Breastfeeding & Overnight Visitation

[Kellyloggs]

Hello All,

I am new here and am looking for guidance or advice from anyone who has experienced a silimar situation. I am a single mother with a 9-yr-old son and an 14-month-old daughter. I practiced attachment parenting with both children and firmly believe in nursing on demand, co-sleeping, and child-led weaning. Neither of my children ever took a bottle, I stayed home with each for a year before returning to work, and neither one spent a night away from me until after age 2 (my daughter has never spent a night away from me). My daughter's father was not involved in the pregnancy, and initially was not going to be involved in her life (which was fine with me) but changed his mind when she was a few months old. Because of my breastfeeding, he would visit our daughter a few times a week in my home for 2-3 hours per visit. He did this begrudgingly, because he thinks breastfeeding is unnecessary & thinks I should've formula fed her. (he has another daughter from a previous relationship & she was never breastfed) Shortly before our daughter's first birthday, we had a major falling out which resulted in me filing for child support & him filing for custody/visitation. He is demanding overnight visits & actually requested a 50-50 split of her time. He says that I've breastfed long enough and if I insist on continuing then the court will force me to pump. I do not mind him taking our daughter for daily visits, she goes to daycare 3 days a week and does fine taking a sippy cup during the day. But she still nurses in the am, in the evening after daycare, at bedtime, and during the night. Overnights will totally disrupt her nursing, not to mention that she's never slept anywhere without me, she's never been to her father's new apartment, nor does she know his live-in girlfriend (who has physically threatened me in the past) and her children that live there as well. I think the combination of all of this at once is just too much for my daughter to adjust to and would be much more comfortable starting with short daily visits and gradually increase the duration of her visits. Not to mention that her father has done little more than have playdates with her. He's never bathed her, has trouble feeding her, has never put her to bed, and doesn't know her schedule or routine. I am not trying to keep my daughter from her father, but I don't want her to be forced to go through such drastic changes all at once. I truly believe it would be traumatic and possibly damaging. To make matters worse, her father hasn't seen her in nearly two months because he refuses to visit her at my home (his girlfriend doesn't want him at my house anymore) and per my lawyer's instructions I am not to let him remove her from my home until we have a court order. I know the courts emphasize shared parenting but I cannot imagine that the court would force me to comply with his wishes. Has anyone had experiences with custody/visitation and breastfeeding? I am sick with worrying about how this will all play out in court. Any advice or guidance would be very appreciated!

[PoppyMama]

From what I've seen it will have little to.do with breastfeeding and everythingto do with standards in your area. You need to find out if 50/50 is the norm or if its e/o weekend + one evening, etc. There may also be an age that children normally start overnights and I've seen that range widely. Has your lawyer given you any feedback on this?

[Goodmom2008]

Like a previous poster stated, you need to find out what your state's stance on 50/50 physical is.  Given your youngest's age and the pitiful knowledge of the benefits of extended nursing, you probably aren't going to get much traction with the fact that you are still bfing in any state. 

Once you find out where your state stands, you will have a better idea of what to expect. 

[Kellyloggs]

Thanks for the feedback. I am meeting with my lawyer next week and am just doing some research & digging on my own in the meantime because I'm truly terrified of the possibile outcomes. She seem's to feel pretty confident that he will not get 50/50 considering other issues pertaining to the case that are not related to BFing and that I should expect an every-other weekend + one weeknight kind of deal. I would be more than willing to offer more access to our daughter during the week in exchange for gradually building up to overnights. (like allowing him to pick her up from daycare, take her to his house for the evening and dinner and returning her for bath & bedtime once or twice a week in addition to his weekend visits) I know ultimately my daughter will be spending extended periods and overnights with her father, but I really think that removing her from her home, the only family she's know, her sole caretaker, and her comfort zone and dropping her in a foreign environment with complete strangers and the inability to breastfeed suddenly and drastically is cruel and unfair to our child. I would think that her father would want this to be a smooth and comfortable transition for our daughter but his only concern is him getting what's "fair" and he is letting his gf influence him. In the meantime, I've reached out to my child's pediatrician to see if they could assist as well. (like writing a letter stating their opinion of what's best for the physical & emotional health of our daughter and also documenting that I did extended nursing & co-sleeping with my son so they cannot say I am doing so with my daughter for the sole purpose of hindering his relationship/visitation with the child) Hopefully things turn out for the best.

[Super~Single~Mama]

I wouldn't focus on the BF'ing AT ALL in any court, I would play up the fact that she doesn't know her father very well (unless she does, then you may just need to allow overnights).

My DS started overnights with his dad at about 11months, and nursed until his second birthday (when he weaned by his own choice).  So, overnights will not automatically ruin a BF'ing relationship.

ETA - ds co-sleeps with me, and his dad when he does overnights, so that is consistent, and is comforting to ds when he's away.  Also, my last ped was completely unwilling to get involved.  Completely.  They flat refused.  His new ped is from after the split, but I'm sure she would opposed too.  They are doctors, not experts on emotional health, etc.

Also, you would be better to come up with a visitation plan that you are comfortable with that would gradually increase his time to overnights and the states "standard" plan for custody.  Then go into the judge, and tell them that your dd doesn't know her father very well, and you want her to be able to slowly form a relationship that allows her to feel comfortable at his house, and that you are happy to gradually increase his time according to xyz schedule that you have laid out.  You can also make clear that the schedule is just a draft, and that you are willing to discuss other options, as long as all of them have overnights being built up to.

I wouldn't mention the BF'ing.  It's really not pertinent to a visitation schedule.

Edited by Super~Single~Mama - 4/16/11 at 7:50am

[Kellyloggs]

Thanks SSM. I really don't know if my daughter will sleep alone at all, and I wouldn't mind her co-sleeping with her father but he is living with another woman now. I do not want my child co-sleeping with her! (aside from the fact that she is a horrible person, IMO, she has threatened me physically and is the reason her father hasn't had contact with DD in 2 months since his girlfriend doesn't want him visiting our child at my home) Her threats of violence, in writing no less, are one of the reasons my lawyer thinks that we can really contest his visitation requests. I'd like to keep my DD as far away from his girlfriend as possible but I know it's inevitable since they live together and allegedly plan to marry.

I do believe that our pediatrician will be cooperative. I've been with the same practice for 9 years now, since my son was an infant, and our doctor is herself a nursing mother. We have a wonderful relationship, I don't think she'll mind writing a letter of recommendation at all.

My lawyer and I are going to write up and propose a visitation plan that consists on daytime visits, gradually increasing until we get to overnights but I know there is no way her father is going to accept it. He wants overnights now, no excuses. Period. He has been convinced that it's only "fair" that he has access to our child on his own terms in his own home as often as I do regardless on what type of stress that puts on DD. There is no rationalizing or negotiating with him. I'm hoping that the judge will recognize that I'm trying to support and foster a relationship with him and DD but in a graduated timeframe that allows DD to adjust and acclimate to the situation.

When you started overnights with your DS, what was the duration and frequency? Was his father keeping him for weekends at a time or was it just one night here and there? How did you manage to maintain your milk supply? Did it effect your nursing at all? Did you pump and if so was you DS fed breastmilk via bottle? My DS has never taken a bottle & is just mastered using a sippy cup throughout the day.

[Super~Single~Mama]

Originally Posted by Kellyloggs 

When you started overnights with your DS, what was the duration and frequency? Was his father keeping him for weekends at a time or was it just one night here and there? How did you manage to maintain your milk supply? Did it effect your nursing at all? Did you pump and if so was you DS fed breastmilk via bottle? My DS has never taken a bottle & is just mastered using a sippy cup throughout the day.

Well, it was a little graduated but not much.  First, Lincoln had 2 day time visits/week (2-3hours each) and one overnight/week (this lasted approximately 3 weeks - just while we waited for the first court date).  Then we went to one overnight one week, and the following weekend (2 nights).  Then, about 6months after that we went to 4 overnights every 2 weeks - so every thursday night, and then when its my ex's weekend he has DS from Thursday night to Sunday evening.

Our situation was very different though, b/c DS lived with both me and his father until we split - so they already had a very strong father/son bond.

As for pumping, I pumped when DS did overnights until he was about 16mo.  Then I just pumped for comfort.  He got BM in a bottle until he was about 12-13mo, then his dad started just giving him whole milk, and would give him a bottle before bed, and whenever he wanted one throughout the day. 

It really didn't affect our nursing at all, except that DS at first just wanted BOOBS all day and all night after coming home from a weekend, but he adjusted rather well, and now gets really excited about weekends with his dad.    It started to affect nursing a tad once he was closer to 2 years, but only when he spent a whole week at his dad's.  It was never a big deal though, and quite frankly I was ready for him to wean when he did, and had already started to put limits on nursing.  It just worked out.

[sunflowers]

I also think it would be detrimental if you promoted nursing as a reason for limiting visitation.  I would not mention it at all.  Many judges will bristle at the percieved inequity of the situation (mom has breasts so she is by default the best caretaker).

My situation is that I was not with dd's dad after 14 weeks pregnant.  He was very open to a graduated schedule for the first year but at 18m he wanted her overnight 1 night a week.  I nursed dd until almost 2yo and she did fine with her dad that 1 night per week.  She did wean just prior to her 2nd bday but we'll never know if it was due to those overnights or not.  My guess is not, though.  I was ready to wean and did not promote night nursing after 21m but did not discourage it.  She was already self day-weaned at that point.

If you can pump, I would encourage you to provide some frozen milk; but not nursing for a day or two at 14m old is not the end of the world.  It's not wonderful for you or baby, but that is one of the pitfalls of not being married/together with the baby's dad.  It sucks but the tradeoff is most likely more positive than negative for both of you.

[robinchap1]

This sounds hard, I'm so sorry.  It sounds like you have a great plan. I definitely would get a letter from the ped. I did for that exact reason and it helped me. I think the gradual plan is an excellent idea.  And the documentation you have about the gf is good (and disturbing... I really hope they consider this). Of course, above all, make sure you trust your lawyer and then really listent to his/her advice because they will know best what your court system is most likely to do and will probably know something about your judge ahead of time as well.

Something to keep in mind... if you are correct about your ex, it sounds like he might lose interest.  It is not going to be easy to have a nursing, co-sleeping 1 year old overnight.  If his true motives center around trying to upset you, trying to impress his gf or just being a control freak... this interest in his daughter may not last when it gets hard.  As much as possible, try to act laid back and ok with everything (once it really comes down to sending her overnight). Don't let him know you are upset or worried.  If he can't get to you, he will stop trying.  And if it gets hard, he is more likely to call you to come get her (this happened to me and it shocked me that my ex would do that) if she really needs you.

When/if it comes down to overnights, I can give you some tips too.  As much as I agree with you that it doesn't seem like a good or necessary plan, if it has to happen, it will be ok.

Ooh, another tactic.  You don't have to let her go until a judge orders you too. Delay as much as you can. Every bit of time makes a difference at this age. Their language and understanding is really starting to grow.  If you can find ways to delay even a few months, she will be that much closer to 2. Have that much more understanding of time, etc. when you tell her you will see her tomorrow, etc.  And, the longer he stays away from her by his choice (you have invited him to visit her in your home, you said), the worse it will look for him in court and will hopefully support the gradual visitation idea.  Although the downside to this is the longer he is away from her, the less likely she is to remember him...  Ask your lawyer.

Good luck and take care.

Message me anytime about overnights if you want. I sort of come and go the forum, but I think PMs go to my email so I will see it.

[Kellyloggs]

Thank you all for the positive and supportive feedback! I meet with my lawyer in 2 days and have been reading everything I can about the new child custody laws that recently went into effect in my state. The new laws now make it mandatory to consider each parent's criminal history (he has felony drug convictions & served 6 months in jail, which I DID NOT know about until recently, as well as several DUI's & one was with his other daughter in the car!), the duties each parent performs for the child (which I perform 100% of), and the status quo or who the child currently lives with. The law also mandates that the judge must consider which parent will be more likely to foster a loving relationship with the other and which one would be more likely to try to poison the child against the other. I have plenty of e-mails & text messages between the two of us where I tell him repeatedly that he is welcome to come see he daughter whenever he chooses until we have a custody/visitation order through the court (which he's refused) and constantly telling him that no matter what I will never project my personal feelings towards him onto my child, our issues have nothing to do with her (to which he usually replies that he can't wait till she's old enough so that he can tell her what an evil, manipulative whore I am). So I shall print everything out and sort through it all with my lawyer friday. 

I got a letter today saying that they gave him the continuance he requested for our hearing this monday. As annoyed as I am, he's only hurting his case. The longer he willingly goes without seeing his child, the worse it's going to be for him in court. At this point, she probably won't even recognize him and they're going to have to go through a period of adjustment. IT will be difficult for us all. Btw, I'm not going to bring up the breastfeeding issue, but he definitely will so I want to have all of my ducks in a row with documentation and whatnot just in case. He thinks that it's stupid to breastfeed and it's no better than formula. Smh...

Anyway, keeping my fingers crossed and looking forward to meeting with my lawyer. :)

[Super~Single~Mama]

Originally Posted by robinchap1 

Ooh, another tactic.  You don't have to let her go until a judge orders you too. Delay as much as you can. Every bit of time makes a difference at this age. Their language and understanding is really starting to grow.  If you can find ways to delay even a few months, she will be that much closer to 2. Have that much more understanding of time, etc. when you tell her you will see her tomorrow, etc.  And, the longer he stays away from her by his choice (you have invited him to visit her in your home, you said), the worse it will look for him in court and will hopefully support the gradual visitation idea.  Although the downside to this is the longer he is away from her, the less likely she is to remember him...  Ask your lawyer.

Re:  the bolded, YES!  An appearance is not a trial.  I had NO idea when my custody battle first started - but when you go for custody/visitation stuff the judges put off having hearings and such as long as possible to push people to settle.  And the judge can't really order anything without hearing evidence, especially if you refuse to agree to it (called "stipulating" to it when in court). 

Originally Posted by Kellyloggs 

Btw, I'm not going to bring up the breastfeeding issue, but he definitely will so I want to have all of my ducks in a row with documentation and whatnot just in case. He thinks that it's stupid to breastfeed and it's no better than formula. Smh...

So when he brings it up, be very non-chalant about it.  Say something along the lines of, "She nurses a few times throughout the day, and at night mostly.  It's a comfort thing for her, but she is eating/learning to eat solid foods, and is being exposed to a wide variety of things.  She is in perfect health, and her pediatrician has no nutritional concerns."

It doesn't need to be a huge documentation drag out fight.  When my ex brought it up with the custody evaluator, the evaluator asked me about it, and I said something similar to the above, and it was put in the evaluators report  that it was completely natural at for ds to still be nursing at his age (at the time he was 16-17mo).  It's pretty much common knowledge that BM is better than formula nutritionally, and unless you get the point where you are in trial (which will probably happen in about a year- 1 - 1/2 years if EVER), the documentation isn't all that important.  A judge likely won't be all upset about a 13mo nursing so long as they are being offered other foods as well.

[blessedwithboys]

It really depends on where you live, but you can go through some of my older posts to see what happens in my state.  Here, BF doesn't matter in infancy.  Nursing a toddler wouldn't make a bit of difference to a judge.  It really sucks.  :(

[RachMartin]

If he does bring up breastfeeding, here are some links that might help your case:

http://theleakyboob.com/2011/02/a-journey-through-breastfeeding-and-visitation/

La Leche League International:

http://www.llli.org/nb/nbjanfeb96p4.html

http://www.llli.org/law/lawextended.html

http://www.llli.org/ba/feb01.html

http://www.llli.org/law/familylaw.html

Katherine Dettwyler's letter to the courts. She'll send you one if you need one:

http://www.kathydettwyler.org/detletter.htm

and the World Health Organization's statement on breastfeeding

(Specifically: WHO recommends mothers worldwide to exclusively breastfeed infants for the child's first six months to achieve optimal growth, development and health. Thereafter, they should be given nutritious complementary foods and continue breastfeeding up to the age of two years or beyond)

http://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/statements/2011/breastfeeding_20110115/en/