Instilling Confidence - Page 2

[Hoopin' Mama]

Originally Posted by brokenheart 

She matter-of-factly says that nobody at her school really likes her.  Sometimes she is sad.  She often asks me to help her get friends.  It is heartbreaking. 

OP, I agree wtih the idea about Girl Scouts or another group activity. I also know a lot of little girls who take marital arts and I've seen the benefits of that in their confidence levels.

It doesn't sound like she is being picked on or anything, just not being sought out. I have been an introvert all my life and I definitely blend into the background pretty easily. Funny, I was just talking about that with my husband and we half-jokingly talked about reading the How To Win Friends book.  Best of luck. My heart goes out to you, it is hard to hear your child say no one likes her.

Edited by Hoopin' Mama - 2/11/12 at 7:47am

[Tjej]

I'm an introvert too, with an introvert DD, and can really empathize with your situation. 

Are there any activities your child really likes?  Dance has been great for my DD.  It's calm and structured, with moments between to slightly connect with other kids.  Church has actually been very good too.  Connecting with kids of different ages. 

If you haven't read about introversion, it could be helpful to feel better about some aspects of what is going on.  And your DD might gain from insights you can share with her about an introverted personality.

Sorry you and your DD are struggling with this.  Having her be a mother's helper and/or leading playgroups of young kids could be a real source of joy for her.  It sounds like an excellent idea to pursue.  It feels good to be respected and listened to and successful.

Tjej

[mom2qts]

Dariusmom, Yes you hit the nail on the head!  I was going to quote you but I would have had to highlight everything.  When I said she is social I meant she is outgoing and eager to make friends, sadly this wish is often ignored.  Then to clear up any confusion, not that my childs emotions are anyone business but yes this does affect her.  She closes herself off and cries.  I may not be the expert sociologst that some are but this tells me she is less than happy.  I reassure her constantly that she is better than that and how she doesnt need other kids to be happy because she is so clever and creative.   To say anyone is putting this hardship on their child is unkind inmy opinion and in my case atleast untrue.  I for one have 1 best friend, my dh.  I am not a social butterfly and am totally happy this way.  That is not to say I am not a social person.  When out I enjoy being around others, chatting, meeting new people.  But in general I enjoy my own company and that of my family.  So as far as the some other posts have said having hoards of friends is not the be all end all in my eyes.  Being happy with yourself is.  I am appalled at some of the harsh generalizations that have been made to the contrary.  Then with the teachers you nailed it again.  I never even insinuated that the teachers were lying and didn't get the impression the OP was saying that either.  I for one just feel since the child is doing well in class and not being bullied all is well.  Ok now I am just rehashing.  I just had to give your post a here here! 

Edited by mom2qts - 2/9/12 at 10:46pm

[DariusMom]

Originally Posted by Hoopin' Mama 

What exactly about these words is Serenbat not getting?

OP, I agree wtih the idea about Girl Scouts or another group activity. I also know a lot of little girls who take marital arts and I've seen the benefits of that in their confidence levels.

It doesn't sound like she is being picked on or anything, just not being sought out. I have been an introvert all my life and I definitely blend into the background pretty easily. Funny, I was just talking about that with my husband and we half-jokingly talked about reading the How To Win Friends book.  Best of luck. My heart goes out to you, it is hard to hear your child say no one likes her.

I quoted that exact same passage, as well, Hoopin' Mama!

According to these posters, trying to help our kids negotiate difficult social situations and feeling sad about those same social situations on behalf of our kids has suddenly morphed into being Tools of the Oppressive Man, forcing free spirited kids into some conformist mode  . . . [insert eye roll!]
 

Originally Posted by mom2qts 

Dariusmom, Yes you hit the nail on the head!  I was going to quote you but I would have had to highlight everything.  When I said she is social I meant she is outgoing and eager to make friends, sadly this wish is often ignored.  Then to clear up any confusion, not that my childs emotions are anyone business but yes this does affect her.  She closes herself off and cries.  I may not be the expert sociologst that some are but this tells me she is less than happy.  I reassure her constantly that she is better than that and how she doesnt need other kids to be happy because she is so clever and creative.   To say anyone is putting this hardship on their child is unkind inmy opinion and in my case atleast untrue.  I for one have 1 best friend, my dh.  I am not a social butterfly and am totally happy this way.  That is not to say I am not a social person.  When out I enjoy being around others, chatting, meeting new people.  But in general I enjoy my own company and that of my family.  So as far as the some other posts have said having hoards of friends is not the be all end all in my eyes.  Being happy with yourself is.  I am appalled at some of the harsh generalizations that have been made to the contrary.  Then with the teachers you nailed it again.  I never even insinuated that the teachers were lying and didn't get the impression the OP was saying that either.  I for one just feel since the child is doing well in class and not being bullied all is well.  Ok now I am just rehashing.  I just had to give your post a here here! 

Thanks, mom2qts.

I, too, am appalled by some of the harsh generalizations in a few of the responses. I feel, as I've said before, that a couple of posters have gone off into Rant Against Evil Society squashing special sparkly children mode rather than really bothering to read what other posters are saying.

Ultimately, a little sympathy, reading comprehension, and punctuation skills go a long way!
 

Edited by DariusMom - 2/11/12 at 4:56am

[Neera]

Hi,

I am an introvert and my dd has just started school. I am a little worried as well. I get to know parents when picking up dd because everyone is there chatting with each other. I've not found it hard to get to know them in such a situation. I probably won't be their best friend or who knows I might make a v. good friend, but I think it helps when kids see their parents know each other. I also hosted a birthday party for her for this reason. I thought having her classmates in a non-classroom setting might help now and hopefully in the future years. Is this an option for you? - getting to know parents at pickup/drop off time.

Edited by Neera - 2/11/12 at 8:05am

[AdinaL]

Hey folks, let's get the topic back on the actual topic and off of other people and what they may or may not "get".  Discussing other posters doesn't do anything but derail the thread and make it hard to continue.

Back on topic.  If you have posted something that may be construed as a personal attack (and I suggest you do reread and double check) please edit.  Thank you

[serenbat]

- I've talked to her teachers 3 times now.  Each time I'm told they don't see an issue and that she IS part of the group.  It isn't like she's being completely shunned or anything, but the other girls seem to ignore her most of the time (from what I can see) or they will be playing a game that does not need more players, etc.

 

regardless of what the issue is, 3 times may warrant taking this a step beyond, perhaps a meeting with the teachers and the school counselor

as I stated prior, if a teacher(s) did not see something that I felt was there I would wonder what else is being missed (I realize other have different opinions on this) - maybe the school is not a good fit if the teachers are not seeing what you see

maybe you will find these helpful - http://www.infj.com/INFJ_Introversion.htm

http://ideas.time.com/2012/01/26/dont-call-introverted-children-shy/ 

[meemee]

OP if you feel this is something that is going to follow your dd around all her life - apart from finding social groups to join as others have said - the most important task is to talk to her (indirectly) and show her that she is not defined by what others think, but by what she feels who she is.

we are sorta kinda in your boat. dd is 9. very social. everyone knows her. but everyone finds her weird. for all sorts of reasons. because she chases the boys and makes sure they play together - not just in boy groups adn girls groups. they think she is weird because she eats salad for lunch when the closest thing to green in others lunches are the jellybeans. 

i have not gone looking for help.

social groups may help - but not really. dd is in girl scouts and she works well with the kids but she is not good friends with them. some invite the whole group to their bday party and leave dd out. 

for me i dont feel bad for dd. she is full of confidence but also sometimes sad. and i share with her my life story. i led the same life. my beliefs, philosophy way of life has seperated me from the usual social group. dd interests and philosophy has kept her apart from the other kids around her. many of them are in awe of her, many dont know what to do with her - but over all they dont want to be buddies with her. 

to add further confusion the two girls who adore dd and worship her - dd does not want to hang out with them anymore. dd has very high standards and i've tried to tell her if that is what it is then be prepared not to have too many friends. thankfully she has one really good friend. 

8 is a difficult time for all kids. its conscience developement time. its existentialist thinking time. 

i think its really important to help her define who she is and not let the other kids get to her - that something is wrong they dont want to be friends with her. 

[Wolfcat]

Originally Posted by brokenheart 

DD is 8 and for the past several years she has been having social problems. I want to help her but I don't know how.

She is a bit shy (off and on), she can come across as alternately standoffish or needy (depending on how shy she might be feeling at the time or who she is with).  She is also sensitive (overly so at times).  However, other than that, I don't notice any real "problems" with her behavior any time that I have been around to observe.  She is kind and fair.

But she has a real problem making friends.  I've noticed that she seems to be the "target".  Other kids do not seem to like her much.  She's been in the same school all along yet she only has 1 friend.  And that friend often wants to play with the other girls and for whatever reason, DD is never included.  She says she asks to play but they either say no or they will tell her she can play if she is the dog (they play house) and then laugh at her.  I take everything with a grain of salt, but the overall theme is that she is not part of the group.  I can see this because any time I'm at the school I either see her alone or playing with the much younger children.    In fact, lately she's been playing with a 5 year old at recess.

She matter-of-factly says that nobody at her school really likes her.  Sometimes she is sad.  She often asks me to help her get friends.  It is heartbreaking.  Here's what I've done:

- I've talked to her teachers 3 times now.  Each time I'm told they don't see an issue and that she IS part of the group.  It isn't like she's being completely shunned or anything, but the other girls seem to ignore her most of the time (from what I can see) or they will be playing a game that does not need more players, etc.

- I have tried inviting the other girls (both as a group and separately) for playdates, to go skating, swimming, etc.  It isn't very successful.  A couple of them do come, but my DD almost never gets invites back. 

- I've tried to get to know the moms, but this has been a dismal failure.  They are not interested in going for tea (or they are maybe too busy, I have no idea).

By the way, if I could see something that was causing this (for example, if she had a real problem sharing or she was rude), I would definitely have something to work with.  As it is, I have NOTHING.  I do not know why she is not accepted.

I am an introvert and I have always had a very hard time making friends.  I truly don't know why.  I do NOT want this for my child.  It eats away at your self esteem.  I should mention that (at least from my point of view) there is nothing wrong with us.  People don't even know us, so they couldn't be put off by anything.  We are average people, dress normal (lol), we are not loud, we don't drive something obnoxious.  Our home, while very modest, is clean.  My child is dressed like everyone else (uniform) and I make sure she is clean.  We make a point of showing up to all the school events and we volunteer.  We are friendly, but not in anyone's face (ever).  I try to set up something fun once in a while (ex: little skating party) so we can get to know people (doesn't work though).  I don't get it at all.

I am thinking if I could find her a team environment she could get some confidence.  But she's not interested in sports.  Any suggestions?

Your DD sounds exactly like someone I know... Oh, wait, it's ME!

I'm a total introvert, and had a VERY hard time all through elementary and high school. I stayed in my room and read, because I never had anyone to hang out with. I was tolerated by all, but loved by none. I had teachers and peers alike attack me for various reasons. My mother spent tons of time trying to get the schools to do something to socially protect me.

Turns out, it was the BEST THING EVER.

I learned how to observe people. I learned to not base myself on others' attention. I learned to entertain myself. I eventually learned how to make friends, but, by then, I just didn't care to try. Now I am able to maneuver through any social situation, but not get hung up in them.

The problem isn't with your DD. The problem is that she likely has a quality that is not entirely understood by the others. I had someone say that I was "ethereal" once. (BTW, I will NEVER be described as "delicate".)

1

a : of or relating to the regions beyond the earth

b : celestial, heavenly

c : unworldly, spiritual

2

a : lacking material substance : immaterial, intangible

b : marked by unusual delicacy or refinement <this smallest, most ethereal, and daintiest of birds — William Beebe>

c : suggesting the heavens or heaven )

How do you bolster her confidence? Let her be herself. Give her the freedom to be herself. But really, give her the freedom to fail. If you make her friends for her, it may SEEM that that is what she wants. She might even believe that. But it will always be in the back of her head that you did this FOR her. Unfortunately, this is truly a "what doesn't kill you" situation. SHE will learn to deal with social interactions, or she won't. But failing would be the lesser evil compared to someone doing it for her.

I'm not going to lie. It SUCKS. In my own situation, there were suicidal thoughts, cutting, the potential for risky behavior (which, thankfully, I didn't act on), and more... My parents were completely lost as to how to deal with me. I got NO support there. But there is nothing I would change about it now, after the fact. If you support her, let her be her, she should turn out just fine.

[lunagirl704]

Originally Posted by Just1More 

How is she doing at school academically?  Is she significantly ahead or behind?  Quicker to understand concepts?  Prefer kids who are older than her?  Have more mature (instead of less, as you wonder) social skills?  What does she like to do?  Is she a talker and a thinker?

I realized that my own dd(6)  doesn't fit in often because she acts and thinks more like a 12yo.  Her older cousins adore her, and marvel at how she just fits right in with them.  She's obviously lacking in worldly wisdom, and, well, puberty, but otherwise, her social skills are on par with them.  I used to think that she was behind, until I really watched her one day, and realized that she wasn't behind, but actually interacting more like adults do.  The other little girl couldn't relate the same.  Dd has always, at parties, sought out adults or the older teenagers, and would only play with the other kids a little bit.  She's not been tested, but apparently is quite a big "ahead" of her peers academically, as well.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that you might come to a different conclusion about what your dd needs if you frame your thoughts in terms of what does she do right, instead of what might be wrong with us, what do we need to learn to fit in.  My dd does seem to want to play with kids her own age, but it just doesn't seem to go well, usually.  She needs the older kids to relate to, and who have enough grace to bend for her childishness at times.  Maybe your dd could benefit from a similar arrangement?

Originally Posted by brokenheart 

DD is 8 and for the past several years she has been having social problems. I want to help her but I don't know how.

She is a bit shy (off and on), she can come across as alternately standoffish or needy (depending on how shy she might be feeling at the time or who she is with).  She is also sensitive (overly so at times).  However, other than that, I don't notice any real "problems" with her behavior any time that I have been around to observe.  She is kind and fair.

But she has a real problem making friends.  I've noticed that she seems to be the "target".  Other kids do not seem to like her much.  She's been in the same school all along yet she only has 1 friend.  And that friend often wants to play with the other girls and for whatever reason, DD is never included.  She says she asks to play but they either say no or they will tell her she can play if she is the dog (they play house) and then laugh at her.  I take everything with a grain of salt, but the overall theme is that she is not part of the group.  I can see this because any time I'm at the school I either see her alone or playing with the much younger children.    In fact, lately she's been playing with a 5 year old at recess.

She matter-of-factly says that nobody at her school really likes her.  Sometimes she is sad.  She often asks me to help her get friends.  It is heartbreaking.  Here's what I've done:

- I've talked to her teachers 3 times now.  Each time I'm told they don't see an issue and that she IS part of the group.  It isn't like she's being completely shunned or anything, but the other girls seem to ignore her most of the time (from what I can see) or they will be playing a game that does not need more players, etc.

- I have tried inviting the other girls (both as a group and separately) for playdates, to go skating, swimming, etc.  It isn't very successful.  A couple of them do come, but my DD almost never gets invites back. 

- I've tried to get to know the moms, but this has been a dismal failure.  They are not interested in going for tea (or they are maybe too busy, I have no idea).

By the way, if I could see something that was causing this (for example, if she had a real problem sharing or she was rude), I would definitely have something to work with.  As it is, I have NOTHING.  I do not know why she is not accepted.

I am an introvert and I have always had a very hard time making friends.  I truly don't know why.  I do NOT want this for my child.  It eats away at your self esteem.  I should mention that (at least from my point of view) there is nothing wrong with us.  People don't even know us, so they couldn't be put off by anything.  We are average people, dress normal (lol), we are not loud, we don't drive something obnoxious.  Our home, while very modest, is clean.  My child is dressed like everyone else (uniform) and I make sure she is clean.  We make a point of showing up to all the school events and we volunteer.  We are friendly, but not in anyone's face (ever).  I try to set up something fun once in a while (ex: little skating party) so we can get to know people (doesn't work though).  I don't get it at all.

I am thinking if I could find her a team environment she could get some confidence.  But she's not interested in sports.  Any suggestions?

Oh, brokenheart, you sound just like me :). My dd is in 2nd grade and is going through the same. She is a kind, sweet girl with an outgoing personality, yet the other girls exclude her. She often says no one played with her at recess or the girls walked away and it made her sad. She gets along very well with others- especially older children (as per just1more's post) and when we get together with friends she gets along with their children wonderfully. I have a younger ds and she plays with him...I think since she is usually in control with him maybe she applies that to her peers? And no one can be the boss all the time. I think she also comes across as needy sometimes...she wants to be liked and the other girls (and their moms) are very cliquey...it seems they have known each other forever. We moved to town right before K started so it's not like dd is the new girl. I have always been introverted too and was never part of a group. I always had a few good friends. Now I am trying to reach out socially and have met a few nice women (not in the same town/school though). DD is in brownies (with the same girls) and we put her in various weekend activities. She will play softball in the spring (with the same girls). I do think this is a hard age, other than that I have no answer, but I understand your worry. Someone posted about projecting ones own insecurity onto their children and for me that's true. My daughter is strong...she doesn't cry about this (yet) and she has fun when she does play with others. I just don't want her to go through all I went through. I still am insecure around these cliquey women and I don't want dd to be the same but rather her own confident self.
 

[Butterflymom]

Originally Posted by Just1More 

Is she a talker and a thinker?

I realized that my own dd(6)  doesn't fit in often because she acts and thinks more like a 12yo.  Her older cousins adore her, and marvel at how she just fits right in with them.  She's obviously lacking in worldly wisdom, and, well, puberty, but otherwise, her social skills are on par with them.  I used to think that she was behind, until I really watched her one day, and realized that she wasn't behind, but actually interacting more like adults do.  The other little girl couldn't relate the same.  Dd has always, at parties, sought out adults or the older teenagers, and would only play with the other kids a little bit. ?

That was me as a little girl (long conversations with adults from age 4....)---- and eccentric and into wearing my own fashion as well. I was ostracized as weird and never in "the group" until I got to high school and I started joining in with the most mature 18 year olds (i got to know during marching band camp) as a 14 year old freshman and gradually found other teens throughout high school to get along with, including some of the ones who ostracized me in elementary school and high school, since they were finally mature enoigh to be friends with. From age 10 i loved babysitting little kids, i always loved younger kids, not only much older people) By the end of high school it had leveled out so much and I wasn't lonely at all. In fact, my unique style and personality made me stand out in a positive way, and I became a leader in almost every sphere at school (and extra curricular activities) and definitely accepted by my peers (& continued to bond outside my peer age, i.e. elderly people in my church choir, etc).
Nowadays I think being able to bond well with age blindness is a great attribute I'm glad to have been developing since age 3-4, and the social pain during elementary and middle school were worth it, as I always managed to have 1-2 friends in my class during those years anyways. There's usually another outsider to join forces with.

[Butterflymom]

Now that I've read the whole thing I just wanted to offer the only advice I can:

Set up one on one playdate opportunities where she invites just ONE girl from school to go to a movie, bake cookies at your home to bring to the whole class, attend a cool local event, etc. 

If DD inviting a desired friend candidate doesn't work, contact the parent directly and say there's room in the car for one more for __(fill in after school or weekend activity here)___ and DD would love for their child to join in and you're happy to provide transportation home after, whatever's convenient.  (or "dd needs an extra set of hands for ____(baking project, whatever)___ and she would love it to be your daughter") hopefully enough attempts will yield a few unhurried opportunities for your daughter to bond one on one with a classmate. After awhile, if she's had success with two girls who have warned up and acted friendly with DD, then invite the two of them together for a threesome situation and see how that goes. If you can get to this stage where two friends at the same time are engaging pleasantly with her outside of school, they should be nice to her & include her at school, too.

Girls scouts is also a great idea!