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2 y/o screaming all day long - Page 2

post #21 of 44

Have you tried the getting down to her level then quiet voiced, "I'm sorry honey mommy can't understand you, please lower your voice" thing?    Works for some kids, of course it depends on why they are screaming, if she doesn't feel HEARD, it may work.  So hard to pinpoint these things.  Good luck! :)

post #22 of 44

Do NOT excuse her behavior.  Can't say that strongly enough.  It is MUCH easier to show her this will not be tolerated the first time it happens than after it's been excused.  I'm not advocating harshness, but I'm advocating a response to the behavior that teaches her it is inappropriate.  You also, of COURSE want to meet her needs and address any physical issues she might have, but DO NOT let the behavior slide and give excuses for it!

 

She's screaming at you while you prepare her food?  Show her how you're doing it, involve her, that might be enough to stop it because she can see what is happening.  If she can't be involved (maybe you are frying chicken for dinner or something) tell her and enforce the rule that she stay away from the stove to keep her safe, however you feel it needs to be enforced, but ENFORCE IT.  Simply  "too hot this time"  whatever, keep it simple, but ENFORCE IT.  Does not have to be a punishment, but simply a response to her, her need, and if necessary, something that shows her this is not how we behave.  After all, if you or I had a toothache, we wouldn't sit in the middle of a room full of people and scream about it.  Neither should she, but since she's 2, we don't expect her to know this--we show her what to do instead.  50, 100, 150 times if necessary, but we don't ignore it or excuse it because that does nothing to help learning.

post #23 of 44
Thread Starter 

Anyone know any good strategies for HN toddlers in dealing with behavior? I'm really struggling!

 

We went TV free and it going well although it's taking a lot out of me. The fits increased a bit b/c of it but now it seems to be getting better.

 

She is a young two and IDK how much she comprehends. The other night she had a fit for 45 mins b/c her food was hot and she wanted it NOW. I was blowing on it and ended up just eating my dinner while she had a 45 min fit..and when she screams she SCREAMS.

 

She does cook with me almost always but we have been having an issue with hands she always wants to touch everything hot and it's a real hassle but I keep telling her "No touch, hot!" The other day after lunch I was on the phone quick and walked into the kitchen and see her on a chair (she dragged over) and she was holding the burner I had just cooked on! (electric stove) Luckily it wasn't hot anymore just warm and she didn't hurt herself but it scared the crap out of me of course! This worries me b/c when I have the baby if I'm nursing or changing a diaper or w/e I can't have my eyes on her every second of the day KWIM? I'm looking into some sort of stove guard anyway...but I feel like maybe I encouraged it b/c she cooks with me? IDK everyone elses' kid I know isn't allowed near the stove or is terrified of it. I mean I don't want her to be afraid of things but I do want her to be safe.

post #24 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by sosurreal09 View Post
This worries me b/c when I have the baby if I'm nursing or changing a diaper or w/e I can't have my eyes on her every second of the day KWIM? I'm looking into some sort of stove guard anyway...but I feel like maybe I encouraged it b/c she cooks with me? IDK everyone elses' kid I know isn't allowed near the stove or is terrified of it. I mean I don't want her to be afraid of things but I do want her to be safe.


http://www.target.com/p/Stove-Guard/-/A-538772

 

Same company also has covers for the stove knobs.  I used both of these.

 

I don't know what the layout of your home is, but I would invest in a gate for the kitchen and keep it locked at all times if possible.

 

As for the fits, the ONLY thing that worked for us was for me to make myself available and ignore the tantrum.  (and your DD sounds EXACTLY like my DS - he's now almost 3yo and while he argues constantly, his fits are shorter and not as bad)  So, the food examples - when she's throwing a fit because the food is too hot (we had the exact same tantrum several times) I would say, "You can blow on it, or I can put it up until you are ready to eat"  If he started blowing on it, great!  If not, I put it out of his reach (his fave was to throw the bowl on the floor), and then I would sit and eat my dinner, or grab a book and ignore the fit until it passed.  Sometimes, it lasted 45min or longer, but soon it got shorter because he realized I wasn't going to do anything about it while he was screaming.  I also made a point after he calmed down to give a few cuddles (not during the fit - that made the fit longer even though it may seem counter-intuitive) and talk to him about asking nicely.

 

Whenever he did ask nicely - which I defined as however he asked when he wasn't throwing a fit, didn't depend on how verbal he was - I made a HUGE deal out of it.  I would say, "Oh THANK YOU for asking so NICELY, I LOVE it when you ask in your nice voice! Let me see if I can help you!"  And I would just make a big deal out of it.  Even when the answer to his request was "No" (can I have chocolate milk?  Can I have Candy?), I would still make a big deal out of the way he asked, "Oh, Thank you for asking so nicely!  It is so sweet when you ask nicely! We don't have any (enter forbidden item here), but how about we find something else yummy?"  If he reverted to a tantrum because I said no, I seamlessly go into making myself available while ignoring the tantrum.

 

I swear, it DOES get better - but you have set the boundaries, and be firm.  Also, when you say something, stick to it.  Think before you speak - because you have to follow through at this age.  "Don't hit me with that book, or I will take it away"  he hits with the book - he only gets the ONE chance because if you keep repeating yourself, when you DO enforce it, it seems arbitrary to them (even if it doesn't seem arbitrary to you).  Setting the boundaries is hard hard work (and I swear, your DD sounds like my DS's clone in your posts - really!), but it DOES get better!  Especially if you enforce the boundaries that you set, she will learn them they just have to be enforced the same every time. 

 

ETA - My DS cooks with me now, but when he was your DD's age, he wasn't allowed to (because he tried to touch the hot stuff).  I waited until he learned how to behave around the hot stove and oven, and then he started cooking with me. I had hard and fast rules surrounding the kitchen when he was younger - not allowed in the kitchen if the oven was being opened, not allowed in the kitchen if the burners were on (gas stove), etc. He learned those fast because they were enforced every single day. 

post #25 of 44
Thread Starter 

Things have gotten worse! Much worse!

 

She is a great kid. She is back to listening REALLY well and is polite and just lovely really but the tantrums have increased major! She seems to tantrum over NOTHING like all day long.

 

How I'm dealing:

 

When she has a tantrum I sit on the floor next to her and let her "get it out" while holding out my arms. I tell her when she is ready to find her calm place mommy will help her. She does really well with this method and will come into my arms and I rub her back and we do deep breaths. However the tantrum durations have hardly decreased we are still looking at some 20-45 min tantrums...

 

What I've done to improve our days:

 

I have the tv off 90% of the time unless she refuses a nap and we watch a movie together.

 

I have organized all of her toys and activities into separate containers so we can get something to do/play with and then put it all back. House is less stressful and we can concentrate on activity better.

 

Other than that she has been sleeping much better. She is still working on her molars as well so I know that is a factor...

 

It is just SO HARD and SO STRESSFUL. It's 2:38pm and she has had 14 tantrums today! DH has stopped being able to deal with them. He is so stressed out she just never seems to stop they are one right after another. They are over everything and nothing and they are everywhere (although less when we are out).

 

 

post #26 of 44

I second looking having someone look at her behavior.

 

Are you familiar with sensory processing issues? This site is *awesome* for explaining sensory stuff. My 24-mo-old has sensory, social, and speech issues (we dunno if she's ASD at this point, we suspect yes) and can easily have 2-3 dozen meltdowns a day, which is hard, as she's *such* a pleasant, compliant girl otherwise.

 

She also has GI issues- chronic constipation, and when she hasn't pooped in a day, you can almost set your watch by the meltdowns. Ditto if she's not been getting enough sensory input and stimulation.

 

Yes, consistency is important, but if there's something else going on, if it's not *just* a behavior she's learned works- if there's something *making* her meltdown, consistency is one of the least important puzzle pieces in putting together a happy day. Some days are days where DD needs to squish everything. Some days are days where she can't stand soft or smooshy things. Being able to quickly jump around your options helps more than always thinking you need to respond in a set way.

post #27 of 44

We had a kid in my older DD's daycare that was like that.  Actually maybe a little different.  All he did was whine cry tantrum.  I felt horrible for the parents.  Our Daycare provider was the only one on base that would take him.  And she ignored him.  She fed him, she talked to him and she gave him opportunities to play but if he did any of his normal things she pretended like it wasn't happening.  His parents did take him in and were told numerous things.  One was that he actually soothed himself through tantrums.  I don't know but I can kind of see it after being around him a whole day.  He actually lessoned his tantrums because he needed things she would pretend she didn't understand, and so he tried to find another way to communicate with the Daycare provider.  His tantrums didn't go away completely for her but they were pretty minimal.   It was kind of like a communication thing between the two of them.  However he still communicated that way with his parents.  I've seen them recently and he appears fine.  This has been years though.  I'm going to see if I can get in touch with our old DP to see if she knew if there was ever a real diagnosis and I'll get back to you.

 

By the way the way this kids acted was something I had never seen before.  It was a constant whine/tantrum and it never stopped. 

post #28 of 44
Thread Starter 

We are starting allergen testing this week to see if that is an issue. I'll keep an update.

post #29 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Imakcerka View Post

We had a kid in my older DD's daycare that was like that.  Actually maybe a little different.  All he did was whine cry tantrum.  I felt horrible for the parents.  Our Daycare provider was the only one on base that would take him.  And she ignored him.  She fed him, she talked to him and she gave him opportunities to play but if he did any of his normal things she pretended like it wasn't happening.  His parents did take him in and were told numerous things.  One was that he actually soothed himself through tantrums.  I don't know but I can kind of see it after being around him a whole day.  He actually lessoned his tantrums because he needed things she would pretend she didn't understand, and so he tried to find another way to communicate with the Daycare provider.  His tantrums didn't go away completely for her but they were pretty minimal.   It was kind of like a communication thing between the two of them.  However he still communicated that way with his parents.  I've seen them recently and he appears fine.  This has been years though.  I'm going to see if I can get in touch with our old DP to see if she knew if there was ever a real diagnosis and I'll get back to you.

 

By the way the way this kids acted was something I had never seen before.  It was a constant whine/tantrum and it never stopped. 

This is why a good functional behavioral analysis is a very good idea. The function of this particular child's tantrums is to communicate; Daycare provider forced the child to learn a different, more appropriate method to communicate. Fewer tantrums.

 

OP - I would strongly suggest a behavior analysis - especially if she is tantruming up to 14 times a day. It is utterly exhausting for you. A good behavioral assessment - which should include goals that you, as the parent, help to set - will be very helpful to you.

 

And I believe the allergy/food route may also be productive, as I've seen food senstivities in action in our friends' children, and sometimes it ain't pretty.
 

 

post #30 of 44

NO advice other than talking her through transitions. With DS1 he went through a period of time where every transition was hard for him, in the car, out of the car, in the cart, out of the cart, in the car, out of the car, in the house...ect..

So I started warning him and giving him extra time to understand what was going to happen next. I did a lot of "when your ready" When I could and waited until he was ready. (not ever said when I couldn't follow through) and the ok in a minute I'm going to count to three, if you want to do it yourself thats good but if I get to three I will help. 1 2 I'm going to help 3 (help) This worked very very well with him.

 

My son is a screamer too. its just hard and overwhelming for him sometimes.

 

Have you read "Raising your spirited child" Yet? That book helped remind me about how his mind is working (just like mine lol)

 

Not to discount anything else that may be going on, but even if she's feeling bad because of X Y or Z her feelings are still real.(not that you've implied they aren't) The book helped me try to empathize understand an address his.

 

I'm sorry she's having a hard time. I'm sorry your having a hard time.

post #31 of 44
Thread Starter 


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dakotablue View Post

NO advice other than talking her through transitions. With DS1 he went through a period of time where every transition was hard for him, in the car, out of the car, in the cart, out of the cart, in the car, out of the car, in the house...ect..

So I started warning him and giving him extra time to understand what was going to happen next. I did a lot of "when your ready" When I could and waited until he was ready. (not ever said when I couldn't follow through) and the ok in a minute I'm going to count to three, if you want to do it yourself thats good but if I get to three I will help. 1 2 I'm going to help 3 (help) This worked very very well with him.

 

My son is a screamer too. its just hard and overwhelming for him sometimes.

 

Have you read "Raising your spirited child" Yet? That book helped remind me about how his mind is working (just like mine lol)

 

Not to discount anything else that may be going on, but even if she's feeling bad because of X Y or Z her feelings are still real.(not that you've implied they aren't) The book helped me try to empathize understand an address his.

 

I'm sorry she's having a hard time. I'm sorry your having a hard time.

I do have the book and have read it! I KNOW absolutely even if it's caused by the allergens and what not her feelings are real! Everyone else has something to say about me helping her through them but I really don't give a crap it's my child and I'm not going to punish or leave her for being upset. Every time someone says something to me I says "She's 2 y/o get over it!" My sis is here right now and has said about 3x "I wonder if she will grow out of her temper?"

 

shrug.gif I'm just rolling with the punches over here!
 

 

post #32 of 44

She probably will grow out of it.  When is the question.  Honestly though if it's not allergies I would really consider finding out if it's her communication language.  Good luck
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sosurreal09 View Post


 

I do have the book and have read it! I KNOW absolutely even if it's caused by the allergens and what not her feelings are real! Everyone else has something to say about me helping her through them but I really don't give a crap it's my child and I'm not going to punish or leave her for being upset. Every time someone says something to me I says "She's 2 y/o get over it!" My sis is here right now and has said about 3x "I wonder if she will grow out of her temper?"

 

shrug.gif I'm just rolling with the punches over here!
 

 



 

post #33 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by sosurreal09 View Post

I do have the book and have read it! I KNOW absolutely even if it's caused by the allergens and what not her feelings are real! Everyone else has something to say about me helping her through them but I really don't give a crap it's my child and I'm not going to punish or leave her for being upset. Every time someone says something to me I says "She's 2 y/o get over it!" My sis is here right now and has said about 3x "I wonder if she will grow out of her temper?"

 

shrug.gif I'm just rolling with the punches over here!
 

 



No one said to leave her because she's upset. However, she's a toddler now and not a baby - which means that your responses to her tantrums and crying change. As a baby, it is our job as parents to respond to them when they cry in such a manner that meets those needs. Now, you need to meet her emotional needs, but that does not mean giving her everything she wants. You can reassure her, and remain close, while not giving in. Some children (mine particularly) do better when left to their own devices during a tantrum. I'm available to him, and he has access to me, but he does better and recovers more quickly if I'm not standing right next to him touching him and trying to calm him down. He needs space - your daughter might too. He knows that I'm there when he's ready, but he needs to be left "alone" (trying to cuddle him while he's screaming doesn't calm him at all, he needs me to be on the other side of the room while he sorts himself out. On the other hand, if he's sad he does like to be cuddled while he calms down, and I do cuddle him when he is crying because he's sad) so that he can calm down and then we talk about it afterwards.

 

Have you read, "Kids, parents and power struggles" ? It's amazing, I'm just getting through it now and I wish I had read it sooner - its about responding to our childrens emotional needs while teaching them how to more appropriately express them (i.e. asking for space rather than hitting, or taking a break rather than blowing up).

 

I agree with Imakcerka - she probably will grow out of this phase, and it may not have anything to do with allergies or anything else. My ds went through this exact same thing (he is highly spirited - I need to get my hands on that book!), and he has no allergies or food intolerances whatsoever.

 

 

post #34 of 44
Thread Starter 

I meant people IRL telling me that not you guys! thumb.gif

post #35 of 44
Thread Starter 

Well SOMETHING is going on for sure b/c we have been in and out of the hospital this month with unexplained vomiting and now she suddenly has skin issues. The theory is that since I'm 22 weeks preggo now she is not getting enough milk to wade off the reactions which apparently she was before (so we had no clue she had any more allergies).

 

So it's been a hell of a month and I'm exhausted should have went into detail about it before my other post!

 

So for tantrums all I am dong is sitting on the floor while she gets it all out and having my arms out so she knows I am available. Whens he starts to calm down I ask her if she would like mommy to pick her up and help find her clam place. (she always says yes) and then I hold her and rub her back and we do deep breathing.

 

She has become a lot more vocal since my OP.

 

I appreciate the help sometimes it can just be SO HARD!

post #36 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by sosurreal09 View Post

Well SOMETHING is going on for sure b/c we have been in and out of the hospital this month with unexplained vomiting and now she suddenly has skin issues. The theory is that since I'm 22 weeks preggo now she is not getting enough milk to wade off the reactions which apparently she was before (so we had no clue she had any more allergies).

 

So it's been a hell of a month and I'm exhausted should have went into detail about it before my other post!

 

So for tantrums all I am dong is sitting on the floor while she gets it all out and having my arms out so she knows I am available. Whens he starts to calm down I ask her if she would like mommy to pick her up and help find her clam place. (she always says yes) and then I hold her and rub her back and we do deep breathing.

 

She has become a lot more vocal since my OP.

 

I appreciate the help sometimes it can just be SO HARD!


Yes, it is SO HARD! I hear you on that mama!! I'm having different issues with my just about to turn 3yo.

 

The method you describe above sounds great, and being in and out of the hospital would make it SO much harder!! I hope the allergy testing tells you something and you can get to the bottom of at least that. That will help with her not feeling well, and then working on behavioral stuff will be easier. I still recommend Kids Parents and Power struggles - its still an awesome book. And, since she sounds very similar to my ds, 3 might be worse (in the sense that all my ds does all.day.long is argue with me).

 

post #37 of 44
Thread Starter 

Thanks for the rec. I will be sure to check it out. Hope my library has it!

post #38 of 44
Thread Starter 

Just found a chiro that takes out insurance! Woot woot! She is getting adjusted thurs. Her shoulder is cracking pretty badly IDK why..but anyways we have a chiro!

post #39 of 44
Thread Starter 

So far she is allergic to eggs (which she ate daily) and tomato. We will see what mon & wed bring. The testing is going OK though. No eggs today and she has calmed down a lot (although we have been busy)

post #40 of 44

Are these IgE allergies (tested via skin test or RAST blood test) or were they sensitivities? Just curious, they need to be taken out either way! If she's not being tested for sensitivities, remember that she can have those, too.

 

I hope that once these foods are out of her diet, you will start seeing some improvements.

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