Warm Winter Wishes and BFP's 40 ++ TTC - Page 18

[WaturMama]

A  rant about going gluten-free:

I'm on day 8 of going gluten-free. Also cow-dairy-free. I just got back from the grocery store. It was stressful and expensive. For the last few years I've been of the mindset that the less processed the better. I like the Weston Price/Nourishing Traditions type thinking, too--eat like cultures where people have been healthy for a long time. So it's not like I was eating a whole lot of processed wheat. Our standard sandwich bread is mostly sprouted wheat and includes other grains. When we ate pasta we ate a mix of wheat and rice, because I think a diversity of grains is important. It seems to me that my ancestors ate wheat! So there I am at the store looking at all these foods that look more processed--with things like potato starch and tapioca flour and rice that ground up, which is not a traditional way to eat it as far as I know. I've been eating a lot of rice cakes and found out today they are made with super high heat. Argh. I also don't feel any different, but I am supposed to try a month. Mostly I just needed to rant, but I am curious how long it took others to feel a difference.

I thinking I should let this month play out. I am learning a few things I do like about different things to eat. I like polenta (unfortunately my dh and ds don't). But I also don't like my increased stress level, and we really can't afford a lot of expensive products right now.

[gumblossom]

Waturmama, I agree that many gluten free products are over processed, and some are full of non-nutrients such as sugar and additives. A gluten-free product isn't necessarily a healthy product.

I've been GF for some time now, and for me, it meant I was able to free myself from some health issues that I had for years - particularly gut issues. But I still had other niggling health issues, so this past 6 months have been mostly grain-free,sugar-free paleo. It has made all the difference. I used to have issues with joint pain, aches in my legs and back. They've pretty well gone away, but I still have a few small issues, and I'm hoping the grain-free approach will help over time.

Being Gluten free for a few years has made going Paleo really easy. I keep reading about how great the Paleo diet is for fertility, so that spurs me on. My DH has a borderline thyroid issue and he's trying Paleo to see if it will help. I sometimes think his thyroid problem may have contributed to our miscarriages.

Having said that, I'm a firm believer that we have to find what suits us. Not everyone thrives on a GF diet, and if you treat grains by sprouting etc, then the toxins are usually gone, and they are okay to eat. It sounds like a good idea to try GF for a month and see if it makes a difference. If it doesn't, at least you know you gave it a go. It shouldn't be stressful though. Eventually I came to think that using anything highly processed wasn't worth it, and we just stayed away from those things. I found a nice GF  sour dough sprouted grain bread(I think it had quinoa,pepitas,sunflower seeds in it), which I loved, but I don't eat any grain now.

The Paleo diet has helped me shed some excess weight, and I am hoping to shed the other extra pounds I don't need, and I think it has really helped get AF back on track. I still have a little cramping at AF time, so I'm going to be more vigilant taking fish oil this cycle.I don't know if you are interested, but reading about the Paleo diet has made me realise that the post agricultural revolution diet isn't so good for our bodies, which genetically are still like the Paleolithic times.

I've noticed that my son's eczema has cleared up since the whole family is on the Paleo diet, though my children still eat rice and some GF things like pancakes, rice crackers and muffins (made with coconut flour and GF flour)

I hope you find some good GF things to eat. I know what you mean about rice cakes, I found them to be a staple, and was upset when I found out how they are produced.

I wanted to say also that I read that book on "baby-friendly body". At the time I found it very interesting, but it also made me feel a bit helpless, because I knew I couldn't afford any of the treatments. However, it did get me thinking about keeping my diet GF( I did go back to eating gluten when I was pregnant, because I seemed to tolerate it then, but in hindsight it worries me that it might have contributed to my miscarriages). Many doctors don't think his work is of merit, but one thing I loved about that book, was that he was pro-older mums. He seemed to think it wasn't necessarily age that caused miscarriages, but other underlying problems.

I liked your "omen". It is so heartening to hear of older mamas having healthy babies, especially after miscarriage. I think I told you how I meet a lady at a school function (I'm a teacher) who had 12 or 13 kids. She is 44 and had recently had a baby, after two miscarriages. I heard she is pregnant again. She suggested I take progesterone. I am still waiting for my doctor to call re: progesterone test, which I think I may have had two weeks ago. I guess I won't hear from her until Monday, if I do at all.I'm not too worried about it as I feel I had a normal ovulation and AF last time.

I'm going to a friend's 50th party tonight. I'll probably have a couple of glasses of champagne for the first time in ages.It will be nice to have some fun.

[lovestolearn]

WaturMama~

I can relate to the difficulty in going gluten-free.  It was hard at first & I kept feeling deprived, then cheated (and felt even worse!)

When I went Primal last year, I started looking at bread differently--it was no longer "food" to me. 

It was easy, once I compared nutrition data--meat & vegetables definitely win out over grains.  Also, after 3 weeks gluten-free, my digestion completely normalized and all my IBS symptoms disappeared--I had been gluten-intolerant all along, but didn't know it!

I don't eat substitutes for bread anymore.  I do eat the occasional corn chip and some rice crackers--but mostly as a vehicle for liver paté!

[Kristin0105]

All I can say is wow. I took a break from the thread for a while and today read 10 pages. You ladies have been busy. I send a heartfelt hug out to Litma your story as it unfolded had be riveted. I am sorry for the outcome for you but it sounds like you are very fertile and your ovaries are healthy. I hope for you a positive outcome as you heal and begin to TTC in the future. 

Waturmama thank you for your PM and it was so wonderful of you to remember my day. I was having a nice day when you wrote. I apologize for taking over a month to respond. Life has just kept me so busy.

I feel like I should apologize to all you lovely ladies as I have totally neglected our thread. I took notes as I was reading today so I will get the updates done on the first page as soon as possible.

Waturmama I was going to recommend Dr. Beer's book to you so I was glad you ordered it. I had the same feeling as I think gummblossom as it made me feel a little hopeless as I think I have some issues but can't really even afford the testing let alone the treatment. I think reading the book helped to put me in a bit of a funk and led me to need a break from the thread. 

I have pulled myself off all grains after going gluten free finally. Waturmama I initially bought some of the substitute products as a bridge but was dismayed at the processing and the fact that few are organic. I then moved to baking my own and then ditched all the grains except rice. I don't plan on staying grain free but am doing it "for now;" however long that is. The result has been that my joint pain is gone, I feel energetic, and I have discovered at least 1 new food allergy. I spoke to my TCM provider this week about what is going on with all my food intolerances and allergies, my not getting pregnant despite a great chart, etc... and my fear I have an immune issue. She referred me to an immune dr. told me it was crazy expensive and then told me the treatment so I immediately ordered the supplements and have started them. Time will tell if it makes a difference. I am hopeful as always. 46 and hopeful, maybe I am delusional but at least it gives me something to do. In the meantime I still toy with getting myself on the donor embryo list. I think once I decide to call it quits that will be the route I take. My optimism and belief in my body keeps me from diving right in right now. 

Ms.Goodbuns so glad to see you here again. Please keep us updated.

Welcome all you new ladies and congratulations to Purplefish and contactmaya, such wonderful news.

Edited by Kristin0105 - 2/11/12 at 9:52am

[Stevi]

Kristin0105...   Can you share with us what the new supplements are?

[Kristin0105]

Originally Posted by Stevi 

Kristin0105...   Can you share with us what the new supplements are?

Sure, it was actually very simple apparently megadoses of vitamin c and a supplement of quercetin. One website I read said to take 5-6 g of quercetin but I read on another site that more than 1g can damage your kidneys so I am sticking to the 1g of quercetin and right now I am only taking 2-3g of vitamin c. As I think over 3g can  prevent pregnancy by killing off the sperm so at least during o time I'll keep the vitamin c lower and then perhaps ramp up after the window of opportunity passes until next ovulation. I purchaSED THE ACTIVATED QUERCETIN AS IT HAS BROMELAIN IN IT wHICH SEEMS LIKE A GOOD IDEA ACCORDING TO SOME SITES i LOOKED AT. Opps, sorry for yelling  I also just added  Astaxanthin which is supposed to be a super antioxidant and I figure it can't hurt. '' I feel like the antioxidant queen with all my supplements. 

I purchased the ascorbic acid powder because it didn't have the fillers etc... that the pills have and I add 1g of baking soda to it add water and drink it after it stops foaming. It converts the ascorbic acid to sodium ascorbate (I think if I have my little knowledge of chemistry correct) which  is the more absorbable form of vitamin c. Also adding a little mg supplement as needed as too much vitamin c can deplete mg stores. It's a chemistry experiment every day in my kitchen.

Edited by Kristin0105 - 2/11/12 at 2:16pm

[Stevi]

Thank you Kristin0105!!! I'll be doing my homework on your list if AF arrives as expected. The Astaxanthin looks especially interesting.

[carmen358]

Originally Posted by WaturMama 

A  rant about going gluten-free:

I'm on day 8 of going gluten-free. Also cow-dairy-free. I just got back from the grocery store. It was stressful and expensive. For the last few years I've been of the mindset that the less processed the better. I like the Weston Price/Nourishing Traditions type thinking, too--eat like cultures where people have been healthy for a long time. So it's not like I was eating a whole lot of processed wheat. Our standard sandwich bread is mostly sprouted wheat and includes other grains. When we ate pasta we ate a mix of wheat and rice, because I think a diversity of grains is important. It seems to me that my ancestors ate wheat! So there I am at the store looking at all these foods that look more processed--with things like potato starch and tapioca flour and rice that ground up, which is not a traditional way to eat it as far as I know. I've been eating a lot of rice cakes and found out today they are made with super high heat. Argh. I also don't feel any different, but I am supposed to try a month. Mostly I just needed to rant, but I am curious how long it took others to feel a difference.

I thinking I should let this month play out. I am learning a few things I do like about different things to eat. I like polenta (unfortunately my dh and ds don't). But I also don't like my increased stress level, and we really can't afford a lot of expensive products right now.

Are you celiac? In Canada, if you have been diagnosed by a doctor you can claim most GF foods on your income tax at the end of the year! And yes, I agree that most GF stuff is over processed and over priced. It's become a huge marketing thing. I also think it's funny how they put GF in the "natural" section of the mainstream grocery stores...nothing natural about GF oreos ;) We buy GF bread but other than that we just avoid gluten products and try to eat whole foods as much as possible.

[LitMama]

Waturmama, I've been GF since I think August, and I definitely share your frustrations! At that time, I gave up gluten on the advice of a fertility nutritionist I had a consult with, and my TCM person (specializing in fertility) was also recommending to all her patients to give up wheat (not necessarily all gluten). Before I gave it up, I had been eating a mix of many kinds of whole grains, including sprouted bread, sprouted pasta, etc. and it certainly felt plenty healthy to me. I was horrified when I saw the GF offerings out there -- both the prices and the lack of nutrient density. It also bugged me that little to none of it was organic. It felt like I was taking a step down in terms of nutrition, and I couldn't see how that could help me. 

I had entered into GF having made a kind of uneasy agreement with myself to do this for a while, in case it gives my fertility a boost, but certainly not for life. It seemed to me that while giving up gluten is certainly critical for those who are intolerant or sensitive, it probably isn't necessary for the rest of the world. But because of the prevalence of the paleo diet and the thinking behind it, it's become a popular choice (and maybe even a belief system) for lots of people without celiac. It reminds me a bit of the low fat thinking of the 80's... fat was the evil nutrient, and since then, we've learned that good fats are important, some fats previously considered "bad" are actually good, and heart disease, etc. might be more linked to sugar than fat. I think it's possible that gluten has become the evil nutrient of our times! I have been a little skeptical of the ideas about grains in the paleo diet, since our ancestors seemed to thrive pretty well for a long time eating whole grains (especially prepared in certain ways, i.e., soaked, etc.). But I also have to temper that statement by admitting that I'm not nearly as educated about the paleo perspective as many of you on this board are. I've read articles and blogs (Chriss Kresser's is great and well researched) but no books. I have talked to a few nutritionists about it, and they've all told me they think organic, whole grains (especially sprouted) are healthy for most people. But I know I don't know the whole story.

So here's the ironic part... despite my skepticism, as a result of going GF, I've been eating a diet that sometimes looks pretty paleo! I just couldn't stand those substitutes. I tried buying as well as home baking breads, desserts, etc. and they just don't feel or taste right to me. So I now will go days without eating any grains. So instead of scrambled eggs and toast for breakfast, I'm having scrambled eggs and kale or kimchi. When I do eat grains, I tend to create modular meals for my family so where they are eating wheat, I'm swapping in some quinuoa or brown rice or polenta for myself. For example, when we have spaghetti and meatballs, I make their meatballs with bread crumbs and mine with quinuoa... and then I serve the sauce and meatballs over pasta for them, polenta or brown rice or quinuoa (or sauteed greens) for me. So I've managed to have a steady supply of simple substitutes on hand, without buying all the spendy, overprocessed stuff in the GF aisle at the grocery store. Once in a while as a treat, I buy pastries or bread or pizza shells at Mariposa Bakery (a great GF bakery), which is near you in the East Bay. Right next door to their storefront, there's also a liquor store that sells great GF beer! Not that I'm drinking beer these days, but nice to know about...

As for any health benefits... for about a week or two after cutting out gluten, I was really constipated, then it cleared up. My nutritionist says this common. I personally chalk it up to a sudden drop in fiber in my diet. After that, I did begin to feel like I had more energy, felt a little lighter and less bloated, and I dropped a few pounds (although I also fixed my thyroid at the same time, so that could have been a factor). I tended to attribute all of these changes to swapping out carbs for veggies, but who knows? I did eat gluten once on purpose and once on accident... the time I ate it on purpose, I had a large slice of my DD's birthday cake (which I had baked for her... there was pressure to share in the experience) and felt like crap for a week afterward. However, that could have been because it was... ahem... a large slice of sugary cake made with white flour! Anyhoo... I'll never know until I get tested, and I can't get tested until I start eating gluten again. Right now the plan is to stick with this until I get pregnant again and through the first trimester (or maybe longer).

I do look forward to returning to a wider variety of grains one day... and being able to eat the thousands of things that seem to contain soy sauce as an ingredient... sigh...

Kristin, it's good to see you again! Thank you for the kind words and thoughts. I'm glad you got some much-needed downtime and are feeling good again. Thanks for sharing your info on supplements with us. Were those supplements recommended by the (expensive) immune doctor?  

Gumblossom, I hope you have fun at the party tonight! Champagne, ahhhhh.....

AFM, the painters (AF) are here! I can't believe it. The end of a long journey. So I'm now 2 days into my first post-m/c cycle. My TCM person wants me to wait ideally 3 months before trying again, but understands that sounds like a long time and could create stress, so she's recommending I wait one month (this cycle) and in the meantime get an HSG to check out (and possibly clear out) my right tube. My only hesitation with that is I need to go through the RE department to get an HSG and I have a lot of fear and anxiety and anger around that department. Even if I get a referral to the other RE at my hospital (there are only 2, and I dislike the one I've already seen), I would likely run into the guy I don't like and it would bring back a flood of bad feeling that I don't need. I guess I'm trying to weigh these things and decide if it's worth it. Other than that, the only news is I'm still. so. exhausted. And finding everyday life (not to mention work) quite taxing. My TCM person tells me that's a normal side effect of major blood loss. And now here I am, bleeding again! Oy.

 

[WaturMama]

Thank you so much for the very thoughtful responses to my rant about GF. It is helpful and thought-provoking to read your thoughts and experiences. Also great to know I am not alone in some of my thoughts about this. Very interesting about all the segues into paleo. I'm feel a bit less frustrated with it this weekend.

Carmen, I do not have Celiac's. I am just trying GF because so many people have suggested it might help with my fertility and my allergies. I think that is so great that Canadian's with Celiac's  get financial help with their diet. Yay.

Gumblossom, I'm glad you read that book, too. I read something today that made me think of you. I can't afford all that testing either. It is overwhelming, but I am going for trusting this process and noticing what I am taking from it/what my thoughts are. One interesting development: it is making me feel more positive about the idea of taking progesterone, so maybe that is good. I resisted before because I've always tested fine for it and seem to have held onto pgs for a long time before miscarrying. The book suggests that the progesterone encourages the your body not to treat the embryo like an invader. For the first time I think it makes sense to try it.

Litmama, sorry to hear you are still feeling exhausted. That's no fun. Does the TCM person have a guess when you'll get your energy back. Also sorry to hear about the tension with the RE dept.

This very cool date, 2/12/2012, was the EDD for my last pg, the one I call Joy because I was just so delighted to get pg again the first cycle after my previous m/c. How amazing that it has already been a gestation's worth of time since then.  Joy.

[alittlesandy]

Originally Posted by WaturMama 

A  rant about going gluten-free:

I'm on day 8 of going gluten-free. Also cow-dairy-free. I just got back from the grocery store. It was stressful and expensive. For the last few years I've been of the mindset that the less processed the better. I like the Weston Price/Nourishing Traditions type thinking, too--eat like cultures where people have been healthy for a long time. So it's not like I was eating a whole lot of processed wheat. Our standard sandwich bread is mostly sprouted wheat and includes other grains. When we ate pasta we ate a mix of wheat and rice, because I think a diversity of grains is important. It seems to me that my ancestors ate wheat! So there I am at the store looking at all these foods that look more processed--with things like potato starch and tapioca flour and rice that ground up, which is not a traditional way to eat it as far as I know. I've been eating a lot of rice cakes and found out today they are made with super high heat. Argh. I also don't feel any different, but I am supposed to try a month. Mostly I just needed to rant, but I am curious how long it took others to feel a difference.

I thinking I should let this month play out. I am learning a few things I do like about different things to eat. I like polenta (unfortunately my dh and ds don't). But I also don't like my increased stress level, and we really can't afford a lot of expensive products right now.

Just popping in to say that I did it for 30 days, and it took that long to feel a difference. However, I think it was worth it and I conceived right after. I haven't been gluten free since then, but my DH is constantly reminding me that I was "different." He says I looked different and acted different! I lost a few pounds and remember just feeling better and healthier.

However, I did NOT use gluten-free substitutes but just stuck with foods that are naturally gluten-free. I ate a lot of rice and rice noodles (luckily I love those), as well as a lot of soups and salads. I eat a lot of sandwiches normally, so just rolled up some turkey and veggies in lettuce. I also ate a lot of homemade spring rolls. I did buy one gluten-free pasta but hated it. I got my pasta "fix" by making turkey and spinach meatballs, slicing up  and lightly steaming a bunch of zucchini with a vegetable peeler (to make thin "noodles') and putting sauce on that. I found that after awhile I started getting used to the routine and stopped craving pasta and pizza. I'm planning on trying again after this pregnancy.

[WaturMama]

Thanks, alittlesandy, that's a striking endorsement. At what point in the pg did you go back to eating gluten? Was your gluten eating different when you went back to it? I see from your date you are in third trimester now. That is awesome!! Enjoy!

How do you gf-ers like your polenta?

[alittlesandy]

WaturMama, I had such terrible morning sickness I couldn't stomach meat or most vegetables until I was sixteen weeks, so GF went out the window immediately, lol. I ate HORRIBLY my first trimester. The main things I could tolerate were toast and cereal! I've just now, at 29 weeks, starting cutting back on gluten and carbs. I will probably give myself six weeks "off" after the birth (I always want to eat everything in sight during those first weeks of breastfeeding) but then will jump right back into GF. I find it much easier to be GF in the summer. I will probably even do some raw vegan.

More GF ideas: I also ate a lot of chili, tacos, fish tacos made with corn tortillas, veggie omelets, etc. One of my easy favorites was to just heat some roast chicken and black beans and roll up with salsa in a corn tortilla. And I do love polenta.

[lovestolearn]

Originally Posted by WaturMama 

How do you gf-ers like your polenta?

GMO-free, thank you! :D

[Shell77]

Hi Ladies.... can someone take a look at my chart and tell me what they think? why doesnt it say I ovulated yet? UGH charting is so confusing to me.... I am on CD 17 and my breast are a little tender... I have had some mild cramping on the right side the last couple days, I have been super crabby the last 2 days :-/ and really tired and worn out. i would really appreciate any insight <a href="http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/37766f/">My Ovulation Chart</a>  

I have been reading all the GF forums... but I cant shed any insight on that... I was a vegitarian for 2 years.. but then had a meat breakdown when i went to Chicago for a visit.. I just had to eat a Beef ... yummo!! lol

[sherryvhkb]

I would guess cd15. Mine doesn't place crosshairs for O until i have three elevated temp days. I bet if your temp is still up tomorrow that was it. I didn't have a real clear temp drop for O this month either. I think because my time was off. It never fails that i hsve insomnia around o when i'm trying to temp so carefully.

[gumblossom]

Waturmama, I do like polenta, but haven't made it for ages. It was particularly nice made with dairy - milk or cream and cheese- very delicious, but I see you are not eating dairy. One thing I find with polenta, is that you really need to let it cook a long time so that it doesn't have any bitterness. Since doing Paleo I don't have any corn.

I heard from my doctor yesterday that my progesterone is 20 and anything over 11 is normal. It indicates that I ovulated, which I suspected all along, but she was sure the low estrogen meant I wasn't. It is reassuring that I am ovulating, and now I feel a bit excited at the thought that there is a possibility of conception. Of course I realize that my eggs might not be as good as I need, but I have faith that there is a golden one in there somewhere!

Shell, it does look like you Oed on day 15. You'll get your cross hairs when you've had 3 elavated temps, which I would say is tomorrow.

Waturmama - I've started baking with coconut flour and almond flour, or ground almonds, and the muffins and friands taste great. My kids really like them. I just google for recipes and have found a wealth of recipes.

[Shell77]

Thank You Sherryvhkb and Gumblossom.... I hope so ... I have been struggling with sleeping at night also!  well I guess I will know something soon ... Thank You again

[WaturMama]

Shell, I would call CD16 1dpo also. Probably all those symptoms are a nice active corpus luteum. Fingers and toes crossed for you!

Gumblossom, GREAT news about the progesterone. That is quite a nice number. Could you be pg this time? Thank you for the flour/muffin idea.

[miss_sonja]

So, AF is late again this month (due ~7th) and just for the heck of it, since I finally went to the Dollar Store and got some cheapo tests, I tested. And it was positive. But I don't really trust it. Are those cheapo tests reliable? I didn't use first morning. Anyway, it's just playing with my head!

I'm mostly GF due to following Primal Blueprint (see Mark's Daily Apple blog/forums for more on that). I do not have celiac sprue, but I've found avoiding grains to be good for me, in that I feel better, lost a little weight too. I don't miss it and I don't use substitutes, since I avoid grains in general. I don't want to do the almond flour/coconut flour thing since I think it would just increase my taste for baked goods, which is basically gone. 

We eat a lot of meat, chicken, pork, eggs, veggies of all sorts and fruits of all sorts. Nuts too. The kids do get some grains and the DH, but not as much as we all used to have.