What herbs are a must have?

[Buddhamom]

Ok, DH and I have pretty much decided on UC and I am due in 18 days.  So, that being said we are geting our supplies together and we are trying to figure out what herbs are a must have, especially for the post partum hemmoraging (sp?) That is the part that worries us the most.

[ElizabethE]

I know this isn't exactly what you were asking for, and that other moms here will have some recommendations for you, but no herbs are really a must have. And, if you are especially concerned with pp hemorrhage, there are other methods for controlling it, such as consuming some of the placenta (which apparently works like a charm).

However, I would also like to add that when everything is going truly naturally, your chances of hemorrhage are actually quite slim! Without the forced methods and various interventions, bleeding of any sort is usually greatly minimized. You'll find yourself much more prone to hemorrhage in a hospital environment, for example. Some UCers report almost no blood. I always am amazed how many women truly believe that *they* are just *prone* to bleeding because of their medically managed birth experience. Undoubtedly a nurse or doctor reinforced this by calling them a "bleeder". Well as special as that sounds, I have heard about tons of bleeders-- in that environment. It's sort of like the amount of women who didn't think they could fit a baby through *their* flawed pelvis. And of course, the med pros reinforce those feelings or ideas as well.

Oops, I went off a bit. :) So yeah, no herbs are really essential, but I'm looking forward to hearing the opinions of the moms who do choose to use herbs.

[ursusarctos]

The herbs I plan to buy (tinctures) so far are Shepherd's Purse (for bleeding only after placenta is out) and Angelica (for bleeding before placenta is out/retained placenta). There are others too, not sure yet if I will get others. I would recommend Susun Weed's Herbal for the Childbearing Year. It has a lot of specific info about which herbs to use for various problems.

[Multimomma]

I would highly recommend Shepherds Purse. I am a heavy bleeder, my first UC (unintended, MW was late) I bled quite heavily and nearly transferred to get blood. There was no intervention, some women are just heavy bleeders and there really isn't much you can do to help that. On subsequent births I took that right after birthing the placenta and had no problems at all

[lisalou]

Originally Posted by ElizabethE 

However, I would also like to add that when everything is going truly naturally, your chances of hemorrhage are actually quite slim! Without the forced methods and various interventions, bleeding of any sort is usually greatly minimized. You'll find yourself much more prone to hemorrhage in a hospital environment, for example. Some UCers report almost no blood. I always am amazed how many women truly believe that *they* are just *prone* to bleeding because of their medically managed birth experience. Undoubtedly a nurse or doctor reinforced this by calling them a "bleeder". Well as special as that sounds, I have heard about tons of bleeders-- in that environment. It's sort of like the amount of women who didn't think they could fit a baby through *their* flawed pelvis. And of course, the med pros reinforce those feelings or ideas as well.

I hope this kind of advice wouldn't prevent anyone from seeking actual medical care if they needed it or would cause anyone who has a history of hemorrhaging during birth to think that a UC would prevent that from happening. I'm sure we're all better informed than that.
 

[rhiandmoi]

I would make sure that you have HERBAL remedies and not HOMEOPATHIC remedies. There is a huge difference.

[tracymom1]

I agree with everyone - shepherd's purse and angelica are the important ones to keep handy. I also have the after ease for cramping because I had terrible afterpains last time around.

[happynaturalmama]

What is a reliable online source to get herbal remedies?  Op, I haven't decided what to have on hand yet, so I'm of no help.

[MOMYS]

I also keep Shepherd's Purse and Angelica on hand.   I have had some heavy post partum hemorrhaging before (both times at home with a very hands off midwife - I birthed baby by myself etc).

[ElizabethE]

Originally Posted by lisalou 

I hope this kind of advice wouldn't prevent anyone from seeking actual medical care if they needed it or would cause anyone who has a history of hemorrhaging during birth to think that a UC would prevent that from happening. I'm sure we're all better informed than that.
 

Well since people aren't here to obtain medical advice, I'd say my personal opinion and experience is fairly harmless to share with others. :)

In terms of history of hemorrhaging, I encourage women to:

a) question the source of said hemorrhaging since it is often entirely preventable and

b) always seek a hospital if they are having the idea that they should.

I made the point I did because I have been called a "bleeder" too, but myself and many other women find it was greatly less so when the things which tend to cause the bleeding were diminished.

And eating the placenta DOES work. I'm not saying that if a woman were losing massive amounts of blood, I would say, "no mama, don't go to the hospital! Here, eat this!". What I am saying is that if a woman has given birth at home and is showing signs that the blood loss may be a little excessive and cause her some worry, one of her options is eating the placenta. It's said to stop the bleeding within 5 minutes, I believe. There are tons of people with real life personal experience in this, and I'm one of them. It's kept many women out of the hospital and in the home where they belong (safely).

So to sum it up better, I wish to question the norms posed to us, and to encourage women that they are quite capable of handling their birth. I don't want women to think they need a small arsenal and a ton of worry to achieve a normal and healthy birth. That will end up not being as normal and healthy, after all. Herbs aren't my thing but if they're yours, that's cool. I'd like to reassure women that a more minimal approach will not be some scary emergency, either, should they go that route. :)

[labortrials]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lisalou 

I hope this kind of advice wouldn't prevent anyone from seeking actual medical care if they needed it or would cause anyone who has a history of hemorrhaging during birth to think that a UC would prevent that from happening. I'm sure we're all better informed than that.
 

Doesn't this go without saying?  I certainly don't treat this forum as some sort of substitute for medical care.  I read it for a completely different, very NON medical perspective.  Anyone who chooses homebirth should prepare (to whatever extent she deems necessary) for an unlikely medical emergency.
 

[ursusarctos]

Originally Posted by labortrials 

Quote:

Doesn't this go without saying?  I certainly don't treat this forum as some sort of substitute for medical care.  I read it for a completely different, very NON medical perspective.  Anyone who chooses homebirth should prepare (to whatever extent she deems necessary) for an unlikely medical emergency.
 

 Thank you.

I meant to mention placenta as well, having also read and heard many good things about it stopping pp bleeding. I would definitely try it if my placenta was out already. Obviously if bleeding were very heavy and not slowing down I would call an ambulance. 

I do think it is important though to acknowledge to ourselves, and let ourselves believe, even (especially) in the midst of all our backup plans, that the chances of complications *are* small and that most likely the birth will be perfectly normal. Just because we have plans for if things get complicated does not mean that we have to keep our minds in fear of those complications. Being prepared is different from being paranoid! And being paranoid won't keep anything bad from happening. I have to remind myself of this a lot, with daily life too.

[lisalou]

Originally Posted by ElizabethE 

Well since people aren't here to obtain medical advice, I'd say my personal opinion and experience is fairly harmless to share with others. :)

I would say asking for what herbs to have on hand especially to treat a certain condition is definitely asking for medical advice.

My problem with your medical advice is you basically said that one is more likely to bleed in a hospital than at home. If you're going to bleed, you're going to bleed. Your body doesn't care where you are. Your chances for bleeding aren't lessened if you are at home UC'ing. Doesn't mean you should give birth in a hospital but you could be a little more responsible with your advice.

[ursusarctos]

Originally Posted by lisalou 


Your chances for bleeding aren't lessened if you are at home UC'ing.

We don't actually know that either way, because there haven't been any studies done on it. I think it would make sense though that there might be a lower risk of excessive bleeding at a UC because a) you won't be exposed to pitocin, which increases risk of PPH (obviously that's not a given in the hospital but it's very common) and b) if you are relaxed, warm, unobserved and unstressed your hormone response has a better chance to be optimal, that is, you have less adrenaline opposing your oxytocin, which is necessary to contract the womb. Obviously this is all theory, and many women do bleed at UCs as well as in the hospital. But I think in theory at least it makes sense. I think that a similar theoretical benefit could be achieved at an attended homebirth with a truly trusted midwife.
 

[KD's Momma]

i have hem halt relief, contract easy, placenta ease, baby blues, and afterease.  I am wondering if I should get shepherds purse and angelica.

[ElizabethE]

Originally Posted by lisalou 

I would say asking for what herbs to have on hand especially to treat a certain condition is definitely asking for medical advice.

My problem with your medical advice is you basically said that one is more likely to bleed in a hospital than at home. If you're going to bleed, you're going to bleed. Your body doesn't care where you are. Your chances for bleeding aren't lessened if you are at home UC'ing. Doesn't mean you should give birth in a hospital but you could be a little more responsible with your advice.

At sentence one-- if that's true, than your issue is not with me, it's with MDC. Take it up with them. As far as I go, I actually never advise
 herbs at all, so I haven't given anyone any "medical" advice. Likewise, telling someone to go to the hospital is "medical" advice. Good one! *facepalm

Second paragraph--  "If you're going to bleed, you're going to bleed" shows a total lack of comprehension of what it is I am actually saying. I will try to put it a different way and hope you understand my intended meaning-- I am saying that the things which take place in hospital and due to the hospital environment are much more likely to cause a bleed. Many women, even non-UCers, can vouch for that from personal experience. The conditions surrounding a calm mother at home UCing are much more conducive to not hemorrhaging. Bleeds don't just *happen*. They aren't magical. There are usually reasons for them, and knowing what those reasons are just might save your life. Or, you could just go to a doctor and put it all in their hands. Why learn? After all, doctors never did anything that killed anybody.

So, that's my extremely irresponsible advice for today-- don't put all your faith in a doctor, and learn some things for yourself. Radical!

[ElizabethE]

Originally Posted by ursusarctos 

We don't actually know that either way, because there haven't been any studies done on it.

Yes and no, Urs. What we do know is homebirth (attended) vs. hospital being more favorable for things like hemorrhage. What we also know is the things which tend to cause hemorrhage. Those things of course are just standard in-hospital procedure today. Factor in as well what the woman's body needs during birth (birth physiology in mammals), and the pieces add up to UCing actually causing less bleeding than other forms of birth (in general, on average, what have you). Although there are no formal studies done on this, I have a feeling that even if there somehow could be, those would be disregarded anyhow. It's about choice, and if some people opt to cherry-pick facts, there's not much we can do about it.

  I think it would make sense though that there might be a lower risk of excessive bleeding at a UC because a) you won't be exposed to pitocin, which increases risk of PPH (obviously that's not a given in the hospital but it's very common)

Yep!

and b) if you are relaxed, warm, unobserved and unstressed your hormone response has a better chance to be optimal, that is, you have less adrenaline opposing your oxytocin, which is necessary to contract the womb.

Exactly!

Obviously this is all theory, and many women do bleed at UCs as well as in the hospital. But I think in theory at least it makes sense. I think that a similar theoretical benefit could be achieved at an attended homebirth with a truly trusted midwife.
To me, I think it's more than just a theory, but I know that could cause an argument on semantics for the definition of "theory", so I guess I have to leave it there.

Using common sense and deductive reasoning though, Urs, I think it's pretty hard to not come to the conclusion which you have, so I'm really pretty much in agreement with you!

[labortrials]

Here's an interesting tidbit - average blood loss during vaginal birth is 500cc; average blood loss during a cesarean is 1000cc.  (link to supporting article)  I'm not saying that people don't hem at home - I know they do.  Personally, my comfort level is to have some pitocin around in case I do hem.  I'd probably try some placenta too . . . yuck.  I'm hoping the RRL tea and dark leafy greens will help prevent excessive bleeding and atony.

[ursusarctos]

Yes, Elizabeth, I think we are in agreement essentially. By "theory" I simply meant that no studies have been done specifically comparing planned UC to hospital birth, in regards to blood loss or any other factor, so I don't feel comfortable stating that hemorrhage is less likely at a UC. I simply don't know that. That doesn't mean I don't believe it's probably true though I do agree with you that if there were such a study and it supported UC it would probably be ignored.