Very strange cycle - thoughts?

[SKJ2011]

I'm BFing and TTC.  Last month was our first month actively trying.  I had some very light spotting 7DPO, exactly the same as when we conceived DD.  I *felt* pregnant.  On 8DPO, the spotting turned into rather heavy bleeding.  Not unusually heavy, but required tampons.  9DPO, bleeding continued, was medium.  10DPO - 13DPO I've had light spotting.  Sometime its very light, only showing when I wipe.  Other times, it's made it to my underwear.  

Last month was my first cycle temping and paying more attention since my PPAF.  I figured my LP was short and that it was my period.  The strange this is that my temp is staying above the coverline.  I've taken 2 tests on 11DPO and 12DPO and they were both negative.  

I've also had EWCM.  Anyone have any thoughts about what's going on?  I figure BFing is making my cycle wacky.

I have the free version of FF, so here are the 2 cycles I'm talking about.

http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/296e3e/

Thanks for any insights  

[Jaimee]

Welcome to MDC!!    I took a look at your charts and have a few questions/comments.   How many pp cycles have you had?  If AF has just recently returned I am not at all surprised to see fluctuating temps, inconsistent CF, spotting, and a short LP.  It took over a year for my cycles to regulate after AF returned pp with my first.  So it really can take a long time for your cycles to normalize.  In addition, breastfeeding and nightwaking definitely can mess with your temps and CF making things a bit confusing.  The reason I bring this all up is b/c I would not be surprised if the spotting/bleeding you're getting is hormonal and not implantation or AF.  I'm not fully convinced that you ovulated, so the bleeding could be annovulatory bleeding.  But at the same time, you do appear to have a general group of lower and slightly higher temps that could indicate O, it's just hard to say.

FF gave you dashed crosshairs, which means it's not quite sure about your O day either.  I see some quite erratic temps and I also see that your temps are very low and do not get much higher after supposed O on CD 20.  While you do have fertile CF and your CP indicated impending O, your temps shift is not super obvious.  It is quite normal to gear up to O and not succeed, especially when you first start your cycles again pp.  Lower temps can also be sign of hypothyroid issues or low progesterone.   I'm not saying either of these things are an issue for you, but it is conceivable that as your cycle is regulating you're a little low on progesterone, causing the spotting and low temps.  Did you chart prior to getting pregnant?  What were your temps like then?  Have they always been low?  This could also just be your pattern.

HPT's on 11 and 12 DPO might not be accurate so I would go ahead and test again tomorrow when you would potentially be 14 DPO.  Be sure to get a test that only requires an hCG level of 25.  It's also not uncommon to have temps remain above last cycles CL during AF, but they should dip shortly after.  Of course, with your erratic and lower to begin with temps this may be hard to spot. 

Otherwise, I would expect you to gear up to O again within the next couple of weeks.  How have you been temping?  Do you focus on the same wake time each morning?  For me, I have found wake time to be the most important factor vs. making sure you've gotten a solid block of sleep prior to temping.  You might also find vaginal temping to be more consistent.  Anyway, you should have an answer with a week or so... BFP, signs of impending O, or a more obvious temp spike.  Good luck!

[SKJ2011]

Hi Jaimee.  Thank you so much for your detailed reply!  I totally appreciate it 

Here are the responses to your questions:

The June cycle was my 3rd postpartum cycle and the first one that I was charting.  My DD is only nursing 2-4 times a day.  I am very fortunate that she's been sleeping long stretches at night so I get enough consecutive hours of sleep.  I temp when she wakes me up - between 430 and 630.  Usually closer to 530-6.  I will try to get that more consistent if she'll let me 

I am using the free version of FF so I can only share 2 charts.  Before DD was born, I only started charting the month I got pregnant with her so I have added that chart to the June chart for comparison.  

Thanks again for your thoughts!

http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/296e3e

[Jaimee]

Ah, so the low temps are your typical pattern.  Thanks for including the old chart.  It's a beautiful chart, btw, very clear and includes the coveted triphasic pregnancy pattern!    At any rate, with this information as well as the fact that this is only your third pp cycle, I would say that you did ovulate this past cycle and just have a short LP.  FF would probably give you solid crosshairs if you discarded a few of those higher, disturbed, pre-O temps.  So, it is my guess that you're experiencing AF right now and your temps will drop back into the 96's shortly.  If you can hold off a few more days before testing to see this pattern emerge you may not need to bother with another HPT.  If your temps do not drop and you start to experience any additional pregnancy symptoms, then definitely test!

Otherwise, I bet that in the next couple of weeks you'll see your next patch of fertile CF and another O spike.  And in the coming months you'll see your LP lengthen and the spotting disappear as your hormones regulate. Some women find that their cycles don't return to normal with fertile length LP's and predictable CF until their LO's fully wean.  I'm not at all suggesting that you wean, just that it's something to keep in mind as you TTC.  Other women go from infertile LP to fertile LP in one cycle (that was me after my second!). 

To share additional charts from FF, you can save the image to your computer and insert it into your post.  The insert picture button is 2 to the left of the paperclip in the tool bar. 

Keep us posted!

[SKJ2011]

Cool.  Thanks for the insights!  I wonder about my LP in general.  Before I got pregnant with my daughter, I had a few cycles with 6 or so days of pre-AF spotting.  I didn't do anything to get pregnant and the cycle that I got pregnant,  I did have 6 days of spotting starting at 7DPO.  Not sure if any of this is related, just thought I add this info in case it means anything.

Thanks again.  I will be curious what my temp is tomorrow.  Is there anything I can do/take for the short LP?

[Jaimee]

It is odd that pre-pregnancy you had 6 days of pre-AF spotting.  It does suggest that you were dealing with low progesterone prior to pregnancy as well.  But it sounds like some cycles were that way and others were not, which means you did often have fertile length LP's and this is probably how you sustained the pregnancy.  Women have more fertile and less fertile cycles and there is a bit of luck involved with catching those more fertile cycles.  The spotting you noticed with the cycle you got pregnant may have had a different cause such as hormonal fluctuation associated with pregnancy.  Hard to say.  I had a 4 day LP the cycle prior to conceiving this third baby and somehow the next cycle my LP was long enough to sustain a pregnancy.  Our bodies can surprise us!

It's certainly possible that if spotting was an  issue pre-pregnancy that it would more likely be an issue now as well, but pregnancy has a way of kicking your cycles into gear once things have regulated.  Most likely the only causes of your short LP now are breastfeeding and pp regulating.  But you can up your intake of B-rich foods and supplement with vitamin B6.  Healthy fats can also help, especially if you're on the underweight side of things, b/c progesterone is stored in fat.  If you're on the other end and a bit overweight, then starting a moderate exercise routine could be helpful.

[SKJ2011]

Thanks again for your thoughts.  I'm really appreciative!  

My temp was still high-ish today - 97.18. Got BFN this morning with FRER and don't feel pregnant.  

I just started taking a B50 complex.  Also, I've read that vitex can be helpful.  Would that be work taking?  

I'm doing my best to just let things happen, but I am a planner and it's hard for me.  Ah parenting - always something to work on 

http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/296e3e

[Jaimee]

All your "high" temps are disturbed temps, though.  The ones that are not disturbed are lower, more like your pre-O temps from your past cycles.  So it's my gut feeling that you're not pregnant, especially with a BFN at 14DPO, the bleeding, and now the temp pattern.  I would expect some dry days coming your way followed by creamy and then eggwhite after that.

Vitex can help, but it is controversial whether it is safe to take while breastfeeding.  That's something you'd have to research and come to a conclusion you're comfortable with.  Vitex is also typically a slow acting herb- often taking 6 months to make observable changes.  By then your body would probably have regulated itself.  Personally I would wait and see what your body is going to do now that you've had a pregnancy.  I know it's hard when you want to TTC now and plan ahead, but I'm also a believer that our bodies often space our children based on what is best for our health- physically and emotionally.  I think it took me a long time to regulate after my dd b/c she is so high need and spirited.  Ds is much more mellow and I regulated right away.  At any rate, next cycle could be the one for you- you never know!

[SKJ2011]

Sounds good.  I agree - we get what we can handle.  I know I need to be patient, and I guess I'm fortunate that I get this experience to practice 

Thanks again for all your help!

[SKJ2011]

Thought I'd add an update. I'm starting to think that I never O'd last cycle.  

My current temps are a little high for me, but the only thing I have to go off of is the cycle I got pregnant, so not a lot of data.  I decided to set my alarm for 430am b/c at that time, I've almost always had a solid block of sleep.  Today, it was 97.05 at 430.  A little on the highish side.  Will be interested to see if I do ovulate this month. 

[SKJ2011]

Temp was 97.33 @ 430 this morning.  I'm thoroughly confused.  These temps are high for me pre-O.  Hmmm.

http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/SKJ2011

[Jaimee]

Well maybe this is your new pre-O pattern.  Your progesterone could be kicking into gear and now you'll be in the low-mid  97's pre-O and 98's in your LP.  I see that you're getting some creamy CF already, so maybe you'll have a couple more days of that and then some EW and onto an O spike.  It's exciting to see how this cycle may be visibly more fertile than your last one.  FX!

[SKJ2011]

Thanks for the encouragement!  I do have a CM question too that maybe you can answer.  I can't remember how it was last time I charted before DD was born, but I feel like my CM isn't following the usual pattern of dry->sticky->creamy-> EW.  It seems to always have some stretch to it and sometimes I'm not sure how to classify it.  It's not stretchy enough to be EWCM, but it isn't really creamy either.  Does that make sense?  I'm not sure what to put on the chart.

[Jaimee]

Sometimes I feel like my sticky has a bit of stretch to it, but if I put it between my fingers and pull them apart it will break quickly.  How far can you stretch this CF you are talking about?  Is it white, yellow or clear?  Otherwise, creamy would be moister, more like lotion and likely yellowish or white.  EW will be clear, though it could be yellow tinted (usually indicating it's less fertile).  Remember to mark your most fertile CF of the day.  So if you get some sticky and some creamy, mark creamy.