At a loss and don't know what to do

[Phyllis Engle]

Point blank, my 4 y/o DD is defiant and I don't know what to do about it. She is fearless and doesn't seem to care about punishment. She is the youngest out of 4 kids. She starts school in August, and I really want to get a handle on this. It doesn't phase her when she goes in "Time Out", it doesn't phase her if she gets a swat on the behind, it doesn't phase her if she gets sent to her room. She does not listen to direction. She is a smart girl. And when she is being good, she is great! But it never lasts long. She has been a naughty girl starting at an early age, and it just seems to get worse with time. It is embarrassing, She throws temper tantrums. I mean, my head is spinning with all the bad things she does. But she really is a good girl! It makes me sad that she is this way. I want to help make her happy and behave!

I have expressed to her that I understand she is upset and I try to find out what is bothering her, but she is 4. I try to help her find different ways to express herself, but in the end nothing seems to help. 

Help. What do we do? How do we handle this?

[ThreeTwoFive]

Phyllis, could you give some more specific examples of situations that trigger problems?  

What is an example of her not listening or being "naughty"?

In general I would recommend "How to talk so kids can listen" as a good reference book.  It's super user-friendly and a fast read.

[Phyllis Engle]

Thank you for the response, and I will check out the reading material you have suggested.

Bascially, she doesn't listen, AT ALL. I have caught her over in the neighbors yard. She climbs our fence to get over there. She hangs out in my neighbors front porch swing. When you ask her nicely to come home, she screams and runs away!  (side note - our neighbor is new, male, single, and has no children)

She screams in the house and fights with her older brothers. And when I say fight, I mean she bites them on occassion and hits them. 

None of my other children were this way, and my oldest daughter has ADHD!  I realize that all children are different, and believe me, all of mine are very different from the other. I am a stay at home mom, so I'm here all the time, we do things together. But when things are not on her terms, she freaks out. She is very much like the Varuca character in the movie Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory. I just want to help her be a good girl. I want to fix whatever it is that is causing her to be this way. She is also very jealous of anyone giving me any sort of affection. I have tried to explain to her over and over that I have enough love for everyone in our family. It is quite obvious to me she is hurting or feels slighted in some way, I just don't know how to find those answers or how to fix it.

[ThreeTwoFive]

Is she playing outside with her siblings and not you?  My DS is 2, so I don't know when I'd be comfortable letting him play outside without me. Climbing the fence is a major concern.  One consequence of doing that would be having to come inside immediately.  An explanation of property lines might be in order, too.

Is there a predictable trigger for fighting with her brothers?  

Playful Parenting would be my next book suggestion.  There are some good ideas in there about play wrestling and turning negatives into games.

[wyogirl]

Does she get "time outs?" I have found that helps tremendously with my son.  There are days, like today, I had to put him in his room 5 times within a 2 hour period for a time out, but eventually it just "clicked" and he started acting good again.  I also just bought this book called "The Strong willed Child" by James Dobson.  I am so anxious to start reading it...Hope this helps.

[transylvania_mom]

James Dobson's books are evil and disgusting. He basically says all children are evil and the lack of "discipline" (read "punishing / beating into submission") is the cause of all crime nowadays. And you need to break you child and show her who's the boss.
 

[Phyllis Engle]

yes, she gets time outs, but they don't seem to work. I guess persistance is key?

yes, she plays outside with her siblings and sometimes alone if she is in the backyard. But I am constantly running out to check on her. (she will be 5 in one week)

we have explained to her that you can't climb fences and just go into people's yards without being invited. Yeah, that doesn't stick either. :( 

Thanks for everyone's responses and ideas. They are appreciated.

[ChitownTracy]

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Edited by ChitownTracy - 7/19/12 at 7:38pm

[Phyllis Engle]

I don't know if there is a way to lock this topic or delete it or whatever... but things seem to be getting out of hand now. I am sorry I even came here to look for advice. Bickering over religious principals of child rearing was NOT what I came looking for. I do have a church, and if I was interested in that, I would go there for advice. I thought this was a place for mothers to get together and help each other out. I guess I was wrong. Sorry for the problems I may have inadvertantly caused.

[ChitownTracy]

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Edited by ChitownTracy - 7/19/12 at 7:37pm

[ThreeTwoFive]

Originally Posted by Phyllis Engle 

yes, she gets time outs, but they don't seem to work. I guess persistance is key?

yes, she plays outside with her siblings and sometimes alone if she is in the backyard. But I am constantly running out to check on her. (she will be 5 in one week)

we have explained to her that you can't climb fences and just go into people's yards without being invited. Yeah, that doesn't stick either. :( 

Thanks for everyone's responses and ideas. They are appreciated.

Looks like I missed a lot during the day.  Don't blame yourself for the hijack.

I would explain, "I can't let you play outside by yourself if I'm not sure you'll stay in the yard."  And let her build the trust back in 2 minute increments.  (I'll be right back -- stay in the yard.)

Do you have a serious/scared voice prepared for when she climbs over again?  That's not a sweet "please come back."  It's a "mommy was so scared.  I DID NOT KNOW WHERE YOU WERE!!"

This is the voice I used when my DS wiggled out of his car seat straps and I had to pull over on the highway.  He hasn't done it again.  That's the safety voice, for very special occasions.

And maybe try to notice when she does play well with her siblings.  "I noticed you had fun with __ today," just to help her reflect on what went right.  Time outs are good for stopping behavior in the short term.  The positive building back up and proactive reminders are what make the rules stick.  And a thousand repetitions.