Do you allow toy guns in your home?

[Kedrosami]

If so, why? If not, why not?

Or do you stand somewhere in the middle--like you allow them but have very strict rules about how/when they are used?

To give you an idea where I'm coming from, I currently have one 1.5-year-old DS, and a new baby due in July, so this issue hasn't really come up yet in a big way, and I'm trying to really figure out where I stand.

I am leaning towards a "no toy guns in our house" rule but I'm not totally hell-bent about it. I just don't think guns should be used as toys, ever, and I associate them with violence, war, crime, and all that nasty stuff.

My DH on the other hand was raised in the country. He associates guns with fun-in-the-sun, target practice, independence and developing skills, and at the very worst, self-defense or hunting for food. He has no problem with nerf guns, water pistols, or toy guns in any form. I really can appreciate where he's coming from but I am still uneasy with the idea of "toy" and "gun" ever going in the same sentence.

Tell me your thoughts so I can mull it over!

[Momofplenty]

I grew up with water guns and "old western" type toy guns. But, with us being 4 girls and no boys, we didn't have an overabundance of them around. THAT SAID....

My first child is a boy and I strictly say no guns of any sorts. Not erasers that look like guns, not water guns, no games that have you shooting at people or animals, and no movies that depict any sort of hunting or shooting. I get a lot of grief over it and have had relatives try to sneak them when I am not around, but my children, all 4 of them, now know they don't play like that. Guns AREN'T toys. It's not funny to shoot someone, even with water, because shooting is violent. I hear from other moms that say their sons just play guns anyway, using their finger or sticks or whatever...but mine don't. They just know not to.

We are glad we have this going on for us. About 3 weeks ago, my husband's committed suicide and we dont have our kids constantly reminding us how he did it (they don't know, but just seeing guns on tv or even blood right now is understandably rough on both dh and I).
My opinion is guns are not toys, therefore, should not be used as toys. It's better to teach them to stay as far away as possible at all times. Forget this whole "oh let kids be kids" or "they need freedom to explore and learn" or even the "I will just teach them as they grow" because seriously, whats the freakin point in letting a kid play with something thats a replica of an aid to murder and suicide? there are better toys out there and theres no NEED to let them play like that.

[Momofplenty]

Um...sorry, I know I just came off as royal biiiiotch. :(

[hopefulfaith]

There have been some lengthy threads on this in the past, some of them quite passionate.  

My dh and I are a lot like you and your dh:  I am not anti-gun (I own a .22 I like to shoot at targets, though I don't hunt), but I was certainly not going to allow my *children* to play-act even something so dangerous. I would have preferred early childhood out of the Nova Naturals catalog, thank you very much.  I had a no-gun policy until my ds was 4, which was as long as I could hold out:  my dh is from a rural area where guns were a fact of life, he grew up hunting and "shootin' stuff" and all of the typical redneck stereotype activities you can imagine.  ;)

When ds was 4, he started making things into guns:  biting his toast into that shape and yelling POW POW POW!  I tried swords to appease the interest in weaponry, which held us out for almost six months .... but I finally consented to a Nerf gun.  I will not allow anything in the house that looks real, and Nerf guns are not "real-looking" to me.  There are a whole host of rules which accompany the guns/darts, and for the most part, the kids are fine about them.

I should also note that dh is a law enforcement officer to boot, so ds/dd see him strap on a duty belt every morning, complete with gun & taser.  It flew under their radars until ds was 5/dd was 4, and then they started asking questions.  We're big on the gun safety teaching.  In our area of the country, it is a fact of life - lots of kids around here start hunting around kindergarten-age, and ds is in the minority in his class in that we have not introduced him to that yet.  I'm not quite there yet.  

A lot of random thoughts here (sorry), but that's my position.  I'm not passionately against any type of gun-sort of thing -- to deny guns is to shortchange my kids by not providing the conversation/discussion/teaching/framework for appropriate use that I think is necessary to put guns into context in our lives - which, as we live in a rural area & dh carries one - means that they are present in our lives and just another thing we need to teach our kids about.

[QuestionGal]

**I have chosen to remove my response since this thread has now been linked to the Mothering Facebook page**

Edited by QuestionGal - 5/23/11 at 12:04pm

[MOMYS]

We don't.  We grew up in a fairly violent society and some of our kids could shoot a gun at ages 8 and 10 in defense.   The could drive in case of an emergency.  Our kids all knew how and where to hide in case of an attack.  We had early morning and evening radio calls in our farmer "cells" just to check that everyone was still alive.   We carried a silent broadcast panic button (to broadcast to the other farms in our cell) in case of an attack.  We had an 8ft electric fence around our house.  

This was our way of life, we thought it was normal. 

At that stage our kids were not allowed toy guns because of the reality of violent crime.

We have since moved to Canada.  Our younger kids don't really remember any of it, but we do, and so do our older 2 (the eldest most of all).  He would love a gun for target shooting.  We might consider it in the future but not now.   To us, guns are not a toy.   Ever.

What other people do in their homes, doesn't bother me.   Societies are different and people's experiences differ.  Just for us, as a family, guns as toys is just not an option.

[Arduinna]

**I have chosen to remove my response since this thread has now been linked to the Mothering Facebook page**

Edited by Arduinna - 5/23/11 at 2:31pm

[JudiAU]

No, I don't. I am not okay with my kids playing with guns in any form. We don't use the word "shoot" either.

I live in an urban area with a lot of shooting deaths. People don't hunt with them.  

[mamaboss]

DD is also 3 1/2 and we do allow toy guns. Our rule is probably the same as most people in that pointing them at people is absolutely NOT acceptable and we discuss why it isn't ok on the rare occasion it comes up. She's never used a water gun and I'm not sure she will because it kinda contradicts the whole no shooting at someone.

Yes, guns are dangerous. But I don't think that guns=violence. I believe in educating my child on gun safety and educating her on for example, what to do if she were to ever come across a real gun at a friend's house. I'd rather my child have enough knowledge about the power of a gun to know not to touch it, etc. rather than receive a phone call that my child shot someone or was shot. I think that by completely forbidding guns, like anything else, raises curiosity about them and that to me is much more dangerous than a toy.

[Momofplenty]

How do you teach a child knowledge of how to protect against a gun? I mean, I've told my children why we dont play with them and what to do if they were to ever come across one, but how does allowing them to play with something that looks like a gun and then turning around and saying "this is not a toy. make sure if you see a real one, cause you know, you'll know what it looks like, you run like hell?" Do you aim the toy gun at the child and say "what would you do?" or... "say this was a black gun, with real bullets, and you found it, would you know the difference, at 3 years old? and what would you do?"   I just dont see all lessons being learned hands on, especially with guns.

Originally Posted by mamaboss 

DD is also 3 1/2 and we do allow toy guns. Our rule is probably the same as most people in that pointing them at people is absolutely NOT acceptable and we discuss why it isn't ok on the rare occasion it comes up. She's never used a water gun and I'm not sure she will because it kinda contradicts the whole no shooting at someone.

Yes, guns are dangerous. But I don't think that guns=violence. I believe in educating my child on gun safety and educating her on for example, what to do if she were to ever come across a real gun at a friend's house. I'd rather my child have enough knowledge about the power of a gun to know not to touch it, etc. rather than receive a phone call that my child shot someone or was shot. I think that by completely forbidding guns, like anything else, raises curiosity about them and that to me is much more dangerous than a toy.

[Ldavis24]

We don't have any guns in our home currently but will be getting some hunting rifles because I really enjoy hunting my own food. DH wants to learn how to hunt as well.

I honestly won't care that DD plays with water guns or whatever, this is one area I think there is so much fear because horrible, preventable accidents happen with real guns. The factor in most of those situations with kids and guns is the gun not being properly locked up and the kiddo not knowing much about guns in the first place...Like NEVER play with a real gun...I don't think a 5 year-old would have a terrible time understanding the difference between a bright green plastic squirt gun and a real gun. At least non of me or my 12 cousins did and all of them had big gun cabinets in their houses as kids. We all used to go hunting together for pheasants...Talk about dangerous, picture a bunch of kids walking around in a field with guns!

DD can play with water guns and even shoot them at people including me if she'd like. She'll learn about real guns and gun safety as she is more and more able to understand it...I have MAJOR issues with the NRA and am not a member nor will I ever be but they have some really great info on age appropriate gun education for kids. Pretending like guns don't exist isn't going to stop your kid from playing shooting games and it certainly isn't going to stop them from hearing about guns from other people. I'd rather not make guns this huge deal that she doesn't understand and just keep it low key and teach her safety measures about guns and how to handle situations involving real guns....

Kids have been playing shooting games since forever and clearly things are ok. Violence amongst kids in general is scary but honestly things like bullying prevention are more important to me and than never allowing DD to play a shooting game with other kids. I don't think the fact that there is gun violence in cities ( as well as in the "country") is going to influence my DD to think real guns are ok to shoot at people..

ETA that I think this is just about the most anti-MDC post I have ever made here

Edited by Ldavis24 - 5/19/11 at 4:30pm

[mamaboss]

Well first of all, my 3 year old isn't going to be off playing at a friend's house without me. She's three and I watch her like a hawk. I meant begin educating her now as a foundation for the future when she is at a friend's house without me.

And I personally wouldn't use sarcasm to teach my child something so serious as you've implied. You can tell your kid a million times what not to do but I'm willing to bet a child's curiosity will win over 9 out of 10 times.

We also have real guns in our home-- kept in a locked safe at all times. Occasionally DH will sit down with her and show her one of his guns and talk to her about them. For now at the level of a 3 year old and more as she gets older, eventually having the opportunity to shoot one herself- in a safe environment and while learning even more about gun safety.

Frankly, guns are toys. They are used as recreational target shooting and hunting tools. It is when they are abused that they become weapons. Almost anything can become a weapon if abused. 

[velochic]

Originally Posted by mamaboss 

Frankly, guns are toys.

Wow!  That's an interesting perspective.  One I don't think I have ever seen here on MDC.

Frankly, they're not.  Guns have one purpose.  To kill.  Anything invented to kill is not a toy.  The guillotine is not a toy, either.  We don't go around with play guillotines pretending to cut off people's heads. 

However, some weapons *are* also tools.  Some tools can become weapons.  But guns... nope.  Never have nor ever will be a toy or a tool because that is not their purpose.  My father is a gun enthusiast.  He taught me a lot about guns.  It is because of what he taught me that we've never allowed toy guns.  We also don't have real guns (because I don't think I could use one for its purpose, so what's the point of having one... if you can't or won't use it, that's even more dangerous than not having one at all).

[Ldavis24]

Originally Posted by velochic 

Wow!  That's an interesting perspective.  One I don't think I have ever seen here on MDC.

Frankly, they're not.  Guns have one purpose.  To kill.  Anything invented to kill is not a toy.  Some weapons are also tools.  Some tools can become weapons.  But guns... nope.  Never have nor ever will be a toy or a tool because that is not their purpose.  My father is a gun enthusiast.  He taught me a lot about guns.  It is because of what he taught me that we've never allowed toy guns.  We also don't have real guns (because I don't think I could use one for its purpose, so what's the point of having one... if you can't or won't use it, that's even more dangerous than not having one at all).

I know what she meant. That people treat real guns like toys which is the problem. I don't think (not that you are saying this) that kids playing with plastic water guns is what allows kids to turn into older kids or teens or young adults or even adults who think guns are toys though. Once again anecdotal but my whole gang of cousins and I grew up around guns knowing that a toy water gun is not a real gun and you respect the difference. None of us thought REAL guns were toys even though we sure "shot" each other a lot with toy guns.
 

 People who think real guns are just toys to shoot around with and impress your friends are people who obviously haven't learned to respect guns from a young age, or have someone to teach them just how serious guns are.

[FiveLittleMonkeys]

We do allow toy guns - water, Nerf type - in our home.  We do not currently own any firearms, and I'm not sure that we will any time soon.  I was raised around guns, and my dh just retired from the Army.  We understand gun safety.  One of my earliest memories with my step-dad was of him teaching me how to properly clean, load and fire guns (although the first time he took me duck hunting, I threw up )

I have a very healthy respect for guns.  My dad has been great in teaching our kids about gun safety every time we visit, at our request.  Last time, he took our 9 yo DS out to the range, and DS really enjoyed both the lessons learned and the one on one time spent with his Papa.  Our kids - all of them (except the baby, and he'll understand it too) understand that guns are serious business.  They aren't toys, they are used to kill animals for food, and in the hands of the wrong people, they are used to hurt or kill people.  But are we minimizing the seriousness of guns by letting them "shoot" each other with Super Soakers in the summertime?  Absolutely NOT.  Not anymore than them using the wands they got at Harry Potter World to "cast spells" on their siblings means they mean them harm.....it's just harmless play (although we did tell them no Unforgivable Curses).

During DH's time in the military, it was such a pain to have weapons that we never really wanted them.  Our now 9 yo DS was an extremely curious child, and if we had owned weapons at that time, they would have been taken to my parents' house, as I would have felt unsafe with them in the same house with him - even appropriately stored.  He was THAT into EVERYTHING.

[velochic]

Originally Posted by Ldavis24 

I know what she meant. That people treat real guns like toys which is the problem. I don't think (not that you are saying this) that kids playing with plastic water guns is what allows kids to turn into older kids or teens or young adults or even adults who think guns are toys though. Once again anecdotal but my whole gang of cousins and I grew up around guns knowing that a toy water gun is not a real gun and you respect the difference. None of us thought REAL guns were toys even though we sure "shot" each other a lot with toy guns.
 

 People who think real guns are just toys to shoot around with and impress your friends are people who obviously haven't learned to respect guns from a young age, or have someone to teach them just how serious guns are.

Toys = Fun.  Toys = Play.  Guns = Toys.  Ergo... Guns = Fun and Playing.  What other way can you interpret it?

I grew up with guns, too.  My father is a lifelong NRA member, was a hunter (no longer, as he's too elderly) and I shot my first target when I was about 10.  I guess we were raised with a completely different philosophy because my father taught me that there isn't anything "toylike" or "fun" about guns.  They are weapons with a purpose and you don't play around with them or pretend.  We were not allowed to have toy guns.  I respect that this philosophy came from someone who really knows guns.  IMO, if you're going to have guns in the house, then at some point, when the children are old enough, teach them how to use the real ones, respect them, and teach them that there is nothing "fun" about guns... but don't turn them into toys, real or plastic.

[Ldavis24]

Originally Posted by velochic 

Toys = Fun.  Toys = Play.  Guns = Toys.  Ergo... Guns = Fun and Playing.  What other way can you interpret it?

I grew up with guns, too.  My father is a lifelong NRA member, was a hunter (no longer, as he's too elderly) and I shot my first target when I was about 10.  I guess we were raised with a completely different philosophy because my father taught me that there isn't anything "toylike" or "fun" about guns.  They are weapons with a purpose and you don't play around with them or pretend.  We were not allowed to have toy guns.  I respect that this philosophy came from someone who really knows guns.  IMO, if you're going to have guns in the house, then at some point, when the children are old enough, teach them how to use the real ones, respect them, and teach them that there is nothing "fun" about guns... but don't turn them into toys, real or plastic.

Well I don't know about you but I never had a problem (if you read my other posts I grew up literally surrounded by responsible gun owners) a problem distinguishing between a orange plastic water gun and a real gun...Perhaps you did I don't know but I never picked up a real gun as a child and thought of it as a toy but I could pick up a water gun and recognize there is a huge difference. I give my DD enough credit to be at least as intelligent as I was, I hope and I am confident that children can and DO recognize the difference. Lazy parents who don't know how to properly store or educate their children about guns are far more of a problem than the responsible parent who lets their kid play with water pistols and have real guns for hunting in the house...BTW that guns are toys thing implies that I will own a hand gun...Which I won't, they have no purpose. We will only own rifles and if my kid can't figure out the difference between a real hunting rifle that I have talked to her about and keep locked up securely and a plastic water pistol then I didn't do my job as a parent. I never EVER thought "well because this water gun I'm having a blast with is a super fun toy that real hunting rifle I take to shoot ANIMALS (which I suppose can be enjoyable in a way but I wouldn't call it fun) is a toy too." I never found the killing of animals overly enjoyable myself but I hunting is an important skill that I appreciate and I find spending time with family enjoyable.

We are coming at this from different places and I don't think you'll really care/understand what I am saying because we are on different sides of the bridge. I do NOT think real guns are toys, I do think water pistols are toys and there is a difference that is easy to see and understand. If I could appreciate the difference at 5 or 6 or 7 (and I was no genius child) then I am confident with education any child can. It's really not that hard to grasp. I don't think you are giving kids enough credit.

I do respect your opinion velochic, I have enjoyed your posts in other threads so I guess here we will just be in disagreement.
 

[MammaG]

I do not allow toy guns in my house and I prefer that my children not play with toy guns at other people's houses. This is partly because they are guns and I agree with pps that guns should not be allowed to be viewed as toys or even child-appropriate tools (nor would I get my kids a plastic chain-saw toy, you know?) and partly because I prefer my kids to play with open-ended toys that can be imagined to be many things.

I don't restrict the kids from playing guns and inventing guns, though. Ditto the Raising Cain ideas from pp above.

So, I would not allow a water pistol that looks like a pistol, but would allow a water-squirter that could be imagined to be a gun or a water wand or a mermaid sword, etc. I wouldn't allow a cap gun or a branded plastic laser gun, but I would allow a stick shaped like an 'L' to be a pretend gun.

I would prefer that they not point at a person, but I think that this restricts their imaginative play, so I allow it with some discomfort. As pp said, kids in play don't see 'dead' or 'shot' as we adults see it. Exploring those themes can really inform their later moral character, I believe.

I have for most of my life really absolutely hated guns, had no exposure to them, and felt that there is NO reason for a private citizen to ever, ever own one. But as I grow and mature, I find I really admire people who hunt respectfully for their own food and use the whole animal. It is not a stretch to then see practicing and recreational use of guns as an extension of that. And so my opinion about guns in general has changed. Whereas before my blind abhorrence may have actually put my kids at risk because I wouldn't have even allowed the word 'gun' in my house, now I feel I can explain to them how guns are used, describe guns, and alert them to the dangers should they ever encounter a gun. And I hope that taking a less militant (as it were) stance will also temper any reactive actions by my kids as they grow.

[raksmama]

  
Ha Ha!  you could be describing my son at that age! I always thought that I would never allow guns in my house too.  DS would just go over to the neighbours who had 3 boys and lots of toy guns. He would make guns out of toast, sticks anything. The more I forbade it, the more obsessed he became! In his art class the teacher took me aside and told me all he wanted to do was draw guns! When we finally relented at age 8 and got him a nerf and  his obsession stopped and he soon lost interest in guns. However boys will be boys. 

Originally Posted by hopefulfaith 

 When ds was 4, he started making things into guns:  biting his toast into that shape and yelling POW POW POW!  I tried swords to appease the interest in weaponry, which held us out for almost six months .... but I finally consented to a Nerf gun.  I will not allow anything in the house that looks real, and Nerf guns are not "real-looking" to me.  There are a whole host of rules which accompany the guns/darts, and for the most part, the kids are fine about them.

  that they are present in our lives and just another thing we need to teach our kids about.

[Jenni1894]

I would not buy one for my son, but I wouldn't turn one down if it was given as a gift.  Which is the case with the 2 he has.   Which are hidden in the front hall closet.   Forgotten about for the last year.   We have water guns, nerf guns and these 2 toy rifles.  

I made the rule that they are to be played with outside only and never to point it at someone.  Or the toy is mine.   End of story. 

So yes, i allow them.   But they make guns out of legos and sticks.  

I've never fired a gun, a paintball or pellet gun is the extent of my knowledge.  

I think if shown the proper respect and handling and an explanation of safety is given then the kids know the dangers of guns.  I had DH do this b/c he's more knowledgeable on these things than me.