I can't believe some of you are advocating lying about your children's vaccine status.
.....because they are pretty much facing being abandoned by their families if they do not vax.
I am not in their position - as such I am not judging them.
He's doing what he thinks is best for his child. Respect that and move on.
I think family is worth fighting for and I would try to reason with him.
Obviously if he won't listen to reason he won't listen to reason but it is worth trying.
I can't believe some of you are advocating lying about your children's vaccine status.
What's the problem with that if it makes family life easier? Nobody advocated for a child that has pertussis to drop by family members. Or any other communicable disease for that matter. If you have a choice between being ostracized from your family or bending the truth, you would advocate being kicked out of the family for totally crazy reasons? Not a single person here would expose another child with any disease. However people i know in my husband's family will come over to a newborn while coughing like a chain smoker saying hey I got the TDaP vaccine so it's safe! Yeah! - I don't see the issue at all.
They could also just wait until the baby is vaccinated, rather than lie. If you all think the brother is unreasonable now, imagine his reaction if he knew he was lied to.
I think family is worth fighting for and I would try to reason with him.
Obviously if he won't listen to reason he won't listen to reason but it is worth trying.
The OP's brother is trying to "reason" with her and it doesn't seem to be going well. Why should the reverse be any different? No matter what I decide to do with regard to my children and vaccines, I get pissed when anyone butts their nose in. It's my child, not theirs. If the situation was reversed that's what all the replies on this post would be too. She either need to respect her brother and what he decides to do with his children or butt out, no matter how wrong she thinks his choices are.
I don't think the issue was to wait 6 months until the infant received 3 doses. I thought the brother never wants to have them around if not vaccinated, and that makes no sense.
In my case I just keep getting pestered, nobody would exclude me, it is just one sister and nobody else is taking offense. And we do vaccinate, just slowly and selectively, and the particular offended person has an overvaccinated child (yes, overvaccinated as he received way more than the recommended doses). I don't see trouble with not being truthful there.
The OP's brother is trying to "reason" with her and it doesn't seem to be going well. She either need to respect her brother and what he decides to do with his children or butt out, no matter how wrong she thinks his choices are.
If my sister were trying to exclude me from her life over something like this (vax or non vax) you can bet your booty I would say something. Why on earth not? As stated earlier (and yes, I am repeating myself) family is worth fighting for. Ultimately the decision to exclude someone rests with the excluder, but that does not mean it isn't worth trying.
FWIW, I think both vaxxing and not vaxxing can be reasonable decisions; what is unreasonable (and it is in this context that I used the word "reason") is to exclude someone for not thinking like you or coming to the same conclusions as you.
I see your point, but it's not in me. They wouldn't believe it anyway, especially because they know I feel so strongly on it. I do wish that I had kept all our health choices private though... it's not a mistake I'll make again.
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It's not too late to start lying, lol. Can you tell them your doctor finally talked some sense into you, and now you are vaccinating?
Your brother is being unreasonable but that's his right as a parent. It's NOT his right to try and control other people's medical decisions. He has every right to say that unvaccinated people can't see his new baby. I suppose they'll be completely quarantining themselves at home until the baby is much older? After all, the world is full of vaccine-free adults and children. Or is it just the people he knows to be vaccine-free that scare him?
The fact that he's trying to guilt your mother into getting vaccinated by threatening to give the newborn the vaccine earlier than usual is absolutely disgusting to me. I think you should stay out of it, but I also think you should buy your mother a copy of Emotional Blackmail
I don't advocate lying but I do know my family's medical decisions are 100% private and if a relative asked us about our vaccine status I'd tell them to mind their own business and the ball would then be in their court. It's not my job to violate my family's privacy just because they feel entitled to the information. 
If someone told me that we weren't welcome to visit unless we took powerful pharmaceutical drugs to assuage their irrational, uninformed fears, I'd regretfully send my well wishes from a distance. It's absolutely their right to decide who sees their baby, but it's also absolutely our right to keep our medical choices private. They're simply not open for debate or discussion.
Your brother is being unreasonable but that's his right as a parent. It's NOT his right to try and control other people's medical decisions. He has every right to say that unvaccinated people can't see his new baby. I suppose they'll be completely quarantining themselves at home until the baby is much older? After all, the world is full of vaccine-free adults and children. Or is it just the people he knows to be vaccine-free that scare him?
The fact that he's trying to guilt your mother into getting vaccinated by threatening to give the newborn the vaccine earlier than usual is absolutely disgusting to me. I think you should stay out of it, but I also think you should buy your mother a copy of Emotional Blackmail
I don't advocate lying but I do know my family's medical decisions are 100% private and if a relative asked us about our vaccine status I'd tell them to mind their own business and the ball would then be in their court. It's not my job to violate my family's privacy just because they feel entitled to the information.
If someone told me that we weren't welcome to visit unless we took powerful pharmaceutical drugs to assuage their irrational, uninformed fears, I'd regretfully send my well wishes from a distance. It's absolutely their right to decide who sees their baby, but it's also absolutely our right to keep our medical choices private. They're simply not open for debate or discussion.
Well said. I'm thankful that both sides of our family know we don't vax, and are very supportive. Some with older children even say that they wish they never did all the vaxes to their children. My DH started talking about vaccinations with a family friend a few nights ago, and was about to tell him we don't vax. I shut him up quickly with a dirty look, because I do NOT see the point in letting people know our personal business.
Uhhg I hate that families make this an issue. Nothing would keep me away from my grandchildren though, even if the request is unfair and irrational. I would get the stupid vaccine. It's not fair to that grandbaby never to know his grandma because she was afraid of the remote possibility that she would get a vaccine reaction. Just like we're always talking about how these diseases are so rare, well reactions are too, at least the serious ones. That's just how I see it.
He is saying that we are causing all the outbreaks and putting all the vax'ed people at risk. 
And he also had to throw in for good measure my use of alcohol hand sanitizer and that it's the reason for all the super germs and that why can I use hand sanitizer but vaccines are not ok.
Thanks for listening to me vent!!
As far as putting unvaxed people at risk, not true. Think about it like this, you had a dog. Your dog has no shots. Your dog goes to a kennel where the other dogs are all vaxed. Your dog gets sick. The illness doesn't spread to the vaxed animals. If anything the vaxed animals are more likely to CARRY the diesease and spread it to unvaxed ones. While people are not dogs. I can't see how it would be the complete opposite for us?
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I completely agree with the OP that said both vaxing and not vaxing can both be reasonable decisions....... The last thing I told my mom was, there is no hard scientific proof that vaccines are safe BUT there also isn't any scientific proof that they are UNsafe. It all boils down to doing all your research on every vaccine and ingredient and looking at the common sense side and the studies that they have done and then decided the best decision for you and your family.....
They way I look at it is..... In what instance would you be able to forgive yourself more, 1. You allow your child to have the vaccine/s and they are permanently injured (which yes I know is not common but it DOES happen) or 2. Your child contracts a disease that (which yes is rare but IS out there) *might* have been prevented with a vaccine and something awful happens. As HORRIBLE as either of those scenarios would be, *I* wouldn't be able to live with *myself* if I made a decision for my child that led them to be harmed. I believe I could except it if they contracted a disease that just "naturally" occured.
I have read both sides.... People who were pro-vax and there child was permanently injured by vaccines and now they are at LEAST advocating for delayed, selective vax AND people who's child contracted a VPD and wished they'd vax'ed.
It really is a hard choice either way and I don't look down on anyone who does vax just because I don't.
FWIW my mom did go this morning and get the vaccine....Before she left she told me that she didn't really want to have the vaccine but she wanted to keep the peace and didn't know what else to do. I just hope I hear from her tomorrow and all is well. I am sure it will be but the chance is still there. My brother has calmed down a little but he isn't open to reason. I understand his worry and fears but he doesn't seem to comprehend mine. We are still on speaking terms as we haven't allowed this to come between us too much. I just hope he isn't like the OP who is totally shut out.
Well, just tell your brother that you diligently researched and red EACH and EVERY link he has sent you and you came to conclusion
that htey all represent just one side. Therefore they are BIASED. As every self respected scientist he certainly must have researched
and red what other side of the medical word has to say and since you invested your time and attention to the first part of his research,
now you await with excitement the materials the can put forward for you to show what the other side has to say and then of course
you would appreciat his balanced scientifical assesment.
(Btw.. your brother has a Phd in Physics does not he? Therefore his expertise on vaccinations does not have to be more in depth
then let's say.. your mailman. He simply knows what he read and what he read is very one sided. Lastly.. you can play a mind game
with him asking him what he thinks of smoking.. and if he thinks it is safe.. and since every package of cigarettes carry a warning
then he can state differently correct? Then simply take him for this cute trip down the medicine memory lane..of times when
doctor did recommend smoking to improve one's health:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCMzjJjuxQI
Lastly you can ask him how valuable are theories in science.. any science? Does he knows any examples when the theory
changes 180 degrees? Is it possible that what was believed safe once might not be safe now when there is momre facts
sating otherwise? And if the vaccinations are as safe why each of them contain a warnning in the booklet that it is not
entirely safe and it might cause so many side effects?
Your brother is being unreasonable but that's his right as a parent. It's NOT his right to try and control other people's medical decisions. He has every right to say that unvaccinated people can't see his new baby. I suppose they'll be completely quarantining themselves at home until the baby is much older? After all, the world is full of vaccine-free adults and children. Or is it just the people he knows to be vaccine-free that scare him?
The fact that he's trying to guilt your mother into getting vaccinated by threatening to give the newborn the vaccine earlier than usual is absolutely disgusting to me. I think you should stay out of it, but I also think you should buy your mother a copy of Emotional Blackmail
I don't advocate lying but I do know my family's medical decisions are 100% private and if a relative asked us about our vaccine status I'd tell them to mind their own business and the ball would then be in their court. It's not my job to violate my family's privacy just because they feel entitled to the information.
If someone told me that we weren't welcome to visit unless we took powerful pharmaceutical drugs to assuage their irrational, uninformed fears, I'd regretfully send my well wishes from a distance. It's absolutely their right to decide who sees their baby, but it's also absolutely our right to keep our medical choices private. They're simply not open for debate or discussion.
Agree completely.
In our house, it was the fully boostered adult (DH--work requirement) who brought pertussis home to our unvaxed kiddos. So, Tdap didn't keep him from becoming ill, or from infecting DS.
I have not been in that situation but I find it pretty offensive that a family member would order me to inject myself with a medication against my own wishes just to participate in family life. Sorry. No way. First, I'd be asking for hard core studies that prove beyond a doubt that Tdap prevents transmission. I've been researching pertussis for years and I haven't found them yet. I'd also want irrefutable science that it prevents colonization. Haven't seen those either.
Then if I was told that we couldn't visit unless we complied (as in, were forcibly vaccinated against our will), I'd say, well, see you after the baby has had his whole series then because by the parental reasoning, he'll be immune.
It is the parents' right to make whatever rules about contact they wish, even if they seem unreasonable or irrational. I've seen new parents petrified of pertussis and the flu who still take their one month olds out to a mall full of sniffling, hacking people every afternoon. So, sure, whatever floats their boat, but we wouldn't compromise our own health to mitigate someone else's fears. No thanks.
Thanks, things have calmed down. My mom is leaving to go visit them this weekend and my dad is going along too....and get this, he didn't get the vaccine.... I told my brother that dad probably wouldn't hold the baby because that's just how he is. The only newborn he held in this family was my son (who was 10+lbs) and my mom says it's because he thinks they are just to fragile. lol. Anyways, I told him that and I also mentioned that dad didn't get the vaccine and that he probably wouldn't mind anyways if he didn't hold the baby and this was his reply... "A 5 mins. holding session is not gonna do any harm. It's more important for the primary caregivers to get the vaccine, like people who will be in close *constant* contact and caring for the baby (I guess he already has plans for my mom's time there lol ). 
That right there, tells me really how little he knows. Doesn't he know that my dad (or whoever for that matter) could come over and be holding him and it only takes a split second for someone to cough in the baby's face?!! And does he really think my mom would come around her grandson with a cold?! oy.
Anyways, enough of my ranting. I have let it go but my conversation with him the other day stirred it all back up again. 
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