Addressing the view of God as cruel and unjust - Page 4

[philomom]

Originally Posted by sosurreal09 

The first documentation written was 30 years after Jesus' resurrection which is why it is so credible.

Or incredible in some eyes like mine.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/incredible

[SweetSilver]

Originally Posted by sosurreal09 

Over 500 witnesses physically saw Jesus raised from the dead so it is hard to say that is not true...

The Bible is a historical document regardless of how you view it

IDK how much proof you need that Jesus is the son of God the NT is testimony of all that Jesus said and did so if you did not believe his words surely his actions would prove it...he fulfilled the prophecy of the Messiah and foretold of it to his disciples.

I suppose you could discount peoples historical written testimonies just because YOU weren't there but that is like calling all those witnesses liars, which I don't think is fair.

Not that this would persuade a devout Christian, and I have no desire to really, but Jews today can give you many reasons why Jesus did not fulfill the prophecy of the Messiah, as much as the Gospels tried to prove it.  The most important was that the Messiah would be the political ruler of the Jews.  Indeed, in his trial with Satan in the desert he rejected this temptation and this is where Judaism will point and say that indeed he did not.  

     And I don't think anyone would argue that the Bible is devoid of historical fact, just that is not fact in its entirety.  How much is anyone's guess.
 

(End Part 1)

Edited by SweetSilver - 6/30/11 at 8:47pm

[SweetSilver]

(Part 2)  Just finished putting the girls to bed......

I find it mildly frustrating when Christians use the New Testament to prove the truth of the New Testament to non-Christians!  The non-Mormon Christians might understand this frustration by listening to a missionary at their door attempt to prove the validity of the Book of Mormon with quotes from the Book of Mormon.  Thus the Muslims reject the notion that Jesus was more than a prophet, Jews reject him as the Messiah, and Christians themselves continue to diversify in belief and the rituals of worship.

     But all this still needs to get back to God as cruel and unjust.  To be generous in this argument, I can see that to accept the god of the Old Testament is to accept this book as truth: wisdom beyond our understanding as people, and as a testament to the need of faith.  Not all things can be thought out or understood and this would be one proof of the greater vision of the Divine.

     Personally I believe that the Divine is contained in all things, not just beautiful and wholesome things but also in the evil and loathsome as well.  And the divine is present in tsunamis every bit as much as it is in the most gentle tide.  Yes, I can agree that the vision of the divine is beyond our understanding.  What I cannot accept is that there is a God who dishes out justice or cruelty or reward to this person and that, to this group and that.  And therefore, I cannot accept the vision of God as the Jews/Christian/Muslims portray.