Sleep! How much are YOU getting? - Page 3 « Back to Group Discussions

[nald1]

cant find a new chat thread so Ill post here- late nights are killing me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  DS used to go to bed by 9:30 - now he wont go down unless im lying there and I cant seem to get ready for bed- and I was getting used to 15 minutes of reading and alone time ;(    Is it possible he suddenly hates his moses bed/co-sleeper combo?  i feel like it's more about wanting to be right there next to me in the bed. I dont mind that, only would love to get ready myself!

[Tear78]

nald, I hear you on the late nights. I think it's really likely he wants to be next to you. Ever since I went back to work DD hasn't been getting enough Mama/boobie time, and she has gone from a 8-12 hour nightime sleeper to an up-all-night-I-wanna-nurse girl. I've been really sad because she seems almost traumatized by how little of me she gets now. DD finally broke us last night. She won. Clever little monkey. (Or poor little mouse who just wants her mommy more than 4 hours a day). I just CANNOT continue to teach fifth graders on anywhere between 2 and 5 hours of sleep. We're going to push our bed against the wall so that on tough nights we can just bring her in bed with us. I've been avoiding this because it scares me. Does anybody have any tips? We have a pillow-top mattress, and German-style blankets. We each have our own, and they are twin-sized so we can curl them around us like our own little cocoons. They're not down, but they have a duvet cover and doubled blankets inside. Don't these two things, the mattress and the blankets, break cosleeping rules? What can I do?

[cat13]

Tear, I have no idea how I would be able to work if I didn't have River in bed with us. Ever since I started back, he is on the boob all night long, just like your DD! I just latch him on and go back to sleep. Even though it's broken sleep, it's still sleep.  What is she in right now, a crib? If so, you can do what we do, which is turn it into a side-car to the bed. I used this tutorial. If you have any questions, feel free to ask me! 

If you don't have a crib, you can get a railing like this or this, or just push against the wall. I just hate being against the wall, then I have to crawl over DH to get out of bed. 

Regarding the bed sharing "rules," I don't think it's always realistic to follow all of them. You can't really buy a new bed, but you can adjust other things. You say you have a pillow tip mattress, but is it super squishy? Then just be cautious that DD doesn't sleep on her tummy.  I don't know what German blankets are, but if you don't think they are safe, you could just get a new blanket for yourself. This blog post has helpful hints on bedsharing, like just having the blankets up to your waist and wearing long sleeves to keep yourself warm. Personally, I use a blanket all the way up to my neck, but it never seems to get over River's face. Part of the great thing about bedsharing is I feel very in tuned to River and I feel like I would wake up if he was in distress. Dr. McKenna is a big co-sleeping researcher and has a great website with lots of the benefits. 

Good luck, Tear! I hope you can find a situation that gives you more sleep! 

ETA: None of this helps with your baby decides that it's playtime at 3am, and then only goes back to sleep when it's time to get up for the day anyway. sigh

[nald1]

Does anyone know how to make the cosleeper a cozier space?  it looks so hard and uninviting to me.....

[Baby_Cakes]

nak -- tear when i have 2 hands, i'll respond to u.
 

Originally Posted by nald1 

Does anyone know how to make the cosleeper a cozier space?  it looks so hard and uninviting to me.....

right??  heres finn's.

i have it inclined for his reflux, a blanket down, and his white noise/sleep giraffe.  Cozy, i think!

[Beckily]

Tear- we've always totally broken the co-sleeping rules. We had our newborn in bed with us on a 3" memory foam thing. And he slept on his daddy, not with me. Now he's on me all the time and we've taken off the foam - it hurt our backs.

So what I do (because I don't want to sleep in clothes OR be cold and he wants to be plastered against me:

He sleeps on either side of me, head at tit level. That way it's a quick thing to roll over and feed him when he gets restless. I nurse on my side and then lay on my back. He just sleeps with his head in my armpit. I don't know about him, but apparently he likes it. OR I scoot him up  so his head is level with ours - but only when he's in the middle. He sleeps on his side or on his back, his choice as he easily moves between the two. He's great with blankets, but if they get on his face he thrashes and I fix it.

Yours is older than mine, and so probably has even better body control.

Oh! Blankets. So when he's on my side and I'm on my back I have the blanket over the opposite shoulder, but down to his level on his side. So I'm kind of toga-ed. If I worry, I just hold the blanket with the hand that's around him so it can't go over him.

He even is good if I roll on my side and face away from him - I snug my back against him so I can feel him moving/breathing and he can pet me as needed. It works great.

Hope this is helpful :)

[Carlyle]

Originally Posted by Tear78 

nald, I hear you on the late nights. I think it's really likely he wants to be next to you. Ever since I went back to work DD hasn't been getting enough Mama/boobie time, and she has gone from a 8-12 hour nightime sleeper to an up-all-night-I-wanna-nurse girl. I've been really sad because she seems almost traumatized by how little of me she gets now. DD finally broke us last night. She won. Clever little monkey. (Or poor little mouse who just wants her mommy more than 4 hours a day). I just CANNOT continue to teach fifth graders on anywhere between 2 and 5 hours of sleep. We're going to push our bed against the wall so that on tough nights we can just bring her in bed with us. I've been avoiding this because it scares me. Does anybody have any tips? We have a pillow-top mattress, and German-style blankets. We each have our own, and they are twin-sized so we can curl them around us like our own little cocoons. They're not down, but they have a duvet cover and doubled blankets inside. Don't these two things, the mattress and the blankets, break cosleeping rules? What can I do?

ARRRRRRGH!  I've lost this message twice now.  Third time's a charm?  I find it ironic that *I* am not getting very much sleep because I am up here rewriting this ...  Good thing I you so much

Here are some of the things I've read.  I can't find my favorite for some reason (I read it while pregnant with Maggie and it totally quelled any fears I had about it, and had me make changes that made it much safer than what we did the first time around...anyway, onward).  First:

http://aappolicy.aappublications.org/cgi/reprint/pediatrics;116/5/1245.pdf  is the AAP Website, very conservative.  It mentions many scary things about cosleeping, none of which apply to your family: smoking, babies under 3 months old, alcohol (use the crib on nights when you've had something to drink right before bed, okay?), multiple kids in the same bed, couch co-sleeping (never do this).  You'll notice their mainstream bent in that they say these things are “hazardous.” However when it comes to babies sleeping in their parents room vs a different room they say “keeping your baby in the same room may decrease the risk of SIDS” instead of “keeping your crib in another room is hazardous.”  Despite their mainstream bent, none of the risk factors that they mention apply to you!  Hopefully this will help set your mind at ease a bit about it AS LONG AS YOU FOLLOW SAFE CO-SLEEPING GUIDELINES.

Which brings us to this really nicely written article that felt very unbiased (in either direction) to me.  It also talked a lot about safety concerns: http://www.parentingscience.com/bed-sharing.html

This was a nice article that might help you feel better about cosleeping: http://www.phdinparenting.com/2009/01/11/co-sleeping-safety/#.TuWwiFa8OSo  It also really covers a lot of the safety precautions.

Here’s another one: http://cosleeping.nd.edu/frequently-asked-questions/#6

MY THOUGHTS

I would get rid of the duvet cover and just use layered wool blankets if you can find them.  Soft bedding is cited as a risk factor everywhere.  I’ve never seen what’s inside your duvet cover to know what the blankets inside feel like, but I remember the blankets seemed awfully poofy.  I like flat wool blankets because they’re super warm, but thin and not poofy at all.  Ask mom if she has some you can borrow.  I have 2-3 and can mail them to you if you need.  Or you might try hitting up an army/navy store for used ones.  Actually, one of the articles suggested no blankets and just dress you both warmly (as you would do for her in a crib with no blanket) is the safest…what did you do for her when she slept in a crib?

I also think you should see if you can trade mattresses with mom and dad for a while or something to get rid of your pillow top.  Could you turn the mattress over (upside down) so that the pillow top was on the bottom and you were sleeping on the firmer side of the mattress??  Again, soft bedding is a no-no...

Several sites actually said DON’T push your bed against the wall.  They recommend taking your bed off its frame and just putting your mattress in the center of the floor of your room.  That reduces crevices for her to get trapped (between bed and wall or bed and head board, etc) and reduces problems if she falls out of bed, since you'll be so close to the floor (my bed it she wiggles right in next to you though--that's what my kids did!).

Also, note that several of these articles mention that if you’re excessively tired maybe wait to try it.  Can you save it for a Monday night after a nice weekend of lots of sleep?  Once you’re underway, I think you’ll find you sleep better this way…I sure hope so, for your and Anika’s sake!!  But you do want to make sure you're not overtired the first few times you try it since you're less likely to wake up well if you're exhausted.

Here are a couple more in case you're really plush with time and would rather read things on the computer than, say, sleep...

http://www.providence.org/alaska/tchap/maternity/bedsharing.htm

http://safebedsharing.org/safetyguidelines.html

I LOVE YOU!!!

[Baby_Cakes]

Tear - we have a soft mattress I'm sure is pillow top and normal sheets, normal pillows and a normal comforter.  When DD was nb, she shared the bed w/us from day one. I would nurse her side lying with my bottom arm under my head and my top arm across her.  I'd wear a thin long sleeved shirt to keep my arms warm (she was a winter baby too), and kept all blankets at waist level so they wouldn't come up over DD's face.  Her face was down low enough my pillow never came close to her.

Of course we want to ensure the safety of our babies, but as long as you follow your instincts and don't do anything obviously dangerous, your little mouse will be just fine. And you'll feel so much more rested!!  Both of you will win!  The rules were invented after the fact.  I didn't even know there were rules with my first.  We just did what worked!!

[jillybeans]

We actually lost a nephew to SIDS. SO I'm pretty well researched on the risk factors. We put Reed to sleep in the pack n' play, but he does wake in the early morning hours to nurse, and we fall asleep in bed together. Things I always make sure of:

He is NOT overly warm. We take off the blanket sack he's in before he comes into bed with me.
I am wearing layers. So that we do not have to have blankets above my waist, I wear layers. Means dh and I fight over how hot it is when reed isn't in the bed, but I avoid blankets that way.
He lays propped up on my arm. Always. Never ever ever does he just lay in bed beside us. If his head is on my upper arm, then I'm always aware of where he is, even while asleep. This always keeps him off of the soft mattress/sheets/pillow as well.
IF he has a cold, he stays in HIS bed. End of story. If airways are already restricted, it's just not worth the risk to keep him with me.

That's what works for us, with all of the extra fear we have floating around. Nathan did not die from co-sleeping, but since he passed (Feb '09) I have been extra-cautious. Way more than I was with the first two. But we are still able to partially co-sleep successfully.

[Baby_Cakes]

Originally Posted by jillybeans 

We actually lost a nephew to SIDS. SO I'm pretty well researched on the risk factors. We put Reed to sleep in the pack n' play, but he does wake in the early morning hours to nurse, and we fall asleep in bed together. Things I always make sure of:
He is NOT overly warm. We take off the blanket sack he's in before he comes into bed with me.
I am wearing layers. So that we do not have to have blankets above my waist, I wear layers. Means dh and I fight over how hot it is when reed isn't in the bed, but I avoid blankets that way.
He lays propped up on my arm. Always. Never ever ever does he just lay in bed beside us. If his head is on my upper arm, then I'm always aware of where he is, even while asleep. This always keeps him off of the soft mattress/sheets/pillow as well.
IF he has a cold, he stays in HIS bed. End of story. If airways are already restricted, it's just not worth the risk to keep him with me.
That's what works for us, with all of the extra fear we have floating around. Nathan did not die from co-sleeping, but since he passed (Feb '09) I have been extra-cautious. Way more than I was with the first two. But we are still able to partially co-sleep successfully.

I agree with putting the baby in the crook of your arm or propped up on your arm.  It's really helpful and does make you more aware of them.  Plus, it keeps them out of the way of the other parent in case they aren't as aware.  

[nald1]

thanks Carrie- he does look cozy - he's bigger than my little guy so he doesnt look as lost :)

[SoonToBe]

I was nervous about cosleeping at first too.  I totally understand.  What I do is this:

- I keep the room a little warmer so I don't have to wear covers, but I do sometimes cover us with the sheet.  I only do it up to his waist and if I need the comforter, I make it so there is no way I could accidentally pull it up over us.

- I sleep on my side and put a pillow btwn my knees so I don't accidentally roll over on him.

 He sleeps on his back beside me or on his side facing me.  Sometimes he is in the crook of my arm, sometimes not

- He also sometimes sleeps on his tummy on my chest.

- I make sure he's not to hot and I make sure there are no pillows that could move onto him.  He is very close to my pillows, but my arm is there and there is also no way he could pull it down on him.

- His face is within inches of mine so it's unlikely I would be pulling covers over him anyway since that would mean I would be pulling covers over my own head.

- Also, sometimes I do sleep on my back with him next to me, but that's a new thing and I'm not quite as comfortable with that, but I'm not sure why.

Hope that helps.

[Peony]

I break every single co-sleeping "rule" out there, except for the smoking and drinking ones. I keep the blankets pulled up to me, we have a pillow top mattress, on and on.  I've co-slept with 4 kids over almost 9 years, 3 out of my 4 still bedshare on a nightly basis and the last one will gladly crawl in if there is a spot one night! We've never owned a pack and play, crib or co-sleeper, they solely sleep in my bed until they are old enough to sleep in a regular bed after age 5 or so.  What I do is just make sure baby is pressed up against me. Most of the time the baby is curled up in my arm. Read through James McKenna's research. co-sleeping is very, very safe. I can say from personal experience that I did have a baby stop breathing on me at night while co-sleeping, and I woke up instantly.  You become very finely tuned to them, and they to you and that is why smokers are strongly discouraged from bed sharing because the babies will mimic their often irregular breathing patterns, fine for an adult, not so for a baby. DD2 had/has significant respiratory problems, she was still on O2 but not on monitors when she pulled her lovely, 'let's take a breath and then not do it again" stunts on me, she was ill for 6 months and of course we didn't spend that entire time in the hospital. 

[Beckily]

Originally Posted by Peony 

I break every single co-sleeping "rule" out there, except for the smoking and drinking ones. I keep the blankets pulled up to me, we have a pillow top mattress, on and on.  I've co-slept with 4 kids over almost 9 years, 3 out of my 4 still bedshare on a nightly basis and the last one will gladly crawl in if there is a spot one night! We've never owned a pack and play, crib or co-sleeper, they solely sleep in my bed until they are old enough to sleep in a regular bed after age 5 or so.  What I do is just make sure baby is pressed up against me. Most of the time the baby is curled up in my arm. Read through James McKenna's research. co-sleeping is very, very safe. I can say from personal experience that I did have a baby stop breathing on me at night while co-sleeping, and I woke up instantly.  You become very finely tuned to them, and they to you and that is why smokers are strongly discouraged from bed sharing because the babies will mimic their often irregular breathing patterns, fine for an adult, not so for a baby. DD2 had/has significant respiratory problems, she was still on O2 but not on monitors when she pulled her lovely, 'let's take a breath and then not do it again" stunts on me, she was ill for 6 months and of course we didn't spend that entire time in the hospital. 

I started getting twitchy last night about how I didn't seem worried enough, so thank you! ;) This made me feel better.

I'm so glad that you woke up!! I wake up if he switches from the nice noisy breathing I like to the annoying quiet breathing.

[sajgos]

How do you deal with nighttime and diaper changes for your little ones? We do a lot of EC during the day, and it's great, but at night, we'd like to sleep without having to change their diapers. Our girls are 4 months now, and sleep together on a bed on the floor just outside our room. We have been using Bum Genious pocket diapers at night. Our girls will usually go to sleep around 7pm and we nurse when they wake up around midnight, and again around 5am. We change them/offer a chance to pee, before feedings and 90% of the time they will pee and are often dry. This is great, but between those two feedings in the night, one or both will fuss/wake up multiple times because (I think) she needs to pee. If we just give the pacifier back at those times, she will go back to sleep, but wake up half hour later wet. Have any of you had a similar situation? How often do you change your babies at night?

[Baby_Cakes]

First of all..

EC, BF'ing, CD'ing with twins!?  OMG mama, you are my new hero!!

I use sposies at night and only change him if he's super soaked.  Lots of mamas on here do cloth at night tho and can probably help out better than I can.  I just couldn't NOT commend you for your hard work!!

[cat13]

Maybe your LOs are more sensitive to being wet because you EC? My guy is perfectly happy to hang out in his 10 lb diaper till morning, because he never poos at night. I just use 3 inserts in the diaper. 

[Carlyle]

Originally Posted by Baby_Cakes 

First of all..

EC, BF'ing, CD'ing with twins!?  OMG mama, you are my new hero!!

!!!!

Originally Posted by sajgos 

How do you deal with nighttime and diaper changes for your little ones? We do a lot of EC during the day, and it's great, but at night, we'd like to sleep without having to change their diapers. Our girls are 4 months now, and sleep together on a bed on the floor just outside our room. We have been using Bum Genious pocket diapers at night. Our girls will usually go to sleep around 7pm and we nurse when they wake up around midnight, and again around 5am. We change them/offer a chance to pee, before feedings and 90% of the time they will pee and are often dry. This is great, but between those two feedings in the night, one or both will fuss/wake up multiple times because (I think) she needs to pee. If we just give the pacifier back at those times, she will go back to sleep, but wake up half hour later wet. Have any of you had a similar situation? How often do you change your babies at night?

I think if you're using Bum Genius pockets at night you're okay leaving them in there even after they pee because they (supposedly) wick the moisture away from their skin, right?  So they shouldn't feel too wet/uncomfortable once they're done peeing.  Plus, I imagine with twins that sleep for you is at a premium!  That said, however, I found that with my dd's if I did manage to get them to pee when they woke up needing it, then they did sleep a bit longer afterwards (they got ALL the pee out instead of peeing enough to take the edge off and then stopping because they didn't like peeing in a diaper).  Either way, I think you're fine!  For what it's worth, my dd2 is 14 months now and sometimes goes all night without peeing and wakes up dry (despite nursing many times through the night), and sometimes just needs one pee around 1:30am.  If you stick with it, you may be done with nighttime pee problems sooner.  But with twins?  I dunno, I might opt for sleep!  Good luck!

[Tear78]

Thanks everybody for your advice and ideas! We tried putting her in her bed for the first couple wakings and then bringing her in bed with us the rest of the night. Jillybeans, it really helped to hear that you also have your LO sleep with a head on your shoulder. This is how I feel comfortable, too, but I didn't know if it was ok. Unfortunately, though I was sleeping better, DH was not really sleeping much at all, and he's the primary caregiver during the day so I want him to be alert and safe to take care of her. He kept waking up when she made a noise, and then he couldn't fall back asleep until she made the next noise. We're trying to find a compromise, but it sort of feels like one or the other of us has to be exhausted to tears. I have 10 days vacation from school, so we're going to try the crib again since I can sleep during the day. If she's having a really hard time I'll bring her in bed, but I'm going to really try. I think part of the problem was that she was so gassy, and I'm cutting out dairy to see if that helps (ok....SERIOUSLY...Christmas chocolate is staring me in the face...this is HARD). But after three days dairy-free her gas already seems better. oh boy...on the one hand I want this to be an "easy" solution, but on the other hand...I WANT CHOCOLATE! lol...I'll have to go buy some good dark chocolate.

DH and I were saying that food is the only hobby we have time for now, lol...beyond playing with DD which is an awesome hobby. But I'm a little frustrated with how much food I can't eat between reflux and gas. Does anybody have any ideas for really yummy treats that are dairy-free? I miss my smoothies and bubble teas!

[Baby_Cakes]

Originally Posted by Tear78 
Does anybody have any ideas for really yummy treats that are dairy-free? I miss my smoothies and bubble teas!

omg.

http://chocolatecoveredkatie.com/

Not sure how yummy you think they are, but oreos are dairy free, with a nice glass of soymilk, or almond milk,  it's a quick treat.  Ghirardelli semi sweet chocolate chips are nondairy, for baking (or by the handful!).  And can you find So Delicious stuff near you?  Their ice creams are insanely good!

http://www.turtlemountain.com/products/index_products.php

For smoothies, grab some coconut milk.  Like the kind in the can, by Thai Kitchen.  Soooo good.

If it helps baby girl sleep, I say go for it.  Gas sucks!!