What age were you (the parent) potty trained?? - Page 3

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Originally Posted by mamazee 

My mom believed in potty training by the 2nd birthday, but her methods were harsh and, according to her, pretty common at that time (although she might have been rationalizing.) She said she's lock us in the bathroom for hours at a time if need be and spank us if we had an accident, and with me she finally put my underwear in the bathroom and had me change myself and clean up after myself when I had an accident, and then she's spank me and put me in my room.

Idunno.. I've been around a long time, and I have never met anybody who would do that, or agree with that.    It was always encouraging, and "Oops... that's OK" if there was an accident.  I can see making a child change their own clothes, that's not harsh, but most parents/adults expect accidents, and wouldn't spank.  I think your experience was different than most people. Perhaps your mom was very uptight about accidents?  Or had new carpet?  (not that that's an excuse)

[AuroraMT]

We are foreigners (from England and my father from Africa) so I think that has a lot to do with our early potty training. My eldest brother was considered really late and he was totally out of diapers by 24 months. My other brother was out of them by 10 months and me by 11. I was totally into that same plan for my son but it didn't happen. At the end we decided to just relax about it and let him lead the way. He was totally diaper free and (so far) accident free for the most part (he gets nervous in large crowds and my have an accident occasionally) by 28 months. I think child led potty training was really the right choice for us. Our youngest is 9 months and doesn't look like he'll be out of them any time soon either. My brothers and I were both pretty much EC'd but no one called it that, with cloth diapers when we did use them. 

[mamazee]

Originally Posted by nextcommercial 

Idunno.. I've been around a long time, and I have never met anybody who would do that, or agree with that.    It was always encouraging, and "Oops... that's OK" if there was an accident.  I can see making a child change their own clothes, that's not harsh, but most parents/adults expect accidents, and wouldn't spank.  I think your experience was different than most people. Perhaps your mom was very uptight about accidents?  Or had new carpet?  (not that that's an excuse)

That method is from a popular potty-training book from the 1970s called something like Potty Training in Less Than A Day or In A Day. My mom's method was much harsher.

[SunRise]

I was born in the 60's too and my parents certainly didn't use any spanking, harshness or threats for potty learning either. Nor have I heard of such experiences from my cousins and friends of the same age (60's&70's). My experience was much more supportive and encouraging.

Originally Posted by mamazee 

That method is from a popular potty-training book from the 1970s called something like Potty Training in Less Than A Day or In A Day. My mom's method was much harsher.

[Imakcerka]

Alright but the shame of a late trainee is not as prevalent.  Not all kids can potty train that early.  Though I was my brother wasn't.  DD2 was but DD1 wasn't.  Is it really laziness when I had more than 4 adults helping me with DD1 to get her out of pull ups at night and not having to change her clothes 5 times a day?  Or was it people realizing not all kids are ready?  Some kids are great at learning to potty train some are not.  
 

Originally Posted by serenbat 

well there is an impact, society does get effect by this

they are finding more UTI in those who train later (and the cost for those without insurance in the US is payed for by others- higher costs effect all- my budget)

the use of disposables effect filling up landfills

the use of cloth is high water and electric consumption

in my area you pay more to daycare if your child is not trained

so yes, some people do care because this effects others

[serenbat]

Alright but the shame of a late trainee is not as prevalent.  Not all kids can potty train that early.  Though I was my brother wasn't.  DD2 was but DD1 wasn't.  Is it really laziness when I had more than 4 adults helping me with DD1 to get her out of pull ups at night and not having to change her clothes 5 times a day?  Or was it people realizing not all kids are ready?  Some kids are great at learning to potty train some are not.  

What exactly is late? IF it is not a "general milestone" that a child reaches in relationship to their peers, IF it is not a "medical condition" that prevents them from having bladder control, IF it is not an "emotional maturity" (again milestone that their peers are meeting), IF it is not "laziness" on the part of the parent What is "readiness" if not a milestone? and how is this not viewed a issue if the child is not meeting it in relationship to their peers?

-what is it when a child trains so much later then their peers? 

[Imakcerka]

Ok, I'm viewing this with my own push for difference.  I don't feel the line drawn by society is what is always right.  It just isn't to me.  We had a neighbor girl who was trained at 18 months, she ran she spoke in a way almost all adults could understand.  She was just ahead of most kids.  At the same time DD2 still wasn't walking, she talked a lot but wouldn't walk.  Which meant potty training wasn't something I could try just yet.  I did go in to see if there was something wrong with her, they found nothing.  Within weeks she walked and right after she was potty trained.  She didn't meet the walking milestone but she beat her sister in years with potty training.  Also, I didn't train her.  She hated to be wet and she liked to use the potty she pretty much did it all on her own.  I seriously had little to do with it.  And I worked my ass off to get DD1 trained.  I wanted to throw in the towel almost every day with her.  Did I fail?  I don't think so.  There are a miriad of reasons some kids will be "late" by social standards or early again by social standards.  It's like any kind of learning it happens when the trainee is ready.  

I doubt I answered your question.  

Originally Posted by serenbat 

What exactly is late? IF it is not a "general milestone" that a child reaches in relationship to their peers, IF it is not a "medical condition" that prevents them from having bladder control, IF it is not an "emotional maturity" (again milestone that their peers are meeting), IF it is not "laziness" on the part of the parent What is "readiness" if not a milestone? and how is this not viewed a issue if the child is not meeting it in relationship to their peers?

-what is it when a child trains so much later then their peers? 

[mt_gooseberry]

My sister and I were done by 24mo.  My parents did the get-it-done-over-the-weekend, lots-and-lots-of-praise method.  My lottle brother was done by 26mo.  I myself started DD very casually at 15 mo, and she is diaper free now at 22mo.  We did some ec-ing starting around 4 or 5mo, and I also always took her to the bathroom w/me...that's what I attribute her success to.

[mckittre]

I started casually with my son a few months before he turned 2, and tried to put him on the fast track several more times with no success.  We really really wanted him done before a trip we were taking when he was 30 months old, and nothing worked (he just didn't care enough not to wet his pants, and thoroughly resisted any suggestions on our part, and rewards just didn't do enough for him).  Now, at almost 3, he's out of diapers, but I can't quite call him "potty trained".  He still has minor accidents regularly, needs reminders (which he resists), and won't deal with his own clothing if he's wearing anything more than just underwear.  He has never been in a pull-up.  I am jealous of my friends who've had an easier time with this, but they neither started earlier, nor tried anything dramatically different then us.  Actually, many started later, tried fewer things, and had more success - ending up with way way fewer months of agony. 

[~cassie~]

My twin and I both trained around 18 months.  I don't know what my parents methods were bc my mother is gone now but she was a neat freak lol so I'm sure that had something to do with it along with being fully cloth diapered.

[Parker'smommy]

According to my mother, I was potty trained at 18 months. BUT...my brother was born 2 months later, and I balked at the potty after his arrival...lol. She took a break from trying to train me after my brother's birth and she said I was trained "late" at about 34 months old!!!

I think perhaps one of the reasons that kids are potty learning later isn't because parents are lazy, but because parents are busy!!! I know that when I potty trained my 2 oldest, I had to be dedicated at staying home and not doing errands and going out for a few weeks. It's total backtracking to potty train at home and then go out and put a diaper on a child. But many parents have no choice but to do this exact thing. They work so they have to bring their child to daycare and have to put a diaper on them to go on the trip there and back. Parents have older siblings that need to be taken place, appointments to get to, Dr. visits to attend....the life of a child in this age is busy, busy, busy...much busier than children of the past. I've had many friends come to me and ask advice on how I got my kids potty trained "early" ( and I don't agree that they were early) as they were right around 2 years old. And my biggest advice was...STAY HOME!  And I tell you, when they blocked out their calendar and cancelled appointments and were able to stay home with the child for the most part....they were definitely more successful. 

But, it's totally a personal choice. If you don't mind it, and want to wait....go for it. But like another poster said, you don't have to be harsh to have your child potty trained before 3 years old. It is totally doable in a gentle way. Of course, there are always exceptions to every circumstance, and some children will not train "early". 

[mrskingred]

From previous conversations with my Mum , my sister and I were potty trained well before two. She can't remember the exact age in months. My brother (13 months younger than I) was apparently lazy . Mum says he was over 2.5, but definately before his 3rd birthday. She used terry squares and safety pins with plastic pull on covers. This was the UK in the late 60s, early 70s.

I did ec with back up for my DS. He was totally out of nappies (I used cloth for back-up)  before 22 months. It would have been sooner I think, as we only had the occasional accident between 15-18 months, but a major change in circumstances when he was 18 months (moving to a new country, new house, new people)  was followed by a short period were we had continual day time accidents.

I think its a cultural thing. Obviously if you were using cloth, and didn't have a modern washing machine like my mother you had an incentive to have your children in nappies for the shortest possible time. However, disposable are widely available in the UK and Spain and I haven't seen many 3 year olds in nappies here.

[AndreaOlson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Parker'smommy 

But, it's totally a personal choice. If you don't mind it, and want to wait....go for it. But like another poster said, you don't have to be harsh to have your child potty trained before 3 years old. It is totally doable in a gentle way. Of course, there are always exceptions to every circumstance, and some children will not train "early". 

There have been so many gems in this thread that I can't pick just one, but the above post sums it up for me...I know plenty of parents who PTed their kids (in 2011) within 3-14 days with non-coercive PT at the ages of 17-22 months. It was easy, gentle, and yet...*firm.* (I will share the wonderful resource with you if you PM me...but don't want to break any rules here on the Forum!)

This is a very heated and diverse conversation, and the poll results are interesting as well....thanks to everyone who has participated thus far. Hoping other parents (and grandparents) will chime in, too.

Potty training (and EC, for that matter) has a long history full of both the disgusting and the beautiful. Yet around the world, we all handle it differently; we do the best we can with what we *know* so far in life.

And, yet, I am certain that if the *parent* wishes to PT their toddler at 18 months, it can be done (without force. without bribes. without ropes! yipes!). If the *parent* wishes to let go of diapers at 9 months, I am certain it can be done (that is what I teach with Elimination Communication). It really comes down to us, and it's not a good thing or a bad thing, or anything we can judge...it's, like Parkers'mommy said, a Personal Choice. :)

We are all so busy and most of us work outside of the home. We do the best we can. Daycares don't generally or necessarily help. It's hard to "fit" potty training in, but if parents make it a priority and do it in a certain manner (one that is firm yet gentle; where the parent is certain of ending the diaper-era, and the child follows suit)...it can be done...and I think parents who are interested in this should be able to access that information. For those who want to keep going til 2.5 or 3 years, then that's okay too.

It does come down to a personal choice, to convenience, to lack of information on how to PT in a gentle (yet complete) way, to culture, to personal belief systems, to lack of information on how to potty from birth, even (had to throw that in there...it's my personal fave). ;)

And I think it's a worthwhile conversation to continue...to look at what's been done, what we're doing now, and the 'why' behind it. To forgive what's been done in the past. To move forward in what we, personally, feel is right for us.

Looking forward to more replies and participation, if that is out there.

<3 Andrea (original poster)

[AndreaOlson]

And PS...I am traveling (visiting DH's family) in Thailand right now and there ARE lots of 3 year olds in disposables here. Especially in Bangkok but even in more remote areas. And apparently the disposables came here 7-10 years ago and are a huge hit!

[pranava]

Originally Posted by AndreaOlson 

Quote:

And, yet, I am certain that if the *parent* wishes to PT their toddler at 18 months, it can be done (without force. without bribes. without ropes! yipes!). If the *parent* wishes to let go of diapers at 9 months, I am certain it can be done (that is what I teach with Elimination Communication). It really comes down to us, and it's not a good thing or a bad thing, or anything we can judge...it's, like Parkers'mommy said, a Personal Choice. :)

Well, I am the parent of a 33 month old(who was ec'ed from early on) and it is my personal choice to be done with diapers and have DS PT'ed before 24 months.  However, it is DS's personal choice to pee in his underwear, or on the floor and not care much at all.  Maybe he is one of the few, but I know I am not getting what I wish here, and that seems to be his point exactly.  Maybe the super stubborn ones are harder?

[crunchy_mommy]

Originally Posted by pranava 

Well, I am the parent of a 33 month old(who was ec'ed from early on) and it is my personal choice to be done with diapers and have DS PT'ed before 24 months.  However, it is DS's personal choice to pee in his underwear, or on the floor and not care much at all.  Maybe he is one of the few, but I know I am not getting what I wish here, and that seems to be his point exactly.  Maybe the super stubborn ones are harder?

This.... Not all kids will magically potty-learn during that 18-22mo window!! I don't think it matters how badly the parents want it, some kids JUST AREN'T READY. And some kids are very potty-resistant. I think it's really frustrating & discrediting to parents of late trainers to insist it's all in the parents' hands. Sure, some 18mo kids will be quite content for you to sit them on the potty every 5-10mins (because some 18mo don't have any more bladder control than that and need to go that often!!) but some kids will resist sitting on (standing on, being near) the potty even once a week. Some kids hate the potty. Some kids hate diapers. Some kids hate diapers AND the potty. It's not all about how determined the parent is.

[serenbat]

I find it very odd that the whole late training is now a socially expectable norm.

Such a mainstream issue that the natural/crunchy community is so eagerly embracing.

You take a natural biological issue and turn it into a socially expectable standard- what if this was done with walking or another function?  In a short period of time this has changed.

IF it is not a social issue, is it that children no longer have the bladder control that they once did at an earlier age for centuries?

I feel there are detrimental ramifications when social wins out over natural. IMO

[crunchy_mommy]

Well wearing diapers isn't exactly natural. So how can you say there is a 'natural' age for ceasing to wear diapers?

Most kids start to walk a bit around a year old, right?? So is there something wrong with my friend's parenting because her DD didn't walk until 15mos? Is there something wrong with the parents right here on MDC whose kids didn't take a single step 'til 18mos? Is my kid more 'natural' because he learned to walk at 7mos old?? To me, that sounds ridiculous -- there is a wide range of readiness and it's probably not the parents' fault if their kid walks on the very very late end.

I feel it's the same with diapers. Certainly some toddlers are able to potty train at 12-18mos. I don't see that as more "natural" than learning at 27mos. What's the difference???

From what I've read, earlier potty-training methods were indeed more likely to be abusive. I read about the government recommending that parents manually stimulate regular bowel movements with a soap stick... and other methods like literally tying kids to the potty, physical punishment for accidents, shaming, screaming, etc. So I don't know how applicable historical age of potty-training is. Maybe the age was so much earlier because the kids were beaten into some kind of compliance. It's not all some social conspiracy to train kids later.

I don't doubt that Pampers has contributed to later potty-training... and I'm sure there are many parents that just find diapers easier and don't want to bother with training before age 3. But you have parents telling you RIGHT HERE on this thread that we did things like EC from birth, use exclusively cloth diapers, started potty-training at 18mos, etc. and the kids were NOT always ready for it that young. I said upthread that my friend started PT'ing at a year old... her DD is over 2yo now and still has many accidents a day, even though she's never gone back to diapers and she's been 100% committed to PT'ing. She'll even say her DD is potty-trained (since she's been out of diapers so long) but in my mind, she clearly isn't. My own kid -- we tried EC quite a bit (from infancy), but he hated it. He's only been in cloth diapers (even on vacation etc.) and we tried formal potty-training many times before age 2. Plus he always came with us to the bathroom, always had a small potty available to him, we talked about bodily functions, he's cognitively advanced and did understand from a young age that pee goes in the potty, etc. HE WASN'T READY. I don't know how else to say it, he just wasn't ready 'til about 2.5yo, and even now at nearly 3yo still has occasional accidents. Maybe I'm a failure as a parent, maybe I did it all wrong, maybe I should lose my "natural" badge or whatever because he wasn't ready sooner. But I really truly think that some kids just aren't ready at that magical age of 18mos.

[Skippy918]

I was trained around 2 1/2.  My mom was trained at 18 months.  I waited until DS was ready and started the process at close to 3.  I really didn't want to force him to use the potty since I knew it would backfire.  We switched him into underwear a little after he turned 3 and he's had only 1 or 2 accidents since then.  Now he's fully capable of going on his own without assistance and I don't need to remind him either.  

My friend's son is nearly 3 1/2 and is still not interested in using the potty.  Consistency is a huge deal.  If a child is with multiple caregivers during the week, it's much harder for them to focus on learning the potty.

[serenbat]

I feel it's the same with diapers. Certainly some toddlers are able to potty train at 12-18mos. I don't see that as more "natural" than learning at 27mos. What's the difference???

I see a hugh difference. If this was reversed and you were dealing with walking or babbling, etc not until age 27 months (not within the normal time frame) that would be view medically as a delay- why isn't this? It is occurring outside of the medium age (at least would normally would have been) be it because of something- is it not? "Naturally" aren't you trying for in-tune with your child- be it eating or bladder control? If you don't know at 27 months when the child is hungry that certainly would be an issue- how is this different?

there appears to be no medical data showing that children are reaching bladder control at a later age thus all studies are indicating that baring a medical delay (physical and/or psychological) the trend is social 

Edited by serenbat - 12/27/11 at 5:33pm