very much wants us to come stay on the way to our summer camping destination, and she always tells me she wants us here for several weeks to spend time with my aging grandmother, who adores my 2 year old DS and counts minutes until he is in her presence...

The problem is that the last time we stayed there for several weeks, I came face to face with my mom's exterminator who comes and sprays the deck and inside the house where my son loves to play. Apparently he comes once a month and I was LIVID that no one told me he has been spraying when my son was playing on the deck this whole time. And then I saw my mom douse her gravel driveway (which my son also loves playing on and picking up rocks) with round up, or some other spray herbicide. Not to mention that her bathrooms are constantly bleached and she washes the floor with something crazy that makes my head hurt. Oh, and of course all of her cats (which my son cuddles) are treated for fleas and ticks with Advantage. Basically, I knew none of this when we've stayed with her in the past and feel she was inconsiderate.

I don't however, want to hold my son over her or my grandma's head...
And I can't ask her to completely change her ways...

So what would you do? Do you think short term exposure to this stuff is ok on some level? Am I overreacting?

[sosurreal09]

Ok hear me out. I don't thin any of it was unreasonable of your mother b/c a lot of (mainstream) people see no issues with any of those things. I completely see your concerns, but *most* people probably wouldn't even think twice about it. I would express your concerns with your mom on why you don't want DS exposed to these toxins. You could even start it out with something like "I know you love DS and wants what's best for him so I thought I would inform you that (I've research, or the Dr. told me) he should not be exposed to x,y,z because it has toxic ingredients in it that can cause x,y,z, so I am sure you wouldn't mind avoiding using these things while we come visit.

[sosurreal09]

Ok hear me out. I don't thin any of it was unreasonable of your mother b/c a lot of (mainstream) people see no issues with any of those things. I completely see your concerns, but *most* people probably wouldn't even think twice about it. I would express your concerns with your mom on why you don't want DS exposed to these toxins. You could even start it out with something like "I know you love DS and wants what's best for him so I thought I would inform you that (I've research, or the Dr. told me) he should not be exposed to x,y,z because it has toxic ingredients in it that can cause x,y,z, so I am sure you wouldn't mind avoiding using these things while we come visit.

[Drummer's Wife]

I kinda do think you are over-reacting, but I'm not an expert on how long the spray outside would remain on the ground and in the gravel, or what effect it could have on your DS's health.  I do know that my DH has sprayed the perimeter of our home with spray to keep ants out, and the only precaution I took was to keep the kids inside and the doors and windows closed while he was in the process of spraying.  It wouldn't occur to me to not let them walk in and out on the cement or dirt at a later date. 

I hate bleach, myself, and wouldn't be comfortable spraying it inside my home and risk breathing it in; however, I assume is dissapates and that it wouldn't be harmful to use a bathroom a few days after it has been cleaned - and heck, I use public restrooms all the time.  I do understand that you are concerned since you'll be staying for days at a time and breathing in the air in her home... but it's not like she smokes in her house, yk?  I think spending time with family is important and well worth any potential risk you are worried about. 

Maybe you could suggest she clean with vinegar for a while before your visit, if you think she would do that.  What about keeping the cat away from your DS, if the tic stuff is dangerous?  I agree you can't ask her to completely change her ways, but maybe just mentioning a few alternatives would be enough to convince her to switch? 

Now, the only reason I kinda see where you are coming from is b/c I happen to have major chemical sensitivities - as in, I get ill from smelling mainstream dish soap, for goodness sake, but when we go to visit family or stay in a hotel, I just bring my own products and try to take care of myself by drinking plenty of water, getting fresh air, and eating well. But this is not something I would expect others to modify their habits to (except fo my DH who knows not to, say, use hairspray inside the house).

fwiw, I do not think your mom was inconsiderate in the past for not letting you know what she cleaned with or how often her deck was sprayed.  Seriously, those are not things most people would feel obligated to disclose.  I'm guessing 90% of bathrooms and kitchens are cleaned with some kind of chlorox or chemical solution... it's really the norm. 

[Chamomile Girl]

I disagree with PPs as this would drive me out of her house too. Especially if she was applying stuff while you were there! No good. No good at all.

As for what you should do? Well you could start by telling her why you're uncomfortable with these things. Your kid is small, so you have a right to be. I think the burden of proof is actually on her to prove that what she is doing is actually safe, not on you to show her it is not. See if she is willing to have a toxin-free window of time in the middle of which you can come and stay with her. I think that this is a perfectly reasonable request really. If she refuses then other arrangements are going to have to be made.

Why on earth does a deck need to be treated once a month anyway

If I were to educate her about anything it might be Roundup and the evil that is Monsanto :

[philomom]

Whew. Can you have her change the schedule of the spraying so that it occurs after your trip? That way the spray has been there three weeks or more before your arrival.

Also, as a person that used to live in bug ridden Georgia... you can find companies that do a peppermint oil/boric acid and such sprays that are more natural.


Round -up is evil. No one should use that stuff.

[crunchy_mommy]

Would you be sleeping there? Could you find other sleeping arrangements? If you were just there a few hours a day, I doubt the exposure would be any more than like a pp said, using a public bathroom (or going to a restaurant/mall/hotel/mainstream friend's house)... I don't really understand why there is so much spraying going on though... but anyway... I like the pp's suggestion of asking her to change the spraying schedule. I'm not sure I have any advice as to the bleach etc. because that is what most people clean with and she'll probably feel like her house isn't 'clean enough' for you guys if you ask her not to bleach. Maybe just talk to her about your concerns and see if you can reach a compromise?

We regularly visit people who use bleach, flea treatments, etc. (though no one I know sprays their deck with anything but garlic!) and the smells/chemicals do bother me but obviously I can't ask everyone around me to do things differently so... I would just suck it up, restrict the areas your DS can play (NOT in the sprayed areas, wash hands after touching the pets) and find somewhere else to sleep.

[beenmum]

Why would it be inconsiderate for your mum not to disclose her daily cleaning routine to you?

Short term exposure to most of those items are not going to be harmful. The spraying with insecticide...you can obviously educate her about the safer methods. But since your not paying for it, she isnt obligated to change her methods b/c you dont like them.

[waiting2bemommy]

Bleach wouldn't worry me...no, I dn't like the smell either, but I use it for washing whites and disinfecting my bathroom, and I deal with the vapors by just opening my windows and so forth. I usually try to clean the bathrooms while my kids nap and it doesn't smell overpowering by the time they are up an hour r so later.

I don't think it would be a big deal to ask her to not spray her yard/deck for a week or so before you get there. Most of those companies will actually recommend that yu not go in the yard for a certain amount of time due to the chemicals. Yu could ask her to call and see what their safety recommendations are for small children.

I don't know what to tell you about the flea stuff...I would personally rather deal with the flea chemicals then have my kid get fleas......shudder....

I don't see the big deal about what she uses to clean though. I'm one of those people who needs things to smell clean so while I love vinegar and baking soda, I still like my regular cleaning products and can't imagine someone coming to my house and telling me not to bleach my toilet. I use like a gallon a week of pine sol and mean green, though, so....

[KCMichigan]

I dont think she is inconsiderate.

Honestly, I suffered from a tick borne illness and talked to my Dr (and girls pediatrician). The small exposure to 'tick meds' we use for our pets are much less risky than exposure to the tick-bourne illness that are out there and very very prevalent this time of year. I have long lasting permanant nerve & joint damage from it, so I do not take tick illness lightly. We sprayed both our house and our pets. After we treat our pets, we simply keep them confined until the treatment is dried/absorbed.

I did consult with the spray company and they used a bio-healthier option around the house. We kept our kids away from the edges of the house, and also kept them off the grass/areas around the spray for a week post spray. 

Spiders are also a serious problem where we live, so we use a natural product to keep them to a minimum.

As for the bleach-- simply bring some cleaners you are OK with (maybe sent them ahead of time??? so she can use them before you visit) and use those to clean up. We use natural products and explain to inlaws/family that it helps DDs asthma and also reduces excema. They are good with it.

BUT that said- lots of friends/family/ PUBLIC locations are chemically sprayed for bugs/ticks/spiders and cleaned with much harsher chemicals that people use in their houses.  Almost all stores, mall,  resturaunt, playground, even campgrounds will spray for bugs to help alleviate problems with weeds breaking up pavement, bugs in the kitchens, spider webs, ticks, in stores, etc.

 I would not expect to close us up in our house or not go in public. Our area even sprays local parks for mosquitoes. They did a lot of research and thought there was some outcry-- the HIGH incidence of mosquito related illnesses (and some kids getting really sick from mosquito bites) and the resulting public cost/ long term health implications the parks are sprayed monthly from spring to fall. YUCK! But it is what it is, we try to avoid the parks post spraying, but otherwise use them often.

I see your point, but I would use reasonable precautions and visit.

It means a lot to your family and is something you can not 'go back' and recapture the moments. Have a blanket for your DS to sit on (or chair)when he is outside. Wash hands frequently, bath nightly, tick checks, natural bug sprays, etc.

Edited by KCMichigan - 3/18/11 at 9:34am

[sosurreal09]

I love the Jason bug spray http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=jason+bug+spray&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=R5G&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&prmd=ivns&resnum=3&biw=1280&bih=619&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=8311605397259273366&sa=X&ei=mW-DTc_rGJOC0QGv_9m_CA&ved=0CFIQ8wIwAA#

That's what we use

[cateerob]

hi

I think asking her not to spray just before your arrival or while you are there  would be fair, most of the parks and open spaces where i live sray and use weed killer....but i would not aviod them. As to the bleach thing im not a big fan but dont think it will do any harm unless you lock yourself up in your home you cant aviod bleach cleaned areas. As to the pets..fleas are alot worse than the chemicals which dry off in a few hours, it would be unreasonable of you to ask your mom not to treat her pets unless you have any proof that it is going to harm your son.

catherine

[happysmileylady]

I don't think she was being inconsiderate at all.  In fact, she likely thinks she's doing a great think by keeping bugs and germs away from your little one.

The bug spraying...I agree that's a lot.  I would suggest finding out why there's so much of it going on.  Maybe they have a problem with brown recluse or something?  I personally would rather having my kid playing on a deck that was sprayed for bugs two weeks ago than risk her being bitten by a brown recluse (or whatever other poisonous bug.)  There might be a very good reason for the spraying.

The animals flea treatments...would you be comfortable with the animals being treated with something internally, would your parents?  I don't do a regular flea treatment for my pets (and rarely have problems) but they have gotten fleas a couple of times in the 9 years we have had them.  And, when they have, I have given them capstar.  It's a pill, rather than a topical treatment.  I am more comfortable with that than something topical because I know it's safe for the pets to swallow.  My cats hate the topical stuff and begin to lick the spot or as close to it as they can reach, and then promptly puke it all back up.  I also know my kids aren't going to get it all over them if they hug the cats.  I am not quite sure how it gets rid of the fleas, I think it secreats something in the sweat of the animal, but I am not sure.  Also though, I don't think capstar is for a daily preventative, rather a flea treatment if they get fleas.  But, perhaps you could suggest that they not treat the pets regularly, but that if the pets get fleas they try the capstar?

Bleach...unless it's excessive use, I wouldn't worry too much.  Do you ever take your little one to a public pool or restroom?  Because those areas are very excessively treated with bleach and other chemicals.  Public heath standards often require more use of bleach and antibacterial chemicals than any average homeowner would use.  You COULD subtly suggest vinegar, or maybe talk about how thrilled you are when you use it in your own home, plus how it's less expensive than bleach or the smell is better or something.  As for the other floor cleaner, do you know what it is?  Could you find out?

The round up and other herbicide...what about suggesting that you and she pull the weeds together when you show up to save her the money?  That's the only suggestion I have on that, I can't imagine being worried about weeds in the driveway to begin with. 

[Marsupialmom]

I never would think to tell you or anyone about these things, so I think you are over reacting some.  

I bet she has been doing this for years and it has not mattered.  

Advantage for the cats can be a major pros and cons.  I have one cat that is highly allergic to fleas Advantage prevents her from chewing wounds and being in a lot of pain.  Plus it stopped our worm issue.  I don't want my kids to get bitten by flea, get parasites, or my pets to be miserable.  This would make those kitties not be nice to your child. I would suggest another product but this you need to relax on because many times doing nothing is worse!

If you never want your child exposed to bleach do not go to public pools, hospitals, public bathrooms, or any public spaces.  If you can smell bleach then I would tell your mom.  She is using to much and this is harmful but overall you need to relax some.  Again if you want to push it bleach is horrible for grout.  There is articles on grout care that you might want to point out to your mom.  Maybe give her an alternitive suggestion. But, IMO, you need to relax some. 

Have you asked why your mom is getting sprayed once a month?  When my mom go roaches (sister brought them from SC after hurricane) for a while once a month we got a visit.  I would investigate because our bug guy wanted to go way longer than necessary for money.  When I bought my house the people before us paid to have it sprayed often and for 2 years after I bought it. We had to threaten law suit for trespassing if they came on our property.  Again you might want to give alternitives, and if it saves money it will make it more likely she will use it.

But if these things are that big of an issue for you and it is unforgivable that your mom uses these items do not go to public parks or building.  You have no clue the last time they were sprayed or round up. 

////because my city is really anal about weeds and grass in drive way and walk ways we use a little salt in the cracks.  This help with our slug issue also.  

Edited by Marsupialmom - 3/18/11 at 9:04am

[Toposlonoshlep]

Thank you everyone. This is why I posted, to hear how others think about pesticides and the like. I don't know much about them. Other then they are carcinogenic and mutagenic, but I don't know in what amounts. I guess the key is t not overwhelm the kid's system and since we don't live there, as long as I am careful with hand washing and the like, we should probably be ok, right?

I think being a first time mom, there is this delicate balance between being paranoid (wanting to shield your little kid from everything) and trusting that everyone knows best. I am always riding that line it seems....

I know my mom means well and that she is just living the best way she knows how, but I guess part of me is freaking out that my son was playing in a pile of rocks that I later saw the bug guy douse with pesticides. The thing about him not wanting to lose his job rings true, because it was a while ago that she had a major ant problem and they got into her pantry. That's when she hired the bug guy and he has been showing up once a month ever since, charging pretty hefty sums from what I understand. I think she is afraid if she stops the ants will attack again. lol. 

[waiting2bemommy]

Ants hate cinnamon. I have used it effectively to get rid of hoards of ants. You can put a pile of sugar  on your floor and sprinkle cinnamon around it and th ants will not cross the cinnamon "barricade." I used to do this for fun when I was little, lol. Just so your mom knows.....cinnamon is a lot cheaper than the bug guy!

[crunchy_mommy]

Originally Posted by Toposlonoshlep 

Thank you everyone. This is why I posted, to hear how others think about pesticides and the like. I don't know much about them. Other then they are carcinogenic and mutagenic, but I don't know in what amounts. I guess the key is t not overwhelm the kid's system and since we don't live there, as long as I am careful with hand washing and the like, we should probably be ok, right?

I think being a first time mom, there is this delicate balance between being paranoid (wanting to shield your little kid from everything) and trusting that everyone knows best. I am always riding that line it seems....

I know my mom means well and that she is just living the best way she knows how, but I guess part of me is freaking out that my son was playing in a pile of rocks that I later saw the bug guy douse with pesticides. The thing about him not wanting to lose his job rings true, because it was a while ago that she had a major ant problem and they got into her pantry. That's when she hired the bug guy and he has been showing up once a month ever since, charging pretty hefty sums from what I understand. I think she is afraid if she stops the ants will attack again. lol. 

I do think your DS will be OK if it's just occasional exposure and you take extra effort to wash his hands and all... Like I & others have said, he's already probably exposed to these things whenever you go out somewhere. I remember another post of yours worrying about incense ? and I think you & I are cut from the same cloth lol... I tend to get very paranoid as well... but the best advice I can give you is to only worry about the things you can control. Some things are just out of our hands for a myriad of reasons... and if you can't really do anything about it (well, without destroying all relationships, breaking laws, whatever the case may be) then it can really help to just "Let go & let God" (I don't know if you're religious, don't mean to offend, it's just the best phrase I can think of for these kinds of situations...)

[Toposlonoshlep]

LOL. Yeah, the incense was me too. 

I think I need to be more gentle with myself and the world, but it is, ironically enough, a difficult journey there. Motherhood comes with so many unexpected things. I SWEAR I never worried at all before I had a kid. 

Thanks for not telling me I'm crazy and identifying with my "cloth". lol.

And although not religious, I am spiritual, and I do need to let God in more to take some of this perceived burden off. Thank you for your words. They were well-crafted!

Originally Posted by crunchy_mommy 

Originally Posted by Toposlonoshlep 

Thank you everyone. This is why I posted, to hear how others think about pesticides and the like. I don't know much about them. Other then they are carcinogenic and mutagenic, but I don't know in what amounts. I guess the key is t not overwhelm the kid's system and since we don't live there, as long as I am careful with hand washing and the like, we should probably be ok, right?

I think being a first time mom, there is this delicate balance between being paranoid (wanting to shield your little kid from everything) and trusting that everyone knows best. I am always riding that line it seems....

I know my mom means well and that she is just living the best way she knows how, but I guess part of me is freaking out that my son was playing in a pile of rocks that I later saw the bug guy douse with pesticides. The thing about him not wanting to lose his job rings true, because it was a while ago that she had a major ant problem and they got into her pantry. That's when she hired the bug guy and he has been showing up once a month ever since, charging pretty hefty sums from what I understand. I think she is afraid if she stops the ants will attack again. lol. 

I do think your DS will be OK if it's just occasional exposure and you take extra effort to wash his hands and all... Like I & others have said, he's already probably exposed to these things whenever you go out somewhere. I remember another post of yours worrying about incense ? and I think you & I are cut from the same cloth lol... I tend to get very paranoid as well... but the best advice I can give you is to only worry about the things you can control. Some things are just out of our hands for a myriad of reasons... and if you can't really do anything about it (well, without destroying all relationships, breaking laws, whatever the case may be) then it can really help to just "Let go & let God" (I don't know if you're religious, don't mean to offend, it's just the best phrase I can think of for these kinds of situations...)