What happens when you can't agree? - Page 2

[PixieAlly]

Yeah, she is lucky that he has a great boss who allows him to have flexible hours (so he can skip lunch to make up for time or come in early, etc...). And yes, he has had to take a lot of vacation days and hours in the past because of her and her schedule changes or refusing to do things when she has the kids. I honestly don't care if she keeps her end of the bargain up since I am fine with keeping the kids home with me. We decided she can have first pick of snow days because there are rarely more than 1 or 2 per year anyway. Our main goal is to stop the constant bouncing around from house to house which is why we requested when a kid is sick, they just stay put until evening transfer time no matter where they are and that on early release snow days, the kids go to whichever house they are spending the night out. We still have a long way to go. She still has not defined a vacation day (she seems to think any day we are gone with the kids is a vacation day even if it's a day we normally have them, but for herself, she only counts the days the kids would be with us normally as a vacation day and insists that visit family out of state does not count as a vacation). We also need to sort out how to deal with the schedule change she is requesting in January where she wants the kids to bounce around to 4 different places (school, her house, our house and karate) all within a span of 50 minutes instead of just letting us pick the kids up from school since we have them every Monday night anyway. We also need to contact the teachers and talk about homework issues and see if we can get the ex to do at least 20 minutes of homework with the kids when she has them on days when the 8yo gets an hour's worth of homework because we just don't have the time to do it all with dinner, karate, bath time, etc..and she gets punished at school by being kept in a recess if she doesn't do it all. I don't know how we're going to get through all this, but I will just be happy if we can get through Christmas with the four measly days we want, days my BF is entitled to as their father.
 

Originally Posted by csekywithlove 

I'm sure that you are both worn out buy it. Situations like these are mentally and emotionally exhausting. Just make sure that he stays on track. Sounds like he is making some great strides as far as staying on point. I doubt she will stick to her end of the bargain about snow days from what you've said. You talk an awful lot about him taking off of work or leaving early during the day. Does he take off that much because she changes plans? That can't be good for his job unless he has an awesome boss and job security. ROFR is the most annoying thing. That is the biggest double standard here because I bet you BF is never allowed to ask who she has watching their children. Ugh. I'm sorry mama.  I really hope that he can get this panned out before next week so you all can enjoy the holidays.

[greenemami]

"We're both so worn out by this :( I hate playing games but it seems like that is the only way she'll compromise. I think we've decided to give her snow days and he will promise to make every effort to take time off during sick days and holidays to be with the kids, but he is still telling her he will not adjust the ROFR to include non-overnights. We also realize she picked us having the kids on snow delay days because if the kids are at her house, it will be nearly impossible for us to pick them up before school starts due to her road  being one of the last ones to be plowed :/  I think he is going to say she needs to pick them up on full snow days to equal things out. He's also going to let her know that he will have time off during the break to be with the kids so they will not be with me the whole time. She is so manipulative though. The way she worded the last email makes me almost feel sorry for her, and in a way I do, but then you look more closely and you see the cracks in her story (like saying she is sad about snow days when for the past two years so has shown very little interest in having the kids on snow days and usually made my BF take time off of work). We've been talking about expressing to her that he wants the kids to spend equal time with both parents, which is true, because that is what is best and healthiest for them, but he wants his time to be equal. And also telling her how the kids complain about being bounced around between houses so much and he is just trying to create some continuity in their lives while keeping time with parents as equal as possible. We'll see what happens or if he even sends that email. I see him getting to the giving up point :("

This sounds really complicated-actually, I'm not even sure how it would work!

I would encourage you to stand up on this one and just say that whoever has them the prevoius night (i.e. where they would be leaving for school from) would just be responsible for either getting them to school or to when school would normally end. Our agreement (the newest one at least, because we have dealt with this issue!) states that "xyz has the child from 3 pm Wednesday until 3 pm Thursday OR is responsible for taking child to school on Thursday morning." (rough terms, not what it actually says!) We had a big argument with dsd's mom at one point too about days off-she insisted we drop her off at the time we would to start school, we said we should get to keep her until the time mom would normally pick her up from school. Originally, we compromised at around noon, but now it has changed to 3 or 4 pm as the default.

[greenemami]

Also, I'm curious-if you don't mind sharing, what is your schedule? I'm confused as to why you wouldn't ordinally end up with 2 days in a row?

Claiming that time the kids would be in school is her time just doesn't make sense, there's no way she would win that one in court. If it states split vacation equably, then insist on close to equal time or you risk being walked all over in the future.

Her ideas on vacation time kind of made me laugh (sorry!) It seems like such a clear cut issue and yet gets so complicated, right?! Vacation time here at least is pretty simply defined as taking time that would normally be spent with the other parent. i.e. if mom went away for 10 days, but only 3 were dad's originally, that counts for 3 vacation days, not 10! And yes, family visits count, lol! I would imagine that if she were more reaonsble, it would be so simple o say a few extra vacation days don't matter instead of feeling like you have to stand your ground-it is a shame she is making things harder for everyone, including herself. :(

[PixieAlly]

Okay, I'll try to explain it! :) But we never get two solid days in a row (she gets 2-3 per week however).  Also, the original schedule was written when the youngest only had half days of school, so it indicates that she or a baby sitter gets the kids in the afternoon during the week, but that was only  because the youngest had to go somewhere. Now he is in school full time so it doesn't apply, however I am assuming if she sent a cop to the house because we kept them during the day on a day school was out, we'd be out of luck :(

So my BF gets the kids at 445pm on M, Tu, and every other Wed. Then we get them at 1pm on Saturday until 2pm on Sunday. However, she picks them up from school every day and has them from 3:20 to 4:45pm. So she gets to see them every day, and he does not, yet she has the nerve to tell him that it almost kills her when he takes them on vacation because she can't see them for so long. She has no empathy for him and the fact that he has to go days without seeing them EVERY WEEK. Also, when they are on vacation, she has a right to call every day, but rarely does. Also, as you can see, we never get them for a full day either. She has Saturday and Sunday broken up so we have to rush back on a Sunday to get the kids back by 2pm if we decide to do something together that day (and she is late picking them up 50% of the time on Sunday which is extra frustrating when we rush home for her). We have asked her to switch it so we pick them up on Saturday at 5 or 6pm and she can pick them up Sunday at 6 or 7pm, but she said no, she doesn't like that schedule, especially in the winter time. So again, the kids get bounced around all weekend and we can never do anything more than an hour away (we are very outdoorsy and like to hike in the spring, summer and fall at different parks around the state or go biking). We don't want to take weekends away from her, we just want a whole day for each parent. So we have to use vacation days or try and negotiate a switch (like, hey can I have the kids 2 extra hours on Sunday and you can keep them two extra hours on Saturday).

And just in case anyone wonders why he didn't fight for a different schedule, he did. He submitted a more "normal" 50/50 schedule where each parent is responsible for the kids for 3-4 days a week in a row, splitting up the weekend. She said no and the judge sided with her. The next county over has a great court system where the kids have their own bill of rights, but not here in podunk-ville! :/ We can't even ask for a different judge when/if we do go back to court because there is only one judge in the county and changing venue is frowned upon.
 

The stupidest part of this whole thing is if she would just act like a normal human being, we would not care about keeping track of hours and vacations so closely and I'd probably call her a lot of the time to see if she'd want to take the kids while my BF is at work. But that woman will just take and take and take and feel she is entitled to it all and when we ask for something she basically says no, we don't deserve it. It is ridiculous some of the things my BF did right after the separation to try and keep her happy in hopes that she would turn around and be nice to him...the first vacation away from mom he drive the kids 20 minutes every day on his vacation to a spot where the phone would work so she could talk to them. She had a surgery (elective, not because she was sick) and he took care of her for two weeks and let her come back and live with him during that time so he could care for her and the kids....you know what she did? She stole stuff out of the house that she said was hers (like gifts from his parents of kitchen items, photos, all the pictures off the walls, etc..) while he was at work. She also insisted he give her the dryer (he kept the washer) even though her apartment didn't need one just in case some day she would need it. It's still sitting in her garage. She took all the king sized bed sheets "just in case she has a king size bed someday" even though at the time she had a queen size bed.  Stupid crap like that. She has their birth certificates and social security cards and refuses to get him copies (she stole those too without talking to him about it first). When he finally wised up and changed the locks, she got super mad at him (this was after she had moved out and was dating the man she cheated on my BF with) because I guess she tried to get into the house when she knew he was away. Can you imagine getting mad at someone for them trying to keep you out of their home because you stole from them? Her thinking is insane.

Originally Posted by greenemami 

Also, I'm curious-if you don't mind sharing, what is your schedule? I'm confused as to why you wouldn't ordinally end up with 2 days in a row?

Claiming that time the kids would be in school is her time just doesn't make sense, there's no way she would win that one in court. If it states split vacation equably, then insist on close to equal time or you risk being walked all over in the future.

Her ideas on vacation time kind of made me laugh (sorry!) It seems like such a clear cut issue and yet gets so complicated, right?! Vacation time here at least is pretty simply defined as taking time that would normally be spent with the other parent. i.e. if mom went away for 10 days, but only 3 were dad's originally, that counts for 3 vacation days, not 10! And yes, family visits count, lol! I would imagine that if she were more reaonsble, it would be so simple o say a few extra vacation days don't matter instead of feeling like you have to stand your ground-it is a shame she is making things harder for everyone, including herself. :(

[jess in hawaii]

Originally Posted by PixieAlly 
 Can you imagine getting mad at someone for them trying to keep you out of their home because you stole from them? Her thinking is insane.

Ah, now i do understand your position. I am going through this exact same thing with my stbx.

[greenemami]

Okay, that is making more sense to me now, thanks :) So you are saying that even though your bf technically has M and T every week, he picks them up at 4:45 on Monday, drops them off at school on Tuesday, they go to mom's house after school, and then he picks them up at 4:45 again on Tuesday?And now mom is saying that since he will be working while they are in school, they should just go to her house for the day?

On the one hand, I understand where mom is coming from (as a mother myself) in that she wants to see her kids if they are not with dad and honestly, I would probably just let them go to mom's for the full days. BUT-I understand too that if you just let this one go, she will probably continue to think she can control all situations, so it is a tough call to make.

The after school schedule sounds kind of crazy with all that bouncing around, I know my kids would hate that. Is it possible to change your bf's hours so he is free to pick them up after school (since I know you said she wasn't okay with you doing it). Again, as a mom I can understand why she wants to the kids with her instead of anyone else, but in this case it just doesn't make sense for the kids and is probably really confusing.

[PixieAlly]

I understand where she is coming from as well and if she wasn't taking them for the rest of the week, we wouldn't care so much about the two days. But we won't see them from 8pm on the 24th until (if she gets her way) 4:45 on the 26th and then they will be gone again from 8am on the 28th until 9pm on the 31st. We don't have any objection to the vacation time she's taking them, we just don't see how it's fair that he can't have them for the two days they are with us normally in the evening anyway. He doesn't have to work on the 26th so he will be home.

He can't change his hours on a permanent basis like that unfortunately and she would never allow him to pick the kids up anyway on a permanent basis (the Monday thing is just because her work schedule is changing for a semester). I don't want to take time away from her and the kids, we just want to provide some stability, especially due to their complaints. Unfortunately, the kids probably never complain to mom and even if they did, she'd never admit it to us. Sometimes when we say they'll have to ask mom about something, they look at us funny and say "never mind". She is much more strict with them and it seems they feel less comfortable talking to her (some examples, in the past (not sure if she still does it now  because we don't want to ask the kids and put them in the middle) she punished the kids by pinching them. The 8yo has told me that her mom won't let her hug her when she's mad. That came up because I was mad at her for picking on the other kids, but still allowed her to come over and hug me - and I hugged her  back - because she seemed to need it. Other little things too that they're not allowed to do or say at moms that just seems weird...they're not allowed to call her Mommy, only Mom. If they do, she gets mad and so they won't call my BF daddy which he misses. Sometimes when the 6yo does by accident, the 8yo yells at him to stop. Weird crap like that.).
 

Originally Posted by greenemami 

Okay, that is making more sense to me now, thanks :) So you are saying that even though your bf technically has M and T every week, he picks them up at 4:45 on Monday, drops them off at school on Tuesday, they go to mom's house after school, and then he picks them up at 4:45 again on Tuesday?And now mom is saying that since he will be working while they are in school, they should just go to her house for the day?

On the one hand, I understand where mom is coming from (as a mother myself) in that she wants to see her kids if they are not with dad and honestly, I would probably just let them go to mom's for the full days. BUT-I understand too that if you just let this one go, she will probably continue to think she can control all situations, so it is a tough call to make.

The after school schedule sounds kind of crazy with all that bouncing around, I know my kids would hate that. Is it possible to change your bf's hours so he is free to pick them up after school (since I know you said she wasn't okay with you doing it). Again, as a mom I can understand why she wants to the kids with her instead of anyone else, but in this case it just doesn't make sense for the kids and is probably really confusing.

[Super~Single~Mama]

I think your DH should scrap the thing and go back to court/mediation to draft a new agreement that addresses the kids school schedule. So, days/times that kids have school, who gets which half of X-mas break, who gets presidents day recess, who gets spring/easter recess, who gets MLK day, who gets Columbus day, who gets labor day, memorial day, etc. My custody/visitation order is SO detailed, that it is our guide as to what to do when we can't agree.  ie, when we cannot agree, we look to the order and it tells us what to do.

Seriously, your DH needs a better order that has more detail - it protects BOTH parties.

[PixieAlly]

I agree and we've pretty much decided that's what we're going to do. We just want to get through the holidays at this point since it's unlikely he'd get into mediation before that. We mentioned mediation to the ex and she wants to avoid it, but it's not helping that she hasn't even written back to our last proposal :( 
 

Originally Posted by Super~Single~Mama 

I think your DH should scrap the thing and go back to court/mediation to draft a new agreement that addresses the kids school schedule. So, days/times that kids have school, who gets which half of X-mas break, who gets presidents day recess, who gets spring/easter recess, who gets MLK day, who gets Columbus day, who gets labor day, memorial day, etc. My custody/visitation order is SO detailed, that it is our guide as to what to do when we can't agree.  ie, when we cannot agree, we look to the order and it tells us what to do.

Seriously, your DH needs a better order that has more detail - it protects BOTH parties.

[Super~Single~Mama]

Originally Posted by PixieAlly 

I agree and we've pretty much decided that's what we're going to do. We just want to get through the holidays at this point since it's unlikely he'd get into mediation before that. We mentioned mediation to the ex and she wants to avoid it, but it's not helping that she hasn't even written back to our last proposal :( 
 

So document document document, and then suffer through this year. After the new year, go into court to ask for a new visitation schedule and use this as an example of her being completely uncooperative.

[-Resque-]

I agree that you need a MUCH more detailed parenting plan. Our spells out everything you could possibly think of, and leaves NO room for argument, which is exactly why it works so well for DH and DSD's mom. They had a lot of trouble a few years ago, when they both switched times constantly, and it lead to anger on both of their parts- both felt like they weren't getting the time they "deserved." For the last 2 years, we have followed the plan to the letter, and it has created a MUCH happier relationship for all involved.

That schedule sounds insane, and I feel really bad for the kids. We have 50/50 as well, and do Sun, Mon, Tues with mom and Wed, Th, Fri with dad, alternating Saturdays. It does suck because we never get a full weekend, but DSD always knows where she will be, and who she will be with.

ROFR is written into their plan as well, with the stipulation that it can only be used if she will be out of the parent's care for more than 3 hours. DSD's mom was VERY strict in enforcing this (only when it came to me, LOL) until DH pointed out that DSD spent most of the time she was "with" her mom being cared for by other people. She has since dropped the complaints. Honestly, I agree with the reasons it is written in, and to me, it makes sense that she should be with one parent or the other whenever possible- but since she spends very little time with her mom BY HER MOM'S CHOOSING, DH chose to make an issue over this. Now it's basically don't ask don't tell, and everyone seems pretty happy with that.

[PixieAlly]

Your schedule sound so much more sane! We don't mind not having a full weekend, but a full DAY would be awesome. Do you mind sharing other things that are specifically spelled out that we might not think of?  I think part of the issue with the schedule is my BF works normal M-F 8-430, but she has 3 jobs that are weird hours (teaches 2-3 college classes at local community colleges as well as online and is a waitress at a local restaurant). She seems to keep a mostly regular schedule, but it's sometimes weird hours I think. I'll have to see if my BF knows the schedule or not and if splitting up the week would work.

The ROFR thing she is bringing up is a little ridiculous. Before I came along, she NEVER wanted the kids when it wasn't her time. He would repeatedly ask her to take them at certain times so he wouldn't have to take off of work and she would either refuse or turn around and call his parents and have them watch the kids. Usually she stated she was too busy, but we are pretty sure she was more interested in punishing my BF than spending time with the kids.  That is why this is extra frustrating. She's fighting for him to have to basically ask her permission every time he wants to leave the kids home with me, but 90% of the time she is going to not take them anyway. It's just a way to degrade or humiliate him by making him have to ask her. It's sick.

And honestly, after today (she still hasn't responded to his last proposal and it's been more than 24 hours...meanwhile, if he waits more than 24 hours to respond to her, she goes ballistic on him), I just don't know why I care so much or if all this stress is really worth it. Is it worth it? I mean, I found myself screaming at my 3 year old daughter this morning because I couldn't get the printer to work and she kept bugging me for something. I hate myself now. The stress has me so on edge and I begin to wonder why the hell I'm pushing for all this anyway. I love his kids, they are great, we have a good time, they are loving towards me, but having them around is stressful. They come in and out like a tornado because we never have them for more than half a day or they get here 3 hours  before they have to go to bed so we are rushing around doing homework, baths, dinner, etc...and the mornings are just as hectic. I hate it. So, I start thinking, Gee, if they weren't around so much, it would be a lot calmer around here and maybe I won't have to start taking blood pressure pills. My BF would be miserable. Usually by Friday he is missing the kids a lot and I can tell. But at the same time, we have my daughter, and hopefully a new baby next year, why push for more time with the kids if it's so hard and so stressful and she is putting up such a crazy fight.

Uh oh, just got the email from her...she is still insisting on ROFR to include non-overnights. I am so sick of this.

Originally Posted by -Resque- 

I agree that you need a MUCH more detailed parenting plan. Our spells out everything you could possibly think of, and leaves NO room for argument, which is exactly why it works so well for DH and DSD's mom. They had a lot of trouble a few years ago, when they both switched times constantly, and it lead to anger on both of their parts- both felt like they weren't getting the time they "deserved." For the last 2 years, we have followed the plan to the letter, and it has created a MUCH happier relationship for all involved.

That schedule sounds insane, and I feel really bad for the kids. We have 50/50 as well, and do Sun, Mon, Tues with mom and Wed, Th, Fri with dad, alternating Saturdays. It does suck because we never get a full weekend, but DSD always knows where she will be, and who she will be with.

ROFR is written into their plan as well, with the stipulation that it can only be used if she will be out of the parent's care for more than 3 hours. DSD's mom was VERY strict in enforcing this (only when it came to me, LOL) until DH pointed out that DSD spent most of the time she was "with" her mom being cared for by other people. She has since dropped the complaints. Honestly, I agree with the reasons it is written in, and to me, it makes sense that she should be with one parent or the other whenever possible- but since she spends very little time with her mom BY HER MOM'S CHOOSING, DH chose to make an issue over this. Now it's basically don't ask don't tell, and everyone seems pretty happy with that.

[PixieAlly]

Okay, can someone explain this one to me?  She has stated she misses the kids when they're away from her and she's trying to make it so they are with her more, especially if they're going to be alone with me or their grandparents instead of with my BF. I understand where she's coming from...well, I would if she were a normal human being anyway. Here's what happened yesterday.

In previous emails she mentioned she was sad she would lose the kids on full snow days because she really looks forward to those and would like them on all full snow days. She also indicated she didn't like that the kids were going to be away from her for so long on winter break (the 2 whole days my BF wanted to keep them at our house). So, when my BF wrote her back after she sent her last proposal (which stated we alternate snow days depending on where the kids are spending the night that night and that we would pick the kids up at 8am on the 26th when he had told her he'd be willing to pick them up later so he could spend the morning with them) he asked her if she still wanted full snow days because he would be willing to write that into the agreement. Her response: "I already indicated to you what my preference is in my last email, so I don't know why you're asking me about snow days again." Um, because her last email indicated we alternate snow days and the one before that said she wanted ALL snow days, so we are confused? In her last email she also said, "Please let me know what time you're picking the kids up on the 26th. If you want to pick up the kids at a later time, that is fine with me." So again, does she or does she not want them for longer periods of time??? When we offer her more time, she either says forget it acts like she doesn't really care one way or the other about it.

This is the biggest reason we're against the more strict ROFR. She just wants to for my BF to ask her permission every time he needs or wants to leave the kids with me or with his relatives as a way to humiliate him or punish him or whatever. Over the past few years she has told my BF she is "busy" (not working) a majority of the time he's asked her to watch them on his time. Meanwhile he or his parents have taken the kids 100% of the time she has asked him to watch them on her time. The other thing is, she works from home part of the time. So the kids tell us a lot that mom is working when they're there. I don't think that's too big of a deal, but how is sitting on the couch watching TV all day while mom works better than going to grandmas who plays with the kids and takes them or or staying at Dad's where we do projects and play games (and go outside a lot in non-winter months) all day? I work from home as well, but limit my time and do a lot of work when my daughter is sleeping or with my BF. She also leaves them home alone to go shopping and run errands, so again, how is NO supervision by an adult better than being with grandparents or at dad's house with me?

[Super~Single~Mama]

I think your DH needs to stop communicating with her entirely, and file in court to revise the parenting plan and ask to be assigned a mediator (if he's comfortable mediating with her). Then serve her the papers and see if she backs down. If not, go to court to get a VERY VERY detailed parenting plan.

[PixieAlly]

Ugh, it's so hard. He keep wanting to write her back and give her one more chance and I don't want to push him too hard in any one direction because I'm afraid he'll resent me later for talking him into doing something he didn't want to, especially if it does not turn out well :( In her last email she stated she didn't see any difference in his proposal compared to hers (which makes NO sense since we completely eliminated the ROFR statement she had in it, but whatever) so I think he's going to write something back like, "Great! I'm glad we've come to an agreement without needing mediation. I've typed up the agreement, signed it and attached it to the email. You just need to sign it and send it back and we're all set for the holidays. I'll pick the kids up at 8am on the 26th," and see what happens. After that, I am hoping he decides to stop communicating (if she doesn't sign it) because there is no point anymore.

Of course she is now accusing him of being "hostile" and "threatening" her with mediation. She also made a point to say the kids never have any problems at her house and her household is always calm (in reference to his statement that the kids complain they are being bounced around between houses too much). I don't know what she's getting at there since he never said things were not calm at the house, just that the kids complain about the schedule. Of course they never complain to her, they're afraid of being punished if they do.

[Super~Single~Mama]

Originally Posted by PixieAlly 

Of course she is now accusing him of being "hostile" and "threatening" her with mediation. She also made a point to say the kids never have any problems at her house and her household is always calm (in reference to his statement that the kids complain they are being bounced around between houses too much). I don't know what she's getting at there since he never said things were not calm at the house, just that the kids complain about the schedule. Of course they never complain to her, they're afraid of being punished if they do.

No, they probably do. She just won't ever tell you about it. My ex always says that my not quite 3yo settles right in and its a seamless adjustment going to his house. Only I was skyping with him once when ds was at his dad's, and there was some MAJOR adjustment issues going on. So he's just lying through his teeth. Oh well, nothing I can do about it.

[-Resque-]

Here is their parenting plan:

Dad's time:

Wed, Th, Fri, alternating Saturdays. When it is not our Saturday, we "return her" at 8am. If it is, we "return her" at 8am Sunday. When she does not have school, she is with the parent whose day it is... although, since Mom is a server, and Dad works 8-5, she generally will remain with her on Wednesdays until picked up by Dad after he is off work... ROFR comes into play there. :) Same for snow days, sick days, etc. All is taken care of by the parent who has her, or me, if it is Dad's time. Mom has been fine with me keeping her for sick days and snow days if it is Dad's day, as I have a much more flexible work schedule. On winter break, she does not mind if DSD spends time with me on Thursdays and Fridays if Dad is working. This is where don't ask, don't tell comes into play.

Summer is the same, although each parent gets a full week. We must notify the other house when our week will be by April 1st.

Memorial Day weekend: Friday at 5pm to Monday at 5pm

4th of July: 8am to 11pm

Halloween is supposedly shared, although she just does it at the house where she is.

Edited to add: Before I came along, DSD's mom had her on Mondays. That was it. DSD suffered for it, and quite honestly, if it took her feeling threatened by me to step up her parenting, then I'm all for it. They have had a much closer relationship the last few years, and while DH misses having all of that time with her, it really has been a good thing for DSD.

Thanksgiving: All day, other than noon to 4, when Mom gets her. We let her spend Wednesday night before with mom though, so we pick her up at 12. This year we picked her up at 2, to give them extra eating time. This pays off for us on Christmas, as you will see. :)

Christmas Day: noon to 4, although Mom always lets her spend the night with us, and return her 8am the next morning.

New Years Eve/Day follows the normal schedule

DSD's birthday: 2pm - 8pm

Father's Day weekend: We keep her all weekend until 5pm Sunday

Father's birthday: 8am - 8pm every year (Father's birthday falls on Memorial Day weekend anyway.)

Mothers time:

Sun, Mon, Tues, alternating Saturdays

Easter: Every year with mother

Labor Day weekend: She gets her Fridays at 5pm, although she has never actually taken her.

Thanksgiving: noon to 4

Christmas Eve: Every year at 6pm through Christmas Day at noon

DSD's birthday: 8pm - 2pm

Mother's Day weekend: She gets her Friday at 5pm, although again, she has never actually taken her.

Mother's Birthday: 8am - 8pm.

It is also written into the plan that DSD is allowed to call either parent whenever she likes, although she has never asked at either house, as far as I know. It is written in that DH picks up DSD every Wednesday morning, and DSD's mom picks her up on the weekend. This does not happen. She is dropped off for school by DSD's mom Wednesday mornings (she attends school in our district), and we take her back to her mom's on the weekends. We generally do most of the transportation, but that's fine with us... that way, we will get her when we are supposed to, and not an hour late. It makes DSD's mom feel "in control" that she makes us drive everywhere, so she lays off in other areas. Fine with us!

It is also written into the plan that if mediation is needed, both parents will pay half of the cost. This has been a really nice way of keeping them OUT of mediation.

Other than some upset when we first got married, things have worked out okay, for the most part. She is generally accepting of me as DSD's stepmother, and does, I believe, actually say nice things about me to DSD. Both houses do a relatively good job of keeping DSD in the dark about any issues that arise. DSD LOVES the parenting plan, and often refers to it... she likes that a judge has decided who she is with, and that she doesn't have to. She doesn't want to hurt anyone's feelings, and feels VERY nervous when we deviate from the plan in any way.

Edited by -Resque- - 12/16/11 at 9:02am

[VocalMinority]

I haven't read the other posts, so disregard this, if it's repetitive.

You can ask for an emergency hearing.  You'd probably win, over the measly 2 days you want.  I don't know if they'd be able to schedule the hearing in time, but if you're going to request one, there's no time to waste.  Write something up and file it TODAY.

Since the ex hasn't actually denied the time yet, unless you have it from her in writing that she won't let you have the kids, then you need to be creative in presenting your case.  If your DH's ex is anything like my DH's, she will realize the immense advantage to her in walking into court and saying, "There's no argument here, I don't know why he's being so litigious!  I never said he can't have the kids."  If the judge doesn't think there's any reason to issue an order, because everyone agrees, then once you walk out of the court room she can do whatever she wants - and she won't be violating an order.  So be prepared (or prepare your DH) to say, "OK, since she's saying she agrees now, but that's the exact opposite of what she's threatened verbally, can we please put this agreement in writing so I have some way to enforce it?"  His lawyer may think that is overkill, or makes him seem petulant, but it's important.

Police generally will not act on behalf of the non-custodial parent.  So how clearly worded are the orders?  E.g., my DH had "joint legal and physical custody", but his ex had their son very slightly more of the time.  Thus, their orders described when DH would "pick up" and "return" their son, implying the child lived at Mom's and only visited Dad.  Even though nothing in their orders actually called Mom the "custodial parent" (they both were), nor called DH the "non-CP", police here still considered him the NCP.  Their policy was that violating a CP's rights to the child is a criminal offense, but denying the NCP's access to the child is a civil offense and can only be resolved by the judge who issued the order.  Sadly, that policy is not even consistent with the letter of our (very egalitarian) law on parental kidnapping...but that's another discussion.  The point is, there's some chance police might intervene, if you have a clearly-worded order and if nothing makes Mom look like she in any way has more access to the kids than Dad.  But don't set all your hopes on the police.

Long-term, if Mom gives your DH NO access to the kids during all of winter break, she'd clearly be in violation of the order that holiday time be equally divided.  Carefully read the criteria for changing custody.  There should be some way to fit this violation into one of the criteria.  And I assume there have been other violations, on her part.  50-50 custody simply doesn't work, when one parent is unsupportive of the kids' need for contact with the other parent.  Your DH needs to have primary or sole custody, presuming he would not try to keep the kids away from their mother, like she does to him.  If parenting time is already 50-50, the schedule would not have to change that much.  The kids' lives need not be terribly disrupted.  But the legal standing of being custodial parent would let your DH have the final say, when she wants unreasonable visitation arrangements.  It would also let police enforce HIS interpretation of their custody orders.  Mom would still have the option to take him to court, but if she's truly unreasonable, her attorney will discourage her and the judge will rule against her and possibly make her pay your DH's legal fees.

Good luck.  I HATE holiday squabbles.  We're days away from our own and I'm just holding on for the ride...

[BrascosPrincess]

ok im sorry hun im not trying to be mean or sound like i am but what is this "us" and "we" crap? they are not your children you are just the girlfriend you are nothing to the children involved. i suggest you leave the disputing custody between your boyfriend and his ex. and so what if she is taking them on vacation? dont you think the children deserve a nice vacation? instead of complaining that you will have no time with them while they are on vacation why dont you be happy for them that they are spending some nice quality time having fun on a nice vacation with their mother? and how is the ex winning anything? lets see, the children are old enough to be in school so there goes 8 hours of her day without them, they are with thier dad for an hour there is 9 hours a day she is losing time with them, lets see she probably has a full time job too, right there is munus more time with them... and just wondering how did you write a detailed schedule of when each parent wakes and sleeps? you dont know what time she gets up and goes to bed. she could get up at 4 am and not even get to bed till late getting the childrens things around for school and to be with you and their father. i think you need to cut the ex some slack and respect her for everything she is doing for the kids. you sound like an immature little girl. if you want my advice.. get out of the relationship because you arent mature enough to have a serious relationship. and stop trying to get in between the custody stuff, its really none of your business..

like i said before i am not trying to be mean or make anyone mad i am just expressing my opinion

[Imakcerka]

Not helpful. 

 

Originally Posted by BrascosPrincess 

ok im sorry hun im not trying to be mean or sound like i am but what is this "us" and "we" crap? they are not your children you are just the girlfriend you are nothing to the children involved. i suggest you leave the disputing custody between your boyfriend and his ex. and so what if she is taking them on vacation? dont you think the children deserve a nice vacation? instead of complaining that you will have no time with them while they are on vacation why dont you be happy for them that they are spending some nice quality time having fun on a nice vacation with their mother? and how is the ex winning anything? lets see, the children are old enough to be in school so there goes 8 hours of her day without them, they are with thier dad for an hour there is 9 hours a day she is losing time with them, lets see she probably has a full time job too, right there is munus more time with them... and just wondering how did you write a detailed schedule of when each parent wakes and sleeps? you dont know what time she gets up and goes to bed. she could get up at 4 am and not even get to bed till late getting the childrens things around for school and to be with you and their father. i think you need to cut the ex some slack and respect her for everything she is doing for the kids. you sound like an immature little girl. if you want my advice.. get out of the relationship because you arent mature enough to have a serious relationship. and stop trying to get in between the custody stuff, its really none of your business..

like i said before i am not trying to be mean or make anyone mad i am just expressing my opinion