new here-looking for support, advice, very long

[onebookheart]

Hello, I will try not to make this too long.  I have a beautiful 3 yr old dd who will be 4 next month.  For a little back round, she has always been a cautious, careful kid who was slow to warm up and she never liked strangers.  From way before the experts even claim they can tell a stranger, I swear she knew and preferred her inner circle.

Right after she turned 2, her social anxiety went up several notches.  She started acting afraid of other kids at the playground, and story time.  If, for instance, another kid is on a play thing, she will literally just avoid it.  She will only  go on things that are empty.  If she is about to slide and another kid comes up, she sort of panics and just decides she doesn't want to to do it after all.  This is true of any plaything or toy.

Right around the time this all started, she and I signed up for a parent/child class.  It went really badly, and we didn't even finish it.  All the kids were older than her (it was a 2-3 class) and she had many toys grabbed from her, etc.  I always thought this added to her anxiety.

So, everyone told me she would just grow out of it.  I decided not to do anything "formal" with her and we didn't sign up for anymore classes when she was 2.  I thought she just might need more time with mama at home.  We kept it to playgrounds, storytimes and things like that.

So, this fall I decided it was time to go back out there.  We signed up for another 2-3 class together with a different teacher.  She seems to really enjoy all we do there, and I am so glad she is getting to experience some positive things.  However, having said that, she still does not play with or near any of the other kids.  She is extremely attached to me.  She often needs me to hold her or hold her hand the first hour of class.  She will literally not go 2 inches from me.  If for instance, she is sitting at the table doing the art project and we need some more glue or something, she won't let me go get it without her.  If I even suggest such a thing, she gets kinda panicky.  Her teacher tries to talk to her, and she won't even look at her, she turns her head and gets really uncomfortable.   I should say, she has ended up in tears a few times in class, I think when things get kinda overwhelming.  When this has happened, I hug her and love her, but try not to bring attention to it, I try to move us on.

I'm struggling with several things.  I really want to be supportive and not make her feel like something is wrong with her, but sometimes while in class I just want to cry when I see how hard my daughter struggles and then all these other kids (who, by the way are younger, this time she ended up being the oldest in class) separate from their moms and play or at least let their moms go get their lunchbox while they wait, etc.  I have to  honest, I'm shocked at the level of social skill.  We have kids who come up to us saying, "can I play?", etc.  I honestly don't think my daughter knows about any of that kind of stuff. (not that she even wants to).  I have tried to talk to her and role play interactions with other kids.  I don't think she has to make friends, but I hate that she seems soooo uncomfortable with other kids.  I have also tried to tell her she doesn't have to speak to her teacher but she should look at her when shes talking.  But, this doesn't seem to be the right approach for my daughter.  Like some other things she struggled with, (potty training) she would get really uncomfortable if we tried to talk to her about it, and act ashamed.  I always feel like I am just making her feel bad about herself (something I don't want to do at all !) instead of helping her.  That is totally her personality, she kinda needs to work things out herself, but I also don't want to just let things go, you know?

Some other issues, we are still struggling with toys being grabbed from her or a kid trying to take her seat.  Totally normal for the age group, but what worries me is my daughter does nothing, no protest, and just looks scared and shocked.  If I don't notice it, it just happens.  We have role played what to do when your toy is taken, but again, she almost seems to take it like I am telling her she is wrong.  I guess I'm just mentioning that because (in case you didn't already pick up on it) my daughter is not typical.  I have seen even the quiet kids at least hold something out of reach if they feel another kid is trying to take it.  And I  have seen all kids grab a toy, but not my daughter, even though I have "taught" her that, she just never would.

Now, her class is about to end, and she can go into the 3-4 class.  This is 2 days a week and the parent comes as well, but I am worried about the dynamic.  In our class, it is not a problem for her to be by my side at all times.  Even during parent discussion, she prefers to sit with me.  I think the next class, the parents have discussion, while other parents watch the kids play. As of now, there is NO WAY my daughter would do that.  And here is my dilemna.  I really think I need to keep exposing her to things, but I also want to follow her lead.  I have gone back and forth on how "attached" I should let her be.  Part of me feels like I should follow the norm of putting her in classes without mom, etc.  But, my heart believes that really, it is OK that she is like this.  Why does she have to not be so attached already?  I would like to try the class, but I also don't want to do something my heart doesn't feel right about because of pressure from the teacher, you know? 

I have to say, I think I would feel better if her class was a bit more diverse in terms of personality.  It seems to me that all the kids we are around are so confident and comfortable.  There doesn't seem to be another kid who is a bit shy even.  So, my point is, she really stands out and I think that can make it harder. 

I guess I am just feeling a bit flustered.  I would really like her to grow at her own pace, but I can feel that people think I should "make" her do things.  I want her to be able to take a swim class or dance class, but I honestly don't see her being able to do things on her own at this point.  I'm starting to get worried about her future regarding school, etc.  I want her to feel that I accept her as she is, but I can't lie, because having her so attached to me can be draining and I can get annoyed.

I'm not even sure what the point of this post is.  I guess I am worried about her social development and was looking for some support or comments from people who parent a bit more in my style.   Thanks for listening and reading all this.

[bellyfruit]

My 5 yo dd is also slow to warm up and very sensitive.  At 2 and 3 she acted like your dd, and I was worried.  As she grows so does her confidence and ability to interact with others.  

I think it is important to both respect her feelings and to help her learn to interact with the world.  They do need exposure to different situations and other children.  But you are with her and can go slowly, so she really is being supported as she learns through observing.  

My dd really blossomed at preschool.  She learned to use her words and tell others what she needed.  She found playthings that appealed to her and played parallel to others for a full year before joining into things that others started.  It was slow going but now you would not know she was so "shy" when younger.  

I think you should just trust your instincts, be with her to explore things and give her the space and time to develop her abilities.  3 is still really young!  

[pianojazzgirl]

Do you have any friends with kids that you could invite over to play?  Maybe right now it's enough "adjusting" for her just to be around other kids.  It's good that you go to the playgroup, but don't push her beyond what she's ready for.  Perhaps if you could have some friends over she could get the chance to be around another kids but not in such a big (overwhelming) group and she might be able to slowly gain confidence to interact with them. 

Another thing that has worked for my shy ds is buddying up with an *older* kid.  Toddlers and preschoolers are pretty intense and egocentric (not a criticism!  it's just where they're at developmentally).  But a gentle older kid can sometimes really draw a shy little one out of her shell.  Some kids get a kick out of playing nicely with little kids.  If you have any families in your circle of friends with an older kid that fits that bill I'd suggest having them over.

Also (just a thought!) maybe you could post here in the "finding your tribe" section to see about hooking up with other mamas of shy/gentle kids to see about finding a less overwhelming playmate for her.  It might be a lot easier for her to relax around one kid who's quietly playing with blocks on the floor, as opposed to a room full of rambunctious 2-3yos.

[mommyofgb]

This is my dd almost to a t; whom is also 3. She attends a preschool/playschool twice a week and is the quiet kid who lets all the other kids steal her toys and walk all over her. Its so hard to watch. Even her teacher has mentioned that she constantly tells dd to stand up for herself, to tell the other kids that those are her toys, but to no avail. Sometimes she will say ''No, that's mine, or give it back'' but it comes out so mousey and quiet, she gets lost. Even my 16 month old ds is more social and playful at events...ugh, I totally get it, it's upsetting. I too wonder if my dd will grow out of it or if she has some sort of anxiety, but only time will tell. My MIL claims she cried every.single.day until 4th grade because she couldn't stand seperating from her mom to go to school, so perhaps its genetic, and my dh is quite sensitive too. I truley think some people are just more shy and that's who they are going to be, but putting her in social settings like mommy and me is the best thing IMO.

[SweetSilver]

My daughter was pretty close to that description at that age.  I did stop going to classes, preferring to stick with open gym instead of gymnastics and the playground.  Even that could cause trouble.  Storytime at the library was out for years.  When she was older she would scowl at the new kids at the playground and insist on going home.  And she hated playgroups for the very reason that you described-- toy snatching.  The kids-- slightly more savvy than toddlers at 4yo-- would still hover and hover waiting for her to give up toys until dd would burst into tears.  Or they'd say that she "has to" share.  Demanded that she share (the very few toys she chose to play with, in an overflowing roomful of toys, before mamas reading this get on their high horse about forced sharing.  Grrrrr......)  She was very slow to warm up with extended family, but after a few hours (that's right, not minutes) she would start running around having a blast.  Just a little more than a year ago, at 5, she started being more sociable.  While still protective of our home turf, she still started having fun with kids.  We had a regular playmate come over who would immediately have the girls in fits of giggles with his antics.  At the playground she started talking and getting them into games.  She will talk and talk with adults and charm their socks of.  At nearly 7 she's still getting the hang of things socially, still protective of her own toys and sometimes overwhelmed (like on busy days at the Children's Museum) but she is really coming into her own.  We homeschool, so I can't attribute her newfound sociableness to school or daycare of any kind.  She's been in gym class for over a year now. 

Anyway, hope this helps.  It might not *pass* but it will *ease*.  Gotta go.  Goodnight!

[Just1More]

My first was this way, too.  She seemed really, really overwhelmed in social situations.  She's okay now, too.  At 6, sometimes she can still be a bit awkward, but she responds well to coaching.  She seems to need to be told when people do this, you should do this.  She just catalogs all the information, and I have to try to find the gaps I've missed.  I've wondered if she isn't a bit spectrum-y.  When she was smaller, I was more concerned, but as she grows, whatever the issue is seems minor in the scheme of things.

But, I wanted to mention another angle.  My dd1 is smart.  I don't know if she is actually gifted, but she can memorize just about anything from only one or two hearings, reads at a 5th grade level (rapidly and voraciously), can do multiplication and division in her head, etc.  I was watching her play at a playplace with another child last spring, just before she turned 6, and I realized that she never was behind socially.  Actually, her problem was that she was way. way. ahead.

She didn't snatch toys or throw fits, etc, because she was so much more mature than that.  She didn't want to parallel play, she wanted to engage in conversation.  Her best friends are usually young teenagers.  At almost 2, she played beautifully with a very advanced 3 year old. 

So, consider that maybe your dd doesn't need interaction with 3 year olds.  Maybe she needs interaction with older kids (like a pp mentioned).  And maybe she isn't behind, but is actually more mature than her peers.

[SweetSilver]

Originally Posted by Just1More 

 So, consider that maybe your dd doesn't need interaction with 3 year olds.  Maybe she needs interaction with older kids (like a pp mentioned).  And maybe she isn't behind, but is actually more mature than her peers.

This is what I forgot to mention in my own post.  My daughter also had the most trouble with her exact peers.  Even though the troubles are less, she still does noticeably better with babies and little toddlers and older kids (my dd is nearly 7.)  When she was 2-4yo I absolutely didn't blame her for not wanting to play with them!  Now she has less reason to avoid them, but she still makes friends more easily with those older and younger than her, especially adults.  I don't know whether it's anything to do with maturity in our case, but somehow the stress is eased.  The summertime playgroups when the big kids would show up and run around she absolutely loved.  I also forgot to mention that even open gym became a problem when both my girls started not being able to share hoppity balls and the bean bags, even when they weren't playing with them.  Too much drama, so we stopped going for a year.

[Emmeline II]

Originally Posted by Just1More 
But, I wanted to mention another angle.  My dd1 is smart.  I don't know if she is actually gifted, but she can memorize just about anything from only one or two hearings, reads at a 5th grade level (rapidly and voraciously), can do multiplication and division in her head, etc.  I was watching her play at a playplace with another child last spring, just before she turned 6, and I realized that she never was behind socially.  Actually, her problem was that she was way. way. ahead.

She didn't snatch toys or throw fits, etc, because she was so much more mature than that.  She didn't want to parallel play, she wanted to engage in conversation.  Her best friends are usually young teenagers.  At almost 2, she played beautifully with a very advanced 3 year old. 

So, consider that maybe your dd doesn't need interaction with 3 year olds.  Maybe she needs interaction with older kids (like a pp mentioned).  And maybe she isn't behind, but is actually more mature than her peers.

These links were recently posted on the learning at school board and seem to fit this idea:

Intensities

http://www.sengifted.org/SMPG/smpg_may10_column.shtml

Friendships

http://www.sengifted.org/articles_social/Gross_PlayPartnerOrSureShelter.shtml