Mamas of spirited kids...when does it get better?

[wondermama]

Thank you, everyone, for your advice and suggestions.  I felt uncomfortable with so much personal detail in this post. 

Edited by wondermama - 5/29/11 at 5:25am

[NellieKatz]

We have a spirited son, I suppose you'd say. And like yours, he was mellow at first. No more! He is very intense. Very sensitive, very verbal, some sensory things....so I know something of what you're going through (except ours is an only). But your post brought up more questions than answers. I found myself wondering...

1) what do you mean "work"? (as in this sentence: "Has anything really worked for you, or do you just have to wait it out?" - the phrase "wait it out" makes me think that the answer is you are hoping to change him from his spiritedness somehow, or as an alternative, wait it out. So clarity would be needed on that point.

2) This sentence is the same way: "I have tried everything I know...and it just doesn't get much better."  Tried with the goal of what? What are you trying to achieve? Do you mean, stop his spirited responses, get him to be more obedient, or just stop him from doing specific rotten things that he's doing....you get my drift.

You do say that you want things to be peaceful and happier. So that's one goal that's very clear.

I think that once those first two were answered, though, better advice could be given.

[34me]

Mine will be 15 next month and I have to say, looking back, every year it has gotten better.  When he left day care at 5 I got our provider a miniature rose bush, because she saw his beauty through his thorns.  Now when people meet him and some of the stories come out about how intense he has been they don't believe it.  I'm not saying everyday is strawberries and cream but consistant expectations have done wonders.

[ssh]

We have two family rules; treat each other with respect and be safe. Our DD is very high energy, intense and persistent. But we don't allow her to treat others badly. We don't use punishment at all, but I have suggested she go to her room or play something somewhere else for awhile. We given her the message that you have to be nice to people or they won't want to do things with you. Unlike your DS, my 5.5 year old has always been spirited. We didn't do much shopping with her or any eating out for about a year when she was around 2. She just too intense and had too much energy.  Have you read the Kurcinka books, Raising Your Spirited Child and Kids, Parents and Power Struggles?

(edited to remove info referring to OPs specific situation)

Edited by ssh - 5/29/11 at 11:34am

[D_McG]

I would be seeking professional help for sure.  This sounds like more than just a 'spirited' issue.  If it's causing so much family discord than professional behavioral help as well as family counseling would probably be where I'd go with it.

What are you currently doing when he 'torments' her?  

[stik]

I have two dds with close to the age gap you're looking at - mine are four and nine.  Like yours, the older one is relatively mellow and the younger one is high energy.  When our older dd complained, during the younger one's first month of life, that the baby wasn't pulling her weight with household chores, we realized we were going to have to be proactive about sibling interactions and parent attention.  

DD9 has space that dd4 is absolutely not allowed into, ever.  It's not much space - it's her bunk bed, but it has been really useful for those times when she needs to escape from dd4's intensity.  She can go there when she needs to, and I can do something with dd4 in another part of the house so that they aren't in each other's faces all the time.  DD4 is not allowed to torment dd9.  

This goes both ways - dd9 isn't allowed to torment dd4 either, and isn't allowed to make developmentally inappropriate demands of her.  If dd9 wants to build something that dd4 can't touch, she can't do it in the middle of the living room.  She has to go do it in her bunk bed or wait until dd4 is out of the house.  Though dd4 doesn't see much use for private space, her bunk is off limits to dd9 unless she issues a specific invitation.  

We try to make sure each kid gets one-on-one time with each parent on a regular basis.  It's in dd9's nature to read, play, and draw pretty independently at this point, and it's dd4's nature to want to be the center of attention all the time right now.  They can't have what they want all the time, but we can do some of the time, so we do.  A couple hours one-on-one with a parent makes a huge difference to both of them, and then they can cope with each other much better.  We usually only need to go to the point of consequences for sibling interactions once or twice a week.  If it looks like things are trending out to more than that, we generally talk to both kids (separately) about doing some problem-solving.  

Looking at your post, I can see that your dd has a hard time dealing with your ds and his more energetic personality.  I wanted to point out that this would be absolutely unacceptable in my house:

She told him he was stressing her (and me) out to the point that she was worried our lives were being shortened, that for the first time in her life she had no love for him left at all, that she was at the end of her rope, she wanted him sent out for adoption, out of her life, and wanted her peaceful life back.  It was heartbreaking to see her get to this point. 

Imagine how your ds must have felt hearing all that.  I'm not sure how that kind of hurtful, hateful speech can be attributed to a child you describe as gentle.  You need to figure out where your dd learned that kind of language and make it clear that adults are NOT to speak to each other in that way in front of your children.  Then you need to clarify for your dd what some acceptable ways are to deal with, or temporarily escape, her frustration with her brother.  And you need to keep an ear/eye on their interaction while your ds learns some better boundaries and your dd learns some better strategies.  It sounds to me like both of your children would benefit from some guidance and redirection in difficult situations.  

[wondermama]

Thank you, everyone.  It's given me a lot to think about and process.  I will pursue your suggestions and take some action to help both my children.