Breastfeeding, etc. - Page 15 « Back to Group Discussions

[seraf]

No, grape seed. My midwives told me to take grape seed extract and I mistakenly look grapeFruit seed extract and that was the time I needed antibiotics. $80 antibiotics.

[jhsmama11]

I don't know how they rule out allergies, we never went back to that in the visit. Once the test was negative for blood in his stool she said to watch and sent me home with a specimen kit if the blood showed up again (I think to test for other causes). Nothing about changing my diet or looking into allergies.
 

Originally Posted by seraf 

No advice, we're going through the exact same thing. Same spit up, same mucus and occasional blood. My guy said dairy and I went off both wheat and dairy, the blood came back several days after dairy was reintroduced so I've gone back off it. He also poops way more frequently when I'm on dairy. And it looks like the spit up, clear liquid with seedy curds and mucous, tho we have had the occasional poo that looked like clear jelly. When I went off dairy the first time he pooped only once a day and it was not clear. He also has a red ring.
How do they rule out allergies?

[dashley111]

I x-posted this in the breastfeeding forum also...but I thought I would ask you guys too.

Baby B is only 11 pounds right now, dropping her from 50th percentile to 16th since her 2 month exam.  She only gained 1 pound in 2 months.  She is very petite.

The ped suggested I quick nursing on-demand or for comfort, and start nursing only 4-6 times a day...waiting until she gets really hungry, so she will eat more vigorously than when she is snacking or comfort nursing. 

Im having a hard time wrapping my head around changing how we do things, and I am really questioning if its best. 

I dont have an answer, obviously...Im very torn as to what I am going to do.

Any input?

[Paigekitten]

Nursing only 4-6 times a day will cause your body to think that your baby is weaning and you may start to lose you supply if you nurse just 4 or 5 times a day, if I recall correctly nursing 6-8 times a day will maintain your current supply.  

Some babies are little and don't gain very fast, but if she really isn't getting enough I personally would try switch nursing, nursing MORE often, breast massage, drinking lots of water, fenagreek, oatmeal, and pumping to increase my supply.

ETA: Most pediatricians don't have training in lactation, so if you also work with an IBCLC in addition to your pediatrician you may get better advice.

[TalkToMeNow]

I am not a dr, obviously, but that sounds counterintuitive. Feeding less so she will eat more? I'm pretty sure that would decrease your supply. Isn't scheduling feelings responsible for the problems a lot of breastfeeding moms have?

I'll let those who know more chime in.

Can you go to a LL meeting? Is she peeing enough? My doctor says to go by diapers and not by weight. Obviously, that is easier when your baby is gaining a lot.

I'm sorry you are dealing with this!

[Abraisme]

Is she otherwise totally healthy, wetting enough diapers, happy, etc?  If she seems contented, I would keep nursing on demand.  I don't see how torturing her with hunger is going to solve anything.  I've actually heard the opposite, that babies fed on a schedule have failure to thrive.  Some babies are just small.  I mean, someone has to be on the low end of the scale right?  I've had friends with tiny babies and some with huge fat babies, both are perfectly healthy and fine. 

[dashley111]

Thanks guys!  I think you are all right.  I knew it just didnt seem right but I was not sure if it was because I tend to NOT listen to the ped (and only go to well-childs because insurance requires it) or I was being stubborn. 

I do notice that when there is longer between feedings she seems to eat more vigorously, but at the same time I feel like I'm starving her by making her wait...and I encourage her to comfort nurse all the time.

How does the wet diapers thing work?  When using cloth she easily has 5 or 6 diaper changes a day, plus one extra soaked diaper at night (she SSTN usually).  We recently, yesterday, switched to sposies because Im having a hell of a time with my inserts smelling thanks to my HE machine.  Its hard to tell when they are wet...

[TalkToMeNow]

I'm not sure what is normal for wet diapers, but wanted to recommend Huggies if you aren't opposed to the idea. They have a yellow stripe down the front that turns blue when the baby pees. That way, you can be positive on how often she is peeing. Just be sure to check the package to see that they have the wetness indicator.

[Abraisme]

That sounds about right to me.  I'd guess that Coralie pees 5-6 times a day and soaks a full diaper at night too.

[Jaimee]

Ash, as long as she is meeting milestones and seems content I would not worry.  I know it's hard not to worry, but really, some babies are small.  I remember waiting and waiting for Avalon to get to the weight requirement to go in the Baby Bjorn.  Seriously, it took 2 months for her to reach 8+ pounds!!  Whereas her brother was born over 8 pounds. 

If she isn't thriving that's entirely a different issue and it would need to be addressed somehow.  But restricting her nursing seems the wrong course of action to me, too.  I would just continue what you're doing.   And the others are right, someone has to be in the bottom percentages!  Most peds will say that (along with milestones) if a baby continues on the same curve and doesn't keep dropping and dropping and dropping at each visit, that things are fine.  Avalon was on the 3rd percentile curve and just stayed there for quite some time.  Eventually she jumped up (maybe around 2 years?) and now she's in the 25-50th percentiles.

As for wet diapers, it's hard to say b/c Avery pees almost every 20 minutes when he's awake- but it's like a couple tablespoons vs. after naps he'll pee a whole bowl full.  So if I was changing a diaper every time he peed (we're ECing), I'd go through like 15-20 a day.  If I let the pee build up a bit then I'd probably go through 10 a day.  But every baby pees a different frequencies with differing amounts and every parent changes diapers differently, too.  So I think number of wet diapers is hard to go by.

[jbk21]

I am not necessarily disagreeing with anything anyone has said, but if you switched to, say, 6 feedings and she ate more at those feedings, wouldn't your body just make a greater amount of milk at those times instead of just decreasing supply in general?  If breastfeeding is based on a supply/demand system, it makes sense that it would still supply what baby demands.  For me, Dylan recently went from eating every 2 hours to eat every 3.5-4 hours.  I did not encourage this- in fact I still offered at 2 hours just because that was our "normal" but he would refuse (like, screaming and arching away refusal) so I just wait until he is noticeably hungry now and he goes MUCH longer between feedings.  But I have had zero issues with supply.  It would also make sense to me that short, frequent feedings might mean she is not getting to the fatty hind milk.  But maybe I am wrong about that.  

I would echo what others have said- LL meeting or IBCLC.

[dashley111]

J, good thought about foremilk/hindmilk, I had not thought of that.  If you think of it like that then she probably does not get much hind milk.

As far as milestones, are we talking just smiling/laughing/cooing type of stuff?  I mean...she is a pretty average baby, with a grasp of small motor skills but not so much the larger.  It does not concern me because ODD was also very late with large motor skills and is perfectly average now. 

Her temperment is pretty bad, but she has always been finicky and generally....cranky.  Literally, the first night we brought her home she cried for 4 hours.  She is always cranky.  She cries after every feeding.  I just constantly walk the floor with her to keep her from crying, which I thought for sure would pass by this point and it has not. 

I think I should definitely contact an IBCLC.

[jbk21]

the crankiness after feedings could be related to too much fore milk, right?  I could be understanding all this wrong and piecing together from various sources in ways that are not accurate.   I definitely think an IBCLC is a good choice.  We are not experts :-)  Report back and let us know what she thinks!

[TalkToMeNow]

Originally Posted by jbk21 

I am not necessarily disagreeing with anything anyone has said, but if you switched to, say, 6 feedings and she ate more at those feedings, wouldn't your body just make a greater amount of milk at those times instead of just decreasing supply in general?  If breastfeeding is based on a supply/demand system, it makes sense that it would still supply what baby demands.  For me, Dylan recently went from eating every 2 hours to eat every 3.5-4 hours.  I did not encourage this- in fact I still offered at 2 hours just because that was our "normal" but he would refuse (like, screaming and arching away refusal) so I just wait until he is noticeably hungry now and he goes MUCH longer between feedings.  But I have had zero issues with supply.  It would also make sense to me that short, frequent feedings might mean she is not getting to the fatty hind milk.  But maybe I am wrong about that.  

I would echo what others have said- LL meeting or IBCLC.

I really shouldn't even be replying because I'm not an expert here! Lol. But I think the difference is that Dylan set that schedule. So it's still a supply and demand thing. If Ash set the schedule, it could throw things off. I think it's when we try to make the schedule versus our babies, that's when there are problems. Also, Jasper still eats very frequently. I want to say every 1.5 hours or so. And he gets plenty of hind milk, as he is a little fat boy. But, again, I really don't know... 

Jaimee, I'm so glad you mentioned how often Avery pees! I was beginning to think Jasper was weird. It's seriously every 20 min. I go through so many diapers. Also, I think there is probably a minimum number of wet diapers... Okay, I just did a quick search and saw 4-6 minimum. Also, according to Dr. Sears, the color matters. It should be clear or very pale. 

[Abraisme]

I just read something online that different women produce their supply in different ways.  Some babies need to nurse every 1-2 hours to keep the supply up, while other babies might only need every 4 hours.  It's why 'some' women can feed on a schedule just fine, but others have major supply issues this way..  I think it's best to follow the babies lead, what ever that may be.

 

Originally Posted by jbk21 

I am not necessarily disagreeing with anything anyone has said, but if you switched to, say, 6 feedings and she ate more at those feedings, wouldn't your body just make a greater amount of milk at those times instead of just decreasing supply in general?  If breastfeeding is based on a supply/demand system, it makes sense that it would still supply what baby demands.  For me, Dylan recently went from eating every 2 hours to eat every 3.5-4 hours.  I did not encourage this- in fact I still offered at 2 hours just because that was our "normal" but he would refuse (like, screaming and arching away refusal) so I just wait until he is noticeably hungry now and he goes MUCH longer between feedings.  But I have had zero issues with supply.  It would also make sense to me that short, frequent feedings might mean she is not getting to the fatty hind milk.  But maybe I am wrong about that.  

I would echo what others have said- LL meeting or IBCLC.

[seraf]

I agree that wet diapers are hard to go by because diapers are different. I think they mean full diapers, not just pees. My kid pees about 20 times a day

I nurse on demand but I pump 4 times a day when I'm at work so I know that the quantity of milk I put out is about the same, but his stomach doesn't hold all the milk I get in one pumping so I feel like:
A. He would take in less total milk.
B. He would get much less hindmilk.

From what I understand, the hindmilk has more calories, so it is important to make sure the baby finishes the first breast before moving on to the second.

Good luck finding answers. I second looking for an IBCLC.

[Paigekitten]

I need to go make dinner, but thought these might help. 

http://kellymom.com/nutrition/milk/change-milkfat/

http://kellymom.com/bf/got-milk/basics/foremilk-hindmilk/

http://kellymom.com/health/growth/weight-gain_increase/

http://kellymom.com/bf/normal/weight-gain/

[Jaimee]

I think I recall reading that all nursing off of one breast in a 3-4 hour block sort of continues where you left off, getting to the hindmilk quicker each time.   So I nurse off the same side twice and then switch at the third feeding since Avery doesn't generally take both breasts at one feeding.

In regards to pee color, clear pee is considered dilute, meaning baby is well hydrated.  Colored pee is concentrated.  However, Avery's pee is technicolor a few hours after take my vitamins.  Just something to be away of!

[wellforth]

I think it is called block feeding, where you keep feeding from the same breast until it feels "empty" (or is getting there).  That way, frequent feeders can get the hind milk they need to fatten up.  I've read that too much fore milk can cause an upset stomach, and therefore lots of crying. 

As an aside, we've been doing the family bed thing for maybe a month now, and I prefer to nurse on what I call the night boob.  I lay on my left side, and my left boob gets most of the action at night.  I feel kind of contorted when I nurse from the right side, so maybe do that once or twice a night.  (He can feed up to 5-6 times a night, and last night, was feeding every 15 minutes for the last 2 hours of his sleep.)  Anyway, he is getting some hind milk like never before.  And his weight went up, from the 25th to 31st percentile, and he's finally getting some chub on his long skinny frame.  I did block feeding before, but even more so at night.

And as others have said, some babies are just petite.  My friend's baby was off the scale petite, and looking at her parents, you can see why.  The doctors always were trying to worry her, but her kid is just fine.

carey

[Mal85]

Yeah, based on what you're saying, I would definitely try block feeding before holding her off. Block feeding won't decrease your supply and it will ensure she gets the hindmilk she needs. I think J hit it right on with a fore/hind milk issue.