How do you do it without resorting to TV in the evenings?

[Stacey B]

So as my DS is about to turn five we are getting into a habit that I Don't like. Evenings seem to be for DVDs, almost every night. I'm just not sure what to do with him after spending every moment from 6 am with him. Because of DH schedule he can be gone up to three nights a week and goes to bed before we do often. I am not against some movies and shows and I don't want this to turn into a media discussion, but I am sort of done at the end of the day and need a break and it seems like its always on, like he doesn't care to play with himself, which he seems only to do in the mornings, some days. I know I could just let it go and be content to have a few moments to myself but as someone who was originally was planning on not having any "TV" I find it hard to hear him beg for movies, it seems like it is the only area that he has a hard time self regulating and gets fairly addicted. But on the other side I can't think of anything else to offer him because I just can't be "on" that many hours in a row.

[SundayCrepes]

After dinner we go for walks--my husband and I walk, our kids ride their bikes (sometimes our 5 year old rides his scooter.) These are very relaxing trips for us.

We've never allowed movies or TV. I was raised with non-stop TV and wouldn't allow any screentime, but I fear the backlash against that when the kids get older. So, when our son turned 3 we got him the DVD Microcosmos http://www.amazon.com/Microcosmos-Kristin-Scott-Thomas/dp/B0000DZ3BS/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1308544300&sr=8-1

Around that time I started letting him watch dvds while I put our daughter down for a nap. (He wanted to nurse while she was and she wouldn't go to sleep with him in the bed with us.) In the last 2.5 years it has morphed into he gets screen time during her nap. Screen time means kids' documentaries, www.youtube.com--he likes How It's Made or sometimes Betty Crocker and similar cooking shows. He also can play www.starfall.com whenever he wants. When we visit my parents, he can watch Blue's Clues videos while I take a shower (so my parents don't have to worry about him while I'm occupied.)

So, no TV, no movies, no cartoons (except Blue's Clues.) And he has learned so much. Tonight we were making ice cream and it wasn't turning out right (we think too much sugar.) He told us the process for homogenizing milk. The other day he used the word malleable...correctly. (How many 5 year olds can use malleable in a sentence?) One day I was cutting an avocado. He told me how to check if avocados were ripe and how to slice one. I handed him the avocado and he knew what to do. That night he told us how airplanes stay in the sky. My husband was previously in charge of flight training for a European airline. He said our son's knowledge was correct. I could go on and on with all the things our son springs on us.

I'd say you have a couple options...

1. Change what you do at night. You might find a walk refreshing and if your son is riding a bike, you won't need to do much (assuming he's competent at a bike. If not check out this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ADkm4qkXAj8 (Both our kids were competent with balance bikes at 2.5 years.))

2. Change what your son watches. He still gets screen time, but you feel better about the content. He may complain for awhile, but stick with your new screen options and he will get used to it and stop complaining. Besides, he may find he likes the documentaries. Here's a few of my son's favorites. Our library has many of these for checkout.:

How'd They Build That...Fire Truck:

http://www.amazon.com/Howd-They-Build-Fire-Truck/dp/B001CMZF46/ref=sr_1_1?s=dvd&ie=UTF8&qid=1308545027&sr=1-1

The Big Boom, about sonic booms, volcanoes, and building destruction:

http://www.amazon.com/Big-Boom-Artist-Not-Provided/dp/B00074DY34/ref=sr_1_1?s=dvd&ie=UTF8&qid=1308545062&sr=1-1

The Big Auto Plant. From a great series:

http://www.amazon.com/Big-Auto-Plant-William-VanDerKloot/dp/B0000E3J8V/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1308545204&sr=1-3-catcorr

Anything in the Popular Mechanics for kids series is great:

http://www.amazon.com/Popular-Mechanics-Kids-Lightning-Forces/dp/B000FTW34C/ref=sr_1_3?s=dvd&ie=UTF8&qid=1308545235&sr=1-3

That's How We Build a House:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000092OM9/ref=wms_ohs_product_T2

The Big Renovation (after talking about a termite inspection, they go to an entomology lab and watch termites. If you draw a pen line on a piece of paper, the termites will follow the line. What a cool thing to learn):

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0009XMV4G/ref=wms_ohs_product_T2

How a Car is Built (also a piece on tugboats):

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0009IWFEM/ref=wms_ohs_product_T2

Cleared for Takeoff:

http://www.amazon.com/Cleared-Takeoff-Herb-Hunter/dp/B000AOEQAQ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1308546107&sr=8-1

National Geographic's Wild Animal Gift Set:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0009K7R20/ref=wms_ohs_product_T2

I just decided to buy these. I got used copies (except the Popular Mechanics Set. That was cheaper to by new from a different seller.):

The Big Rescue:

http://www.amazon.com/BIG-Rescue-Little-Mammoth/dp/B000M7FRSQ/ref=pd_bxgy_d_text_b

The Big Newspaper (better hurry with that one before newspapers go away, lol):

http://www.amazon.com/BIG-Newspaper-William-VanDerKloot/dp/B000A702EW/ref=sr_1_17?s=dvd&ie=UTF8&qid=1308546715&sr=1-17

Popular Mechanics for kids, 6 different titles:

http://www.amazon.com/Popular-Mechanics-Kids-Artist-Provided/dp/B000AYYV6A/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1308546663&sr=8-1

Again, our library has many children's documentaries for checkout. And, of course, youtube is free if you have internet--which I would suspect if you are posting here.

[elisheva]

What time is dinner and how does that compare to bed time? We eat around 6:30 and for my ds1 (4.5), bed time is 8:30ish. We are done supper by 7ish usually and DH reads to the kids or watches an episode or two of Gilligans Island with them. We aren't anti-screen time - we're realists who are tired at the end of the day.

Do you have a yard he can play in right now when it's light later? Can you sit out with a cup of tea and he can play? Hard for an only child to play by himself, I'm guessing. Does your ds like puzzles or any other kind of quiet, self-directed activity? Playdough? Colouring? 

I guess I don't think end-of-day screen time is a bad thing if it works for your family. I know there are studies that associate all sorts of things with screen time before bed but we haven't found that to be the case for our kids. Watching one program on dad's computer in a darkened room actually seems to calm them. Then DH lays with them until they fall asleep (often telling them stories or listening to their stories). You also mentioned your ds being addicted to TV/movies. My ds2 tends toward this and so we have very boring dvd choices. Things they've seen many times tend to make them less likely to spend hours in front of the TV. Of course, YMMV. We also don't have cable because it's just too tempting for me to let them watch much long...

I'm sorry to not have more concrete suggestions for you. Just wanted to chime in that screen time isn't all that bad if it works for you.  

[sarahtar]

We have several hours at night between dinner and bed, and tend to fill them with independent play (which I understand isn't going to work for your family at this time), sometimes books, sometimes easy projects or games, and then nearly every day, some screen time. In OUR family, it's not kids screen time, necessarily, we choose programs that everyone will enjoy. Sometimes nonfiction shows (even bizarre nonfiction shows like Finding Bigfoot, or educational shows like How the States Got Their Shapes), sometimes fiction shows, but we watch a show before bed nearly every night. It's something our whole family enjoys doing together, and it works out to be good wind-down for everyone.

I know all the "experts" say NO TV At Bedtime and they also say to give a bath before bed to relax your children, but neither of my children have found baths to be relaxing, and TV doesn't seem to have all the detrimental effects they claim.

If you're looking for some TV time for him but not necessarily you, can you record whatever educational programming you find appropriate and interesting to him? My son started watching Electric Company about that age, and I noticed a marked increase in his reading ability after that. (Oh! That's a silent E. It makes the vowel say its name. I heard that on Electric company.) Many of the other afternoon PBS shows are geared towards the lower elementary ages, as well. If you have satellite or cable, there's a treasure trove of shows catering to nearly any interest on Discovery, History, Biography, etc.

I don't personally like YouTube videos, because of the tendency my kids have to click on whatever other video looks interesting in the sidebar, and before i know it, they're watching some wildly inappropriate spoof of Scooby Doo or something.

[KimPM]

I SO get where you're at. My DS sounds similar with not being able to do much by himself. He doesn't do "free play" very well. One of the few things my 5 yo DS will do by himself is Legos and K'Nex building activities. Occasionally Tinkertoys too. He will also do some easy workbooks by himself if he's in the mood. He also likes to read alone sometimes, but not sure if your LO is there yet.

You might also consider changing the dynamic by changing the order of things you do in the evening. If he gets a bath, make it earlier...then start him doing something else. It may take a bit more time in the short term to change the dynamic, but once he gets used to less (or no) TV, he may not miss it if he's into something else.

[tbone_kneegrabber]

It doesn't help with evenings, but maybe if you have a friend over during the day he can play with his friend and then you can do whatever you need/want to do and then those evenings you may be more interested in hanging out/playing after dinner.

We usually have dinner with a friend and their family 1-2 nights/week which I love excellent combo of kid time and grown up time. Helps that we have several (like more than 6) groups of friends who we were friends with pre-kids who now all have kids similar in age and we mostly all live walking distance from each other

[onlyzombiecat]

How long a time period each day is this? Can you get a break earlier in the day to recharge your batteries for evening? Can you set a timer and say to ds, "I need time alone. I will do x with you when the timer goes off."  Can you call a grandparent/aunt/uncle/friend and let ds chat to them for awhile while you take a break?  If nothing like that would work then I'd just set a time limit for the dvd and let it go for now. Choose dvds that are acceptable to you- maybe nature programs would be good.

It has gotten easier as dd has gotten older for me not to spend every moment with her. She is actually very good at playing by herself now.

During the day dd can watch dvds. She self-limits with them pretty well. She was horrible at self-limiting when we had tv reception but she can handle dvds okay.

In our home the rule is no tv, computer, or video games 1 hour before bedtime. During that hour dd can draw, do other art projects, do puzzles, coloring or activity books, read, take a bath, play with her hamster, listen to music or an audio book, or talk. Sometimes she leaves us alone and other times she wants company.

Edited by onlyzombiecat - 6/21/11 at 10:01am

[Stacey B]

Originally Posted by elisheva 

What time is dinner and how does that compare to bed time? We eat around 6:30 and for my ds1 (4.5), bed time is 8:30ish. We are done supper by 7ish usually and DH reads to the kids or watches an episode or two of Gilligans Island with them. We aren't anti-screen time - we're realists who are tired at the end of the day.

Do you have a yard he can play in right now when it's light later? Can you sit out with a cup of tea and he can play? Hard for an only child to play by himself, I'm guessing. Does your ds like puzzles or any other kind of quiet, self-directed activity? Playdough? Colouring? 

I guess I don't think end-of-day screen time is a bad thing if it works for your family. You also mentioned your ds being addicted to TV/movies. My ds2 tends toward this and so we have very boring dvd choices. Things they've seen many times tend to make them less likely to spend hours in front of the TV. Of course, YMMV. We also don't have cable because it's just too tempting for me to let them watch much long...

Dinner is somewhere between 6 and 8, depending on everyone's schedule. I'm not against some screen time in the evenings it's just gotten to where that's all there is after dinner, unless I play with him, at full attention. I wish we had a fenced yard where he could play on his own. We live on a very busy street so if he wants to be outside I have to be on the porch, which is okay some times but I some nights I have to get a lot done around the house and actual work.

Originally Posted by KimPM 

I SO get where you're at. My DS sounds similar with not being able to do much by himself. He doesn't do "free play" very well. One of the few things my 5 yo DS will do by himself is Legos and K'Nex building activities. Occasionally Tinkertoys too. He will also do some easy workbooks by himself if he's in the mood. He also likes to read alone sometimes, but not sure if your LO is there yet.

You might also consider changing the dynamic by changing the order of things you do in the evening. If he gets a bath, make it earlier...then start him doing something else. It may take a bit more time in the short term to change the dynamic, but once he gets used to less (or no) TV, he may not miss it if he's into something else.

I like this bath idea, it might be time to buy some more bubble bath, though persuading him into a bath more than three times a week is going to be hard.


 

Originally Posted by onlyzombiecat 

How long a time period each day is this? Can you get a break earlier in the day to recharge your batteries for evening? Can you set a timer and say to ds, "I need time alone. I will do x with you when the timer goes off."  Can you call a grandparent/aunt/uncle/friend and let ds chat to them for awhile while you take a break?  If nothing like that would work then I'd just set a time limit for the dvd and let it go for now. Choose dvds that are acceptable to you- maybe nature programs would be good.

It has gotten easier as dd has gotten older for me not to spend every moment with her. She is actually very good at playing by herself now.

During the day dd can watch dvds. She self-limits with them pretty well. She was horrible at self-limiting when we had tv reception but she can handle dvds okay.

In our home the rule is no tv, computer, or video games 1 hour before bedtime. During that hour dd can draw, do other art projects, do puzzles, coloring or activity books, read, take a bath, play with her hamster, listen to music or an audio book, take a bath, or talk. Sometimes she leaves us alone and other times she wants company.

I can't wait until he is more independent. He would love to spend a lot of time by himself in the morning and I should take advantage of that but so many of the activities we're involved in are in the morning. As for the DVDs he watches I'm fine with his choices (this is the boy who is scared of The Littles and Word Girl because there are bad guys), it's the quantity and the habit that bugs me. On nights that my husband is home and awake they go to the park and build forts in the livingroom and then go to bed together, but there is no garantee that my DH won't be sooo tired from his work that he doesn't go to bed right after dinner.

I have dreams of reorganizing DS room into a better play space, it's still set up for a 3 year old without much sense of calmness (he still sleeps with us). I think  you guys are right, I need to look more at how we are spending our whole days not just the evenings and then make some more philosophical and deep changes to how we do things. It's a hard balance because we have a fairly (no completely) democratic household so when the changes happen they have to be more in the style that we all do things. It's worked before but it takes a lot of "behind the scenes" work by me and dh.
 

[treemom2]

We're pretty much TV free (we have a computer we watch movies on occasionally).  In the evenings my family goes on walks together after dinner, plays games, does crafts (or just plays with playdoh or colors), or the kids have somewhat independent playtime (sometimes I'll have to make some suggestions for my DS. . .like, "Can you make me a garage for this car with your Lincoln Logs?").  Every night I read a chapter out of a book and when we finish the book we have a movie and popcorn night (we just finished Harry Potter and watched the movie. . .but we've also read Old Yeller, Alice in Wonderland, Mouse and the Motorcycle, Charlie and the Chocolate Factory, etc. . .).  There are times when I'm tired and I just feel like popping in a movie for the kids.  Usually I'll put in a Magic Schoolbus or find a Bill Nye on youtube.  Also, at 5, my DS loved to play games on the computer (he loved Kid Pix).  Sometimes we'll get into a cycle where the kids are watching too many movies or playing on the computer too much (we only have one in the house) and we'll take a week or two off just to stop the cycle.  

[SweetSilver]

I totally understand, especially with DH gone that must be exhausting!

We do have TV time (library videos only, so no commercials) but we have it first thing in the morning.  They get between 30 minutes to 1 1/2 hours per day.  We started this because of the whining for videos during the day.  This way, TV is first thing.  Done.  Gone.  Nomoreanddon'tevenletmehereyoufussinaboutit!  (And, yes Darling Husband, that means no TV for you either!)  Morning videos lets us get things ready for the morning and one of us out the door.  (DH and I will watch movies after the girls are asleep).

Clearly your struggle is in the evening instead, and the only thing harder about that is setting the limits as to when it starts.  I think it's like opening presents Christmas Eve instead of Christmas morning.  You have all day to whine about it!  So while I think that this can work, you'll have to work harder to prevent that lead-up whining.  First, I would say absolutely no TV before ______  and no fussin' about it!  And really try to stick to the time as much as possible.  If you have a range for dinnertime, make that range smaller.  Then stick to it, and limit the number or amount of video time.  My sister, whose husband was in the Army and often away for weeks or months at a time would have (slightly) different rules when Daddy was gone.  Maybe this could be something you do when Daddy is away.  But we do "extra video day" when one of us is sick (I get to declare that, not them) and this can be hard to get out of once the illness is not as severe.  However, they get better at this as they get older.

Finally, are you using TV time as snuggle time?  Before bed, this might be a sweet time for the both of you.  If you can't stand to watch Bob the Builder for the 20th time, get a book or a puzzle and snuggle close.