Dealing with the "ferel" neighbor kid - help!

[Klynne]

How can I convey to the neighbors, with out burning bridges, that their child is a MENACE!!!!!!

Their DD is a year older than our DD (5). I was delighted when we moved here, that DD would have a playmate right next door but after getting to know this child I don't want my DD playing with her.

To compound the problem, during the summer this neighbor child is EVERYWHERE - she's bored and no one cares where she is or what she's doing. We can get no relief from her. If my kids are in our backyard playing she's on the fence trying to join in verbally. If they are in the front playing, she's there dictating play. She is constantly yelling dd's name, trying to get DD to come over to the fence to talk. She encourages dd to do mean things to or say mean things to DS (2) or do things DD is not allowed to do (dd is often swayed by her and does xyz). She manipulates DD by telling her "I won't be your friend if you... or because you....". Not to mention the junk food she passes DD through the fence (via a knot hole).

I've tried asking her nicely to get off the fence. Her reply is always "why" - - always. 

I'm at my whits end. To the point that I don't want my kids out in our beautiful yard because of this menacing girl. This has been going on since July and I've had enough.

I made up my mind to talk to our neighbors (who we like and are friendly with on the occasion we see them) but I don't know how to put this, err, gently to them. I don't want things to end up awkward.

Once school starts this won't be an issue but these are my last weeks with dd before she starts school and I resent this girl for crashing our cozy end-of-summer time and schooling dd in bad manners and junk food. (I get that she'll get some of that at school but this girl is basically LIVING, uninvited, in our yard during the day.)

I feel like a mamma bear! lol

[philomom]

Yep, the feral unwatched child is an issue. You will have to spend some time away from your own home or march over and have a dreaded parent chat with the child's parental unit. The meanness and the junk food must stop! And being perched on a fence is a safety issue.. I'd tell her to get down every time I saw her there.


If you want to hardball this, you could report her to CPS as a child who seems to be alone all day. Really, at her age, she should have some supervision.

[Imakcerka]

We had two of these. 

On girl actually would open our living room window if nobody would answer the door and ask us why we aren't opening our door.   Which meant she was in my back yard without being invited.  I had one window without a screen that was floor to ceiling that I allowed to the dogs to go through during the day.  Then one day she opened my garage door and took out my kids bike and rode off on it.  And that was the day I had had enough.  Her parents weren't going to do squat about her, so when she came back with the bike I told her I had called the police and reported the bike stolen.  She told me to call them back and tell them it was just her...

I told her NO!  You took something and didn't ask, you broke into my garage and didn't ask.  You've repeatedly come into my back yard and have not asked.  I will allow it no longer.  Get off my yard and do not come back until you learn how to behave at other peoples homes and learn some respect.  And yes as soon as her mother came over I let her have it too.  I will not be hostage in my home because she cannot teach her child something simple as RESPECT!  (this makes me angry just thinking about)

By the time the other girl came along I was well prepared.

So you can put the sprinkler up by the fence and blare fun music.  Your kids can hear her and hopefully the sprinkler will make it hard to stay near the fence line.  I would even consider putting up some wood over the knot holes.  I've done it. 

Good luck and take over your yard and your summer!

[midnightwriter]

 We have a similar situation, only there are 4 kids, and no fence, AND (which complicates things) my kids periodically do want to play with them, and for shor periods of time they play well. But things deteriorate when the neighbours become too controlling and disrespectful.

As you have only one child to deal with, I'd be just firm with her, over and over again. 

[Buddhamom]

Sounds like the neighbor should get invisible dog fencing and put the collar on the kid  No, but seriously you need to have a chat with the family. Is she doing it to other neighbors?  Perhaps you could get a few together and you all confront parents.

[lilyka]

You have to be firm.  A well placed sprinkler is not a bad idea.  Also, cover up that hole.  Your best defense is teaching your kids as well.  My kids have a bedtime.  The neighbor girl does not.  Even during school.  Neighbor girls solution...yell up to their window.  My kids are forbidden to do this and they are responsible if they break the rules.  i am also not above giving the neighborhood kids the what for.  I say things like "go away it is family time." and "the girls cannot play right now.  you need to go home."  and "if you take our toys again I will call the police"  on a regular basis.  I stopped feeling bad a long time ago and it is generally easier to teach the kids than the parents anyway.

[Imakcerka]

See I'm not mean! 

 

Originally Posted by lilyka 

You have to be firm.  A well placed sprinkler is not a bad idea.  Also, cover up that hole.  Your best defense is teaching your kids as well.  My kids have a bedtime.  The neighbor girl does not.  Even during school.  Neighbor girls solution...yell up to their window.  My kids are forbidden to do this and they are responsible if they break the rules.  i am also not above giving the neighborhood kids the what for.  I say things like "go away it is family time." and "the girls cannot play right now.  you need to go home."  and "if you take our toys again I will call the police"  on a regular basis.  I stopped feeling bad a long time ago and it is generally easier to teach the kids than the parents anyway.

[nextcommercial]

Originally Posted by lilyka 

You have to be firm.  A well placed sprinkler is not a bad idea.

Bahaha!!!

[mamazee]

Originally Posted by philomom 



If you want to hardball this, you could report her to CPS as a child who seems to be alone all day. Really, at her age, she should have some supervision.

Report her to CPS because she's playing outside her house next door? Really? You think 6-year-olds can't handle being outside without a parent? That's fine for your kids, but IMO 6 is plenty old enough to not need parents continually watching them, and this is absolutely not a CPS issue.

OP, just set some boundaries. Kids this age are very literal, so say exactly what you mean. "We aren't playing with anyone today. You need to go home now." If you try to say it too politely and therefore don't say specifically and explicitly what you want, she won't understand. I have a friend who was having trouble with a next-door child who told the child she wasn't welcome to play in their yard. It's harsh, but the girls was hitting her kids, and would keep coming over to play. But telling her she wasn't welcome to play in their yard ended it.

[midnightwriter]

Originally Posted by mamazee 



Report her to CPS because she's playing outside her house next door? Really? You think 6-year-olds can't handle being outside without a parent? That's fine for your kids, but IMO 6 is plenty old enough to not need parents continually watching them, and this is absolutely not a CPS issue.

I agree that this is not a CPS worthy situation. My 6 yo plays in our yard, often with his 3 yo sister, without constant supervision. However most 6 year olds are not well equipped to deal with situations described by the OP. If a 6 yo constantly pesters her neighbours, causing the neighbours' parents to speak to the child sternly and set boundaries with her, it is not an ideal situation to let that child to be unsupervised. I don't watch my kids 100% of the time, but whenever there are neighbours around I'm constantly on the look out, ready to be there if needed. Obviously the OP's situation is different.

OP, just set some boundaries. Kids this age are very literal, so say exactly what you mean. "We aren't playing with anyone today. You need to go home now." If you try to say it too politely and therefore don't say specifically and explicitly what you want, she won't understand. I have a friend who was having trouble with a next-door child who told the child she wasn't welcome to play in their yard. It's harsh, but the girls was hitting her kids, and would keep coming over to play. But telling her she wasn't welcome to play in their yard ended it.

This is a great point.
 

[LynnS6]

Some of her behavior is very typical of a 6 year old. That doesn't mean that you should tolerate it, but do know that the bossiness and dictating play is very typical. It doesn't mean that she's evil, just that no one has taught her this behavior isn't acceptable.  As the pp said, you have to be very direct with her. You can be direct and firm, but still polite to her. Some people have a signal that they put out (a flag, an open garage door) that means the kids can come over. I might suggest that.

"If you want to play with us, you need to be polite. If I hear you bossing people around or not listening to other kids' ideas, I'll send you home for an hour. If it happens again, you'll have to go home for the rest of the day."

"If my kids do something they're not supposed to do while you're here, you'll have to go home for an hour, because they need to take a break from playing with friends when they break the rules. If it happens again, we'll need a time out for for the rest of the morning/afternoon."

"Don't pass food to my kids over the fence." "Why?" "Because I don't want them messing up their appetites for the meals we have."

"Get off the fence." "Why?" "Because we want some family time without you and you're interrupting it. We can play again tomorrow/after dinner."

"Get off the fence." "Why?" "Because I'm tired of you telling my kids what to do." (Yes, it's OK to be this direct. She's being rude and she needs to know this.)

"That sounded bossy. How can you say it more politely?" (We've been working on this with our dd (age 7) for about a year now!).

"At our house, the rule is that everyone gets to play. YOU can choose to play by yourself, but if you tell someone they can't play, you'll need to go home."

And probably most importantly,

"It's time for you to go home now." "Why?" "Because we need some family time. Go find something else to do."

Personally, I would take 2-3 days where you're out there with them and enforce the rules. If she's not had any rules enforced at home, and you've not been consistent with the rules with her, she's going to need a lot of practice. If you do this now, you'll have a pleasant last 2-3 weeks of summer, and more over, when winter comes and she wants to be inside or next summer rolls around, you'll have a basis for discipline. You have every right to discipline a child who's in your house/yard without their parents. If she's not following your rules, you have a duty to send her home. View this as your contribution toward socializing this child.

Edited to clarify

Edited by LynnS6 - 8/12/11 at 2:35pm

[Storm Bride]

Originally Posted by LynnS6 

Some of her behavior is very typical of a 6 year old. That doesn't mean that you should tolerate it, but do know that the bossiness and dictating play is very typical. It doesn't mean that she's evil, just that no one has taught her this behavior.  As the pp said, you have to be very direct with her. You can be direct and firm, but still polite to her. Some people have a signal that they put out (a flag, an open garage door) that means the kids can come over. I might suggest that.

"If you want to play with us, you need to be polite. If I hear you bossing people around or not listening to other kids' ideas, I'll send you home for an hour. If it happens again, you'll have to go home for the rest of the day."

"If my kids do something they're not supposed to do while you're here, you'll have to go home for an hour, because they need to take a break from playing with friends when they break the rules. If it happens again, we'll need a time out for for the rest of the morning/afternoon."

"Don't pass food to my kids over the fence." "Why?" "Because I don't want them messing up their appetites for the meals we have."

"Get off the fence." "Why?" "Because we want some family time without you and you're interrupting it. We can play again tomorrow/after dinner."

"Get off the fence." "Why?" "Because I'm tired of you telling my kids what to do." (Yes, it's OK to be this direct. She's being rude and she needs to know this.)

"That sounded bossy. How can you say it more politely?" (We've been working on this with our dd (age 7) for about a year now!).

"At our house, the rule is that everyone gets to play. YOU can choose to play by yourself, but if you tell someone they can't play, you'll need to go home."

The two points I bolded are contradictory. If your dd is too bossy, does that mean that nobody has taught her? You say you've been working on it for a year. DD1 has had issues with this forever, and they're finally improving - but she turned 8 in May. We've been working on it all along. She's not evil. She has been taught. It's just her temperament, so it takes a while for certain things to sink in for her.

I don't think it's acceptable to give neighbourhood kids "what for", as a previous poster phrased it. But, I definitely think that "you have to leave now - it's family time", "get off the fence", "stop telling my kids what to do", "don't give my kids treats", etc. are all perfectly valid. You have a right to set your own family's boundaries, and to expect certain behaviour within your own home/yard!

re: the junk food. This is actuallly one of the few areas where my neighbours and I are on the same page. None of our kids is allowed to accept any food from the other kids without checking in at home first. Consequences for doing so vary widely, but we all agree on it. This even applies to healthy food. Basically, I don't expect the kids to always be able to make the "healthy or not" call (and ds2 will happily eat 20 pieces of fruit in a day, if we let him), plus I want to know what they've eaten. I almost always say "yes", but I want to know what they're getting. There's no reason you can't have a similar rule in place, and also explain it to the neighbour girl.

[LynnS6]

Got interrupted in the middle of the sentence -- I meant "No one has taught her that this isn't acceptable" .

I do think that if a child is breaking rules in your house, you can (and should) send them home. We've had to do that with neighbors, and they've become much better playmates since then.

[Klynne]

Thank you for the support! I'm the type that says things in a round about way and HOPES people get what I mean...  after reading the posts this morning I was firm with her this morning when the calling/fence scaling started. I don't know if her family went out today but I haven't heard a peep from her this afternoon!

Originally Posted by midnightwriter 

 We have a similar situation, only there are 4 kids, and no fence, AND (which complicates things) my kids periodically do want to play with them, and for shor periods of time they play well. But things deteriorate when the neighbors become too controlling and disrespectful.

As you have only one child to deal with, I'd be just firm with her, over and over again. 

!!! no fence!! wow. I'm so thankful for our fence!!

My dd likes to play with her too. But I don't like the type of influence this girl has on DD and I won't let dd be introduced to "that" type of communication and behavior.

Originally Posted by lilyka 

You have to be firm.  A well placed sprinkler is not a bad idea.  Also, cover up that hole.  Your best defense is teaching your kids as well.  My kids have a bedtime.  The neighbor girl does not.  Even during school.  Neighbor girls solution...yell up to their window.  My kids are forbidden to do this and they are responsible if they break the rules.  i am also not above giving the neighborhood kids the what for.  I say things like "go away it is family time." and "the girls cannot play right now.  you need to go home."  and "if you take our toys again I will call the police"  on a regular basis.  I stopped feeling bad a long time ago and it is generally easier to teach the kids than the parents anyway.

Do you live on the OTHER side of this family?? lol yeah, no bed time over there. Yelling my DD's name AFTER dd has gone to bed (I was VERY firm on this one and I think the older siblings heard and reprimanded her too so we're past that issue thankfully). My kids also know the rules, are not allowed to talk from the windows.

I'm covering up the whole. I posted the op at 1:30 am and considered covering it at that time but it seemed a little crazy to patch the fence at 2am.

Originally Posted by mamazee 



Report her to CPS because she's playing outside her house next door? Really? You think 6-year-olds can't handle being outside without a parent? That's fine for your kids, but IMO 6 is plenty old enough to not need parents continually watching them, and this is absolutely not a CPS issue.

OP, just set some boundaries. Kids this age are very literal, so say exactly what you mean. "We aren't playing with anyone today. You need to go home now." If you try to say it too politely and therefore don't say specifically and explicitly what you want, she won't understand. I have a friend who was having trouble with a next-door child who told the child she wasn't welcome to play in their yard. It's harsh, but the girls was hitting her kids, and would keep coming over to play. But telling her she wasn't welcome to play in their yard ended it.

Reporting to the CPS is not necessary. They have enough to deal with- this is not a problem for them.

The family is a good family, they just let the siblings take care of the youngest and unfortunately she needs more attention and love than the siblings know how to give. Her mom just started working out of home last year so there are transition issues for this girl too. Plus her English is bad and she doesn't receive instruction on socially acceptable ways of communicating with other kids. Am I making excuses for this girl?? No, I just see what might be driving her and that a gentle yet firm approach is what IS needed.

You're right. I just need to set clear boundaries and be firm with her. I won't bring this up with the parents until I've exhausted this approach.

Gosh, actually getting time to sit down and think this through felt good. With a colic-y newborn in the house thinking has practically gone out the window. :}

Edited by Klynne - 8/12/11 at 3:27pm

[Klynne]

Originally Posted by LynnS6 

"If you want to play with us, you need to be polite. If I hear you bossing people around or not listening to other kids' ideas, I'll send you home for an hour. If it happens again, you'll have to go home for the rest of the day."

"If my kids do something they're not supposed to do while you're here, you'll have to go home for an hour, because they need to take a break from playing with friends when they break the rules. If it happens again, we'll need a time out for for the rest of the morning/afternoon."

"Don't pass food to my kids over the fence." "Why?" "Because I don't want them messing up their appetites for the meals we have."

"Get off the fence." "Why?" "Because we want some family time without you and you're interrupting it. We can play again tomorrow/after dinner."

"Get off the fence." "Why?" "Because I'm tired of you telling my kids what to do." (Yes, it's OK to be this direct. She's being rude and she needs to know this.)

"That sounded bossy. How can you say it more politely?" (We've been working on this with our dd (age 7) for about a year now!).

"At our house, the rule is that everyone gets to play. YOU can choose to play by yourself, but if you tell someone they can't play, you'll need to go home."

And probably most importantly,

"It's time for you to go home now." "Why?" "Because we need some family time. Go find something else to do."

Personally, I would take 2-3 days where you're out there with them and enforce the rules. If she's not had any rules enforced at home, and you've not been consistent with the rules with her, she's going to need a lot of practice. If you do this now, you'll have a pleasant last 2-3 weeks of summer, and more over, when winter comes and she wants to be inside or next summer rolls around, you'll have a basis for discipline. You have every right to discipline a child who's in your house/yard without their parents. If she's not following your rules, you have a duty to send her home. View this as your contribution toward socializing this child.

Edited to clarify

Great post. Thanks.

[berry987]

Originally Posted by LynnS6 

Some of her behavior is very typical of a 6 year old. That doesn't mean that you should tolerate it, but do know that the bossiness and dictating play is very typical. It doesn't mean that she's evil, just that no one has taught her this behavior isn't acceptable.  As the pp said, you have to be very direct with her. You can be direct and firm, but still polite to her. Some people have a signal that they put out (a flag, an open garage door) that means the kids can come over. I might suggest that.

"If you want to play with us, you need to be polite. If I hear you bossing people around or not listening to other kids' ideas, I'll send you home for an hour. If it happens again, you'll have to go home for the rest of the day."

"If my kids do something they're not supposed to do while you're here, you'll have to go home for an hour, because they need to take a break from playing with friends when they break the rules. If it happens again, we'll need a time out for for the rest of the morning/afternoon."

"Don't pass food to my kids over the fence." "Why?" "Because I don't want them messing up their appetites for the meals we have."

"Get off the fence." "Why?" "Because we want some family time without you and you're interrupting it. We can play again tomorrow/after dinner."

"Get off the fence." "Why?" "Because I'm tired of you telling my kids what to do." (Yes, it's OK to be this direct. She's being rude and she needs to know this.)

"That sounded bossy. How can you say it more politely?" (We've been working on this with our dd (age 7) for about a year now!).

"At our house, the rule is that everyone gets to play. YOU can choose to play by yourself, but if you tell someone they can't play, you'll need to go home."

And probably most importantly,

"It's time for you to go home now." "Why?" "Because we need some family time. Go find something else to do."

Personally, I would take 2-3 days where you're out there with them and enforce the rules. If she's not had any rules enforced at home, and you've not been consistent with the rules with her, she's going to need a lot of practice. If you do this now, you'll have a pleasant last 2-3 weeks of summer, and more over, when winter comes and she wants to be inside or next summer rolls around, you'll have a basis for discipline. You have every right to discipline a child who's in your house/yard without their parents. If she's not following your rules, you have a duty to send her home. View this as your contribution toward socializing this child.

Edited to clarify

Totally agree. My kids run around the street unsupervised (they are 6 and 4) in the afternoon and there are some 6-8 year old girls on the block (mine are boys) who tend to be a bit bossy and do that exclusive/inclusive stuff. I thought it was just a pretty normal 6-8 year old girl thing. I intervene when necessary, but I also consider it a good learning experience for my kids. We talk about not having to play with kids who are bossy or rude, deciding for yourself what to do and not letting others tell you, etc. It seems like that behavior gets more and more common the older the kids get and teaching your DD to deal with it might be the best approach.

I can't believe someone suggested you call CPS. Now THAT would be an overreaction. 

[*bejeweled*]

This is laugh worthy. You're joking right?


[quote name="philomom" If you want to hardball this, you could report her to CPS as a child who seems to be alone all day. Really, at her age, she should have some supervision.[/quote]

[*bejeweled*]

"It's time for you to go home now." "Why?" "Because we need some family time. Go find something else to do."

Love this.

[Klynne]

Originally Posted by berry987 

Totally agree. My kids run around the street unsupervised (they are 6 and 4) in the afternoon and there are some 6-8 year old girls on the block (mine are boys) who tend to be a bit bossy and do that exclusive/inclusive stuff. I thought it was just a pretty normal 6-8 year old girl thing. I intervene when necessary, but I also consider it a good learning experience for my kids. We talk about not having to play with kids who are bossy or rude, deciding for yourself what to do and not letting others tell you, etc. It seems like that behavior gets more and more common the older the kids get and teaching your DD to deal with it might be the best approach.

I can't believe someone suggested you call CPS. Now THAT would be an overreaction. 

Yes. Dh and I are using this to teach DD these exact things. Dd is very social and like to play with everyone. I just hate the constant presence of this girl in our back yard.

[philomom]

Originally Posted by *bejeweled* 

This is laugh worthy. You're joking right?


[quote name="philomom" If you want to hardball this, you could report her to CPS as a child who seems to be alone all day. Really, at her age, she should have some supervision.

No, I wasn't. A young child who is always unsupervised is a problem. Who knows what she could get into? Who knows why her parents turn her out of the house each day? Are they home? Are they inside doing drugs?