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[BaileyB]

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Edited by BaileyB - 2/10/12 at 11:54am

[philomom]

Okay, not to pick on you but then your kid won't have a social security number or be able to get a passport. My kids couldn't even get a license to drive a car without three forms of id, two of which were directly related to proof of birth. Why would you not get some sort of birth certificate? Am I missing something?

[BaileyB]

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Edited by BaileyB - 2/10/12 at 11:24am

[Imakcerka]

 I do believe our dear former President Bush made it illegal not to have a Social Security number... which means you have to have a birth certificate.  I know, pesky laws.  I think it wouldn't be worth the annoyance of not having one even thought I think it's all crap.

[zinemama]

Originally Posted by BaileyB 

I am just wondering because I have heard of UP/UC'ers not getting them. I'm not sure not having a social security number is a bad thing....lol.

I don't understand why not having a SSN is something to laugh about. Your child would not be able to:

be claimed by you as a dependent on your taxes
get government services he may be eligible for as a minor
have a bank account/college savings account opened in his name by you
apply for financial aid for college
get a passport
get a driver's license
open his own bank account
get a mortgage
get a state ID
apply for most jobs
collect social security as an adult (if it's still around)

What's the benefit of having your life be so constrained?

[JenRN]

Originally Posted by Imakcerka 

 I do believe our dear former President Bush made it illegal not to have a Social Security number... which means you have to have a birth certificate.  I know, pesky laws.  I think it wouldn't be worth the annoyance of not having one even thought I think it's all crap.

I work in a hospital (labor and delivery). On the birth certificate form, you have to check if you want a social security number or not. Now, I've never seen or heard of anyone declining a SSN, so I can't speak to what happens if you do. I just know its an option.

[zinemama]

Originally Posted by Imakcerka 

 I do believe our dear former President Bush made it illegal not to have a Social Security number... which means you have to have a birth certificate.  I know, pesky laws.  I think it wouldn't be worth the annoyance of not having one even thought I think it's all crap.

Getting a SSN for your child is voluntary.

http://ssa.gov/pubs/10023.html

[BaileyB]

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Edited by BaileyB - 2/10/12 at 11:24am

[Imakcerka]

You are correct.  Then is it the birth cert you need for vital records?  Like it would be considered concealing or hiding a live birth?  I can't remember.

[Greenlea]

Originally Posted by JenRN 

I work in a hospital (labor and delivery). On the birth certificate form, you have to check if you want a social security number or not. Now, I've never seen or heard of anyone declining a SSN, so I can't speak to what happens if you do. I just know its an option.

I thought it was just an option you check if you want the hospital to forward your info to get the SSN automatically.  Otherwise, if you don't check the box, it means you would have to go to the SSN office and apply for one in person?

[LindyGirl]

I had a huge birth certificate headache with one of my children. She couldn't get a BC with an SSN, due to the laws of the state she was born in. The SSN was mailed to us, but never arrived. Because we didn't know the SSN#, we could not get a new card. After six months of wrangling, we finally had to ask our congressman to intervene. Without the birth certificate, our insurance refused to cover her after a certain point.

I have a friend whose family was very off the grid and did not get BCs or SSNs for their kids. They had to apply for them as adults, which is next to impossible without a BC. My friend's first child died of SIDS at 8 days old, after being born healthy. They buried her in their homestead. Their small town law enforcement eventually found out, and a formal investigation into them was launched, their daughter's body was exhumed, and while they were eventually cleared of any wrongdoing, it put them through a lot of heartache unnecessarily. The eventually felt like they were being targeted because of their anti-government beliefs, and had they been more "mainstream," reported her birth and death, etc., it would have been less hurtful.

They later went on to have nine more children, and did get BCs/SSNs for them.

[BaileyB]

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Edited by BaileyB - 2/10/12 at 11:25am

[BaileyB]

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Edited by BaileyB - 2/10/12 at 11:25am

[zinemama]

Originally Posted by BaileyB 



Anonymity and not being taxed, or tracked, etc. is the main reason. As far as bank account, mortgage, getting a job: Bank account in not a big deal. Get a safe in your house, live debt free, pay as you go, etc. Mortgage: buy a for sale by owner home or a rent to own home. Jobs: find a cash only job, etc. There's a lot of illegals with no SSN that get jobs. Or farm, which we do. State ID and driving is the only problem that will have to be worked out.

I'm not trying to be combative but there are plenty of good reasons not to have a national tracking number.

I don't see you as combative, no worries! understand that you may feel this way, but perhaps as an adult your child might like to visit other countries, see how other people live. Maybe "going through airport crap" will be worth it to him. Perhaps your child will choose to apply his love of learning to a college education and may need aid to do so. Maybe he won't think that's "gross" (not sure what you mean by that - that formal education is disgusting?). Nor am I clear why you would find programs like disability payments - if, God forbid - your child should be disabled, or WIC, which helps so many low-income families, to be "gross" as well. I get that you don't like them, but It's a very strange word choice. Maybe you can elaborate?

All I'm saying is, it's much more difficult to get a SSN as an adult than as a child, particularly if you don't have a BC, as a pp mentioned, and not having one takes a lot of choices off the table.

I don't quite understand the anonymity thing.

[Imakcerka]

Well make the kid a North American rather than a US Citizen.

[serenbat]

 Otherwise, if you don't check the box, it means you would have to go to the SSN office and apply for one in person?

SSN can NOT be got via a birth Certificate you must show proof of birth- your BC means nothing and they will not except it- the hosp sends proof of birth (different) the physician, MF or a ped can also sign this- they have a form at SS that they give you and it states BC is not excepted --- this is for a young child

we went thru this three years ago

we could not use our BC for our DS and had to have the SS form filled out by his ped

ETA - some states do issue BC for stillborns that is one of the reasons BC are not valid  

Edited by serenbat - 11/28/11 at 4:58pm

[Imakcerka]

I think all states are different, the hospital sent my information to vital records.  I then picked it up from there and was able to request a SSN with the birth certificates.  I've lost SSN cards before and brought in the BC's.  It can be done.

[bri276]

There are in fact many countries that can be reached from the US without airport crap.  

The use of the word gross to describe benefits that allow people to gain access to food and health care that they would otherwise suffer without is making it difficult to respond seriously.

[Lisa1970]

I think it would be cruel to not allow a child to have a birth certificate. I suppose it would be ok for you, as you are not the one who would be unemployable, unable to ever go to college, unable to anything in the future. But it would only seriously hurt your child. Makes no sense.

[stik]

Originally Posted by Imakcerka 

Well make the kid a North American rather than a US Citizen.

You can't be a North American citizen - North America is not a country.  

I generally think children should have social security numbers, and while I think the many perspectives on that issue are interesting, in this thread, mainly I'm offended by the poster who described accepting government benefits that help people in need as "gross."  Is it also gross to accept government subsidies by driving on interstate highways?  What about buying food grown by farmers who receive government subsidies?  Or accepting a government subsidy to run a farm?  It's infuriating to me that anyone would consider people in need of government assistance "gross."