sleep help please!

[baltmom]

Hi everyone, I'm new here and have already learned so much from everybody. There have been some earlier posts on this issue and they have helped me understand that every situation and every solution is different for every family, but I would love any advice on our situation.

My DS, 21 months, had been an excellent sleeper up until around the beginning of last month. Now, he wakes up between 1 and 3 a.m. most nights, and is usually up for 2-3 hours. At first it seemed to be hunger, so now he gets a good bedtime snack before bed. Lately there doesn't seem to be a particular reason he is waking up - he's just awake. Back when this started, he suddenly started skipping naps, but now he is back to 2-3 hour afternoon naps.

At night it has always taken him at least an hour to fall asleep after going to bed - he used to just talk happily and then drift off, and now more often than not the talking is interspersed with whining, and sometimes he won't drift off but needs help before falling asleep. Then when he wakes at night, it will often start with whining, which I try not to respond to, but if it progresses to crying, I do respond. If I just go in his room and sit in the chair or even pat his back, he cries more. He will only stop if I take him out and hold him in the chair. Then he stops immediately, and usually tries to start a conversation. I only say "it's night time, time to sleep, go back to sleep please." Then it takes 2-3 hours for him to go back to sleep. We don't usually co-sleep, but when I have tried bringing him to bed with me, the pattern is the same as when we sit in the chair.

I know I am helping to create an unhealthy habit - I just can't figure out how to get us out!

We are both pretty sleep deprived at this point. I really appreciate any suggestions and advice!

[organicviolin]

Your toddler is looking for your attention.  Saying anything at all is what's driving this new routine.  DS know that whining and whimpering won't get a rise out of you, but crying will.  She wants to reconnect and that's fine, but the middle of the night is not the time for that, especially because she used to be a good sleeper.  You should read Dr Weissbluth's Healthy Sleep Habits Healthy Child.  It has everything from newborn to teenage sleep.  This comes up a bit.  There's a difference between I'm scared crying and protest crying.  When you go in and refuse to pick up, that crying is protest.  I'm pissed that you aren't picking me up and making me better and talking with me, I want your attention.  The reason for not going to sleep right away is because she knows that you'll respond by picking her up and speaking with her.  So, if you want it to stop, I would suggest not picking her up or not going in there at all unless it's a something is seriously the problem cry.  You know which cry is what.  Trust yourself.  You both are overtired!

PS the first night will be hell with loads of protest crying, the next night probably not much.  It's up to you how to handle it of course, but I only go into my kiddo's room in the middle of the night if it's serious I am super scared or sick cry.  Really my DS hasn't woken in the middle of the night since the baby was born over 6 months ago.

[Youngfrankenstein]

I don't think that letter her cry is a solution at all.  I don't think there has to be a reason this is happening but I can't understand you wanting it to "go away".  My 4th baby is/was a terrible sleeper.  She will be 2 in a few weeks and hasn't slept through the night since a handful of times when she was 3-4 months old.

We tried so many solutions with her ending up in bed with us.  The only problem with that is that we only have a double bed and there wasn't a lot of room for the three of us.  What I ended up doing is taking the side off of her crib and using a bedrail.  I think there was just something about the crib she didn't like.  It was different than her other 3 siblings.  She moved to a regular twin bed at about 18 months (with a bed rail) and now I can crawl in with her if I need to.  I don't find that I have to do that at all anymore.  Now she is to the point that if she wakes I can cover her back up, tell her I'm there, and find her binky and she goes back to sleep without me picking her up.

I know that doesn't exactly address your problem of being awake in the middle of the night for a few hours!

If it helps, I also sit on the end of her bed and do crossword puzzles while she looks at a book and then she lays down and falls asleep while I sit with her.  I barely talk to her much after tuck-in so she knows it's sleepy time.  I also play music for her.

[Ma Cactus]

Could he have seen scary Halloween decorations? My DS (23 mos) woke up one morning a few weeks ago telling me he was scared of 'grim reaper in window!' his exact words! It turned out to be a decoration that his cousins helpfully explained to him when he was at my sisters. 

Or maybe teething? Or perhaps he is beginning to dream more and it is confusing and scaring him?

my sister says dr sears sleep book has a lot of helpful stuff. 

[newmamalizzy]

I can understand why you're not doing this, but what happens if you DO go soothe him right away when he starts whining?  And what happens if you continue to not pick him up when you go in to soothe him?  I know you said he cries, but would he keep crying for hours if you didn't pick him up?  Would he get frantic?  I guess I feel like there's nothing really wrong with a toddler wanting attention at night, but you shouldn't feel like you're being pushed to do exactly what he wants you to.  That's coming from a mom who almost ALWAYS believes that my baby's cry means she's in pain or scared or something else dire :)  I think not talking is a good idea.  I instituted that policy at naptime, and it really helped.  Have you tried shifting bed/nap times around at all?  Maybe his sleep needs have changed?

[baltmom]

Thank you everyone, so much, for your advice and your support. I really appreciate it! Last night, he slept 12 hours straight :) I don't expect this will happen every time or anything, but I'll take it!

Newmamalizzy, I used to be able to go in right away and soothe without picking up, but in this latest round he gets furious if I try this, and yes, frantic crying describes it perfectly. I have tried adjusting sleep times a bit - I think it's helped a little but it's sort of hard to know.

Ma Cactus, your dream suggestion is a really interesting idea! I wouldn't be at all surprised if that was at least part of it. Not necessarily bad dreams, just, like you said, having dreams at all, which would absolutely be confusing when you haven't had them before. It would make sense, too - his imagination has really been taking off lately, which is really fun.

Youngfrankenstein, I think that like you, we may just need to keep trying things until we find what works for us. Which may change over time  - an ongoing process :)

Organicviolin, I read the Healthy Sleep Habits book back when he was 3-4 months old and really appreciated the "sleep begets sleep" concept. That really helped me figure out nap and bedtimes and behaviors along the way. His approach is a little too CIO for me, so I don't really follow his strategies, although I fully appreciate that DS needs to learn to soothe himself back to sleep when he wakes at night, as a lifelong habit.

I guess my instinct is telling me that he doesn't really want to be awake at night, that something - developmental? teething? dreaming? separation anxiety? - is waking him, and that right now what works (sort of) for both of us is to try to create conditions where this doesn't happen (good naps, regular bedtime routines, lots of connection during the day), and for me to hold him back to sleep without talking when it does.

Thanks again everyone, it means a lot to know I'm not alone :)

[Ruby2]

My dd (23 months) was the exact same...well, expect for the going down easily at bedtime part! 

We tried EVERYTHING! Soothing, not soothing, rocking, bouncing, etc. The poor girl just could NOT sleep. She tried so hard but her brain would just not turn off. I felt so bad for her...when I wasn't feeling bad for myself!

She finally just (I hope...) grew out of it. I really think it had to be developmental. The whole process probably went on for about 4 months. After 2 months of getting up with her in the middle of the night for 2-3 hours at a time, we moved her bedtime up to 7 and I think that helped a little. We started going to her immediately when she made a peep so that she didn't have the chance to wake all the way up. Dh and I spent many a night dozing in the rocker with her on our chests. Now she still wakes at least once in the night, but we're able to get her back to sleep quickly. 

She never ever sleeps 12 hours though - hopefully your problems are over and the phase was shorter than ours! Best of luck.