"Kick Butt" shirts - Page 2

[whatsnextmom]

It's not offensive "too you." That doesn't make in non-offensive. I can't believe I actually have to say that. I can't believe anyone would not understand "at all" why "kick-butt" could be offensive to someone on an elementary school campus. I can't understand why anyone who has every been in a 3rd grade classroom couldn't see the distraction a kid with such a shirt can make. The word "Butt" doesn't offend me personally but sorry, I like to consider the feelings of others. I like to show a little class in public and teach my kids the same.

How is school stringent on dress codes? They are SO basic. Don't wear flip-flops because duh, you have recess during the day and in elementary school, you don't dress-out. Don't show underwear... oh dear, those poor kids have to wear a *GASP* belt or god forbid, a tank top with a little thicker strap. Oh man, you mean I can't wear that one t-shirt I have with a marijuana plant on it? But I only have 15 other shirts to choose from!  Wow, we are just putting SO much pressure on our kids to show a little manners.

This is so ridiculous. Go ahead. Fight for the right for your kid to wear a shirt with the word "butt" on it. I'm going to put my energy towards something more important lol.

Originally Posted by kathymuggle 

I think it is nice for kids of all ages to have self expression - as long as it is not offensive to most moderate people.  "Kick butt" is not offensive.

I like to flip this point around - kids have enough rules to deal with particularly at school (many of them necessary but some arbitrary) without micromanaging what they wear.

I do not think the school/office comparison holds up.  Where to work is optional for many people (indeed I know people IRL who won't work in certain places due to having to wear a suit or uniform).  School is not optional for many youth.  If school is optional, or if there is an option of a school with less stringent dress rules, then maybe, maybe, it is OK to say "this is the expectation here."  (although I still do not think it is the best idea)

[kathymuggle]

Originally Posted by whatsnextmom 

It's not offensive "too you." That doesn't make in non-offensive. I can't believe I actually have to say that. I can't believe anyone would not understand "at all" why "kick-butt" could be offensive to someone on an elementary school campus. I can't understand why anyone who has every been in a 3rd grade classroom couldn't see the distraction a kid with such a shirt can make. The word "Butt" doesn't offend me personally but sorry, I like to consider the feelings of others. I like to show a little class in public and teach my kids the same.

Obviously I was speaking of myself when I said it was not offensive.  I thought that was self evident.  

What is offensive is subjective.  I expect moderate heads to prevail.  By moderate - I do not think simply because a  small percentage of society is uncomfortable with the saying "kick butt" that it should be disallowed. I am offended by being asked not to wear what I see as a fairly innocent shirt - why is my concern about hyper-conservatism and micro-managing less important than someone concern over a shirt?

I do not actually care that another 3rd grader might find the t-shirt a distraction.  I work in a public library with kids (including school kids) and I can tell you they would not find such a shirt a distraction beyond 30 seconds.  Moreover, and across the board with few exceptions, people have the right to wear what they want without worrying how others will perceive it.  Their perception is their problem.  

This is so ridiculous. Go ahead. Fight for the right for your kid to wear a shirt with the word "butt" on it. I'm going to put my energy towards something more important lol.

Ridiculous to you.  I actually do take the right to wear what the heck I want in public pretty seriously.  I only have one child in school, I do not think this will be an issue she will need or care to pursue - but if she does I will support her 100%.  As long as clothes are not hurting someone (hate shirts and the like) I think people should be able to wear what they want.

Kathy

[peaceful_mama]

Well....I see the point.  This *is* my 1st child.  ;)  And I seriously think I noticed it simply because I am sick of hearing assorted bathroom words at the dinner table.  (My idea to combat it?  Well, DS1 is loving the whole idea of money and what it can buy right now....while I won't pay allowance for contributions they should be making as members of the family...or so I've always *said* till I actually had children old enough to get one.....I am at a loss on how else to stop this.  Allowance.  With inappropriate language fines.  (but I'll keep in mind that I had an affinity for a much worse word than "butt" at one point in time, just because my dad said a girl shouldn't say that...and I knew full well that word didn't belong at Grandma's  ;) )

[TCMoulton]

When did the word "butt" become a foul word - considering some of the things that I have heard out of the mouths of elementary school kids butt would not even phase me. I think that most schools have bigger issues to worry about.

[One_Girl]

Originally Posted by TCMoulton 

When did the word "butt" become a foul word - considering some of the things that I have heard out of the mouths of elementary school kids butt would not even phase me. I think that most schools have bigger issues to worry about.

ITA.  I learned to swear in elementary school.  Two duty teachers can not monitor the language of 75+ kids outside at recess, it is hard enough to monitor the violence they are supposed to be preventing and a lot of that slips through.  I would far rather have school professionals paying attention to important things.  There are many distractions in the classroom that are laughed about and moved on from during the course of the day.  I actually think it is a great shirt for a principal, especially while interacting with kids on the playground, because it takes her/him off of the high and mighty scary person spot and makes her/him a real person kids see as approachable.  If it was a daily thing I might worry depending on how I view the school in terms of academics and atmosphere.

[Chamomile Girl]

Originally Posted by whatsnextmom 

It's not offensive "too you." That doesn't make in non-offensive. I can't believe I actually have to say that. I can't believe anyone would not understand "at all" why "kick-butt" could be offensive to someone on an elementary school campus. I can't understand why anyone who has every been in a 3rd grade classroom couldn't see the distraction a kid with such a shirt can make. The word "Butt" doesn't offend me personally but sorry, I like to consider the feelings of others. I like to show a little class in public and teach my kids the same.

How is school stringent on dress codes? They are SO basic. Don't wear flip-flops because duh, you have recess during the day and in elementary school, you don't dress-out. Don't show underwear... oh dear, those poor kids have to wear a *GASP* belt or god forbid, a tank top with a little thicker strap. Oh man, you mean I can't wear that one t-shirt I have with a marijuana plant on it? But I only have 15 other shirts to choose from!  Wow, we are just putting SO much pressure on our kids to show a little manners.

This is so ridiculous. Go ahead. Fight for the right for your kid to wear a shirt with the word "butt" on it. I'm going to put my energy towards something more important lol.

Why the warpath? You say manners but you mean conformity. Why should people have to conform?

It is only going to be a distraction if someone makes it one by labeling it as inappropriate.

Look, here is the thing you need to understand about kids. As soon as you make a Big Deal out of something small like a harmless shirt that says "butt" kids will do everything they can to subvert your rule..and on top of that they won't believe you when you make a Big Deal out of something that actually matters. To many Big Deals (ie. pointless rules) and you have lost any chance you might have at them taking your authority seriously.

That is why dress codes suck. They are ultimately counter productive because you are always going to have kids that think the logic behind them is flawed, unnecessarily punitive and pointless. Once they make that determination the rest of the rules are as good as fair game, and its one big ideological fight from there on in. Most schools with dress codes resort to authoritarianism to get kids to do "what they are told" so then your kid is not only learning that rules are pointless but that their opinion about them doesn't matter...oh and that they have to OBEY just because they are kids. Is that what you want them to learn?

Respect for others is a worthy goal..like caring for the feelings of others. Ok. But what I don't like is when the "feelings of others" actually means the feelings of the small vocal minority of adults who give a damn about a word like "butt". So what you are really saying here is that you don't care about the feelings of the kid who likes the shirt or the parents who let hu wear it. Their feelings are somehow lesser than those of folks who might get offended by the word butt? Why?

I too am going to put my energy towards something more important than fighting kids about their clothing choices. As a teacher I am going to respect them as individuals capable of making choices about the most basic and individual of things (what fabric they choose to put on their body) and then I am going to teach them how to think critically about society.
Edited by Chamomile Girl - 4/27/11 at 10:32pm

[kathymuggle]

Originally Posted by peaceful_mama 

Well....I see the point.  This *is* my 1st child.  ;)  And I seriously think I noticed it simply because I am sick of hearing assorted bathroom words at the dinner table.  (My idea to combat it?  Well, DS1 is loving the whole idea of money and what it can buy right now....while I won't pay allowance for contributions they should be making as members of the family...or so I've always *said* till I actually had children old enough to get one.....I am at a loss on how else to stop this.  Allowance.  With inappropriate language fines.  (but I'll keep in mind that I had an affinity for a much worse word than "butt" at one point in time, just because my dad said a girl shouldn't say that...and I knew full well that word didn't belong at Grandma's  ;) )

Speaking as a mother of an older child - I can tell you it will end on its own.  I can almost promise.  Some people do keep up with potty humour and words into their teens and beyond - but it is not that common.

That being said, I do think you have the right to ask that kids refrain from potty talk around you.  My oldest likes to watch South Park and the like (shudder - he is 15, btw, before someone comments) and I do ask him not to watch it while I am in the same room as him.  Put on the headphones and listen on the computer!  I find the words grating and often offensive.  It is Ok to put up boundaries and say "you can say it if you want, but I do not want to hear it".  As for how to stop it - anyway that works and fits the not too serious crime.  Yes, bribe him, lol.  Mini time -outs etc.   

I wonder if you are taking what is a home concern, though, and trying to extend it to the school?  I do understand the allure of a school that can support what you want at home - but given that numerous parents have different beliefs on where to draw the line on clothes, they probably are not going to be able to accommodate your anti kick-butt idea.  

If you think about all viewpoints and decide that this really is more than a home issue - it is a school issue and you want the shirts banned, you can ask the school to clarify the dress code.  It might give you a starting point if you decide to pursue things.

[Jenni1894]

I see nothing wrong with it.  Of course my son also has a shirt that says "he did it" with a finger pointing one way. 

IMO the shirt is saying I'm good at xxxx sport.   It's not saying I'm going to kick your butt.

I also don't see anything wrong with the phrase either.   Unless of course it's being directed at me or his siblings.