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Update pg 10. Yay!-The ever-present CPS fears have materialized for us - Page 7

post #121 of 192
Thread Starter 

We had to postpone our atty visit. We met with her late yesterday. Fortunately she is intimately acquainted with our local CPS agency. Unfortunately, since she knows how they work, she suggested we go along with whatever they want. If we play their game they'll let us sail through. If we fight, they'll drag us through the mud and we obviously can't afford it. :( She said there is always a public defender, but that a public defender will not get a good outcome. We'll be in worst straits than if we just went along now.

 

She agreed that it seemed to be a simple accident, and that the original worker assessed it correctly and should have closed it. She was extremely irritated that the supervisor kept the case open. She said it's typical in our county and it frustrates her to no end; that the worker is there and uses her good judgement and then the supervisor undermines the worker when they don't know anything about it and weren't there. She also said the original worker is wishy-washy and wouldn't have stood up for her original assessment, and that's why the supervisor won out and the case is still open. Sigh.

 

We've been referred to an "ongoing worker" now and she seems to want to set up scheduled times for visits, so that's good. I haven't actually spoken to her yet, just phone tag. Fingers crossed she just drops the referred "program" and we get out in 7 weeks, as scheduled.


Edited by gabbyraja - 10/21/11 at 8:03pm
post #122 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by gabbyraja View Post

We had to postpone our atty visit. We met with her late yesterday. Fortunately she is intimately acquainted with our local CPS agency. Unfortunately, since she knows how they work, she suggested we go along with whatever they want. If we play their game they'll let us sail through. If we fight, they'll drag us through the mud and we obviously can't afford it. :( She said there is always a public defender, but that a public defender will not get a good outcome. We'll be in worst straits than if we just went along now.

 

She agreed that it seemed to be a simple accident, and that the original worker assessed it correctly and should have closed it. She was extremely irritated that the supervisor kept the case open. She said it's typical in our county and it frustrates her to no end; that the worker is there and uses her good judgement and then the supervisor undermines the worker when they don't know anything about it and weren't there. She also said the original worker is wishy-washy and wouldn't have stood up for her original assessment, and that's why the supervisor won out and the case is still open. Sigh.

 

We've been referred to an "ongoing worker" now and she seems to want to set up scheduled times for visits, so that's good. I haven't actually spoken to her yet, just phone tag. Fingers crossed she just drops the referred "program" and we get out in 7 weeks, as scheduled.


This update fills me with anger. You just have to go along with it and HOPE that these people turn you loose in SEVEN WEEKS??? That is INSANE.

 

So do you see this, CPS lovers?? Look at the power this organization has over the lives of perfectly law abiding parents!! THIS IS RIDICULOUS!!!! Look on as these poor people have to deal with the presence of CPS in their life, take time out of their freaking days and family life to take a goddamn "parenting program".  ONGOING WORKER???? This is SUCH bullcrap. I'm irate at this update.

 

OP, these people are hindering you in your ability to live peacefully and it sucks. This is just ridiculous. I just can't even say everything I want to say, because it would be inappropriate and offensive. I'm so sorry you are dealing with this. This is absolutely ridiculous.

 

Again, I'm just not able to say what is on my mind in any kind of respectful way, so I'm just not going to open this can of worms....suffice it to say, I'm absolutely PISSED for you, that you are dealing with this crap.

 

So are you going to sign that paperwork? Is that what the lawyer is telling you to do??? I wouldn't sign that vague, right waiving, bullcrap piece of paper for all the tea in china. I cannot imagine a world where my attorney would allow me to sign something so vague for an organization that was obviously so intent on staying in my life and messing with me...tell them you;ll agree to the program verbally, or in a specific signed statement or whatever....but please don't sign that paperwork. It just gives them too much room to screw you...and considering what they are already putting you through FOR NO REASON, they may be more than inclined to screw you some more.

 

LIVID.

 

post #123 of 192

SERIOUSLY....all you people who sit around like "oh CPS is so great!" - look at this, seriously. "If we play their game, they;ll let us sail through....if we don't (WHICH REALLY MEANS: If we advocate for our rights as parents and demand fair and constitutionally sound treatment) - we get dragged through the mud" - this is a disgusting abuse. Anyone involved in this situation knows that these are good parents who are doing their best. This is absolutely insane. OP, I'm so sorry.

post #124 of 192

I'm certainly no CPS lover. I know there are times when the system doesn't work as it should but that's not the norm (in my experience as a foster parent and having worked with at-risk families for years.) It sucks being involved with CPS. That's a fact. No matter if you are "innocent" or "guilty" of the allegations.

 

OP, I've worked with many wonderful "public defenders." I actually don't think that's the proper term but that doesn't matter. DD's birth mother's lawyer is a state senator. And her birth father's lawyer was a pit bull (in a good way- I was impressed.) I would ask for representation and talk to someone who deals with this stuff EVERY DAY.I can't imagine that they would suggest that you accept a parenting plan If everything you've told us is true (and I have no reason to doubt that,) then then all this isn't necessary and you should be able to get people (neighbors, teachers, employers, etc) to support your case.

 

 

post #125 of 192

http://fightcps.com/2010/04/09/what-to-do-if-child-protective-services-social-workers-are-investigating-you/ For all the times CP

 

 

For all the time CPS does well, there are just as many times they don't.  And when they don't, and I mean I know of a few situations where kids were left in bad situations and kids were taken out of good situations.  I've once seen CPS do right by a kid and CPS leave kids to fend for themselves. 

 

There are a lot of women in my own family that do not need to be mothers.  My cousin had 5 girls she didn't take care of, her sister would come by every day and look after them for her until she had had enough and told her either to give her custody or straighten up.  She chose to take of with the ones she like and left her oldest by her self in a crappy apartment.  She was 9.  CPS had been called on her over 12 times.  The meth head got to keep her other kids but her sister was able to get custody of the oldest.  Now the other 4... nobody knows where they are. 

 

There was a situation at work a few years back where a mother was obviously off her rocker.  My DH was her supervisor and he sent someone out to her home to make sure her kids were ok.  She left them alone while she was at work.  Two toddlers and an infant.  They were locked in a room with a bag of suckers.  The bathroom was full of dirty diapers (bathtub was used as a trash can) and the fridge had a pint of milk.  That was it.  The home was filthy, animal feces everywhere.  The situation continued to get worse and CPS would drop by and leave.  She kept her kids and she never lost custody.  She was never sent to parenting classes and she eventually moved away.  

 

Our old neighbors had a boy they werefostering, the kid went to school smelling like patchouli... they apparently decided that the mother was using patchouli to cover the smell of weed.  She's been trying to get her son back since they took him from school.  Not her home, from school.  They never went to her house.  The family doesn't see a reason why the boy shouldn't go back to his mother.  From all their interactions with her and from their time with the boy the relationship is obviously healthy. 

 

By the way I grow patchouli at my house.  I love the smell. 

 

 

 

post #126 of 192
Thread Starter 

I know it's hard to believe anyone you "meet" on the internet, but I swear I'm the best parent I know irl. I had all natural births for my babies. If it could be proven that drugs did nothing to your babies I'd never have given it a second thought! Bring on the drugs! But I had to protect my babies. When my first had food allergies as a baby I didn't switch to forumla like everybody on the internet, I removed the foods from my diet. Allergy diets have been the hardest thing I have ever done as a parent, but I've done it 5 times (eating nothing but chicken and oranges for 6 weeks while we worked out the 14 things my 4th is allergic to). I began researching immunity and nutrition. I stepped up my efforts last winter and this year I have read over 100 books on the subjects. My entire family has a very specific diet and supplement program that I designed MYSELF and ran past my doctor (DO, very naturally-minded) to check for my accuracy. I'm trying to HEAL my kids so that they can have better lives. If it was just me getting a headache from corn, or a stuffy nose from milk, I'd have never changed a thing. One of the things that worries me the most about them being taken is that NOBODY'S going to take care of them and feed them the way I do. Nobody's making all their meals from scratch, from grass-fed animals and herbs and probiotic-rich foods/drinks. Sigh... I've never met anyone as dedicated to their kids and their well-being, and that's the part most disturbing to me.

 

I literally drove past Payless on my way home, just days after this started. 2 very large women left the store with 5 children between them (aged maybe 2-7 yrs old). I saw only one car in the parking lot, so I watched as I sat at the light. They piled the kids in the back of the car, cuffing the last one in the head I assume because she wasn't moving fast enough, no car seats what-so-ever. They still had their kids.

post #127 of 192

I don't like to go into my dealings with CPS (I'm trying to forget that nightmare), so I've stayed out of this topic so far, but if they do continue to push for you to sign that paper, you might be able to get it changed a little. I did that with a couple different things. I was sweet as pie and told them that I really wanted to work with them, but that I just wasn't comfortable with some of the language in what they wanted me to sign. I pointed out the specific sentences that made me uncomfortable, the worker went over it with her supervisor, then came back to me with some of the sentences removed, and others changed. It still wasn't completely what I wanted, but it was enough for me to feel more comfortable signing, and I wasn't about to nitpick. Gotta pick your battles. Might be worth a shot.

post #128 of 192

 

Good for you, gabbyraja, for getting a lawyer who knows all the players involved here. Yes, what she told you was frustrating (enraging, in fact). But AT LEAST SHE KNOWS THE SCORE. If she's telling you that they'll abuse their power if you stand up for yourself, then you have every reason to believe her. After all, she makes more money if you fight :-(

 

Chin up, mama. You've gotten your legal advice. You should probably follow it unless your gut is still screaming "noooo!" to signing that horrible paper. 

post #129 of 192

gabbyraja, I'm so sorry this is happening to you. I know you are a dedicated mother and advocate for your children and it's making me sick that you are going through this. Nobody is going to take your kids, don't worry.  I think Tooraloora made an AWESOME suggestion...do everything you can to get that language changed and try and be sweet as you can without giving them anything that isn't good for you. I'm sick you have to play their games....this is horrible. It's just AWFUL. That an OBVIOUSLY good mother who didn't actually do ANYTHING wrong is having to jump through these kinds of hoops to prove to the state that she is a fit parent is disgusting.

 

What have they actually CHARGED you with? What is the actual determination?? Unfit? Somewhat unfit? Negligent? WHAT? Ugh. I've seen this so many times, just so so many times. I don't understand it. It sickens me so deeply. We must protect children, yes, obviously....but how much power do we give this kind of organization? Why do they have the power to hold anyone they want in such a precarious place....the threat of losing your kids cuts so deep. CPS shouldn't have the power to just decide that anyone, no matter how lacking they are in evidence of any actual abuse, has to PROVE that they are suitable parents.

 

post #130 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by gabbyraja View Post

We had to postpone our atty visit. We met with her late yesterday. Fortunately she is intimately acquainted with our local CPS agency. Unfortunately, since she knows how they work, she suggested we go along with whatever they want. If we play their game they'll let us sail through. If we fight, they'll drag us through the mud and we obviously can't afford it. :( She said there is always a public defender, but that a public defender will not get a good outcome. We'll be in worst straits than if we just went along now.


I'm sorry you're having to go through this.  I cannot imagine the stress.  Having worked in child welfare, I think your attorney gave you excellent advice (and I am thinking it is similar to what others in child welfare have suggested).  Going along with "the game" will get you through this much much more quickly, and yes, if you fight, they probably will drag you through the mud.  Another way to think of it though is this-- If you are cooperative with them in allowing them into your home to see with their own eyes that your children are well cared for, that you're nurturing, not neglectful or abusive, and if you seem willing to take their suggestions for parenting classes, etc., proving to them that you are interested in parenting your children to the best of your abilities (nevermind that you already know you've read tons of books and done tons of research--they don't know that), then they can close your case in a few weeks with the satisfaction of knowing that your kids are safe and well cared for.  After all, the majority of social workers truly want this for all children and families, which is why they do the job in the first place. 

 

On the other hand, if you don't cooperate, through their eyes, they are going to see the lack of cooperation as an indication that you have something to hide, aren't interested in doing what you have to do to keep your kids, can't follow through, etc.  So then they "drag you through the mud."  Which to them isn't some sort of punishment for you.  They feel they *must* ensure your children are safe through whatever means necessary.  They aren't trying to be punitive, punish, drag you through the mud.  They're trying to do a job they take very seriously.  If you don't cooperate and provide access and seem interested in "learning" from them (even if you already know more than them), they assume they are still needed and will not close your case because they won't be satisfied that your kids are okay. 

 

I promise you, that is how the vast majority of social workers think.  When I see all sorts of wild suggestions on MDC about not providing access, etc., I seriously am distressed because I *know* the best way to get CPS out of your life is to *show them* your kids are fine.  When they cannot verify that fully, they cannot close your case with a clear conscience. 

 

I truly believe that if everything you have posted on MDC is a full and accurate portrait of what your home is like and your parenting is like (and I do believe you are telling the truth), that you have nothing to fear in terms of them taking your kids.  Yes, it will be a long few weeks.  It could drag on a few months.  It will be stressful and there will be very difficult days for you emotionally as you worry about the what-ifs.  But I really believe you are strong enough to endure everything that you will have to deal with, and that in a few months this will be nothing more than a horrible memory for you.  Good luck, mama. 

 

post #131 of 192

Hi APToddlerMom: Here's the problem....if you've been around MDC long enough (which I know you have, BTW, HI! Nice to see you!) and have been paying attention to the CPS threads as they come up......then you are aware of the RIDICULOUS things that have happened to people who DO let them in, thinking "what's the worst that could happen, I want to prove I have nothing to hide" - only to have the CPS worker cite "stained floors" and "not enough beds" (in a co-sleeping household) or other COMPLETELY RIDICULOUS things and end up having people dragged through long battles to prove that they aren't really secret monsters who abuse their children.

 

I don't trust CPS workers...I don't trust any government employee when they are engaging me in their official capacity. The CPS worker is trying to decide if you are a good parent. The cop is trying to decide if you're a criminal. The IRS worker is trying to decide if you are in any way dodging paying what they think is "your fair share" - the list goes on. Never help a government employee with any information that could be used to hang you in a court of law. The burden of proof is supposed to lie with the state....so why is that so different with CPS? They can open a file on you, NOT find ANY proof...and demand certain things of you to prove that you aren't an unfit parent ANYWAY. Any lawyer worth their salt is going to explain to you that CPS workers are like cops...and that unless they have a warrant or a damned good -emergent- reason, they shouldn't be allowed to just waltz into your house to "check things out".

 

Mamas who KNOW they are good mamas, have let CPS into their home to check things out, open the fridge, etc....because THEY think that the CPS worker is looking for signs that the children in the household are living in filth, not being fed, etc....when really, some of these agents just don't like their lifestyle and are looking for ANY reason to keep a case open and make a family "pay".

 

It's insane. Telling women here that they should just "play the game" with CPS is dangerous. I can think of two mamas off the top of my head, who would have avoided months of extreme stress for themselves and their children, ongoing problems with CPS and in one case, temporarily losing custody of their children, if they had said "no thank you, CPS worker, I need to speak with a lawyer before you come in my house" - but they didn't have anything to hide.....so they opened the door and invited CPS right into their lives. One of the ladies was reported by a nurse at her doctors office for "medical neglect" (yeah, non-vaxxing) and the other was reported by a nosy neighbor who thought their two year old was naked in the yard too much. Those are just the two who come to mind...there have been ---so--- many mamas over the years who have had minor or MAJOR brushes with CPS for little to NO reason.

 

CPS has too much power to ruin the lives of people who are not, by any means or definition, abusers or neglectors of children. It's insane. The fact that this women should just have to "go along with it to be done with it" even though everyone involved knows her children are FINE, flies in the face of everything that it is supposed to mean to live in the USA.

post #132 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by AverysMomma View Post

Mamas who KNOW they are good mamas, have let CPS into their home to check things out, open the fridge, etc....because THEY think that the CPS worker is looking for signs that the children in the household are living in filth, not being fed, etc....when really, some of these agents just don't like their lifestyle and are looking for ANY reason to keep a case open and make a family "pay".



I could totally see this happening. 

post #133 of 192

Hi Averysmomma.  There have been lots of threads I've agreed with you on, but I just totally disagree with you on this one.  Yes, I've seen the billion threads on MDC about CPS and yes I do think that on occassion workers make very poor decisions regarding pulling kids from homes when it should not happen.  I just happen to think that the majority of bad decisions made by social workers are leaving kids in dangerous situations.  I think you and I view CPS very differently.  My opinion is that their job and the work they do is protecting children and supporting families who would otherwise not be capable of parenting their children safely.  You view them as an entity that walks all over parents'rights.  Maybe if you saw .1% of the situations I've seen up close and personal, you would understand why ensuring child safety is a bigger priority than a parents' "rights" not to have to deal with CPS, have intrusive visits, go to therapy, take classes, etc.  It sucks for those who go through the process without good reason, but probably for every time that happens, 100 kids in disgustingly abusive and neglectful situations are saved more heartache, pain, and hardship.  To me, the benefits of CPS outweigh the negatives.  Also, all those intrusive things CPS requires....like making parents do education...is really CPS doing its best to keep kids where they belong--with their families.  Child safety within the biological family home is the absolute goal of CPS.  "Ongoing workers" are assigned solely to help the family with any and all resources possible to strengthen the family unit and allow the children to remain in the family home.  Yes, it sucks if you are like OP and don't need it, but the vast majority of families who work with an ongoing worker truly do need assistance.  Ongoing workers regularly help connect families with WIC, food stamps, MA, childcare, employment, housing, parenting education, therapy, addiction services, etc.  I've worked with many families who have ended up really liking me (imagine that) and being so grateful for the assistance they've received because so many of them really couldn't do it on their own.  The outside stressors majorly impacted their parenting, and they were happy to have those stressors removed so they could become better parents. 

 

Also, this is definitely in NO way a reference to OP, but I will tell you I have seen other posters on MDC posting about the horrific things CPS has done to them, claiming they are "perfect" and CPS had no justification for their actions.  However, I've seen other threads by these same exact posters in which extremely serious safety issues have been brought up.  I am not going to list names, obviously, and will not even get into the details of what they themselves wrote on MDC in other threads because I don't want to get "warned" or anything, but feel free to pm me if you want me to provide you with some examples.  Without a doubt, there have been posters on here who had absolutely no business parenting their children and CPS, but more importantly, their CHILDREN, had every right in the world to have CPS intruding on their lives.  Horrific, dangerous, and sickening things.  So, while there are threads in which I wholeheartedly believe the MDC member has been the victim of really bad luck (like OP in this case), there are also posters claiming CPS is so awful who are not telling the whole story in their "scare the pants off of everyone else at MDC" threads.  You also have been around long enough to have picked up on some of these cases...  This is the internet afterall, and being an MDC mama does not mean someone isn't neglectful or abusive. 

 

Even being a social worker, I'll agree with you on this...CPS sucks.  They do a bad job in general of protecting children.  I just am of the belief that their major flaw is underreacting, not overreacting.  Social workers, for the most part, do not have the attitude like a cop or IRS worker that they want to catch you being bad.  They want to ensure children are safe.  Period.  Those who do the work without those values are screwed up.  We all think teachers are great, right?  Nobody says all teachers are terrible people who want to abuse children just because we occassionally hear on the news that a teacher has done so.  Why paint all social workers with the same brush?  We're massively underpaid (think literally half of what teachers make and no summer breaks), work long hours and are frequently on call nights when there is any sort of emergency, go into dangerous and disgusting situations, sit up awake at night grieving for the children we see in such horrible situations (frequently with no way to truly improve things for them),and are viewed as people who ruin families, take children away from good families, leave them with bad families, etc.  I mean, really... Do you think most workers take on those responsibilities because they want to yank kids from good families, or do you think, just maybe, we actually care about kids being safe? 

post #134 of 192


I hate that I can only thumbs up once.
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by AverysMomma View Post

Hi APToddlerMom: Here's the problem....if you've been around MDC long enough (which I know you have, BTW, HI! Nice to see you!) and have been paying attention to the CPS threads as they come up......then you are aware of the RIDICULOUS things that have happened to people who DO let them in, thinking "what's the worst that could happen, I want to prove I have nothing to hide" - only to have the CPS worker cite "stained floors" and "not enough beds" (in a co-sleeping household) or other COMPLETELY RIDICULOUS things and end up having people dragged through long battles to prove that they aren't really secret monsters who abuse their children.

 

I don't trust CPS workers...I don't trust any government employee when they are engaging me in their official capacity. The CPS worker is trying to decide if you are a good parent. The cop is trying to decide if you're a criminal. The IRS worker is trying to decide if you are in any way dodging paying what they think is "your fair share" - the list goes on. Never help a government employee with any information that could be used to hang you in a court of law. The burden of proof is supposed to lie with the state....so why is that so different with CPS? They can open a file on you, NOT find ANY proof...and demand certain things of you to prove that you aren't an unfit parent ANYWAY. Any lawyer worth their salt is going to explain to you that CPS workers are like cops...and that unless they have a warrant or a damned good -emergent- reason, they shouldn't be allowed to just waltz into your house to "check things out".

 

Mamas who KNOW they are good mamas, have let CPS into their home to check things out, open the fridge, etc....because THEY think that the CPS worker is looking for signs that the children in the household are living in filth, not being fed, etc....when really, some of these agents just don't like their lifestyle and are looking for ANY reason to keep a case open and make a family "pay".

 

It's insane. Telling women here that they should just "play the game" with CPS is dangerous. I can think of two mamas off the top of my head, who would have avoided months of extreme stress for themselves and their children, ongoing problems with CPS and in one case, temporarily losing custody of their children, if they had said "no thank you, CPS worker, I need to speak with a lawyer before you come in my house" - but they didn't have anything to hide.....so they opened the door and invited CPS right into their lives. One of the ladies was reported by a nurse at her doctors office for "medical neglect" (yeah, non-vaxxing) and the other was reported by a nosy neighbor who thought their two year old was naked in the yard too much. Those are just the two who come to mind...there have been ---so--- many mamas over the years who have had minor or MAJOR brushes with CPS for little to NO reason.

 

CPS has too much power to ruin the lives of people who are not, by any means or definition, abusers or neglectors of children. It's insane. The fact that this women should just have to "go along with it to be done with it" even though everyone involved knows her children are FINE, flies in the face of everything that it is supposed to mean to live in the USA.



 

post #135 of 192

I had to thumbs up yours too...

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by APToddlerMama View Post

Hi Averysmomma.  There have been lots of threads I've agreed with you on, but I just totally disagree with you on this one.  Yes, I've seen the billion threads on MDC about CPS and yes I do think that on occassion workers make very poor decisions regarding pulling kids from homes when it should not happen.  I just happen to think that the majority of bad decisions made by social workers are leaving kids in dangerous situations.  I think you and I view CPS very differently.  My opinion is that their job and the work they do is protecting children and supporting families who would otherwise not be capable of parenting their children safely.  You view them as an entity that walks all over parents'rights.  Maybe if you saw .1% of the situations I've seen up close and personal, you would understand why ensuring child safety is a bigger priority than a parents' "rights" not to have to deal with CPS, have intrusive visits, go to therapy, take classes, etc.  It sucks for those who go through the process without good reason, but probably for every time that happens, 100 kids in disgustingly abusive and neglectful situations are saved more heartache, pain, and hardship.  To me, the benefits of CPS outweigh the negatives.  Also, all those intrusive things CPS requires....like making parents do education...is really CPS doing its best to keep kids where they belong--with their families.  Child safety within the biological family home is the absolute goal of CPS.  "Ongoing workers" are assigned solely to help the family with any and all resources possible to strengthen the family unit and allow the children to remain in the family home.  Yes, it sucks if you are like OP and don't need it, but the vast majority of families who work with an ongoing worker truly do need assistance.  Ongoing workers regularly help connect families with WIC, food stamps, MA, childcare, employment, housing, parenting education, therapy, addiction services, etc.  I've worked with many families who have ended up really liking me (imagine that) and being so grateful for the assistance they've received because so many of them really couldn't do it on their own.  The outside stressors majorly impacted their parenting, and they were happy to have those stressors removed so they could become better parents. 

 

Also, this is definitely in NO way a reference to OP, but I will tell you I have seen other posters on MDC posting about the horrific things CPS has done to them, claiming they are "perfect" and CPS had no justification for their actions.  However, I've seen other threads by these same exact posters in which extremely serious safety issues have been brought up.  I am not going to list names, obviously, and will not even get into the details of what they themselves wrote on MDC in other threads because I don't want to get "warned" or anything, but feel free to pm me if you want me to provide you with some examples.  Without a doubt, there have been posters on here who had absolutely no business parenting their children and CPS, but more importantly, their CHILDREN, had every right in the world to have CPS intruding on their lives.  Horrific, dangerous, and sickening things.  So, while there are threads in which I wholeheartedly believe the MDC member has been the victim of really bad luck (like OP in this case), there are also posters claiming CPS is so awful who are not telling the whole story in their "scare the pants off of everyone else at MDC" threads.  You also have been around long enough to have picked up on some of these cases...  This is the internet afterall, and being an MDC mama does not mean someone isn't neglectful or abusive. 

 

Even being a social worker, I'll agree with you on this...CPS sucks.  They do a bad job in general of protecting children.  I just am of the belief that their major flaw is underreacting, not overreacting.  Social workers, for the most part, do not have the attitude like a cop or IRS worker that they want to catch you being bad.  They want to ensure children are safe.  Period.  Those who do the work without those values are screwed up.  We all think teachers are great, right?  Nobody says all teachers are terrible people who want to abuse children just because we occassionally hear on the news that a teacher has done so.  Why paint all social workers with the same brush?  We're massively underpaid (think literally half of what teachers make and no summer breaks), work long hours and are frequently on call nights when there is any sort of emergency, go into dangerous and disgusting situations, sit up awake at night grieving for the children we see in such horrible situations (frequently with no way to truly improve things for them),and are viewed as people who ruin families, take children away from good families, leave them with bad families, etc.  I mean, really... Do you think most workers take on those responsibilities because they want to yank kids from good families, or do you think, just maybe, we actually care about kids being safe? 



 

post #136 of 192

I think the main reason MDC mamas are fearful of CPS is just b/c most of us don't live a very mainstream America life. I have an irrational fear of CPS based on my nursing my toddler (and now I'm pregnant too), co-sleep, I don't have any "kids snack/junk food", we don't vax, we have FC, we EC so yeah my kid is naked quite a bit or at least bottomless (with babylegs in the cold)...etc so the way we live I love and feel confident and comfortable with it, but I def know people who think I'm a total nut job. Some people view nursing a toddler as sexual abuse even...I guess I am just afraid of what the CPS workers opinion would be of our lifestyle.

 

When someone has so much power in their hands and you have no clue what they will think of your "unconventional" ways (even though they are really closer to real traditional ways..) you can't help but have some fear. I know Alma in Spain lost her baby for Bfing her at 15 m/o! Now true it's not America but I don't really believe this country is all that free and you just never know what will happen next...

post #137 of 192

 

Like lmacerka, I'm giving a big thumbs-up to both both POVs here.

 

Under-reaction by social workers IS far more common then over-reaction. Keeping a child in the home if the home is remotely acceptable IS the goal of almost all social workers. 

 

Even so, providing any information or access to an agent of the government when you're not legally obligated to do so IS morally revolting and potentially very dangerous. But we do it, sometimes, because CPS swings a very big club and we're afraid.

 

Social workers are mostly nice people working within a large bureaucracy who don't want to rock the boat, deviate from the plan, or do anything outside what they consider "normal." The OP's lawyer is advising her to "play along" because she knows that the OP's first priority is to get CPS out of her life. She knows that the supervisor in this case tends to second-guess her workers, and that the worker in question is a wimp. The lawyer doesn't think it's right. I don't think it's right. But the OP needs to protect her children, and in this case, that means that she is going to self-abrogate her civil rights. 

 

I don't trust CPS workers...I don't trust any government employee when they are engaging me in their official capacity. The CPS worker is trying to decide if you are a good parent. The cop is trying to decide if you're a criminal. The IRS worker is trying to decide if you are in any way dodging paying what they think is "your fair share" - the list goes on. Never help a government employee with any information that could be used to hang you in a court of law.

 

truedat.gif  

post #138 of 192

APToddlerMama, I could not agree more.  I think CPS is being unfairly maligned here.  By law, they have to check up on every single report that gets made.  They don't do this because they want to harass you, they do it because their job is to look out for children.  And it's ridiculous to take the attitude that all they want to do is take kids away from their mothers.  That's not true at all.  It takes a lot of evidence to even begin to remove a child from the home, and most of the time CPS works hard to keep kids with their families. 

 

People don't go into social work because they want to hurt people, they do it because they are trying to do some good in this world.  The last thing they want to do is put more kids into the foster care system.  And really, they're damned if they do, damned if they don't when it comes to taking children out of the home.

post #139 of 192

Also, there seems to be a misconception that CPS itself has the power to take your children away from you.  In reality, you'd go to court over it and a judge would decide.  CPS would share whatever evidence they had (which, if everything you say is true, they don't have any), but the judge would ultimately decide.  I don't see them wanting someone to follow up within seven weeks as them "holding you" or anything of the sort.  It will likely be a phone call or a short visit.  The chance of them taking your children is very very slim.  If they had reason and proof to do that, they'd have done it by now.

post #140 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by AHodges View Post

Also, there seems to be a misconception that CPS itself has the power to take your children away from you.  In reality, you'd go to court over it and a judge would decide.  CPS would share whatever evidence they had (which, if everything you say is true, they don't have any), but the judge would ultimately decide.  I don't see them wanting someone to follow up within seven weeks as them "holding you" or anything of the sort.  It will likely be a phone call or a short visit.  The chance of them taking your children is very very slim.  If they had reason and proof to do that, they'd have done it by now.



I've seen two situations where the children were removed at an initial visit, with no order. I'm in Canada, and I'm sure the rules are somewhat different, but I've never read anything that suggests this can't happen. I know CPS can't keep kids without an order, but I've seen them take them without an order. (Neither situation was a wonderful living environment, in one way or another...but there was no hint of immediate danger to the children in either case.)

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Mothering › Mothering Forums › Mom › Parenting › Update pg 10. Yay!-The ever-present CPS fears have materialized for us