3 1/2 mo will NOT nurse unless walked at the same time

[KateDavies45]

  The title pretty much says it all. This has been going on for over a month now. I'm not exactly sure how it got started. But DD absolutely refuses to nurse while I'm seated/lying down or even standing still. If I attempt to nurse her other than while walking around she pushes me away, scratching at me, arching her back and screaming bloody murder until I get up and walk with her. After 5/ 10 min of walking she is usually calmed down enough to nurse but if I try to sit or stop walking with her she pulls off and starts the process all over again. This is not just happening in the evenings or at certain times of day...it's literally EVERY TIME she gets hungry even when she wakes up at night to eat. (Before this started we would nurse lying down and go back to sleep. Now, I have to get up and get her up and walk around the house.) Just F.Y.I. DD is not a colicy baby, when we're walking she is quiet and smiling and cooing and laughing....I just don't know why she gets so upset when we stop!

   The part that's driving me nuts is that I KNOW she's hungry when I try to nurse her (i.e. hasn't eaten in 2hrs or so, sucking on her hands and drooling, all her usually hunger cues) but she refuses to eat unless we're walking. I've tried waiting it out before, for about an hour and a half (comforting her while seated or walking with her until she calmed down and then sitting down to try again) but nothing worked. She screamed until she was turning blue. Sometimes I don't mind walking with her while she nurses, but I've got old injuries on both my knees and I'm getting to the point that I physically can't carry her and walk constantly. Im starting to think about pumping and bottle feeding so that DH can walk and feed her.

(I'm spending between 6 and 8 1/2 hours with her in my arms while on my feet now) and while she'll occasionally lay down or sit and play with me, for the most part she wants to be moving ALL THE TIME!

Neither myself nor DH are getting any sleep (where before we were) and she is waking up more now (and will only go back down after 20 - 30 min of walking) than she was when she was a newborn. We borrowed an amby bed from a friend hoping that the motion at night while she was sleeping would help but it didn't, we tried a hammock, I've tried putting her in a swing before she eats, we've tried letting her sleep in the swing, I've tried putting her in a sling to nurse but she doesn't like that either. Im not sure what else there is to try.

  If anyone has been through this before or has any suggestions I would really appreciate them!

[MovingMomma]

Have you tried swinging baby in a blanket in a head to toe direction?  http://www.llli.org/llleaderweb/lv/lvjunjul01p51.html  Cranio-sacral therapy also comes to mind.  Do you hold her in a different position when nursing and walking than nursing and sitting?  How about sitting baby straddling your leg, facing you, to nurse?  My DD found that position helpful when she went through a brief stage of preferring movement to nurse.  

[marzena]

Hi there, Cranio-sacral therapy sounds great. My son exhibited some of what you were describing. I ended up removing dairy from my diet and it made a huge difference for him. Hope it helps. 

[meggiejean]

Also sounds like a positioning thing to me that makes her uncomfortable while you sit. I also recommend cranio-sacral therapy. wow. hugs to you

[tex.mom]

My 1st dd was like this and subsequent 2 babies to some extent.  My 1st 2 needed craniosacral relief as mentioned, which I found out later was party due to them having been OP (didn't come out that way, but turned last minute)--I knew they were, but didn't know about the pressure it causes.  Chiro helped, but unfortunately I didn't know to try it with my oldest.  She did however also have some sensory issues and didn't love being snuggled.  Everyone always suggested the sling to calm her, but she hated it!!  Nursing stressed her out from the closeness.  We thought it must be diet related from the way she always popped off, but she nursed when moving.  We finally realized she just liked being in motion, and it distracted her.  She and my ds preferred walking, but had to get used to a very vigorous rocking in the glider while eating.  I wish I had known about craniosacral therapy from the beginning though.  Good luck, hopefully you will find it helps with feeding and sleeping difficulties as we eventually did.

[KateDavies45]

MovingMomma I have tried many different positions but she doesn't seem to prefer one over the other, we use the same position whether sitting or walking. As for the blanket, I haven't tried that yet. It seems like it would make the same motion as the swing but perhaps being wrapped up at the same time would make a difference.

Marzena, I'm not sure what cranio-sarcal therapy is....perhaps you could explain it to me?

MeggieJean  Like I said, I use the same position for sitting and walking.

[jennilynn]

Pretty similar situation here except my baby (9 months old) won't sleep unless being walked. He can be soooo tired but has the same reaction you describe if we try to sit down and rock him. Luckily, though, he will fall asleep while nursing sometimes and sleeps fine at night next to me (nurses back to sleep.) But we rarely are able to lay him down alone. And he's 20 pounds. We just hold him.

[BakerALM]

First let me send you a huge hug! Since I totally know what you are going through! 

I have been to hell and back to nurse both my children. Everything from Exclusively pumping for my first for almost 2 years and also dealing with a major nursing strike that really effected our nursing for almost a year with my second. Where I can relate directly is that my second during our strike exhibited the same behavior. What you may not realize is that you have a bit of a nursing strike going on here since your little one is refusing to nurse except if you meet all the exact conditions that they want. How I dealt with this behavior is that I slowly transitioned from...

1) walking around the room and nursing
2) bouncing while standing in one place and nursing
3) sitting up high on a rocking stool (or rocking chair) that is in the same location as you were bouncing and standing. But keep your height as high as possible so it seems like you are still standing and keep the motion the same as if you were still moving while standing up. 
4) keep rocking and slowly reduce your height by removing pillows or whatever you put underneath you
5) try to reduce the amount/speed of your rocking until you hopefully are sitting and not moving! :-D

I have to also add that you should keep the standing nursing position EXACTLY the same as the sitting nursing position so that their is little to no difference. Each step of the way should be only ONE small change so that it is basically barely noticeable and if it is noticed it can be tolerated since everything else is still the way your little one wants it.  

This is what I did and my babe was almost the exact same age as yours.  It took weeks to make this transition and much patience!  But I can happily say that I am still nursing and in EVERY position and she is going to be 3 in July. 

I would also say you may have another problem on your hand that triggered this problem in the first place.  cranio-sacral therapy is a good idea but it may not be position at all it could just be something else and may be agrevated by patterning and personality. Mine was due to overactive letdown and oversupply which caused a HUGE strike.  Once I did get her nursing again and my supply under control she was traumatized and she has a STRONG personality so she demanded (at only 3-4mths old LOL) that we only nurse in positions that she had deemed comfortable since she had a huge breast aversion at this point.  Patience and creativity on my part got her though it and taught her that my breasts were a safe comfortable place now.  It took almost 6mths to sort though most of the major problems (would not nurse at all, lying down, outside the house, if anyone else was around, only in my bedroom, only standing up, only in certain positions, certain locations, etc.) it was really bad. I would just have someone take a look at the latch and watch your little one nurse along with trying what I mentioned above.  

HUGS! 

Andrea

[KateDavies45]

   BakerALM thanks for the advice. I do keep my sitting and walking nursing position the same, and I agree with you that it's not the position making her uncomfortable (as long as I'm not trying to nurse her she doesn't mind it at all). You said that your problem was due to oversupply and overactive letdown. I wonder if I don't have the opposite.

   DD was a NICU baby and I established my supply by pumping in the beginning. Not sure if my body thought I had twins or what because I wound up with a HUGE oversupply (If I slept for more than an hour or so I was waking up with the mattress soaked in milk). However it never seemed to bother DD in the slightest. (we found out that she is PTT so perhaps that was helping her to get the milk she needed in the beginning while she learned how to latch in a way that worked for us). Now that I think about it, this fussiness about nursing started when my milk supply started to balance out - read, not continuously engorged - perhaps she'd gotten used to it and now prefers it? I do notice she somewhat less fussy, still wants to be walked but doesn't mind nursing, in the morning when my supply is highest....

[cinnamonamon]

I had something similar happen when my oldest was a babe...turned out we had a (largely asymptomatic) thrush infection -- I think the walking & bouncing was the distraction he needed to eat through the pain.  I only figured it out when it got bad enough that he finally got the white tongue/cheeks...

[aprilnicole]

Oh my goodness! Bless you for not giving up yet!

I thought of an idea you can do to possibly wean her from standing to getting her to a sitting position- Moby Wrap! http://www.mobywrap.com/  or the Ergo Carrier http://www.ergobabycarrier.com/ . There are nursing options in both of these carriers. Personally, I suggest trying the moby wrap first, since it is less expensive and much more comfortable to wear. There's a nursing option....so this way you wouldn't have to hold your DD's whole weight with your arms. Three month olds can get real heavy, real fast! Anyways, just another suggestion too. I think you could get to a point of sitting down with the carrier....hopefully?

GOOD LUCK!! You're awesome for still sticking with it!

[BakerALM]

Originally Posted by KateDavies45 

  . Now that I think about it, this fussiness about nursing started when my milk supply started to balance out - read, not continuously engorged - perhaps she'd gotten used to it and now prefers it? I do notice she somewhat less fussy, still wants to be walked but doesn't mind nursing, in the morning when my supply is highest....

That really could be the case now that your supply has regulated she is a bit upset! My little one ended up with an awful latch due to our nursing strike and my oversupply. She never really learned to nurse properly and still currently has a lazy latch. Over the years it never really has gotten any better and when the teeth began to come in I had some hard times.  I have gotten use to the feeling of a bit more teeth than she should be using as well as my nipple being too far forward in her mouth so it gets pinched.  Funny it really does not "hurt or cause damage anymore", more like a pinching feeling but anyone with an eye for what a good latch looks like can see its really bad LOL! "have had Lactation consultants ask me how I can stand it" 

But what I am trying to get at is that you should have the latch looked at now while she is still little and you have a better chance of improving. The slower flow can bother a lot of babes especially with lazy latches since when they don't have a huge amount of flow (like you do in the morning when you are full) they really cant remove the milk well enough so they get upset that the flow is not where they want it. But this is can be a slipery slope if it is a lazy suck since your supply can continue to reduce if they don't learn to improve their latch on their own.  You can be taught how to help them if that is the problem. 
 

This might just be a phase you need to work though or it could be a bigger problem. Might want to look up La Leche League or a Lactation Consultant that you might already have a relationship with.

Hugs!

Andrea

[KateDavies45]

Cinnamonamom - I hadn't thought of thrush. I checked her when this started and there were no white patchesactually that fits too....it would explain her reluctance to eat since it would be painful even though she's hungry. However, I don't have any symptoms of thrush either. Do you know if there are any downsides to using a Gentian Violet regimen if it ISN'T thrush?

Aprilnicole - we actually have both a moby and an ergo sash, she will on occasion eat while she's in them but it's uncomfortable for both of us. I have fairly large breasts and for her to be in the right place she has to be sitting about level with my crotch....NOT ideal positioning for babywearing Lol.

BakerALM  - we've had her latch looked at by an LC (she was one who realized that DD was PTT) and while she does make clicking noises they don't seem to hint at anything hindering her. When she latches she has no problems getting the milk she needs.

[KateDavies45]

Cinnamonamom I think you were right. I had checked her previously for thrush and didn't see anything, but when I opened her mouth today almost her entire palate is white. I'm guessing this has been brewing for a while without showing the usual white patches. We started using GV and I can already see a difference in her when she eats! tho she still prefers walking. lol.

Thanks for all the wonderful ideas and support from everyone!

[BakerALM]

Originally Posted by KateDavies45 

Cinnamonamom I think you were right. I had checked her previously for thrush and didn't see anything, but when I opened her mouth today almost her entire palate is white. I'm guessing this has been brewing for a while without showing the usual white patches. We started using GV and I can already see a difference in her when she eats! tho she still prefers walking. lol.

Thanks for all the wonderful ideas and support from everyone!

Thats just wonderful! :-D Hopefully once everything is clear you can sit and kick your feet up. 
 

[HappyMommy2]

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Edited by HappyMommy2 - 6/20/11 at 3:02pm

[cinnamonamon]

Originally Posted by KateDavies45 

Cinnamonamom I think you were right. I had checked her previously for thrush and didn't see anything, but when I opened her mouth today almost her entire palate is white. I'm guessing this has been brewing for a while without showing the usual white patches. We started using GV and I can already see a difference in her when she eats! tho she still prefers walking. lol.

Thanks for all the wonderful ideas and support from everyone!

I'm so glad it worked out!  We had the exact same situation, it sounds like!  I'm glad the GV is working -- I had to do the nystatin when we had it, because I couldn't find any GV where we lived then.  Give your baby a squish for me -- mine are all big now!

[KateDavies45]

Originally Posted by HappyMommy2 

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