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Friend asked her pedi if it was "safe" to be around my kid!

post #1 of 32
Thread Starter 

Just thought this was interesting and need to vent (DH is NOT all onboard with the no vax decision, so I choose my words with him about it) ...

 

I have a friend whose first baby is 2 months older than mine.  Her MIL is a labor and delivery nurse who just believes in every type of medicine under the sun.  Her husband dutifully listens to his mom about the importance of vax, etc.  My friend, who was totally against getting a flu shot while pregnant, was convinced into the flu shot by her.  They, of course, have chosen to vaccinate. 

 

My friend knows my thoughts and also knows that my DH and I were divided on the issue.  The other day, in front of both our DHs and the kids, asked if Max got his shots at 2 months .... she asked with good intent:  her baby was a mess after their first doses at 2 months and had advice about when to give tylenol, etc.  I hesitated to answer because I didn't know how ... should i tell them the truth?  I like her, talk alot with her, and want our kids to grow up close to one another.  But, people can be so alienating if they are on the other side of the fence.  So -- i hesitated and eventually did say simply that he did not get shots at his 2 month appt -- I didn't explain that I told the doc we'd delay for a year, but that i intend to never vax, etc ... I just kept it simple.

 

Today she and I were going back and forth in texts and I apologized fo the awkward position i put her in when answering her question that day (she's a live and let live kind of gal) ... she replied saying it was no problem and that THEY HAD ASKED THEIR PEDIATRICIAN ABOUT HER DAUGHTER (VAXXED) BEING AROUND MY UNVAXXED SON and the doc said it was no problem.

 

Um .... DUH!

 

I was put off by this -- not sure why ... I expect to just be cast off, really.  But i said back to her -- if vaccines do what they think and expect, then the vax kids wouldn't be affected by the no vax kids, but the other way around!  I guess as a proud mama and someone who feels stronlgy that her decisions are THE BEST decisions (hahahaha!), I was offended that she could think my son could harm her daughter.  So silly, I know.  But it's bugging me.

 

I want to highlight for her how max can do everything that emma can do and he's 2 months younger than she is.  I want to highlight the fact that he hasn't had so much as a sniffle since he was born and emmas been sick with 3 colds already.  I want the world to believe what I believe about vaccines.  :(  Meanwhile, I feel like I need to hide from and lie about this parenting decisions, even though it isn't any of the public's business anyway as far as I'm concerned.

 

This definately puts us in such a social pickle.  :/

post #2 of 32

hugs!!  that always makes no sense to me... if you think vaccines work like they are supposed to...  whats the problem???
 

post #3 of 32

i would not use your child's health as an example...my baby at 7 weeks old had a cold and stomach virus and was hospitalized with a bad uti. she has 3 older sisters. i think she's had 4 colds in her less-than 8 months of life. NOT the poster-child for no-vax or breastfeeding! my second vaxed daughter never got sick her whole first year.

post #4 of 32

My sis doesn't do anything natural or organic. She's on the SAD (Standard American Diet) for sure. She wasn't able to breast feed them exclusively and dried up at 6 months with both. Her two kids are forever sick. Her 2 yr old has been hospitalized twice and has a breathing machine. She does most but not all vax. My brother's wife does natural/ organic and is very healthy. She still BF both kids, and has never vax. I think her 2 yr old has been sick once with a cold. The end.

 

I think all those make a difference and I want to make my kids as healthy as possible!
 

post #5 of 32

My friend is a L&D nurse with 4 children, NONE of whom she even attempted to BF, not because she couldn't, but purely bc (and I quote) she "doesn't want her boobs to be messed up by kids touching them".  She even told her 6yo old daughter how gross it is that some people don't feed from bottles.  Nice, huh?  Luckily this 6yo is close to me and so she's been able to see me BF (no boob hanging out) and I'm totally open for discussion with her so I'm hoping I can sway her opinion a bit.  But as a nurse, her kids are vaxxed to the max, on every rx drug ever made for every ailment - all 4 have asthma (including the 14mo), and the oldest son who's 10, well he poops once every 2 weeks and has been on stool softeners since he was 2.  Thier diet consists of chicken nuggets, french fries, steak, chips, sugar cereals - not a drop of anything unprocessed.  She always asks how long I'm going to BF for and she is constantly criticizing my decisions about vax with my daughter.  She's almost 7 mos, and while I started some vax with her on an alt schedlue, I'm leaning more towards being done vaxing at this point.  Already signed one waiver at the pedi's office.  DH started off thinking I was crazy but he's gotten better.  Luckily I do all the dr's visits so he leaves the final decision with me and if he does go alone, he always calls me before anything gets done (dogs included!).  His mother works in the hospital I delivered at doing paperwork, but she's pretty pro-vax so we just don't discuss with them.  My parents are much more open to our vax decisions.  But because we've gotten quite a bit of negative reponse from the majority of the friends we are close with, we just don't talk about it anymore.  I play around with wording my responses to gague what works best.  Our neighbors have a daughter who's 3mos older than ours and when they thought she had the chickenpox a few weeks ago, I asked if we could do a playdate.  She ended up not having them but we got to talking about why I wanted her to have them.  She was interested bc her family is Jamaican and her husband is from Haiti, so their parents are more familiar with natural remadies and non vax even though once they moved to the states they followed the vax protocols here.  I've accepted that while some of my friends are on board with me on CD'ing and BF, most are not so open to my decisions about vax.

post #6 of 32

She probably wants to avoid her child getting a VPD. I don't know how old your kids are, but if they're still fairly young, hers may not have gotten all the boosters yet. Therefore she is concerned about her daughter's increased risk of catching a VPD before she is fully vaccinated, and since she doesn't want this to happen, she naturally wants to know whether she should be concerned about an unvaccinated kid potentially exposing hers. She just wants to keep her kid safe, just like you do, even though you have different ideas of what that constitutes.

 

I know you probably feel like she is judging you by even trying to get this information, but try to look at it from her point of view. She knows you don't vaccinate, she wants to keep being friends with you and doesn't want vax status to become an issue, so she asks her doctor so she can be sure that she needn't worry about her child, and then she even tells you so that you know that she's not worried. She tried to make a space for the two of you to still spend time together despite your different decisions. You don't see her child being vaxxed as a big deal, and she is trying to make a space where she doesn't see yours being unvaxxed as a big deal either.

 

As for the developmental differences, different babies develop at different rates. You don't know that your baby is more advanced than hers because of vaccines or the lack thereof. I do vax my daughter, and if I found out that one of my friends had been speculating behind my back on whether her lack of development or her having gotten mildly sick a couple of times (my daughter has never been sick, but let's pretend for purposes of this example) was due to her being vaccinated, I'd be really hurt and upset. I would feel judged, and I would want to snap back that my kid was normal and to quit making speculations about us that don't give us the benefit of the doubt. Try not to judge your friend or negatively assess her (probably perfectly healthy and developmentally normal) baby.

 

Fwiw, my daughter is about average in development for her age--not ahead of the curve, not behind it. I have a friend whose daughter is a month younger and is doing more stuff than my daughter... and her daughter has had even more vaccines than my daughter (because I have so far skipped Hep B and I know they gave at least one dose and probably the entire series). We otherwise parent in fairly similar ways. Should I conclude that the extra vaccine gave that other baby the edge, or should I simply conclude that two different children have two different time tables and that both are in the range of normal?

post #7 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by erigeron View Post

She probably wants to avoid her child getting a VPD. I don't know how old your kids are, but if they're still fairly young, hers may not have gotten all the boosters yet. Therefore she is concerned about her daughter's increased risk of catching a VPD before she is fully vaccinated, and since she doesn't want this to happen, she naturally wants to know whether she should be concerned about an unvaccinated kid potentially exposing hers. She just wants to keep her kid safe, just like you do, even though you have different ideas of what that constitutes.

 

I know you probably feel like she is judging you by even trying to get this information, but try to look at it from her point of view. She knows you don't vaccinate, she wants to keep being friends with you and doesn't want vax status to become an issue, so she asks her doctor so she can be sure that she needn't worry about her child, and then she even tells you so that you know that she's not worried. She tried to make a space for the two of you to still spend time together despite your different decisions. You don't see her child being vaxxed as a big deal, and she is trying to make a space where she doesn't see yours being unvaxxed as a big deal either.

 

As for the developmental differences, different babies develop at different rates. You don't know that your baby is more advanced than hers because of vaccines or the lack thereof. I do vax my daughter, and if I found out that one of my friends had been speculating behind my back on whether her lack of development or her having gotten mildly sick a couple of times (my daughter has never been sick, but let's pretend for purposes of this example) was due to her being vaccinated, I'd be really hurt and upset. I would feel judged, and I would want to snap back that my kid was normal and to quit making speculations about us that don't give us the benefit of the doubt. Try not to judge your friend or negatively assess her (probably perfectly healthy and developmentally normal) baby.

 

Fwiw, my daughter is about average in development for her age--not ahead of the curve, not behind it. I have a friend whose daughter is a month younger and is doing more stuff than my daughter... and her daughter has had even more vaccines than my daughter (because I have so far skipped Hep B and I know they gave at least one dose and probably the entire series). We otherwise parent in fairly similar ways. Should I conclude that the extra vaccine gave that other baby the edge, or should I simply conclude that two different children have two different time tables and that both are in the range of normal?


Exactly.

post #8 of 32

She doesn't sound like much of a friend...

Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyfirechick View Post

My friend is a L&D nurse with 4 children, NONE of whom she even attempted to BF, not because she couldn't, but purely bc (and I quote) she "doesn't want her boobs to be messed up by kids touching them".  She even told her 6yo old daughter how gross it is that some people don't feed from bottles.  Nice, huh?  Luckily this 6yo is close to me and so she's been able to see me BF (no boob hanging out) and I'm totally open for discussion with her so I'm hoping I can sway her opinion a bit.  But as a nurse, her kids are vaxxed to the max, on every rx drug ever made for every ailment - all 4 have asthma (including the 14mo), and the oldest son who's 10, well he poops once every 2 weeks and has been on stool softeners since he was 2.  Thier diet consists of chicken nuggets, french fries, steak, chips, sugar cereals - not a drop of anything unprocessed.  She always asks how long I'm going to BF for and she is constantly criticizing my decisions about vax with my daughter.  She's almost 7 mos, and while I started some vax with her on an alt schedlue, I'm leaning more towards being done vaxing at this point.  Already signed one waiver at the pedi's office.  DH started off thinking I was crazy but he's gotten better.  Luckily I do all the dr's visits so he leaves the final decision with me and if he does go alone, he always calls me before anything gets done (dogs included!).  His mother works in the hospital I delivered at doing paperwork, but she's pretty pro-vax so we just don't discuss with them.  My parents are much more open to our vax decisions.  But because we've gotten quite a bit of negative reponse from the majority of the friends we are close with, we just don't talk about it anymore.  I play around with wording my responses to gague what works best.  Our neighbors have a daughter who's 3mos older than ours and when they thought she had the chickenpox a few weeks ago, I asked if we could do a playdate.  She ended up not having them but we got to talking about why I wanted her to have them.  She was interested bc her family is Jamaican and her husband is from Haiti, so their parents are more familiar with natural remadies and non vax even though once they moved to the states they followed the vax protocols here.  I've accepted that while some of my friends are on board with me on CD'ing and BF, most are not so open to my decisions about vax.

post #9 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by emmy526 View Post

She doesn't sound like much of a friend...

 

Tell me about it!  She's more a packaged deal friend - her DH works with my DH and they've been friends for almost 15yrs...although she did manage to put her feelings aside to make us the godparents.

post #10 of 32
Thread Starter 

Not sure if I mentioned this in my first post ...

 

But DH and I have not yet discussed how we will handle the questions like "did he get his shots yet?", "how was he with his shots?", etc.  I hate even bringing up the vax subject with my DH because I know he diasgrees ... but he knows I'm trying to do what's best, too.  He cares, but respects me as a mother and primary care giver, so I'm happy about that.  Still, i wish he was on board.

 

Anyway, that's why we haven't had the conversation.  But, more and more often, I fear, we'll be put int he situation to answer those questions.  I know how hard it can be to share this with people, though I want to shout it from the mountaintops!  :)  I don't really want anyone close to us to know -- I hate doing it, but I think I'll just lie from now on.  "Oh, he was fine".

 

But then, if the convo turns to the latest (and forever uprising) news issue on vaccines like the recent storage issues, I would have to bite my tongue off trying to say "and we don't use them!" ... because anything man made that you put in a baby could have some kidn of issue.

 

Though, I am on facebook and I have liked the national vaccine information center which highlights some wonderful articles and videos that I"m always "liking" ... so maybe no one will ever ask because they think they know my answers!  ;)

post #11 of 32

I think it's just downhill from here. 

 

You have to decide to be an activist, or avoider, on most fronts.  Sadly, I've come to realize that avoiding is best in most cases.  Sure, the way things are working out for my family are great, and I'd love to share my logic and reasoning and experiences, especially with people I love.  It isn't just vaccines, either.  Lots of things fall in this category, depending on what group of people I'm with.  And, it can be incredibly frustrating to answer a "what books does your dd (7) enjoy."  Well, I can lie, or I can shrug off the question, or I can be honest and say she just finished Little Women.  The first feels wrong, and the last feels like I'm bragging.  The middle feels like I don't care enough about dd to be honest about her, or want to talk about who she really is.  It's a pickle.  I say that to say that this sort of issue may come up in your parenting life more than you think it will. 

 

But...

 

I read a quote once that went something like this:

 

There are two kinds of people.  The ones that already know, and the ones that aren't going to know no matter how many times you tell them.

 

Find some of the first to have someone to talk to, and dodge the conversation bullets with the rest.  That's my current method. YMMV.

post #12 of 32
Quote:
I was put off by this -- not sure why ... I expect to just be cast off, really.  But i said back to her -- if vaccines do what they think and expect, then the vax kids wouldn't be affected by the no vax kids, but the other way around!  I guess as a proud mama and someone who feels stronlgy that her decisions are THE BEST decisions (hahahaha!), I was offended that she could think my son could harm her daughter.  So silly, I know.  But it's bugging me.

 

 

FEAR is what drives "vaccination". Most is based on ignorance. What do I do , what do I do? Oh mister AUTHORITY what do I do? Glad to help here take take this  toxin.

 

When you panic a person enough he stops thinking. You would think even the most brainwashed individual would find the "unvaccinated are a threat to the vaccinated" pure logical idiocy. HHS can make a case for ANYTHING and they have the PhDs to do it. WE must be firm to totally reject this as it is the basis for FORCED VACCINATION.

 

"The real risk to others? People who routinely take antibiotics

 

As it turns out, the real health risk that does exist in person-to-person exposure of infectious disease comes from people who routinely take antibiotics. Those who take the most antibiotics become drug-resistant bacteria factories, and they can spread their drug-resistant strains to others around them. Their risk of developing superbugs rises proportionally to the frequency and duration of their taking prescription antibiotics.

 

The most dangerous person in your family, it turns out, is not the “unvaccinated” person but the one taking antibiotics! They are human breeding grounds for bacterial mutations that can be downright deadly."

 

http://www.ener-chi.com/tag/vaccines-do-not-confer-total-immunity/

post #13 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Louisw View Post

FEAR is what drives "vaccination". Most is based on ignorance. What do I do , what do I do? Oh mister AUTHORITY what do I do? Glad to help here take take this  toxin.

 

 

The ONLY solution to fear is KNOWLEDGE; not a fact sheet from your "doctor" or CDC; use independent sources. Personally I NEVER trust CDC they have lied to me so many times I do not trust anything they say. Yes most of what they say is correct but until you know a LOT you may not be able to tell the lies form the facts. As for trusting my  doctor I do not have one and have not for 30 years. I would  go near the Medical Industry after I cut my arm off. Serious trauma excepted of course. When I hear the ignorant peds threaten to toss out their patients who will not "vaccinate" enough for that second boat, it breaks me up. Women do not need a ped they think they need one of these needle pushers. I can tell you one thing if women did their own research into vitamin D and then quizzed their ped about vitamin D they may find out just how ignorant he is on a  KEY health issue.

 

Assuring blood levels of  60 ng/ml of vitamin D for both you and yours is 20 times more important than having a "doctor" who knows next to nothing about vitamin D.

 

Here is an excellent source of polio information. Polio history is VERY  important IMO because it exposes the obvious engineering of harm and death by the "authorities" You know those people we are supposed to trust with our lives.

 

http://www.vacfacts.info/polio-and-small-pox-vaccinehis/

post #14 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Louisw View Post

 

The most dangerous person in your family, it turns out, is not the “unvaccinated” person but the one taking antibiotics! They are human breeding grounds for bacterial mutations that can be downright deadly."

 

http://www.ener-chi.com/tag/vaccines-do-not-confer-total-immunity/

 

The more you "vaccinate" the more antibiotics will be foisted on you. IMO most pediatric ear problems are VID Vaccine Induced Disease. There are MANY VIDs.

 

Middle Ear Infections

 

“90% of upper respiratory infections, including children's ear infections, are viral, and antibiotics don't treat viral infection. More than 40% of about 50 million prescriptions for antibiotics each year in physicians' offices were inappropriate."   CDC

 

“I have treated many hundreds perhaps thousands of cases of ear infections with echinacea and I know it works. I rarely have to give antibiotics or use tubes to clear up these infections.”    Doctor Jay Gordon, Pediatrician Cedars Sinai MC

 

"The best way to prevent allergy in infants is to breast feed them. Children who are allergic to foods often have fluids in the ear tube leading to infections."     Prevention

 

“80 out of 100 children, if given only medication to reduce pain or fever, would recover from an acute ear infection within a few days. If they were given antibiotics instead, the number would rise only to 92 -- and 3 to 10 of the children would develop a rash, while 5 to 10 would develop diarrhea.”   Journal of the American Medical Association November 17, 2010; 304(19):2161-2169 , Note if you forget the “medication” and allow the fever you will see even better results IMO How to treat ear infections Doctor Mercola

 

"We found in our clinical practice an over 90% reduction in middle ear problems with the kids using xylitol for their teeth."   Doctor Lon Jones D.O. Note Doctor Jones also had good results using xylitol with colds, allergies, ear infections, sinus infections and dental health.I hope with the publication of this book more pediatricians will get their earache patients using xylitol."   Doctor Lon Jones D.O.

 

Giving a child Drug Antibiotics for a middle ear infection is almost never a good idea. Anti-biotics are vastly over prescribed presumably to induce the placebo effect in the paying stiff. Fine, use SUGAR PILLS, please. Believe it or not Drug Anti-biotics are STILL given for viruses. But please don’t YOU be so foolish as to accept this insane “Prescription”.

post #15 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Louisw View Post

 


As it turns out, the real health risk that does exist in person-to-person exposure of infectious disease comes from people who routinely take antibiotics. Those who take the most antibiotics become drug-resistant bacteria factories, and they can spread their drug-resistant strains to others around them. Their risk of developing superbugs rises proportionally to the frequency and duration of their taking prescription antibiotics.

 

http://www.ener-chi.com/tag/vaccines-do-not-confer-total-immunity/

 Do you honestly think the CDC does not understand this?

post #16 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Louisw View Post

 Do you honestly think the CDC does not understand this?

 

The people who rule the CDC want nothing more.

post #17 of 32
Louisw, replying to yourself multiple times does not encourage discussion with other members. Also, this thread is about vaccination, not antibiotics; so change your posting habits or your posting privileges will be removed.
post #18 of 32
Thank you thank you thank you Mosaic!!!!
post #19 of 32
"Did he get his shots yet?"
- "He has all the shots he needs."

I vax, but I still see no reason that you should be offended by someone asking their ped about safety.
post #20 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mosaic View Post

Also, this thread is about vaccination, not antibiotics; so change your posting habits or your posting privileges will be removed.

 

Vaccination induces disease which your ped will tell you requires antibiotics. So IMO they are VERY RELATED. We MUST understand this. Talk to a mother who "vaccinated" her first child and did not "vaccinate" her second child.  See what the difference in antibiotic use was between the children.

 

The more you "vaccinate" the more your ped will tell you, you need antibiotics.

 

One should look at the body as systems interconnected. Everything effects everything else.

 

"We refer to our broken brains by many names, depression, anxiety, memory loss, attention deficit disorder, autism and dementia to name a few. This epidemic of brain breakdown shows up an radically different ways from person to person so that they all seem like separate problems. But the truth is that they are all manifestations of a few common underlying root causes." Doctor Mark Hyman MD, Note "vaccination is IMO one of these root causes

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