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The huge Trolls thread - Page 37

post #721 of 767

Smokering,

 

I completely agree with you vis-a-vis your own process with alternatives and the understanding of how people come to things in different ways, certainly. I am of similar mind to many things. But, I'm not asserting that people buy all things wholesale.

 

Instead, I have a (false?) expectation that people who believe in the supernatural would recognize that they are in the same category of preposterousness? And if so, perhaps recognize that they are under the same scrutiny (or, in my case, I respectfully disagree -- just as you respectfully decline lotus birth or homeopathy? I assume you're not out trash talking homeopathy users or lotus birthers -- individually or collectively). 

 

I think I just see it as a pot-kettle situation. (And, again, this is "in general" and not specific to TWWS, or a specific poster). Or for that matter, even about me or the thread(s) in question at all. :) It is a very broad generalization. 

post #722 of 767

Lala,

 

Thanks for your insights about it. Being that I was close to the equation, I cannot say that I have a clear view of it. 

 

 

On Stories: I, too, find the original thread really funny and interesting, as I don't necessarily take myself so seriously. I do take a more Jungian approach to things *and* I have had experiences that I cannot explain without mythos of some kind. And, I'm intensely curious about other people's experiences in general -- how they characterize those experiences through their cultural mythos. 

 

I also particularly find the stories regarding trolls particularly entertaining. It's why I was trying to dig up that particular version. It is truly a fun story -- lots of adventure, and Rose Red is *amazing* in the story -- just so much fun. 

 

 

This is why I wasn't really offended by the process, but wanted to make certain that I wasn't involving myself in something that wasn't friendly toward me. I can be too trusting and too forgiving, and so I decided to simply not go that route. And later, when I was invited to "defend myself" via PM, I thought I'd made the right decision. 

 

On Fat: I've long been an advocate in fat acceptance, and I work in that area actively with the yoga that I teach. But, I also know that I can sometimes not use language appropriately, or communicate clearly, and in the process say some hurtful, mean-spirited, and needless things. So, I apologize for that, and please do be aware that I am constantly trying to improve myself in that regard (in any area where I may hold prejudices consciously or unconsciously).

 

 

On Rabbits and Hawk: When I was about 3 months pregnant, the name "came" to us -- we were driving down the road and it just came up to both of us. So, that was his name, and I cannot say that it was a logical process. I had a short list of names, such as Dashiel, Jasper, Violet, and Ruby, but we just couldn't find a name that was fitting and so we sort of gave up. Then it came to us.

 

The reincarnation bit -- I admit I am a complex creature. I believe in it and don't believe in it. When I do, I feel certain that DS is the rabbit. When I don't, I think it's a comfort measure. At a certain level, it doesn't matter to me whether or not DS is or isn't, I love him as he is, whoever he is, and he is amazing. :) But then, I'm his mother! LOL Thanks for saying he's cute. We think so.

 

(I also found the airport story a comedy in errors. I'm glad you 'read' my humor. some people read me way too seriously.)

 

 

 

post #723 of 767

 

Quote:
Instead, I have a (false?) expectation that people who believe in the supernatural would recognize that they are in the same category of preposterousness? And if so, perhaps recognize that they are under the same scrutiny (or, in my case, I respectfully disagree -- just as you respectfully decline lotus birth or homeopathy? I assume you're not out trash talking homeopathy users or lotus birthers -- individually or collectively).

I'm not sure I get what you're saying. Presumably you don't believe that belief in the supernatural is preposterous? I mean, given that you believe in it yourself? So are you just saying "From a materialist perspective, all supernatural beliefs are equally ridiculous"? I'm not even sure that's true; I mean, obviously holding a materialistic worldview would mean you thought all supernatural beliefs were ultimately false, but you might still believe that some were more philosophically plausible than others, for instance. But I'm not sure why we should hold ourselves to a materialistic worldview in the first place, particularly given that it's self-refuting at a very basic level.

 

And no, I'm not "trash talking" homeopathy users or lotus birthers, but if my MW forced the conversation in that direction I would eventually get to the point of saying, for instance, that I felt lotus birth was not evidence-based alternative medicine. (Which it doesn't pretend to be; as far as I've seen, it claims only spiritual benefits for the baby, in comparison to delayed cord clamping at any rate. So it'd be my MW's misperception of lotus birth that I'd really be addressing, not lotus birth itself.) My point is simply that not all beliefs (in the supernatural, in alternative medicine, in attachment parenting, in natural birthing, whatever!) are created equal within their own category. And while two beliefs might seem equally preposterous to an outsider - say, a by-the-book OB who thinks that both a UCA5C for footling breech twins and a singleton full-term vertex homebirth for a low-risk mother with qualified attendees are both equally ridiculous - that doesn't mean said outsider is actually informed about the issues.

 

I mean, I think I get what you're saying. I'm a Christian: I should realise that sniggering over the Mormon Joseph-Smith-wearing-glasses thing simply because it seems ridiculous, is a bit steep coming from a religious tradition that includes talking donkeys and men walking on water. Obviously I can't criticise another religion on the basis that it contains unusual phenomena; that would indeed be hypocritical, coming from a worldview which allows for unusual phenomena. But I also don't have to believe that people who don't believe in unusual phenomena at all are right and we religious folks are all equally wacky. :p That simply doesn't address the myriad philosophical differences between various unusual-phenomena-containing religions; not only is it disrespectful to all of them (including my own, ultimately), but it's intellectually lazy. "I believe in fairies because it makes me feel happy" is not the same thing as "I believe in a non-specific deity because of the argument from reason" is not the same thing as "I believe in Allah because the Qu'ran testifies about his existence" is not the same thing as "I believe in past lives because I remember them" - and so on and so forth. And even the same belief may be more or less intellectually justified depending on reasoning of the person holding it. You know?

post #724 of 767

Sometimes it is easy to misinterpret where another person is coming from, because we are interpreting their posts through our own filter. This filter could be happy or defensive. We can't read tone in an e-mail so we make it up!

 

I like to check a person's past posts to see what kind of a person they are before I take offense and interpret something badly about them.

 

Also Byron Katie has helped me a lot in disengaging from negativity, you can learn her technique called,The Work, for free.

 

Through Byron Katie I learned to be able to disengage from my own negative mind traps that kept me dependent on others actions to keep me happy. You can see lots of free videos of her you-tube bringing people through the process.

 

I find that self exploration on matters that "snag," me are so much fun!

 

post #725 of 767

I have removed posts from this thread.  Personal arguments should be taken to PM.  Our UA still includes the part about not defaming others.  

 

 

 

Okay, now that everyone has had some time, I'm going to reopen this.  Please remember to keep it civil, keep out the personal attacks, and give what you post a double check to make sure it within rules.

 

Thanks.

 

 

post #726 of 767

This is an example of why MDC really aggravates some people. We are all adults here and yet we were put in the forum equivalent of a time out. It's ridiculous. There are still some places on MDC that I do like to visit, but being treated like a child is really getting old.

post #727 of 767

yahoobarb, I've done quite a bit of reading on Byron Katie's approach and her products and courses, and I think that while it's admirable that she has attempted to share her insights into "turning of the mind", most of the research I've done indicates that the more one becomes immersed in her approaches, the more harm one feels "The Work" has done to him or her. Obviously, it's against the UA to link information from other boards, but there are a number of people who have emerged from immersion into "The Work" with tragic stories.

 

I find that if one is interested in "turning the mind" and becoming more accepting about one's life circumstances and finding peace in the middle of difficulties, DBT therapy - by oneself or with a professional - can be extremely helpful and logical. I like that DBT encourages a holistic approach to integrating the difficult circumstances in life, it engages emotion, logic, science, spirit, all the parts of what makes me, me. It doesn't ask me to question whether or not a situation exists, or imagine life without that circumstance, which was never helpful to me. It simply helps me process that the situation exists, and has given me tools to come to a place of acceptance so I'm not stuck on resentment or anger or grief forever.

 

Marsha Linehan is the most well-known researcher in this area, in case anyone is interested.

post #728 of 767
Quote:
Originally Posted by amydidit View Post

This is an example of why MDC really aggravates some people. We are all adults here and yet we were put in the forum equivalent of a time out. It's ridiculous. There are still some places on MDC that I do like to visit, but being treated like a child is really getting old.



MDC is not, and likely never will be a free for all forum. We do moderate things, and we do make judgement calls.  Any choice I made here would have likely resulted in someone saying it was wrong.

 

Sometimes, we close things to give ourselves time too.  I closed the thread as much to give folks who were having trouble with this thread some time, as I did so that I could spend some time with my family this weekend.  I'm sorry that this action aggravates some people.

post #729 of 767
Quote:
Originally Posted by daniedb View Post

I find that if one is interested in "turning the mind" and becoming more accepting about one's life circumstances and finding peace in the middle of difficulties, DBT therapy - by oneself or with a professional - can be extremely helpful and logical.


What does DBT stand for?

 

post #730 of 767

Thanks Adina! Hope you had a good weekend.

post #731 of 767

since it got lost, smokering, we are on the same page.

post #732 of 767


TOLD YA!  Hot mess. 
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cascadian View Post

Busy girl that I am, I googled Trainwrecks and..why...our very own lil stroller brigade thread is on there! We's hit the big times, gals! That thread was dissected and 'commented' on by more'n a few peeps, apparently. wild.gif

 

...makes TWWS look like the UN..



 

post #733 of 767

Personally, I LIKE that the threads are moderated.  Im not on Facebook - one reason is that people get really super ugly there and think nothing of it.  Thanks Adina!

post #734 of 767
Quote:
Originally Posted by amydidit View Post

This is an example of why MDC really aggravates some people. We are all adults here and yet we were put in the forum equivalent of a time out. It's ridiculous. There are still some places on MDC that I do like to visit, but being treated like a child is really getting old.


Well, you can't please all the people all the time. Some people want us to go back to more moderation, some even less. We're trying to find a balance that works the best for the majority of the people on MDC, and that takes time and effort by everyone involved. As has been discussed quite openly on this thread, there are other boards you can go to that don't have moderation. Why stay somewhere that you obviously feel isn't a good fit for you?
post #735 of 767
Quote:
Originally Posted by QueenOfTheMeadow View Post
Why stay somewhere that you obviously feel isn't a good fit for you?


So would mothering prefer users just go away rather than stating what they like and don't like?

 

 

post #736 of 767
Quote:
Originally Posted by Linda on the move View Post




So would mothering prefer users just go away rather than stating what they like and don't like?

 

 


I think not. Obviously mothering listened to what the user wanted, as is apparent in our new UA.
post #737 of 767
Quote:
Originally Posted by Linda on the move View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by QueenOfTheMeadow View Post
Why stay somewhere that you obviously feel isn't a good fit for you?


So would mothering prefer users just go away rather than stating what they like and don't like?

 

 


i have a hard time with the question, "Why stay somewhere that you obviously feel isn't a good fit for you?" MDC was a good fit for a lot of people, for a long time. then it changed, and many people left. now the pendulum is swinging back, and some people are coming back to see if this new version is a good fit or not. discussing it, including expressing what they don't like, must be part of that.

 

if it were "obvious," then they'd leave without being nudged with a question like that. but if they're feeling on the fence, trying it back on for size, the question, "Why stay somewhere that you obviously feel isn't a good fit for you?" sounds like code for, "go away, we don't want you."


 

 

post #738 of 767
Quote:
Originally Posted by formerluddite View Post




i have a hard time with the question, "Why stay somewhere that you obviously feel isn't a good fit for you?" MDC was a good fit for a lot of people, for a long time. then it changed, and many people left. now the pendulum is swinging back, and some people are coming back to see if this new version is a good fit or not. discussing it, including expressing what they don't like, must be part of that.

 

if it were "obvious," then they'd leave without being nudged with a question like that. but if they're feeling on the fence, trying it back on for size, the question, "Why stay somewhere that you obviously feel isn't a good fit for you?" sounds like code for, "go away, we don't want you."


 

 


I guess it comes down to the constant, "it's not good enough" comments that I see on this thread. I can guarantee you that as mods and admins, we are all trying our hardest to make things work for everyone. It has not been an easy transition for anyone, and yet, I think it's been a good move.

I think the open discussions are great. I think constructive criticizing is helpful and has already made things happen. I don't think accusations are helpful. I am not suggesting that people just leave. I'm suggesting that if a situation is so frustrating that people feel as though they are "being put in time out", because the mods and admins are trying to take the time to be thoughtful and find some sort of balance that works for the community, then perhaps it's the time to take a step back.

Everyone here wants the benefit of the doubt that their intentions are well meant, so why in the world would they think that the admins and mods have some maniacal plan to do what, I'm not sure, but certainly something nefarious! lol.gif
post #739 of 767
Quote:
Originally Posted by amydidit View Post

This is an example of why MDC really aggravates some people. We are all adults here and yet we were put in the forum equivalent of a time out. It's ridiculous. There are still some places on MDC that I do like to visit, but being treated like a child is really getting old.



I personally totally needed a time out ;).  Let this thread die already....  We are complaining there is too much moderation, not enough, too much, not enough and meanwhile this thread was getting seriously silly.  Nothing good was coming of it anymore anyhow.

post #740 of 767

my husband disagrees. he notes that his blog readership is up by a lot, mostly from TWWS. he loves having a larger blog readership. he also notes that they read multiple pages -- maybe they like the pictures from our travels (most seem to look at the travel ones the longest -- according to him). 

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