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Too skimpy clothes? Or others should not look? Paranoia? - Page 2

post #21 of 140

I sound old and stuffy saying this but I am shocked by what I am seeing teen girls wearing these days.  I was at a family event over the weekend and one 17 yo old girl was dressed like she was ready to walk the streets, it was so extreme.  I feel sorry for these girls, in a way, because I don't know that they understand what sort of message they are sending and they don't know how to handle the negative attention "sexy" dressing can bring on.

post #22 of 140
Thread Starter 


That was me! I think I also posted about my niece dating at 10 yrs old and having tons of make up. It is just sad. I am still friends with my sister, but if you dare say anything, she gets very defensive. I really care. But I am just frustrated with the situation. There is a lot to it obviously. But yes, same sister.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ldavis24 View Post




how is not full of yourself to assume a random person taking pictures at a public place is targeting you? I don't see someone with a camera out and assume he must be taking pics of me (regardless of age) just because I am in a bathing suit! I never thought that as a teen either. I actually don't know anyone IRL who has felt that way before.

Maybe the girl isn't full of herself she is just fully aware that her bathing suit is too small and is paranoid because of that, in which case I feel really bad for her and her mother needs to get a clue.

 

OP are you the same poster who had a thread a while back about this mom and her daughter's again and how obsessed with popularity the mom was and she wouldn't let your kid hang out with the girls or something? Or maybe another poster.

 



 

post #23 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by new2this View Post

I agree with you. But my line of thinking is if you dress like you work the corner then you can expect to be treated like such. I believe a person can dress sexy whatever without actually dressing like they work the corner. Its a huge conversation that DH and I have. Now that we have DD he notices the way younger people dress now and he is just disgusted that parents would allow their kids out like that when the fact is there are perverts out there and while the child/teen may be innocent the first impression always sticks and it sends the wrong message. 

Sadly him and I go round and round and she isn't even a year old yet because IMO his thinking is way overboard where as I am more relaxed but I think there is a huge difference between class and well trash. 

 

How should a person who works on a corner (or dresses like one) be treated?  I don't want my daughter dressing in skimpy clothing, but I'm not liking the attitude that if she does, it's ok to treat her a certain way.  I have a friend who dresses in clothes that I find too revealing for my taste, but she deserves every bit of respect as anyone else.  

 

This isn't as much in response to the post about the swimming pool incident (poor guy!), but just looking at our attitudes in general that some people deserve maltreatment based on whatever we think justifies it.

 

post #24 of 140

Teenagers in general are very full of themselves. However this girl if 14 and from the sounds of it has no real guidance on how to act, dress and has a mom that seems to be more worried about being a friend then a parent. 

 

I have no problem with two piece suits however I also think there are classy ones as well as skanky ones. People can wear what they want but then be prepared to be judged, talked about whatever. While you can't control others behavior you can control your own and that includes how one presents themselves. It also speaks a lot about how one views themselves. And I do believe people dress how they want to be treated, just as they act how they want to be treated. Some people say/do things to attract any type of attention to themselves be it good or bad. 

post #25 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by APToddlerMama View Post





She is fourteen.  Again.  She has a lot of growing up to do.  And OP, I see you also just replied that your sister encourages the behavior.  How is she supposed to *learn* when her own mother is encouraging that sort of behavior?  I feel sorry for her and think we should judge children a little less harshly Ldavis--especially ones who clearly don't have someone explaining to them why you might not want to wear a swimsuit like that at age fourteen (the likes of which OP claims she hasn't even seen anywhere else....and I've seen some pretty skanky swimsuits...guessing she has too) at a public pool. 

i don't think I'm judging her particularly harshly to say she is full of herself...Does being 14 somehow exempt one from being full of themselves...Misguided yes, but still full of herself..The OP confirms that yes the girl is full of herself...I'm not going to sit and pretend that it's not how she is behaving with the OP confirms it because you personally think it is too harsh....14 is NOT a child...Not an adult but not a child...

I do feel bad for this girl because she is clearly not getting any guidance from her mother that is helpful but that doesn't exempt the girl from being full of herself, it's not like I think she is a bad person but I'll call a spade a spade when I see one and not try to tap dance around thinking of the most "gentle" way to say what my point actually is.

 

If it was my niece I'd be feeling really bad for her but I'd also probably tell her she was full of herself...Then I'd ask niece if she'd like me to buy her a properly fitting bathing suit and Mom can have a cow about it or niece can hide it and wear it when mom isn't around so she is at least comfortable, although if niece thinks she is hot stuff maybe she likes wearing something to small who knows....I know all that is incredibly MDC incorrect though.

post #26 of 140

It's pretty common for young teens to be full of drama and self absorbed/self referential.  It wouldn't surprise me that girls that age thought the entire world was looking at them, much less thinking someone was taking pictures of them.  I commonly hear my kid and her friends thinking that everyone is noticing something about them, leading them to die of embarrassment.  It's the age, IMO.

post #27 of 140

OP, ok I thought that was you again! I remember that thread about your sister (the mom is your sister right?) and how she is really kinda nuts sounding.

 

Ugh, good luck with that mess..if you can sneak a time to talk to niece alone maybe just ask if she'd like a bathing suit that fits better? She probably will say no but you could always offer to buy her one and while it would probably create drama with mom, maybe the niece would really appreciate...It would drive me nuts to see girls trying to navigate what is an incredibly awkward/difficult age with a mom who probably just makes things worse a lot of times.

 

ETA...karne, I think you nailed it. I remember my friends and I used to think everyone was paying attention to us all the time...mostly what we were getting was eye rolls because we were loud/annoying/acting like idiots so yeah maybe we we were getting looked at but nearly as much as we would have liked to think. Teens after all are the center of their own very special universe.ROTFLMAO.gif

post #28 of 140
Thread Starter 

It was in April I think, I just remember it was before younger niece's 11th birthday. Niece had a date..a one on one date with a boy, with no adults and it was not a group thing. My sister was supposed to drop niece off at the movie theater where the boy was meeting her. I do not know how old the boy was. But the boy apparently did not show. So my sister said she wanted to cheer her daughter up after being stood up so asked me to go out to eat with her. We met up and in comes niece, with heavy make up on, talking on her cell phone, at 10 yrs old. Niece was supposedly grounded from the cell phone for refusing to take her TAKs test or something like that (TAKs is a state mandated benchmark test here). But my sister said she is letting her be on the phone anyway because she feels bad about being stood up. Younger niece has been in cheer since before 3 yrs old. There was a thing there where you are not supposed to be in it until 3 but my sister always insists her daughter is so mature, she should be in with the older kids. She used the same logic to have her children out of their car seats by 2 yrs old (which clearly has nothing to do with it). A lot of the cheerleaders, even when little, wear a lot of makeup. I just always thought they only wore the make up for their shows. But niece was wearing it for her date. Then niece proceeds to baby talk to my son who is a year younger and take his knife out of his hand while saying "knife....sharp" in a very baby tone. I told her to give the knife back, he is not a baby and he is not younger than her (he was spreading butter on his bread). Then I get told that niece just is so much more mature than my son. My son is not immature, and I don't think acting sexual and wearing tons of makeup at 10 yrs old makes you "mature." My son was the mature one who handled having the knife yanked out of his hand very well. He never got upset and let me resolve it and then got his knife back and went on buttering his bread. And older niece does not invite my daughter, who is 7 months older, to her things, like birthday parties. Niece actually originally would invite my daughter and my sister would tell me privately not to bring her because she wants her daughter to be a cheerleader and "this is too important" and my daughter does not fit in. There is nothing wrong with my daughter. She just is not the outspoken type. She plays in the city orchestra and does very well in school. She is not rude or judgemental (my niece is though, so is my sister). My niece in recent times has given my daughter a hard time about how my daughter dresses. There is nothing wrong with how my daughter dresses. But my daughter went to a pool party and told niece about it because a boy my daughter likes was going to be there. That is when niece started in big time on my daughter that my daughter's swim suit will make her stand out and be humiliated and all that. The boy, and all the other kids at the party, went to private Catholic schools. My daughter wore a tankini. Of the other girls, they were all in 1 peices or tankinis, or at least bikinis that covered more. The boys all wore the traditional boxer short looking suits. But my niece and sister were relentless toward my daughter, insisting that she would be humiliated and everyone would laugh at her and even point at her because of her swim suit. In the end, DD fit in just fine in her tankini.
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ldavis24 View Post




how is not full of yourself to assume a random person taking pictures at a public place is targeting you? I don't see someone with a camera out and assume he must be taking pics of me (regardless of age) just because I am in a bathing suit! I never thought that as a teen either. I actually don't know anyone IRL who has felt that way before.

Maybe the girl isn't full of herself she is just fully aware that her bathing suit is too small and is paranoid because of that, in which case I feel really bad for her and her mother needs to get a clue.

 

OP are you the same poster who had a thread a while back about this mom and her daughter's again and how obsessed with popularity the mom was and she wouldn't let your kid hang out with the girls or something? Or maybe another poster.

 



 

post #29 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ldavis24 View Post

 

 

ETA...karne, I think you nailed it. I remember my friends and I used to think everyone was paying attention to us all the time...mostly what we were getting was eye rolls because we were loud/annoying/acting like idiots so yeah maybe we we were getting looked at but nearly as much as we would have liked to think. Teens after all are the center of their own very special universe.ROTFLMAO.gif


I try to be all Zen about this when I hear how MORTIFIED my kid is about, well, everything, these days.  I can also remember being 14 and thinking my friends and I were pretty hot stuff.  That's no help to you, OP, but just saying, I remember....

 

post #30 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by new2this View Post

Teenagers in general are very full of themselves. However this girl if 14 and from the sounds of it has no real guidance on how to act, dress and has a mom that seems to be more worried about being a friend then a parent. 

 

I have no problem with two piece suits however I also think there are classy ones as well as skanky ones. People can wear what they want but then be prepared to be judged, talked about whatever. While you can't control others behavior you can control your own and that includes how one presents themselves. It also speaks a lot about how one views themselves. And I do believe people dress how they want to be treated, just as they act how they want to be treated. Some people say/do things to attract any type of attention to themselves be it good or bad. 




This.

 

I feel sorry for the girl.  Sounds like she is actually very insecure--probably because she is trying to navigate this crazy world w/out the proper guidance. 

post #31 of 140

I'm biased against this topic anyway because while I could care less what others wear DH and I are in agreement that DD won't be owning a 2 piece bathing suit until she can buy one with her own money. She just turned 2 and got a 2 piece from my step MIL...I was so pissed. I have made it pretty clear to my family in general how I feel about my DD wearing 2 pieces as a toddler...More than just the fact that I (personally) think it looks weird/bad on babies/toddlers but I prefer DD to actually wear something that covers her skin and protects her from the sun. We are a rash guard on toddlers kinda family.

post #32 of 140
Thread Starter 

And for the record, I really do love my nieces and my sister. Our other sister tried to talk to this sister about how her daughters are dressing, but younger sister just said older sister doesn't get it because she has no children. I am very concerned about what is going to happen in the long run with my nieces. Also, I do not think someone who acts this way can be that happy with herself. There is a lot more my sister does that I have not posted about that indicates she is not very happy with herself. I wish wish wish I could "fix" this, but I know we cannot just "fix" other's problems. I wish these problems were not being projected on to my nieces too.

post #33 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by chaoticzenmom View Post



 

How should a person who works on a corner (or dresses like one) be treated?  I don't want my daughter dressing in skimpy clothing, but I'm not liking the attitude that if she does, it's ok to treat her a certain way.  I have a friend who dresses in clothes that I find too revealing for my taste, but she deserves every bit of respect as anyone else.  

 

This isn't as much in response to the post about the swimming pool incident (poor guy!), but just looking at our attitudes in general that some people deserve maltreatment based on whatever we think justifies it.

 


Well....IMO, someone who works the corner is offering herself up as an object to be used. Is it surprising that society then objectifies these women? Gawking at someone is now "maltreatment"? Really?

 

On a side note, people who wear revealing clothing do not bother me. People who wear revealing clothing and then complain that people are looking at them DO bother me. Why are you showing most of your chest if you don't want people to look at it? Why do your shorts begin an inch above your pubic hair and not cover your cheeks if you don't want people to look?

 

I think people need to examine what they are trying to say about themselves when they get dressed. If your goal is to look sexy, then you can hardly become upset when you attract attention.

 

And if you are dining out with your D-cups pushed up and all your cleavage showing, believe me....it's not an accident that all the waitstaff is walking by your table. Depending upon their sexual orientation, they are either checking you out or laughing at you in the kitchen.

 

 

 

post #34 of 140

it's like the woman who wears the low cut tank top with the word BITCH splashed across the chest in glitter, getting really offended at people looking at her...give me a break, you wore that shirt specifically so people would stare at you.

post #35 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2xy View Post




Well....IMO, someone who works the corner is offering herself up as an object to be used. Is it surprising that society then objectifies these women? Gawking at someone is now "maltreatment"? Really?

 

On a side note, people who wear revealing clothing do not bother me. People who wear revealing clothing and then complain that people are looking at them DO bother me. Why are you showing most of your chest if you don't want people to look at it? Why do your shorts begin an inch above your pubic hair and not cover your cheeks if you don't want people to look?

 

I think people need to examine what they are trying to say about themselves when they get dressed. If your goal is to look sexy, then you can hardly become upset when you attract attention.

 

And if you are dining out with your D-cups pushed up and all your cleavage showing, believe me....it's not an accident that all the waitstaff is walking by your table. Depending upon their sexual orientation, they are either checking you out or laughing at you in the kitchen.

 

 

 

I wasn't thinking of gawking, actually, but your post does bring up some questions for me.  How much gawking is acceptable? What is the point of gawking? At what point does gawking=maltreatment.   Does it matter how the person being gawked at feels about it?  How does gender play into this?  Is it different depending on the age of a woman 15? 25? 40? 6? Does her financial status play into whether it's ok to gawk at her.  How about cat calls?  What about other attractive parts of us that are considered erotic by some?  Neck nape?  Hair?  Inside of elbows?  How much leg, arms or chest is ok?  How is this idea played out in countries where women are expected to cover? 

 

Also, what if the woman wants the attention, judgement, cat calls, etc?  Does that make it ok, even then? If someone wants to be treated badly, does that make it ok to treat them badly? 

 

IMO, noticing someone isn't the same as gawking at them.  Gawking is meant to make someone feel judged, objectified, disrespected, odd.  Catching someone's eye is not the same as catching someone's eye and then having them stare at you for an uncomfortable amount of time.  I saw a woman yesterday who was dressed and positioned in a way that made me wonder if she was prostitute. I don't think it would be ok for me to gawk at her or otherwise treat her in any other disrespectful way.  I might not want to strike up a conversation with her, but that's my own boundary. 

 

I'm not sure why some of the responses on this thread make me feel like this is as much of a feminist issue as anything else.  The girl's situation is real that she needs a good role model and may be having some difficulty in her life that makes it hard for her to know how to present herself.  There's no question about that, but the underlying attitude?  Maybe someone else can put into better words than I can.
 

 

post #36 of 140

I think this is the same ole "woman dresses in skimpy clothes and gets raped and then society blames her for the rape because of the way she was dressed" argument all over again, isn't it?

post #37 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicky2 View Post

I think this is the same ole "woman dresses in skimpy clothes and gets raped and then society blames her for the rape because of the way she was dressed" argument all over again, isn't it?


Kind of, but rape is less subtle.  I'm thinking of more subtle acts. Acts that most people think are ok at first glance.

 

post #38 of 140

Does your niece feel comfortable in this clothing or would she like a bathing suit she didn't have to adjust all the time? Did she choose it or did her mother?

 

If she chose it and her mother approved, then really nothing you say will help. If your sister chose it for  your niece, then you can perhaps ask your niece if she'd like a swimsuit that would allow her to horse around without worrying. You can suggest a bikini with a strap over the neck or shoulders. You can mention to your sister that you noticed your niece wasn't able to have as much fun because she had to worry about her suit as much, 'and you know, if she's worrying about her suit, she's not going to be doing the social interaction she needs at this age..'.

 

 I won't buy a suit for my daughter that makes her visibly uncomfortable, but I can't really control what others buy for their kids. If my daughter were to suggest a suit like that, I'd take her through the steps of "what do you think is going to happen when you jump into the pool?" If she wanted to spend her money on it? I dunno.

 

Aside from that, I feel sorry for the grandpa, and sorry for your niece.

post #39 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ldavis24 View Post

I'm biased against this topic anyway because while I could care less what others wear DH and I are in agreement that DD won't be owning a 2 piece bathing suit until she can buy one with her own money. She just turned 2 and got a 2 piece from my step MIL...I was so pissed. I have made it pretty clear to my family in general how I feel about my DD wearing 2 pieces as a toddler...More than just the fact that I (personally) think it looks weird/bad on babies/toddlers but I prefer DD to actually wear something that covers her skin and protects her from the sun. We are a rash guard on toddlers kinda family.


My 10 year old picked this one out:

 

http://www.childrensplace.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_10001_10001_-1_672850_137020_27151%7C133141_girl%7Cswimwear_girl

 

(it is about as skimpy as I'll allow--some showing of the belly--maybe 1 1/2 inches.  She will wear a cover-up when not in the water.)

 

This is something like I want to get for my 2 year old:

http://www.onestepahead.com/catalog/product.jsp?productId=537149&parentCategoryId=85179&categoryId=117679 and http://www.onestepahead.com/catalog/product.jsp?productId=537154&parentCategoryId=85179&categoryId=117679

 

Two pieces, how we generally think of two-pieces (itsy bitsy teeny weeny yellow polka-dot bikini, anyone?) are inappropriate for tots and small children.  But, ones that happen to be two-piece, but cover as much or more than a one-piece (and there are plenty of those that we'd probably consider inappropriate--plunging necklines, high-cut thighs, strappy--all on the same suit), IMO are fine.
 

 

post #40 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2lilsweetfoxes View Post




My 10 year old picked this one out:

 

http://www.childrensplace.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_10001_10001_-1_672850_137020_27151%7C133141_girl%7Cswimwear_girl

 

(it is about as skimpy as I'll allow--some showing of the belly--maybe 1 1/2 inches.  She will wear a cover-up when not in the water.)

 

This is something like I want to get for my 2 year old:

http://www.onestepahead.com/catalog/product.jsp?productId=537149&parentCategoryId=85179&categoryId=117679 and http://www.onestepahead.com/catalog/product.jsp?productId=537154&parentCategoryId=85179&categoryId=117679

 

Two pieces, how we generally think of two-pieces (itsy bitsy teeny weeny yellow polka-dot bikini, anyone?) are inappropriate for tots and small children.  But, ones that happen to be two-piece, but cover as much or more than a one-piece (and there are plenty of those that we'd probably consider inappropriate--plunging necklines, high-cut thighs, strappy--all on the same suit), IMO are fine.
 

 



yeah I should specify bikinis is what I mean by 2 pieces

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