Lots of blood when the doctor snipped my babe's frenulum. I think they cut his tongue. :( Help...

[Beauchamp]

We drove over an hour to a well recommended crunchy ped for my new baby boy. He asked about nursing and I told him the latch was a bit fussy, I was somewhat engorged and slightly painful, possibly a hard spot or two. DS was mildly jaundiced, also, we noticed. So, the doctor looked in his mouth and said he had a "fairly prominent" tongue tie and said he highly recommended snipping it that day. This guy came so highly recommended to us from many AP mamas, and I felt like I could trust him. I also noticed that DS's tongue didn't go up all the way, and seemed to "flap" when he cried, because it was attached in the center. So...we let him snip. The doctor said he's only seen a drop of blood at the most ever...well, there was a LOT of blood. They needed gauze to absorb it, it was on DS face as I was trying to nurse him, drops of blood/saliva smeared on his blanket, burp cloth, my shirt...

I think the doctor cut the base of his tongue. I can see a cut there and a sort of Y-shaped flap. DS cried quite a bit, although he was able to nurse after a little.

The doctor and the nurse left the room so quickly, and told us nothing. We'd already pretty much closed out our visit before they snipped, but with that much blood I am just surprised they watched him latch on and then left.

I am so distraught over this, feeling like I hurt my baby. I am confident that he did have a tongue tie, but to accidentally cut his TONGUE...will this heal??? His latch today has been not strong at all. He's had some MAJOR spit ups (although he has since birth, but I was hoping the snip would help with this.) His latch/suck just doesn't seem right to me. Is it because his tongue just hurts from the "extra" cut, and therefore he will heal and eventually be okay?

I am so nervous and anxious and sad today. Postpartum hormones are already getting the best of me and I am just crying and crying over everything, especially not feeling great about feeding my baby and helping him to have an easy time BFing.

Any help, advice, etc, is greatly appreciated.

[PatioGardener]

It sounds like baby had an anterior and a posterior tongue-tie. The posterior ones bleed a lot more, but remember, a little blood goes a long way, so it often seems more than it is.

Did they give you any instructions?

Is it still bleeding now?

Nursing baby is great to put pressure on the wound and to stop bleeding. Plus breastmilk is a natural germ killer, so infection is unlikely.

If I were you, and if it was still bleeding tonight I would call the doctor back. If there is no way to contact them then I would call a nursing hotline or take the baby to emergency.

If it wasn't bleeding and baby was nursing well I'd keep an eye on things and keep nursing.

[Beauchamp]

Originally Posted by PatioGardener 

It sounds like baby had an anterior and a posterior tongue-tie. The posterior ones bleed a lot more, but remember, a little blood goes a long way, so it often seems more than it is.

Did they give you any instructions?

Is it still bleeding now?

Nursing baby is great to put pressure on the wound and to stop bleeding. Plus breastmilk is a natural germ killer, so infection is unlikely.

If I were you, and if it was still bleeding tonight I would call the doctor back. If there is no way to contact them then I would call a nursing hotline or take the baby to emergency.

If it wasn't bleeding and baby was nursing well I'd keep an eye on things and keep nursing.

No, it's not bleeding. It stopped bleeding very soon after...but I could definitely see a "cut" in the bottom of his tongue, i.e. it wasn't just a thin piece of membrane that was snipped. I'm not sure of anterior/posterior...off to Google that one a little. (As I eat my "dinner" of PB&J at 11:30pm after finally getting both kids to sleep....sigh. So...if he did have both anterior and posterior...that would mean a deeper cut or something?

No, they didn't give us any instructions at all. Just left the room. So weird! I know I should have asked, but I was so focused on nursing him and holding him to make sure he was calmed down, and when I looked up the doctor was gone.

He's nursed several times today (and spit up, too) but he doesn't seem to be in pain now. Although his latch is....I don't KNOW!!!! Argh!! Sometimes I think it's okay, and other times he frantically wiggles his mouth around, desperately trying to latch like he can't find the nipple or something. I hope they cut what needed to be cut. I'd be so upset if there was still some tongue tie or impediment to his nursing.

[homemademom]

I'm sorry!  I'd be upset, too. I don't know if what the doctor did was "right" as far as the procedure, but just leaving you without talking isn't good.   

In any case, I think you can expect the tongue to heal and the latch to improve. Remember, your lo has all this range of motion he hasn't had before and he needs to learn to use those muscles.  I hope he heals soon.  My ds had his tongue and lip ties lasered and it took 7 or 8 days for it to completely heal.  

[Taryn237]

We had my DD's posterior tie snipped twice this month.  Here are a few pics if you are looking for a comparison:  http://s107.photobucket.com/albums/m313/taryn237/Posterior%20Tongue%20Tie/?albumview=slideshow

The 1st one is after the second clipping, you can see how the wound is bigger and she can raise her tongue higher.  The other is after the first clipping.

eta: It was an awful experience for me too.  I made DH go in with her and hold her the second time.  :(  Stretching it is so hard too, I hate to see her upset but it reattached a bit after the first time so I had to make sure to stretch it thoroughly.

[katec67]

It does sound like they clipped for a posterior TT as well, and they do bleed more.  My DD had it done twice and the doctor held gauze on the wound until it stopped bleeding.  I'm sorry the doctor didn't explain the procedure to you better.  We had a very clear understanding of what was being done before we did it.

Rest assured that you did a wonderful thing for your baby, even though it was very hard.  I don't know the level of severity of the TT, but with many posterior TT's, a second clipping is required.  I recommend that you talk to the ped who did this procedure and tell him that you are uncomfortable with the level of information he gave you.  Or you could try to find another doctor or dentist who does TT clippings/laser. 

I remember being told after my dd's clippings that we should sweep a clean finger (gloved is best) under the tongue for a few days to prevent reattachment.  There are also facial massage techniques and other exercises recommended to help release the jaw muscles and stretch the tongue. 

I have a document that explains tongue tie very well and gives some post-frenotomy information.  If you are interested, PM me and I will email it to you.  Here is some info:

VI. Post frenotomy
a. Small amount of bleeding – control with pressure from a 2x2 gauze pad under the tongue. There is occasionally a
visible small vein down the anterior edge of the frenulum. Ligation may be considered though usually pressure is enough.
b. Mother holds and comforts, and almost immediately puts the infant to the breast.
c. Latch, milk transfer, swallowing, and especially mother’s comfort are immediately evaluated.
d. Child is then re-evaluated for wider mouth opening and improved tongue protrusion, elevation and a deeper latch.
There will be improved maternal comfort, often immediately.
e. Follow-up: recheck at 1 week, 2 months, and as needed, which can be entrusted to an International Board Certified
Lactation Consultant. Mother is given an emergency phone number and is instructed to call anytime for anything and as
often as she requires.
f. Nursing on demand.
g. Weight checks.
h. In the infant, it may be necessary to engage in tongue stroking, from the base of the tongue to the tip, in the days
immediately after tongue-tie release in order to help extension of the tongue, particularly if the infant is more than five
days of age. (Authors’ experience.) A pacifier “tug of war” may also help. This may be required for seven to fourteen
days for optimal results. The assistance of a lactation consultant will be most helpful. In the older infant or child, tongue
exercises are more frequently required in order to help the patient learn the use of a mobilized tongue. Lolly pops and
ice cream cones work very well, especially for encouraging tongue protrusion.

[Momo123]

My DS had a posterior tie and it bled a lot (IMO) when the dr snipped with scissors. By a lot I mean several pieces of gauze soaked with blood before it stopped. My DH was traumatized and I was worried. But after the bleeding stopped, it was fine. As it heals, the cut turns a whitish/grey color (I guess kind of like a scab but it's moist) then falls off. As PP said, bleeding is more common with a posterior tie because it's attached closer to the tongue. I actually had mine snipped recently (I'm in my 30s!) with a laser and there was no bleeding, so I think it is the fact that it was cut with scissors. As for the y-shaped flap, is it on the base of the mouth? If so, I had that too and I think I just could not see it before because it was covered up by the tie. DS has it too. Like Taryn237's babe, my DS had to have his clipped twice. I was told this happens with posterior ties not only because of reattachment, but because there can be more tissue underneath after the first clip. Because of the blood, you can't see enough to make more than one snip. The exercises I did were to have him imitate me sticking out my tongue and after the wound healed, to sweep the bottom of the tongue once a day and try to lift his tongue upwards. Not sure if it actually helped with reattachment though. Also, if you have access to a craniosacral therapist, a few sessions can really help to integrate the new movements.

[gemasita]

I was under the impression that not many people in the US are trained to diagnose and clip a posterior tongue tie?  And I thought it was usually done by a dentist or ENT?  I hope I'm not worrying you more but I am just confused as to why the ped clipped it?  I may be ignorant on the subject but we did think that DS had a posterior TT and had to take him to a certain ENT in the area who was trained.  I am wondering (if you are still worried) if you could check with a local IBCLC and see if there is anyone in your area trained in posterior TT who could take a look at the clipping for you?  Or verify with an IBCLC that this ped is trained to do this?

[lilikoi]

Our ped clipped DD's posterior TT with scissors. It bled quiet a bit and she nursed right away. I think it was more traumatizing to me and DH though because of  all the blood. I didn't feel any difference right away with the latch, but a week later she was nursing much better. I do remember my ped explaining that we would see a Y shaped gap on the base of her tongue. She asked us to come back to the office 2 days later for her to check the wound. DD was very cranky for 2 days after the clip. I wasn't sure at the time, but now I am so glad we did it. Nursing became a lot more easier.