Are these IQ results related to Asperger's?

[Plummeting]

I'm really confused right now. I will, of course, talk to the psychologists who did the testing, but we're traveling right now, so I can't. I just received the report in the mail. They said my dd meets the criteria for Asperger's, which I already knew based on a communication with them a couple of weeks ago. The report states she does not seem to have any learning disabilities, which is what confuses me, because her Verbal Comprehension was 130, but her Processing Speed was 78. I thought a difference as great as 52 points was indicative of a learning disability. Is that not the case because they're attributing it to Asperger's? They basically don't talk about this difference much at all in the report, other than to say that Asperger's might explain her strong abilities with language and verbal communication. They do make suggestions for the slow processing speed (accommodations to be made and ways to compensate) but they don't ever address the huge difference in the 2 scores. Actually, her verbal comprehension index was a great deal higher than all 4 of the other scores, but perceptual reasoning and working memory were both within the average range. What do I make of this?

[Emmeline II]

I did find this on, what I think was, a school district website:

•Does not include learning problems that are the result of other disabilities or environmental, cultural, or economic disadvantage

But that doesn't seem to be part of IDEA's definition of learning disability. States establish their own criteria, but it has to fit within IDEA.

Though that is for school; there may not be any requirements as to how testers define "learning disability," so it is possible that she doesn't fit their criteria because they are attributing her processing speed to another disability--when I was searching, slow processing speed kept coming up in relation to ADHD, not Asperger's.

Google Search--Low Scores in WISC IV Processing Speed

http://www.brainy-child.com/expert/WISC-IV-processing-speed.shtml

http://www.etfo.ca/MULTIMEDIA/WEBCASTS/SPECIALEDUCATION/Pages/Processing%20Speed.aspx

IDEA

http://idea.ed.gov/explore/view/p/,root,dynamic,TopicalBrief,23,

[RiverTam]

Those results are consistent with an ASD. Higher verbal IQ than performance IQ is consistent with Asperger's. Low processing speed is more typically seen in HFA, but it's not inconsistent with Asperger's.

http://www.aane.org/asperger_resources/articles/education/social_behavior_aspergers.html

[Plummeting]

Thank you both.

[chiefmir]

A child can have a huge discrepancy between WISC-IV Index scores and still not have a learning disability as per the educational definition which is heavily based upon academic achievment.

My guess is that with an Asperger's diagnosis, your child will qualify for either an IEP or a 504 under the educational category of Autism Spectrum Disorder, so even if they had diagnosed an LD access to services (or not based on whether or not the disability(ies) are severely impacting academics or other areas of school functioning) wouldn't change.

FWIF, I very often see children with Asperger's who have very slow processing speeds.  Usually the VCI is higher than everything and the PRI is the lowest, but that is not always the case.  Does your child have ADHD?  Kids with  Asperger's often  have sort of "subclinical" ADHD and a slower processing speed is a hallmark of that.

[Plummeting]

I'm not sure about ADHD, but I can't completely rule it out. If LD's are determined based on academic performance, then that would also explain why one wouldn't be dxed, ASD or not, since she's actually academically advanced, according to their testing. We're not looking for an IEP or anything  - we home school. I was just curious. Thank you!

[Linda on the move]

I really don't understand how all the testing and dxing works, but my DD also has a dx of Asperger's and has the same big gap in scores. She is not labeled with a LD.

The way it worked for school purposes was to have a dx in place that qualified her for accommodation (her's were under a 504) and then it was really just winging it with the school it figure out what worked. There wasn't a solid protocol for all ASD kids. We just had meetings and talked about what was working and what wasn't, and tweaked things.

Kudos for getting testing done even though you homeschool.

[Village Mama]

We also home school and received an educational  assessment last year. My sons looked similar to your daughters... except the VIQ was in the 99.7th percentile and the processing speed ( no joke ) was in the bottom 1st percentile. The psych said that it will match up if we get a  diagnosis ( still awaiting the final assessment) ... as a part of the aspergers diagnosis. But if other aspects of the Aspergers diagnosis didn't fit , that he still would meet DSM guidelines for a LD.

[chiefmir]

things can get really confusing diagnostically. DSM criteria for a learning disability is not the same as meeting criteria for an educational diagnosis with a specific learning disability in the school system.  This is so difficult at times- I work in a private practice (DSM criteria) and also in a public charter school (educational diagnosis).

[Village Mama]

that is because there has to be a specific learning disorder met in the DSM-IV  right?  Like written, reading or math disorder or an NOS diagnosis?( My son would qualify for both written and math LD diagnosis per DSM criteria) So specifically the processing speed without any indication of learning difficulties wouldn't be an indicator of a LD. I was all in my own head when responding! sorry!  Amazing though to have such a discrepancy and to NOT have it translate into difficulties in certain areas.

[Plummeting]

Originally Posted by Village Mama 

So specifically the processing speed without any indication of learning difficulties wouldn't be an indicator of a LD. I was all in my own head when responding! sorry!  Amazing though to have such a discrepancy and to NOT have it translate into difficulties in certain areas.

lol That's okay. DD did do poorly in writing fluency (but still advanced in the overall writing portion), but I expected that, because she's only 1st grade and I have not at all pushed writing yet - just a different philosophy I have about that. I think it might also be that she's only in 1st grade right now. I've read (and maybe I'm wrong on this) that a slow processing speed usually starts to cause more problems at around 3rd grade or higher. Lastly, it's probably easier since we home school - I know she'd be lost in a classroom at this point in her life. At home I can cover something 15 times in 10 different ways if that's what it takes, so that might help. (I'm not suggesting home schooling is better or anything - just that I think it's better for her right now. :) )

[Village Mama]

The psych actually told me how great it was that we were homelearning  for just that exact reason. Now that I think back to when my son was in grade one.... there wouldn't have been any indicators of learning issues at that point for us either. Your daughters scores look similar to my sons too. The psych had commented that it isn't something that is seen very often at all.

[chiefmir]

the discrepancy sizes you are talking about ARE very rare in the general population, for sure.   A person with highly variable IQ Index scores (almost everyone is variable to some degree, and even within that, there is statistically significant and then clinically significant... clinically means that it is super rare and pretty likely to cause learning or other issues) is much more likely to have learning problems (or other issues related to their weaker skills, like lower perceptual can go hand-in-hand with some social deficits).  The issue for SCHOOL is that most places (and all that I've worked in or heard directly of) need to see actual achievment delays that are indicative that the child is not (or no longer) achieving and learning at a rate that could be expected considering their overall abilities.  A lot of kids, especially those with higher verbal IQ since so much of school and life are verbally mediated, do fine in the early years in school but may struggle more in 3rd/4th/5th grade.  This can happen because the demands of certain subjects have gotten harder, because they can no longer compensate with their other more advanced skills, and other reasons.  If your (general your) child doesn't officially qualify for services at one point, definately request reevaluation in later years if something feels different later on. 

[Linda on the move]

Originally Posted by chiefmir 

 The issue for SCHOOL is that most places (and all that I've worked in or heard directly of) need to see actual achievment delays that are indicative that the child is not (or no longer) achieving and learning at a rate that could be expected considering their overall abilities.

But a kid with a dx of Asperger's (or any other ASD) qualifies for services, whether or not they also have a label of having a LD.

Anything on the autism spectrum is kinda the golden pass for special services at school.