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avoiding nonorganic but still being polit - Page 2

post #21 of 56

 

 

Quote:
Where do you find such bounty?

we are in the northeast and have a hugh bounty, within two hours drive I get 90% of all our food-I do know how it is grown and who grows it

post #22 of 56

Well that works for you.  Wouldn't work for me.  I would have to do a lot of driving around just to eat, or borrow my neighbors yard to continue my garden.  It's not easy.  Acting like it's any other is not exactly helpful.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post

 

 

we are in the northeast and have a hugh bounty, within two hours drive I get 90% of all our food-I do know how it is grown and who grows it



 

post #23 of 56
Wow! I live in the Northeast too and I certainly can't get 100% organic food. Even one of my friends who has a much larger budget than me (in other words, never even looks at the prices) and makes organic & local eating top priority, is not able to feed her child 100% organic. It's more like 60-70%. Consider yourself lucky that you are able to do this and that you're able to afford it. You're in a minority.

That said, your title was "avoiding non-organic but still being polite" -- I don't think there's a way you can do that. You can bring all your own food, which is the simplest & most preferable solution IMO (but you'll still offend some, many people like to cook for others and take great pride in it!) I think it is completely out of line to ask whether a dish is all organic.

I get that you're saying lots of people have dietary restrictions, but it's just DIFFERENT to say 'we eat strictly organic.' You are making a value judgement on others. You are asking people to spend money they simply may not have. It's hard to explain but there's a difference. I can cook a vegan meal without spending any extra money. I am happy to spend extra money to make an allergen-free meal if necessary. Kosher is a religious thing and I'd gladly comply. Most people can cook a meal without artificial colors/flavors. Most people CAN'T cook a meal that's 100% organic.

You are also assuming that those who don't eat 100% organic are just ignorant or not using their resources wisely, but that's not true at all. Sure, there are people that think organic is all hype, but there are many who go out of their way to get organic food but just can't do it 100% or even 50% because of where they live, income, resources, etc. A tiny speck of residual non-organic pesticide that makes it into the finished dish is not going to kill you. You are getting lots of health benefits from eating 95% organic and 5% not while out & about. Or just don't eat while you're out. I can't imagine you'll find many people willing to accommodate your preferences.
post #24 of 56

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post

 

 

we are in the northeast and have a hugh bounty, within two hours drive I get 90% of all our food-I do know how it is grown and who grows it



And just to clarify, all of this food is grown without pesticides, not even organic pesticides?

 

 

 

post #25 of 56

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by crunchy_mommy View Post
I get that you're saying lots of people have dietary restrictions, but it's just DIFFERENT to say 'we eat strictly organic.' You are making a value judgement on others. You are asking people to spend money they simply may not have. It's hard to explain but there's a difference. I can cook a vegan meal without spending any extra money. I am happy to spend extra money to make an allergen-free meal if necessary. Kosher is a religious thing and I'd gladly comply. Most people can cook a meal without artificial colors/flavors. Most people CAN'T cook a meal that's 100% organic.
You are also assuming that those who don't eat 100% organic are just ignorant or not using their resources wisely, but that's not true at all. Sure, there are people that think organic is all hype, but there are many who go out of their way to get organic food but just can't do it 100% or even 50% because of where they live, income, resources, etc. A tiny speck of residual non-organic pesticide that makes it into the finished dish is not going to kill you. You are getting lots of health benefits from eating 95% organic and 5% not while out & about. Or just don't eat while you're out. I can't imagine you'll find many people willing to accommodate your preferences.

 

I agree with this entirely. 
 

 

post #26 of 56

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post

you happen to be the one that implied and put words in my mouth (that I DID NOT STATE!) - you come off as very offensive and rude- talk about high and mighty!

 

I stated US - not others

 

our choice is ours 

 

facts are facts - pesticides are what they are - fact not fiction - it is not a "judgement" when you state a fact

 

ETA - people make "life-style"(non-allergic) food related choices all the time (kosher, vegan, avoiding certain ingredients, etc) avoiding non-organics should - IMO be view in the same context - nothing to be afraid of or embarrassed of - but a choice that should be respected

 

if you can respect that a person does not want their child to eat a potato fried in pork fat (for ex.- for any number of reasons) why can't that person respect the organic choice that parent is making?


Your exact phrase was "we happen to care about what goes into our child's body". That's not putting words in your mouth, that's making a reasonable inference from your statement that those that don't feed their children a 100% organic diet don't care. And I'm sorry if you don't see it this way - but that's ridiculous. 

 

post #27 of 56

Well, the other tricky thing with 'all organic' is that unless you are eating raw (which for all I know that is what you do!), different people define what constitutes 'all organic' differently.  I have enough fussy people in my life that when someone says something like that I take them more literally at their word than most people do.  So *I* would assume that if you asked if my banana bread was 'organic' you also meant the baking soda/flour/salt/spices.  I think a normal person would probably answer 'yes' as long as the oil/bananas/flour were 'organic' on the label.

 

I really don't think you can reject people's food in a polite way to all people.  As I mentioned before, I'm to the point where it doesn't phase me and I don't take it personally, because I have many otherwise loveable but very insistantly hardcore people in my life.  I know it's not about me, it's about them.  People do get bent out of shape over food (ask a person who keeps kosher/has food allergies/is vegan or vegetarian--no matter what the reason is, some people will be offended or assume that you think everyone who doesn't eat like you is a piece of crap).  It's just one of those weird primal things I guess.

 

So yes, be all organic and do what you have to do--but it's unrealistic and IMO unreasonable to expect to insist on that and have nobody be mad or offended at you ever.  Maybe in happy perfect world, it could be like that, but it's just not reality.  If you have food needs, you're going to have to have uncomfortable conversations whether you like it or not, and you are going to be impolite to some people.  You'll just have to be charming in other ways or go out of your way to make sure that you directly say that this is YOUR thing and you do not blame anyone or expect them to bow to your preferences;  and hopefully they will believe you.  If you do kinda look down on non-organic people though, you're not going to be able to fake it though. All my friends who think they fake it well so DO NOT.  I love teasing them about it.  :)

post #28 of 56

 

 

Quote:
And just to clarify, all of this food is grown without pesticides, not even organic pesticides?

 

YES we do!

 

there happens to be many farmers in our area that use no pesticides at all

post #29 of 56

 

 

Quote:
Your exact phrase was "we happen to care about what goes into our child's body".

OUR child not your child!

 

- same as a parent of a child who is vegan, allergic, kosher, etc -

 

 

 

 

 

would you dare make such a rude remark to a parent of a child with a nut allergy who cares what goes into their body

 

 

 

our child, our choice 

post #30 of 56


Angry Serenbat! 
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post

 

 

OUR child not your child!

 

- same as a parent of a child who is vegan, allergic, kosher, etc -

 

 

 

 

 

would you dare make such a rude remark to a parent of a child with a nut allergy who cares what goes into their body

 

 

 

our child, our choice 



 

post #31 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post

 

 

we are in the northeast and have a hugh bounty, within two hours drive I get 90% of all our food-I do know how it is grown and who grows it



But you're ok with the car emissions from driving that much to get your food?

post #32 of 56

I viewed this much like other parenting issues - I have my ideals, but I also live in reality.  I think moderation is key. 
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post

poisons are just that- poisons

 

some people understand that one seed can cause harm or a skin of an apple,etc  - same goes with pesticides (they do cause harm)

 

we avoid soy, we would not think to NOT ask about that- regardless if it organic or not- just like alcohol or caffeine - we don't want our child eating those things---we would not be responsible parents if we just let anything be placed in-front of our child by a host 

 

pesticides are right up their with soda for us-we happen to care what goes in our child's body and our too!


And yet others don't even know what the word poison means. 

post #33 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post

 

 

we are in the northeast and have a hugh bounty, within two hours drive I get 90% of all our food-I do know how it is grown and who grows it



I simply don't believe this.

post #34 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post

 

 

OUR child not your child!

 

- same as a parent of a child who is vegan, allergic, kosher, etc -

 

 

 

 

 

would you dare make such a rude remark to a parent of a child with a nut allergy who cares what goes into their body

 

 

 

our child, our choice 



I'm pretty sure that your comment was the one that is being viewed as rude. And FWIW I would hazard a guess that the majority of the members here do not see the choice to consume ONLY organic foods to be even slightly comparable to allergic/religious dietary restrictions. Comparing a child with a nut allergy to someone who refuses to eat a non-organic apple and their struggles is ridiculous and slightly offensive.
post #35 of 56

 

 

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post

 

 

we are in the northeast and have a hugh bounty, within two hours drive I get 90% of all our food-I do know how it is grown and who grows it



I simply don't believe this.

 

 

you obviously don't know much about Rodale and their vast influence - it is great to live in an area that does get it!

 

to drive once a year 2 hours for blueberries is far better to use vs weekly trips to a grocery store to buy trucked in fruit that is out of season locally 

post #36 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post

 

 

 

YES we do!

 

there happens to be many farmers in our area that use no pesticides at all


Er.... and I simply don't believe this. Maybe you are misunderstanding the situation. For example, if you ask them if they use pesticides, and they say no, perhaps they are really saying, "no, no synthetic pesticide, or no non-organic pesticides."?

 

I've worked on organic and conventional farms since I was in high school, I've gotten a graduate degree in Plant and Soil Science, I've worked for University Extension Services that provide education and outreach to farmers across each state, I obsess about growing things... I have yet to visit a single farm that uses no pesticides at all. Not a single one. They do exist, but when they do they are often very, very unique - Sepp Holzer anyone?

 

 

post #37 of 56

 

 

Quote:
Maybe you are misunderstanding the situation. 

 

 

 

I understand very well, MANY ARE NOT USING - not even organic anymore!

 

I know ones that did in the past and now are not.

 

 

I know the farmers I buy from and I know how they food is raised and what I am getting. I know what I am growing too!

 

post #38 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post

 

 

 

 

you obviously don't know much about Rodale and their vast influence - it is great to live in an area that does get it!

 

to drive once a year 2 hours for blueberries is far better to use vs weekly trips to a grocery store to buy trucked in fruit that is out of season locally 


Oh pfft. Here is an article from the Rodale Institute about how to approach pest management decisions. Here's a quote:

 

Quote:

If you plan to use a botanical or biological pesticide or a synthetic pesticide on the National List, make sure that the formulated (brand name) product you intend to use is approved by your certifier prior to applying it to your crop or land. Keep in mind that most insecticides contain inert ingredients as carriers and/or fillers. Synthetic inert ingredients that are classified on the Environmental Protection Agency’s List 4 “Inerts of Minimal Concern” may be used. Inert ingredients on EPA’s List 3 “Inerts of Unknown Toxicity” may only be used in passive pheromone dispensers.

 

 

Organic. It does not mean what you think it means.

post #39 of 56

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post

 

OUR child not your child!

 

- same as a parent of a child who is vegan, allergic, kosher, etc -

 

would you dare make such a rude remark to a parent of a child with a nut allergy who cares what goes into their body

 

our child, our choice 


You're not even addressing what I'm taking issue with in regard to your original comment at this point. Yes of course it's "your child, your choice". But I take issue with you making a value judgment on those parents that cannot afford/acquire a 100% organic diet for their children - your original statement implies that they don't care enough about their children! That's the kind of attitude that I think is offensive, high and mighty and rude. You many not think so, but that's what people are going to think/feel when you start tossing around phrases like "we happen to care...". A statement phrased in that way is a value judgement. At any rate, you don't understand the logic or you don't care to.  

 

post #40 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by kitchensqueen View Post


You're not even addressing what I'm taking issue with in regard to your original comment at this point. Yes of course it's "your child, your choice". But I take issue with you making a value judgment on those parents that cannot afford/acquire a 100% organic diet for their children - your original statement implies that they don't care enough about their children! That's the kind of attitude that I think is offensive, high and mighty and rude. You many not think so, but that's what people are going to think/feel when you start tossing around phrases like "we happen to care...". A statement phrased in that way is a value judgement. At any rate, you don't understand the logic or you don't care to.  

yeahthat.gif

Go ahead & eat only organic & let everyone know that you won't eat what they've cooked otherwise... that is totally & completely your right, and there's nothing wrong with it, you can make whatever choices you want, but it certainly wouldn't be polite.

ETA: didn't realize serenbat wasn't the OP...
Edited by crunchy_mommy - 1/31/12 at 6:14am
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