Raw milk while pregnant - is it ok? - Page 2

[Emily Johnson]

It doesn't matter how well you know the farmer: raw milk is going to contain pathogens. That's because a cow's udders are right next to her anus. Healthy cows can carry Salmonella and other deadly bacteria without showing any signs of disease. And just try telling the six children who lost kidney function that the truth about raw milk is "exaggerated claims of the dairy industry."

Raw milk consumption is also NOT a personal choice. When an outbreak occurs, and there have been six just this year, taxpayers are forced to spend tens, sometimes hundreds, of thousands of dollars to launch an investigation. People hospitalized with illnesses caused by raw milk cost thousands and in some cases millions of dollars. We all pay for that. Finally, someone with salmonellosis or listeriosis or an E. coli infection is contagious and can easily pass that infection on to others.

Do your research and don't listen to the raw milk people; it's quite obvious where their priorities lie. Raw milk farmers charge three times the going price for their defective product and they routinely look for ways to violate the law. Trusting someone like that is foolish. As far as the argument that "people have consumed raw milk for thousands of years": that's right. They also died by the thousands of infectious diseases caused by that raw milk. And until modern medicine, the average human lifespan was 35 years. Do you really want to go back to those times?

[HouseofPeace]

whoah.  

the advances in dairy sanitization are far beyond what is described above.  a responsible dairy completely disinfects the cows udders, then connects the pump, and the milk is transferred from sterile teats to a sterilized vat which cools it immediately.  It's called a closed system milking machine.  The milk can even be cooled in the sterile piping which carries the milk to the vats.  Alternatively, they have nice pasteurizing machines that use the pipes to both heat and then cool the milk for a faster and milder form of pasteurization that avoids homogenization.

Raw milk farmers are certainly not out to make a fortune.  They are banned from government subsidies, and in order to maintain their standards and licensing, must sell milk at a much higher price simply to cover farming expenses.  As most of the ones I know have a grass-based herd, they also need much more land, and depend on organic certifications and lots of hands-on time and herding in order to feed and care for their cows.

I know too many hard-working farmers who always excel at sanitization, never even coming close to the 10,000ppl of bacteria that pasteurized milk is allowed to have, and certainly never reaching the 750,000ppl of bacteria that unpasteurized milk intended for pasteurization is reaching.  

[Millie Ivy]

Cassianni- Applause!!!!!

Cindy (OP)-I think you made a great choice.  I happen to be pregnant and drink raw milk, and think it'd be fine to start when pregnant, with some preparation.  I'd honestly be more concerned with the increased enzymatic and probiotic effect than pathogens, while pregnant..  Sometimes people can have a bit of a probiotic "cleanse" when switching to more raw/live foods.  That might be uncomfortable while pregnant. 

I digress.  I think you made a great choice because you are listening to your gut (haha, pun), and not the hype, and making a really decent compromise.  There are many people in certain areas in the States that would love to get fully raw, non homogenized milk and can't so they get what you are sourcing instead.  It's a pretty darn good alternative for the time being.

As for the expense, how much is it?  I pay 9 bucks a gallon here in TX, and go through two gallons a week  (and we run out sometimes! could probably order 5 every two weeks, sigh) for my family of 5.5.  I consider it not too bad for the nutrients it offers.  I shave off expenditures elsewhere, like barely ever buying packaged anything.  I'd rather my kids go grab a glass of milk and some fruit than anything packaged and that saves a ton of money.

[Michael Belt]

I think it's a safe bet that "Emily Johnson" is a plant.

[MelKIN]

I was introduced to Raw milk while pregnant and now, three years later I still drink it as does my daughter. 

I was actually given a heads up on this thread via a Raw Milk facebook group. It's definitely a personal decision, you'll hear arguments on both sides, but only you can decide what feels best for you.

As for those citing cases of sickness...I'd like to point out that pasteurized 'safe' store bought milk is responsible for more sicknesses on a yearly basis then raw milk, cheese, and butter combined.

[lastrid]

I agree with Michael. Love ha Hon.

[RealFoodMommy]

You take a calculated risk with everything you consume.  There are risks to drinking raw milk, just like there are to eating cantaloupe or spinach.  There's a much higher risk when eating sushi, but nearly everyone eats it, and almost everyone I know has gotten sick from it at some point.

I drink raw milk.  I love raw milk.  It tastes better, it's better for you, it comes from a local dairy that I drive by almost every day.  It's NOT more expensive than organic milk from the store.  I pay $5.50 a gallon for it.  Since I started drinking raw milk, I've been sick far less often.  I can't consume pasteurized milk, because I'm lactose intolerant, but I can drink raw milk because it contains lactase, the enzyme needed to digest lactose.  My husband now swears by the stuff.  My kids drink it.  Could we get sick from it at some point? Sure. Possibly.  We could also get sick from a chicken not getting cooked enough when we go to a restaurant.  

[ealasaid9]

I agree Emily is a "plant" everything "she" wrote is absolutely absurd. . .I milk cows. and I drink raw milk. I am very clean with my procedures. I drank it when pregnant, and my youngest (3) has never had pasteurized milk.I make yogurt and raw butter out of it. I will go kicking and screaming if I am forced to go back to that crap at the store.

[MintBecca]

I LOVE RAW MILK.  Best switch I ever made, I searched for half a year before I could find my supplier.  Raw milk is ideal for pregnant women.  The unborn child grows much better, stronger, smarter and healthier.  You can also expect to ward off gestational diabetes and all of those other pregnancy related diseases. Raw milk is a gem!  I will never drink the legal stuff again.  The claims against raw milk are misunderstood.  There are great books and websites that can clear the air on the misunderstanding of outbreaks and bacteria.  For instance the cows of commercial farming that are left to stand knee deep in their own waste, pumped full of antibiotics and fed things that you can't imagine a cow eating along with that soy, corn and wheat; you do not want raw milk from those cows.  Those poor commercially farmed cows do not produce clean milk.  However, if you're lucky then you can find a small nearby dairy farmer who has cows that graze the fields, these are grass-fed cows, they are healthy and clean and in turn, give you healthy, clean and rich milk.  Get your milk there.

[pekoe]

Thank you for this discussion - I have been thinking about this question a lot lately and this forum has helped.  I have been drinking raw milk for years, but there is so much negative publicity about it's dangers that I felt worried about drinking it while pregnant. 

[MintBecca]

I was worried at my first purchase, I had my husband test the milk and then I tested with a tablespoon and waited 24 hrs (during my pregnancy)... never had an upset stomach, so then I started to believe in the benefits that I read about and I was also able to disregard the negativity that had been pinned on this misunderstood food. 

[Cynthia Mosher]

I received a report about a post here that is arguing against drinking raw milk and that it seemed inappropriate in the Traditional Foods forum.

While we try to maintain a comfortable posting atmosphere in all forums and particularly in keeping things appropriate for a forum's focus, when a thread is titled as this one is, it invites both sides of the fence to give their input, regardless of the forum. This can be amplified by the New Posts feature, which is what may lead someone into a forum to post without paying attention the the forum's focus of discussion. So while some replies may come from members who are not at all traditional foods people it is not in our best interests as a healthy community to restrict such input. Discussion can be educating and eye-opening for those who come into it with the intention to argue against a point.

That said, we totally encourage traditional foods folks to respond to state their own opinions, philosophies and information to refute anything stated. That's the nature of discussion and we are confident that you will serve the forum well in doing so. Should things get out of line and it become obvious that a member is bent on attacking and insulting I'll be glad to step in and put a stop to that and that. So feel free to report anything of that nature.

Thanks everyone!

[katealicia]

Everybody pretty much said what I was going to say. I am pregnant, and I drink raw milk whenever I can get it from a good source. I agree that it's a personal choice, and I know that a person's body can have trouble adjusting to any animal foods if they have been off them for a long time. After I didn't eat meat for 22 months (couldn't find a non-CAFO source) it was very difficult for me to digest meat for a while. I had to have beef cooked well done when before I enjoyed it rare. Several years later, I can eat all healthy animal products with ease, though as others have mentioned I have serious issues handling conventional milk. I also eat soft cheeses. I don't worry so much about what you aren't "supposed" to eat during pregnancy as long as I know it is high quality and nutrient dense. 

I also have some issues with what some PP's said about the health risks of raw milk. I know we have all heard this a lots of times, but there are food poisoning outbreaks all the time involving a wide range of foods, but raw milk is the only one consistently targeted by public health officials. I can specifically remember two Ecoli outbreaks in recent years, one from tomatoes and one from spinach. Both crops were recalled for a limited time but you don't hear the CDC wanting to outlaw spinach or tomatoes. It is a double standard. 

Also, Ecoli is present in the guts of most people without causing harm. There are different kinds of Ecoli, and the dangerous kinds of Ecoli only develop in the milk of very sick cows being fed things that cows should not be fed. When cows only eat factory silage their stomachs don't have the proper chemistry and that's when the dangerous Ecoli develops. When the giant pools holding the sewage from these horrible operations get flooded, there can be toxic runoff, which is the cause of the contaminated vegetables. The problem here is the factory farm system, not milk itself.

As for the PP who stated that the Ecoli in raw milk "often" leads to miscarriage, I'd like to see statistics (with conclusive proof the illness was caused by raw milk) for how "often" this actually occurs.

ETA: also, Emily Johnson, if you do your research about life expectancy, you will find that your claims are misleading. While the average life expectancy used to be much lower, people were not actually only living to 35. Infant and childhood mortality was extreme, mostly as a result of unsanitary conditions and practices of all kinds, but not because of healthy foods like raw milk from grassed cows. The people who survived childhood generally lived as long or longer than we do today. So no, traditional foods aren't actually bad for us and were not causing people to die before 40.

[RieMcGaha]

I was told  by my midwife that raw milk is a no-no during pregnancy UNLESS you were drinking it prior to becoming pregnant and  use the same source. I drank raw milk throughout all of my pregnancies with no problems because I was raised on it and it came from the same place. I also used the fresh cream to make butter and cheese. I think it's wise to speak with your dr., midwife, or nutritionist, especially if you did not drink it prior to pregnancy. 

[Smithie]

That's a very good point. In my third pregnancy, I was already drinking raw milk and did not stop, and used the same farmer throughout. I would have been more hesitant to start up with raw dairy after becoming pregnant. 

[iowaorganic]

Yes....  As a farmer and dairy girl I must....  OP- your comfort level is what matters here.  I only drink raw milk and am so passionate about it we bought our own Jerseys.  The sun and fresh air  clean my parlor and my cows get plenty of fresh air and room to roam.   If it makes a difference- when you are buying USDA Organic you may rest assured that that cow has had as much pasture as possible in that part of the country.  Inspectors take this very seriously.  The only organic milk that is available to me is UltraPasturized.  Which I basically think is a waste.  It is sad really that that good milk is killed so it can sit for a month on a grocery store shelf.  So if we don't have our own we really don't drink any milk.  

Originally Posted by courtney_c 

Most of the outbreaks are because of the fact that the farms are not as monitored.  There are raw milk farms that I think need to be shut down because they are the ones that cause all of this ridiculousness. 
But, there are more outbreaks from pasteurized milk than raw milk!  Raw milk is just in the media more, so that's what people see. 
If you find a grade A dairy farm, it is actually safer than pasteurized because it is highly monitored... very clean... tested often.
The reason why outbreaks were reduced is because back then, raw dairy farms were filthy.  Now, raw dairy farms are much cleaner than pasteurized.  It's all about the farming practices. 
Farms that produce pasteurized milk are dirtier, the cows are stuck in their own feces and filth (not allowed to graze), the cows are given hormones and antibiotics, and the cows eat anything (I've seen reports of cows actually being fed beef, gum and gum wrappers, candy bars, etc). 
 

Raw milk is a complete food.  You really can't get better than that.  It is much healthier than pasteurized, which is hardly a food at all.  Most of the nutrients cannot be absorbed into your body because the good bacteria and enzymes are killed off during pasteurization. 

Seeing snippets in the news does NOT give you an accurate picture of the dairy industry.   In general your points about farms are rubbish and I don't think you have a CLUE about what it takes to be Grade A or sell milk and I really wish you wouldn't spread nonsense.

I do however agree with your final comment.  It is a complete living food.  

Originally Posted by linian89 

You are completely buying into the exaggerated claims of the dairy industry! If it were so dangerous, it wouldn't have been a staple of so many traditional diets...and by the way, yes, pasteurization absolutely does destroy EVERYTHING good about natural grass-fed raw milk (and is in fact, probably just flat out bad for you)! Do the research, and don't just listen to the FDA, etc., because it's quite obvious where their priorities lie.

Raw milk is amazing!  I completely agree!