New Tfer, ex-vegan, battling ECC, bone broth $$ question. WHEW!

[Lazurii]

Oh, and, hello!  I'm new here, but I've been reading a good long time.  All y'all are fabulous.  This is going to be a novel, and I'm sorry for that, but everything ties to everything else, YKWIM?

I have a 3yo DS, "BuggaBoo", and a 1 yo DD, "Doozer".  They are both nursing.  I became vegetarian a few months before conceiving BuggaBoo and went vegan when he was 7 months old.  However, in the beginning of both pregnancies I craved meat (and ate it) before morning sickness kicked in.  A few months ago I added eggs back into our diet for a lot of reasons.  Before we were vegetarian we ate CAFO meats.  Actually, I feel that going vegetarian helped us conceive BuggaBoo since we had been trying for 2 years and had 2 miscarriages.  After doing a cleanse and being nearly vegan for a few months we got our baby.

Anywho, BuggaBoo has pretty bad teeth, the front top ones started decaying rapidly right after he turned a year.  He had a ton of reflux as a baby, and will still spit up sometimes if he's eats or nurses and immediately runs around.  We've never treated the reflux because he's grown well and was never very upset about it.  My midwife and pediatrician chalked his tooth decay up to the reflux.  We halted the decay through intensive brushing, to the point that a pediatric dentist didn't even know he had decay, he thought BuggaBoo had malformed teeth.  I had to insist several times that his teeth grew in perfectly at 3.5 months.  Silly dentist.

Now the decay on his front teeth has started again, and he also has at least two new cavities in his molars.  I now understand that I wasn't not well nourished during his pregnancy and that is probably the reason for his tooth decay.  We're trying to fix that now. 

We don't do dairy, so I'm going to be using 72 hour bone broths.  But I'm estimating BuggaBoo needing 2 quarts a week and me needing at least 2 quarts a week and then sundry other quarts for Doozer and The Hubby.  Our budget is tight.  So here is my question (finally!):  Is it okay to use CAFO bones for broth?  I would rather avoid them, but if they are cheaper it would really help out the cause.  I would skim the fat off and dispose of it, since I would want to limit my toxins.

Okay, if you're still with me, thanks for reading.  I'm willing to answer any questions, and there's a ton more to the story (oh my).  Thanks for any advice!

[craft_media_hero]

Lazurii-

I just wanted to say  and to invite you to our former/questioning veg*n thread here: http://www.mothering.com/community/forum/thread/1298565/questioning-or-former-veg-n-support-chat/60 Many of the mamas on the thread are in a TF mindset ;)

I am new to TF and bone broths, but your plan sounds pretty good. I think that the use of CAFO meats/bones is at your discretion--could you possibly call local farms/butchers and ask them if they have bones on the cheap? I know my local natural meats store sells "dog bones" pretty cheap-that might be a good way to go. I hear that you're trying to minimize toxins, but I am under the impression that the fats is where the good stuff is and that the fats actually help you absorb other nutrients? Not sure--I'm sure there are some more experienced mamas here who can give you more info.

Also, concerning tooth decay, have you considered cell salts? There is a huge cell salts thread in health and healing. I think the vegan and breastfeeding thread (current here in TF) has links to that and also to a thread about nutritionally healing tooth decay.

I know there are folks who do their best with TF but have to use all CAFO products due to finances. I think you do the best you can, kwim?

Good luck and welcome!

[Lazurii]

Thank you for the warm welcome!  Also, very helpful links, I'll settle down and read them once the little ones are in bed.

The plan was to use half organic, grass-fed bones and half conventional.  I am using the organic ones right now and saving the tallow to use for cooking.  We also just moved and bought four laying hens, so we're eating a lot of pastured eggs and loving them.  I've also started adding some organ meats into our diet from pastured animals.  Last of all we're starting to eat fish again, mostly canned due to cost, but we're eating sardines and salmon.

Budget just because less of a deal because we FINALLY got our tax return in.  We usually don't have budget problems, but we just moved into a place with higher rent and it had an $800 deposit and other moving costs came up, so we were feeling the pinch there for a bit.

I'm been calling around for organ meats and bones, but I've been focusing on the offal.  Maybe a bone focus is in order.  I did find a source of pastured bones for $1/lb, but they're a few hours away.  He does deliveries, but charges $10 for that.  Actually, I don't know what a good price for bones are...  Hmm.

Oh, another question.  Once my broth is done my bones are very soft.  Could I then dehydrate these and grind them in my mortar and pestle and add them to food for a mineral supplement?

Sorry for all the questions, I'm just very excited.

[velcromom]

I thought about the conventional vs. pastured a lot and determined that if it's a choice between plenty of bone broth or occasional bone broth, I'm ok with using conventional as needed. I get antibiotic and hormone free chicken feet for about a dollar a pound at the local meat shop. A dollar a pound for pastured is an amazing price, I'd go for it! If you want to have it on hand for daily use, you'll want to make room in the freezer for a bulk amount. The local shop sells 40lb boxes. I split it up to help it fit into the freezer better. Combine the feet with saved carcasses from pastured birds you have roasted, and you'll get a nice rich broth.

The cooked bones don't have a very good flavor. I once tried pureeing them into some of the broth and it did not taste good at all. I'm not sure how much nutrition is in them after so much of the minerals being cooked out into the broth...

[craft_media_hero]

Great that you have laying hens! You can throw the eggshells into your bone broth, too.

I would go for the $1 for pastured and get a bulk amount so that the $10 delivery charge was spread out per pound. Awesome to get them delivered to your place!

Another use for your grinded up bones might be adding to your compost for your garden? Or mix into your garden soil? If you did not want to directly consume them--people pay for blood and bone at the garden store, right? Just a thought, I've never personally tried it but it might work out.

[Lazurii]

Velcromom, thanks about confirming the price about the bones, I wasn't sure if that was a good price or not.  I'll have to stock up (pun intended).  Maybe I can do a group buy for my friends and split the delivery cost.  He sells all sorts of meats, so it's not just bones.  I bought some fabulous beef hearts and tongue, and the heart is sooo yummy.  It was my first time eating it, I was pleasantly surprised.

Craft_media_hero, that's a good idea about the eggshells.  We've been throwing them in the compost or crushing them and giving them back to the hens, but now we have oyster shells for our girls.  Oh, and also thanks for the feedback about the pastured bones, I like hearing a lot of different opinions.

I ground up the softer bones last night, dehydrated them since they were soupy, and ground them again this morning.  I sprinkled some into BuggaBoo's homemade ketchup this morning.  He saw me to it, and didn't complain about the flavor, so I think I might use it like that; adding it to hummus, stews, etc.  The harder bones I'm throwing in the compost pile so our veggies can be chock full of minerals, too.

Okay, have a great day!

[chattyprincess]

not exactly diet related but thought I would point you in the direction of an intresting woman and her blog. alot of people on the health and healing board use her method or a variation of her method. I have been using it successfully as has my dd..http://askdrellie.blogspot.com/ 

[Lazurii]

Thanks, chattyprincess, I'm checking it out right now.

[SandraMort]

May I ask how you came up with this amount?  I've got some health issues that I'm hoping to assist healing with the bone broth, but can't find the nutritional content ANYWHERE, so have no idea how much I need to be eating.

Thanks!!!
 

We don't do dairy, so I'm going to be using 72 hour bone broths.  But I'm estimating BuggaBoo needing 2 quarts a week and me needing at least 2 quarts a week and then sundry other quarts for Doozer and The Hubby.  

[Lazurii]

SandraMort, I heard you're supposed to be drinking/ingesting a cup a day if you're trying to heal tooth problems.  My son has cavities and I've had weak spots in my teeth for years, so we both need a cup a day.  I was vegan during my daughter's pregnancy, so I want to get some bone broth in her, either directly or through breastmilk, which means I'll want to drink more than a cup a day.  And I think The Hubby would benefit from it to.  So that's how I arrived at my number.

[SandraMort]

Thank you!