The neighbor children- aka, "You don't live here!!!"

[insidevoice]

I am thrilled that my daughter has some kids around to play with, however, I'm feeling terribly overrun by kids.  They've started arriving from 8am on and simply land here.  Their parents are nowhere to be found- often the kids are home alone for the summer (middle/upper elementary age) and seem simply to gravitate here.  At the moment- there are six of them out in our play area outside- climber/slide and sandbox in the middle of a big open field area near the main garden.  SIX!!  They keep wandering into the house to use the bathroom and looking for snacks and drinks.  

Anyone else have random kids simply arrive?  I've tried talking with the parents, but they tend to not care unless the kids are getting "in trouble".  They leave to work and as long as the kids are in one piece when they get home, they don't really seem to think about what happens during those hours they are gone. 

[mamazee]

I have kids who just end up here for ages, but they're all kids with parents at home. And sometime my kid is at one of their houses for ages. Our kids are all out and about all day during the summer at various people's houses and yards. But, again, they all have parents at home.

If they bother you, you can just send them home, right? But it isn't the same thing because you don't want your kids playing at their houses unsupervised, and hopefully they have a rule that they can't have friends over when their parents aren't home. So it isn't at all reciprocal like it is in my neighborhood.

[Vancouver Mommy]

Only occasionally do the neighbour kids show up without parental knowledge, and luckily, the kids seem to spend equal time at everybody's house. Usually if it happens I check with the other parent just to make sure they know where their child is and make sure it's OK that they came. My kids are a bit younger though and their friends all have stay at home parents.

If we aren't in the mood for extra kids or they have been around long enough, I usually let them know (gently) that it's time to go home - this is a skill I have gotten much better at lately.

[insidevoice]

Originally Posted by Vancouver Mommy 

If we aren't in the mood for extra kids or they have been around long enough, I usually let them know (gently) that it's time to go home - this is a skill I have gotten much better at lately.

I don't usually mind, but I need to perfect this skill.  I'm not good at creating boundaries like this.  I'm pregnant and we have two toddlers who still nap, so sometimes I'm just not up for it, and I am working on finding a gentle way to send them off for a while.   But the guilt!!  A couple of these kids hang around because I really think they don't have anything at home.  I don't mind putting together some popcorn or a plate of sandwich pieces to share (discovered in desperation one day- awesome batch o kids snack!) I just need to feel like I'm not being overrun. :P

[mamazee]

Why do you think they don't have food at home? Kids can come across that way if they think you might have something they'd like better than what they have at home, but do you really think you have several families of truly neglected kids who are left home with no food? I really find that unlikely. My guess is either you have yummier food, or you do the prep work so they don't have to if they eat your food. Just send them home and don't feel guilty.

[Vancouver Mommy]

I have found that kids don't really get subtlety (and don't have their feelings hurt by polite, but direct conversation). I have also found that speaking to kids in these situations is a bit different than to adults, as kids are still learning social boundaries. I usually say "thanks for coming - see you tomorrow" or "we're going to have some family time now, but we'll see you again soon" and then open the gate or door (or pass them their coat or whatever). I also agree with what another poster said about them probably having food at home, but preferring to eat yours. If you think this might be the case you could suggest that next time they come everybody brings a snack to share.
 

Originally Posted by insidevoice 

I don't usually mind, but I need to perfect this skill.  I'm not good at creating boundaries like this.  I'm pregnant and we have two toddlers who still nap, so sometimes I'm just not up for it, and I am working on finding a gentle way to send them off for a while.   But the guilt!!  A couple of these kids hang around because I really think they don't have anything at home.  I don't mind putting together some popcorn or a plate of sandwich pieces to share (discovered in desperation one day- awesome batch o kids snack!) I just need to feel like I'm not being overrun. :P

[earthmama369]

My kids will always happily chow down on anything someone else offers them, because it's *different.* It can be the same exact thing we serve at home, but if it's not at home, hey -- apparently it transforms into an entirely new and exciting food. But really, they're quite well fed and we do practice our "being a guest" manners. However, I don't let my kids just roam the neighborhood.

We're that house now -- the one with toys out and an adult home, so the neighborhood kids who are allowed to roam tend to come over here. It took me a while to figure out our boundaries and how to enforce them without feeling like an ogre, but I'm pretty comfortable with where we're at now. I send them home for snacks and meals, we don't allow hitting or unkind words, and if kids start to crank out I send them home ("OK, gang, everyone's getting tired, time to go home!"). If I'm not up for watching them, they can play in the front yard where the neighbors can theoretically see their own children, or they can head home. I'm perfectly comfortable saying "Not today" if I'm not up for company or my kids want to just play with each other. I also don't allow kids in the house unless it's a planned playdate and we've invited them over. For me, that takes most of the "eh" out of having neighborhood kids over. If everyone's outside, the only thing they need to do is stick the outside toys back in the shed to clean up. Having kids running in and out of the house can make exponentially more mess, so I just avoid that.

[insidevoice]

Three of them (same family) truly are left without food.  Sadly, there isn't anything I can do to fix it- it's pretty well known and CPS has been contacted/involved for years now. During the school year, the bulk of their nutrition comes from the school food program, but during the summer they don't attend the summer school program and as a result, don't have the meals there.  They usually become fairly gaunt over the summers. Because of that, I tend to be willing to offer snacks when they are hungry.  

I think I need to create better boundaries in general- particularly regarding the parade through the house when I'm feeling frazzled. :P

[limabean]

This was one thing I was glad for when we moved -- it gave me a chance to set a new precedent, since none of the neighbor kids knew me. It allowed me to be much more hard-assed, right from the get-go, than I had been at our previous house. And you know what? They all (seem to) like me anyway! 

I have really firm, clear boundaries and am completely unshy about enforcing them, and so far none of the kids have had the slightest problem with it. I just say, "It's not a good time for us to play right now -- come back tomorrow at 10, bye!" Or, if they're already here and I've had enough I just say, "Okay, 10 more minutes and we're going to say goodbye, thanks for coming!" and then stick to it. They really don't mind. Once or twice I've had a kid say, "But whyyyy?" when I've said it's time to go, and I just repeat myself: "It's time for us to say goodbye, see you later!" without offering a specific explanation, because it's none of their business and it would be rude to say, "Because I'm sick of having you here." 

I also have a firm snack policy. I'll put out something like fruit and crackers about an hour after they get here, and once it's gone, that's that. If they ask for more I say, "That was all we had to share -- you can head home and come back after you've eaten if you're still hungry." Or, if it's time for us to eat lunch and I don't have enough for everyone or just don't want to feed everyone I say, "Okay, time for us to eat lunch, see you later!" Again, they really don't mind. (ETA: We cross-posted. That's sad about the kids who truly don't have enough to eat. For them I'd probably offer a sandwich when they came over, but I'd still shoo the other kids away first.) 

[mammal_mama]

Originally Posted by Vancouver Mommy 

I have found that kids don't really get subtlety (and don't have their feelings hurt by polite, but direct conversation). I have also found that speaking to kids in these situations is a bit different than to adults, as kids are still learning social boundaries. I usually say "thanks for coming - see you tomorrow" or "we're going to have some family time now, but we'll see you again soon" and then open the gate or door (or pass them their coat or whatever). I also agree with what another poster said about them probably having food at home, but preferring to eat yours. If you think this might be the case you could suggest that next time they come everybody brings a snack to share.
 

I agree with all of this. I very quickly learned that it's important to be very direct and not worry about hurting feelings. Of course, I'm always polite but just more direct than I've ever needed to be with a truly polite adult (though I have had to be quite direct with at least one adult who wasn't even getting it when I said, "We're going to have dinner now.") I say similar things to the examples that Vancouver Mommy gave, and even our 15 year old neighbor usually needs it this directly. 

I usually give a prep-talk such as, "In about ten minutes we're going to need to say goodbye," and then, in about ten minutes, I follow up with something like, "Thanks for coming and we hope to see you soon!" One time, the 15 year old actually didn't require the follow-up speech. Within about ten minutes after my prep-talk, she told her bro and sis that it was time to go and they left. Just like that! But she has usually needed the whole spiel just like a younger kid. I guess because she doesn't have Internet at her house. :)

[insidevoice]

I'm beginning to see this is going to be largely about me being comfortable in my own shoes- more than anything else.  I've never been all that good at being assertive, so it seems like it's time to learn.  I *am* good at it in more structured settings (when I am teaching, when I have led children's groups etc- I am really good at those things) but at home I feel like I don't have my 'suit of armor' I usually lean on to help me define my own boundaries.  

We're in the midst of moving, so I get to start over soon- and I suspect that will help me a lot as I know better what my personal limitations are.  We'll also have more space, so I suspect my tolerance my increase- visitors in 750 sq feet is a little cramped. 

[ja mama]

I keep neighbor kids as outside guests only.  They aren't allowed in, unless I specifically invite them in.  If they live close enough to walk to my house they can walk home for any bathroom, snack, drink of water etc they may need.  If I take snacks outside they are for everyone.  Meals and snacks I don't want to share are served inside.  That boundary has helped me immensely, for sleeping babies, toys not being broken or left a mess, as well as my fruit bowl stays full for longer than an hour.  And it helps me explain to my kids to stay outside and in front yards of our neighborhood friends.  I can find them easily by yelling or walking down the street without having to knock on numerous doors.  (I really don't want my kids in half of these houses!)

It works really well for us, and the friends show up every day still. 

[Linda on the move]

Could you start a family quiet time in the afternoon when all guests MUST leave the property so your children (and you!) can rest? Saying that from 1:00-3:30 everyone must leave, not knock on the door, etc. could give you break and some structure to your day?

[journeymom]

Originally Posted by insidevoice 

I'm beginning to see this is going to be largely about me being comfortable in my own shoes- more than anything else.  I've never been all that good at being assertive, so it seems like it's time to learn.  I *am* good at it in more structured settings (when I am teaching, when I have led children's groups etc- I am really good at those things) but at home I feel like I don't have my 'suit of armor' I usually lean on to help me define my own boundaries.  

We're in the midst of moving, so I get to start over soon- and I suspect that will help me a lot as I know better what my personal limitations are.  We'll also have more space, so I suspect my tolerance my increase- visitors in 750 sq feet is a little cramped. 

It's a wonderful thing, how we're challenged to stretch and grow.
 

[insidevoice]

Originally Posted by Linda on the move 

Could you start a family quiet time in the afternoon when all guests MUST leave the property so your children (and you!) can rest? Saying that from 1:00-3:30 everyone must leave, not knock on the door, etc. could give you break and some structure to your day?

I really like this idea!

[SuburbanHippie]

Originally Posted by ja mama 

I keep neighbor kids as outside guests only.  They aren't allowed in, unless I specifically invite them in.  If they live close enough to walk to my house they can walk home for any bathroom, snack, drink of water etc they may need.  If I take snacks outside they are for everyone.  Meals and snacks I don't want to share are served inside.  That boundary has helped me immensely, for sleeping babies, toys not being broken or left a mess, as well as my fruit bowl stays full for longer than an hour.  And it helps me explain to my kids to stay outside and in front yards of our neighborhood friends.  I can find them easily by yelling or walking down the street without having to knock on numerous doors.  (I really don't want my kids in half of these houses!)

It works really well for us, and the friends show up every day still. 

 

[LROM]

Originally Posted by insidevoice 

Three of them (same family) truly are left without food.  Sadly, there isn't anything I can do to fix it- it's pretty well known and CPS has been contacted/involved for years now. During the school year, the bulk of their nutrition comes from the school food program, but during the summer they don't attend the summer school program and as a result, don't have the meals there.  They usually become fairly gaunt over the summers. Because of that, I tend to be willing to offer snacks when they are hungry.  

I think I need to create better boundaries in general- particularly regarding the parade through the house when I'm feeling frazzled. :P

For those 3 kids, if you're really interested in helping them, you should consider calling whatever the local version of food stamps is (I think it's called SNAP now across the country, used to be called WIC) (you can look it up on the internet google "food stamps" and your state).  Call them and ask what summer programs (both for activities and food) a child living in your zip code who is foodstamp-eligible might be able to get into.  If there is some resource in your area, you could ask the kids' parents if they know about the program and offer to help them sign their kids up.

There's no guarantee there is a program near you, but usually there is.  Summer is also already underway, but some programs will allow sign ups as long as they have room.

I know you feel for these kids and don't want to seem mean to them, but if their parents aren't meeting there needs there are much bigger issues that you can't help them with.  But taking steps to maybe get them into a program and give them something to DO over the summer... if that can happen that would be a huge help to that family I'm sure.

Otherwise, you have to do what you feel in your heart is right.  And it is ok to treat kids differently if you feel like some have a need that the others don't.  But mainly, you need to have boundaries that will help you feel good about the space you're creating for your own kids and family, as well as how you do and don't engage neighbor kids in your house.  And yes, kids usually do NOT get subtlety, so as a PP said, kind respectful directness usually is best for setting boundaries with kids.
 

[jessemoon]

As for summer food:

SNAP and WIC are different programs.  Both require children's parents to be the ones who sign up, but they may already be getting one or both of those.

During the summer, though, most school districts offer free lunch and breakfast just as they do during the school year.  The difference is that rather than every school site offering food, it is usually one or two central locations in a district.  At least in our community, there is no actual documentation needed to come and get a free meal during the summer...any kid who shows up gets fed.  If they qualify for free or reduced lunch during the school year, they should still qualify during the summer, even if your district does actually require some documentation. 

[tjjazzy]

i'd try not to allow neighbour kids into the house. EVER. they can go home if they want to go to the bathroom or get snacks. if they get in once, they'll think they can do it anytime IMO

(i have no fear of being strict. the neighbour kids probably don't like me but my life is pretty peaceful! LOL)

Edited by tjjazzy - 7/6/11 at 12:09pm

[BennyPai]

A lot of great suggestions here!  It's best to set boundaries up front, in my experience.  Kids do tend to pay attention to the first interactions and sometimes make assumptions based on them.

I have had this get out of hand in the past.  Right now, we're letting three young (7 & under) siblings next door use bikes/outdoor toys and we keep finding them left in the road. Now I'll have to explain the rules to them that I should have explained at the beginning.