Pediatrician Woes

[Just Ducky]

I'm new here so I'm afraid you ladies will probably have to be a bit patient with me, but I'd love some advice because I've been driving myself crazy. 

Now, this may seem like a complete non sequitur, but please bear with me and let me back up to a few years ago. We have animals and I am fairly well versed in veterinary protocols regarding the vaccination of mammalian critters. My vet always always always gave me the pre-vaccine run-down (and still does). "Look for this and this. If this, take him in immediately. If that, watch him closely." He knows I know the drill. He's known me for years. But he still walks me through it. That's part of standard vaccination protocol in veterinary practices. While it is extremely unusual for a cat to react to a vaccine, one of mine did. It was a terrifying experience. He was vomiting blood and having difficulty breathing. We took him to the ER vet (it was after hours) and he's fine. His reaction, frightening as it was for us, was not that severe. Now we take steps to prevent it from happening in the future.

My son (one year old now) is vaccinated. We are not picking and choosing which vaccines he receives but we are only doing a few shots at a time (more for his comfort than for fear of the effects on my part).

After his first round of vaccines, we were told absolutely nothing. I was concerned not about autism but about vaccine reactions so I asked. The nurse was quite surprised but after a bit of coaxing she showed me print outs from the CDC regarding potential reactions to the vaccinations my son had just received. That was the last time I saw that pediatrician (there were a variety of reasons for the decision but I'd be lying if I said that lack of information didn't play into my decision at least a bit). We found a new one and I asked him right off about potential vaccine reactions. He told me the ingredients they use in human vaccines were so clean that reactions just don't happen and assured me that I had nothing to worry about. He seemed well informed so I took him at his word and dismissed my concerns.

A few months later by a bit of dumb luck I stumbled across a PBS documentary regarding the "vaccine wars." I watched it and was surprised to learn that vaccine reactions are statistically significant. Severe reactions, of course, are much more rare than mild reactions but they do occur. I didn't understand why my two doctors had not given me this information from the start. After all, over the counter medications are required to list potential side effects. And pharmacists are required to disclose the same with regards to prescription medication. But since the problem seemed to be systemic, I hadn't made up my mind regarding what I wanted to do about it. And today my son had his one year well baby exam. He only had two shots (we were planning to do the other two over the next two weeks) but he had a mild reaction to one of them (redness and swelling at the injection site). Miffed, I called my doctor's office. They put me off and I didn't hear back from them until an hour and a half later. By that point I was already on the phone with a woman from an organization called the Immunization Action Coalition discussing my concerns (specifically, the lack of a law requiring my doctors to disclose potential reactions to the medicine they inject into my child's body.) You can imagine my surprise when she told me that the doctors are, in fact, required to provide that information. They have to give the guardians of their patients a print out. It is mandated by federal law.

Meanwhile, the nurse finally got back to me. My mom (she's retired and I'm a stay at home mom so we spend a lot of time together with my son) answered my phone and talked to the nurse since I was on the other line. The nurse claimed his reaction wasn't severe enough to be a real reaction and even said that it was probably caused by the band-aid! She made it clear that they would do no preventative management in the future.

I'm not sure what to do. I'm two for two on pediatricians ignoring federal law and failing to provide me with information that I should absolutely have access to. Yes, I can get that information myself, but I'm looking for a new doctor. Again. Am I overreacting? Is it common for doctors to break this particular law (for what reason I cannot begin to imagine - reams of paper are cheap and hitting the "print" button on a computer is so simple!)

And I keep coming back to the same thought: Why does my vet have more concern for the safety of my dog than my pediatrician has for the safety of my child? It just doesn't seem right.

Edited by Just Ducky - 8/15/11 at 7:33pm

[Marnica]

Originally Posted by Just Ducky 

I'm new here so I'm afraid you ladies will probably have to be a bit patient with me, but I'd love some advice because I've been driving myself crazy. 

Now, this may seem like a complete non sequitur, but please bear with me and let me back up to a few years ago. We have animals and I am fairly well versed in veterinary protocols regarding the vaccination of mammalian critters. My vet always always always gave me the pre-vaccine run-down (and still does). "Look for this and this. If this, take him in immediately. If that, watch him closely." He knows I know the drill. He's known me for years. But he still walks me through it. That's part of standard vaccination protocol in veterinary practices. While it is extremely unusual for a cat to react to a vaccine, one of mine did. It was a terrifying experience. He was vomiting blood and having difficulty breathing. We took him to the ER vet (it was after hours) and he's fine. His reaction, frightening as it was for us, was not that severe. Now we take steps to prevent it from happening in the future.

My son (one year old now) is vaccinated. We are not picking and choosing which vaccines he receives but we are only doing a few shots at a time (more for his comfort than for fear of the effects on my part).

After his first round of vaccines, we were told absolutely nothing. I was concerned not about autism but about vaccine reactions so I asked. The nurse was quite surprised but after a bit of coaxing she showed me print outs from the CDC regarding potential reactions to the vaccinations my son had just received. That was the last time I saw that pediatrician (there were a variety of reasons for the decision but I'd be lying if I said that lack of information didn't play into my decision at least a bit). We found a new one and I asked him right off about potential vaccine reactions. He told me the ingredients they use in human vaccines were so clean that reactions just don't happen and assured me that I had nothing to worry about. He seemed well informed so I took him at his word and dismissed my concerns.

A few months later by a bit of dumb luck I stumbled across a PBS documentary regarding the "vaccine wars." I watched it and was surprised to learn that vaccine reactions are statistically significant. Severe reactions, of course, are much more rare than mild reactions but they do occur. I didn't understand why my two doctors had not given me this information from the start. After all, over the counter medications are required to list potential side effects. And pharmacists are required to disclose the same with regards to prescription medication. But since the problem seemed to be systemic, I hadn't made up my mind regarding what I wanted to do about it. And today my son had his one year well baby exam. He only had two shots (we were planning to do the other two over the next two weeks) but he had a mild reaction to one of them (redness and swelling at the injection site). Miffed, I called my doctor's office. They put me off and I didn't hear back from them until an hour and a half later. By that point I was already on the phone with a woman from an organization called the Immunization Action Coalition discussing my concerns (specifically, the lack of a law requiring my doctors to disclose potential reactions to the medicine they inject into my child's body.) You can imagine my surprise when she told me that the doctors are, in fact, required to provide that information. They have to give the guardians of their patients a print out. It is mandated by federal law.

Meanwhile, the nurse finally got back to me. My mom (she's retired and I'm a stay at home mom so we spend a lot of time together with my son) answered my phone and talked to the nurse since I was on the other line. The nurse claimed his reaction wasn't severe enough to be a real reaction and even said that it was probably caused by the band-aid! She made it clear that they would do no preventative management in the future.

I'm not sure what to do. I'm two for two on pediatricians ignoring federal law and failing to provide me with information that I should absolutely have access to. Yes, I can get that information myself, but I'm looking for a new doctor. Again. Am I overreacting? Is it common for doctors to break this particular law (for what reason I cannot begin to imagine - reams of paper are cheap and hitting the "print" button on a computer is so simple!)

And I keep coming back to the same thought: Why does my vet have more concern for the safety of my dog than my pediatrician has for the safety of my child? It just doesn't seem right.

 Welcome and Im sorry you are having trouble finding a doctor that you feel comfortable with. As a non-vaxing parent, I've had my share of troubles finding one too!. Unfortunately what you describe is all too common. Although the info sheets are supposed to be handed out to parents to read prior to vaccines being administered, often they are not. While I do not vax, most of my friends do and Ive asked them all if they were given this info. About 50% were. I agree, as it is law that preants have this info, it is terrible that some doctors are not providing it or making it that much harder for parents to get their hands on.

I do not think you are over reacting, but honestly, Im not sure switching peds for you would solve the issue because the next doctor you go to may do the same thing. the imortant thing is now you KNOW to ask for these sheets of info if they are not automatically offered. You may want to ask the doctor why he is not abiding by federal law and see what he says.

I would be wary however of any doctor that denies that adverse reactions to vaccines happen. That is simply not true. Many doctors believe them to be extremely rare (I don't happen to agree with this notion). As to your last thought, Vaccines reactions are widely recognized and accepted in veterinary medicine. I think that the reasons they are not in humans and children is largely political and financial, but I seriously don't want to start any kind of debate about that!! Just sharing my 2 cents! I hope you can find a resolution to your concerns.

[teraze]

Hello!  Welcome.  :)

We're a delayed/selective vax family and the nurse always without fail gives us the CDC printout every time.  Even when we're getting subsequent doses.  

Personally, I think it's odd a doctor's office fails to give out this information.  I'd be perturbed.  

I was really lucky to find a pediatrician who is absolutely comfortable with no vax or selective/delayed vax before my babe was born.  I'd probably look around for another pediatrician if what happened to you, happened to me.  But I wouldn't quit the doc before finding another.  

[kathymuggle]

Hello,

I hear you.  When my son was born we did partly vaccinate him.  It was the doctors and nurses inability to answer questions or take me seriously that led me on the path of researching vaccines and diseases further.

I would be perturbed that they did not take your call about a possible reaction seriously - and that they did not ask to speak to you (the parent).

[ma2two]

Not only would I be looking for a new doctor, but I'd be researching if there was any penalty (even if only a warning letter) for doctors who fail to provide the Vaccine Information Sheets before vaccination. Then I would report the doctor to the appropriate agency, if there is one.

The doctor is either lying about the vaccine ingredients and the possibility of reactions, or he is extremely ignorant. Either way, I wouldn't want him as my doctor. I also wouldn't want a doctor who regularly broke federal law.

Vaccine ingredients as well as side effects are listed in the package inserts, which come with every vaccine batch delivered to the doctor.

http://www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/Vaccines/ApprovedProducts/ucm093833.htm

You might want to print this out and give it to the doctor.

http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/vis/downloads/vis-instructions.pdf

[Just Ducky]

Marnica - Thanks very much! I suspect you and I might very well see eye to eye regarding the way health care in the United States works (or rather, all too often, doesn't). It's just so frustrating that there isn't anywhere near enough information available. Right now it's a judgement call and it shouldn't be. This is science, not philosophy.

Teraze - Thanks you. =) And thank you for letting me know that there are doctors who follow the law. It's reassuring and gives me hope that I'll manage to find one if I keep looking.

kathymuggle - Of course you're right and she should have spoken to me, but given the things she had to say it might very well be a good thing that she didn't. If she had been on the line with me when she trotted out the nonsense she tried to sell there would have been some very not nice things said and I would have needed to find a new doctor immediately rather than having a bit of time to do so. 

ma2two - That was actually my first reaction when I found out both of the doctors I've seen have broken the law. But I can't tell you how reassuring it is to hear that I'm not the only one who thinks that is the right course of action. I was worried that I might be overreacting. I do that sometimes.  Also, thank you so much for the links! They'll be very helpful. We just joined Gymboree so I'll ask the other moms there about their pediatricians today. Hopefully someone can recommend a good doctor.